September crappie fishing on Lake Wisconsin has become an annual right of passage for my boat. The numbers and size of the fish aren’t as good as it was five or six years ago but if your willing to put in a solid effort, it can still pay off with some nice slabs.
The locations where we find these fish are the same locations we found them in years ago. The difference is the number of fish found in each location.
Some people will no doubt argue that the local fishing guides are the problem. That’s never going to change and goes with the territory.
And for sure this is a can of worms many will say I never should have opened. Especially since I personally have little or nothing to gain from bringing it up. But shying away from something just because it may not shine the best light on me personally doesn’t seem fitting in this case. Instead, I’m going to shine a light on this issue and hope it leads to a positive discussion. Pretty high hopes no doubt but lets see what happens.
To begin with, although crappie fishing on Lake Wisconsin is not nearly as good as it was 5 or 6 years ago, it’s also not in a crisis situation either and has actually improved slightly from 2 or 3 years back.
What happened you may ask?
As far as I know there’s never been any specific studies done so that’s also sort of up to individual interpretation. But from my point of view, there are two main factors contributing to the overall decline.
Number 1 is weather. Bad weather and bad timing to be more specific.
Several years in a row, we’ve had severe to moderately severe cold spells hit right as the crappies were moving onto there spawning grounds. These cold spells didn’t last for a day or two but hung around for anywhere from a week to more than three weeks. The end result of these cold spells was a large percentage of the crappie population did not spawn or if they did spawn, there eggs or young of the year didn’t survive.
Now I’m not a fisheries biologist and no studies were done so the above hypothesis is nothing more than mine & mine alone. The only thing I do have is a lot of years of fishing experience and that’s what I’m relying on to form the above hypothesis.
The 2nd problem is more controversial. That being fishermen themselves and bag limits that could use some revising to adjust for the advent of better electronics, better lures and better overall equipment in general which naturally leads to a better ability of those who chase these fish to consistently locate and catch them.
What hasn’t happened is any sort of review on the daily limit or bag limits for crappies or panfish in general.
In the spring, these fish have a bad tendency to use the same spawning grounds year after year, after year, after year. And in the fall, although we don’t see as large of schools on the same locations as in the spring, they still use the same locations over, and over, and over again.
Basically once an angler has figured it out, it’s relatively easy to go out and put a bunch of fish in the boat. The daily possession limit is 25 panfish with a bag limit of double the daily possession limit.
Many fishermen have figured out exactly where these fish spawn and they will target these area’s for days on end come spring until they hit it just so they can pack there freezer with crappies.
The same can happen in the fall although with so many competing interest in the fall, it doesn’t appear to be as common.
In order to solve any problem, the first thing that needs to be done is to admit there is a problem. As I’ve already said above, crappie fishing on Lake Wisconsin is not in a crisis situation. Not yet anyway.
At the same time however, knowing the potential of Lake Wisconsin makes me think that we are wasting a tremendous opportunity to show case just how great crappie fishing could be if we would make some minor adjustments in how we manage it. (my belief)
What I personally would like to see is this:
Keep the panfish limit at 25 fish per day and the possession limit at double the daily bag limit.
Within that daily bag limit of 25 panfish, only 10 could be of any one species. This way and angler could still take 25 fish home on any given day if that’s what they really wanted to do while still protecting against over harvesting of any one species.
What I would really like to know, is what do you think?
Good, bad or other, I would really like to hear what you think. Especially those of you who frequently fish Lake Wisconsin.
1st pic – Tony Paszyna
2nd pic – Dustin Klemp
3rd pic – Dennis Knuth
4th pic – Al, Jim & Jan
5th pic – Mike, Tony & Al
6th pic – Earl Ball
Just for reference, the last picture represents the most crappies any one client has taken home this fall.
Nice batch of crappies Joel!
I agree with your theory whole heartily. This entire region of WI has had unstable spring weather with water temps taking critical swings through spawning periods of panfish as well as a number of game fish. Does it have an affect? I believe so. For those that would argue this fact, I agree that some bodies of water didn’t feel the affect as much as other bodies of water.
Then compound this with bodies of water that traditionally see a cycle in the crappie population. If you have a lower population with multiple years of poor spawning conditions, you will inevitably have lower populations.
I don’t frequent Lake WI often, but I have seen the exact same thing on Fox Lake, Mendota, Bago chain, and the local lakes near my house. Within these bodies of water I listed, you see distinct year classes of crappies with “gaps” in the sizes. Catch a few over 12″, very few in the 9-11″, tons at 8-9″, nothing in the 6-8″ and then a fair number in 5″. Backing up and looking at the years classes that way, you don’t need to be a Fisheries biologist to understand the affects weather has on a year class of fry.
How to control the over harvesting during the spawn? Age old question. Education, peer pressure, and self control will account for a small percentage. Possible putting a date range bag limit from May 1 to June 15th of 10/20 might be an option. Then how do we handle the few lakes that are over-abundant and should have more pannies removed? No clear answer on the best way that is suited for all bodies of water and all people.
I never like ending anything on a negative note, but I’ll do it today anyways. Too dang many people that have it dialed in over harvest – PERIOD. Like many other guides, I see repeated visits day after day by the same individuals in the same spots. I stand on the soap box and plead for people to release the spawners. Most agree and go with it. Some are opposed and want to keep “their” fish. But there is a huge difference between select harvest and slaughter fest. This isn’t just about crappies; pike, bass, walleyes, and so on all experience this. But how do you justify calling a warden and turning in a person for over bagging when you can’t see what is in their freezer. In my heart, I know a guy may be doing it. How how do I know he didn’t give the fish away or eat them every night. Very gray area.
To cure the problem, you need to stop the mind set of entitlement and greed.
As it relates to my local hole down here on the Chippewa river, I believe it is a direct result of natural cycles in population. The river in my area does not receive the pressure some other body’s of water receive yet the size swing seems to cycle every 5 years or so. Last fall and winter saw a number of large crappie brought to my boat and ice. I have not targeted them yet this fall but I am expecting great things. In a year or two I would expect much smaller and fewer fish for a few years. Mind you I have never even come close to taking a limit from my boat – I don’t see the need or purpose, but they sure are fun to catch and a few in the fry pan never hurt either. Interesting topic, looking forward to other thoughts and opinions….
Interesting discussion for sure. I believe that your suggested revision to the daily bag limit defined as a total daily limit of 25 with no more than 10 of any one species is certainly a fair and reasonable proposal and it’s worth a try to introduce it the spring hearings for both Sauk and Columbia counties. I do have concerns whether it would be considered without some sort of study being performed to create a baseline for any data that could document that there is in fact a problem. That raises other questions about what the study would be, and how it would be funded etc… Fisheries Biologist Nate Nye would likely be the guy to ask.
I also agree on cold spring weather negatively impacting recruitment. (I think we’re going to see negative impact on a couple year classes of walleyes as well in the coming years). While I believe it would be beneficial, as Lake Wisconsin is part of a river system that has the capability for natural reproduction, I don’t see dollars being allocated for studies, stocking or changes to regulations as easy things to get passed.
That doesn’t leave much immediate recourse other than what you just successfully did do, and that is to raise awareness by writing about it in a public forum. Floating your ideas on “other” forums that are maybe not moderated quite as well as this one will be up to you, as you know that you could be setting yourself up to get flamed by some who believe that their success rate is negatively impacted by fishing guides. Continuing to have conversations with our clients and other fisherman relative to the positive aspects of catch and release and proper fish handling is certainly helpful.
That’s my .02
I think there should be a 10 fish limit on crappie with a size restriction. Some of the fish I see people keep must have the meat equivalent of a potato chip. I don’t see guides as a problem. But when I fished this spring on lake Wisconsin for crappies I witnessed a boat with 4 people put every fish caught in the livewell. I kept hearing them complain every time I tossed one back as I had what I wanted to keep-10 crappie and a couple fat gills.
When I talked to them later, it was the third day they had limited out in a row! Hmmmmm.
Classic Greed – How do we break that cycle?
One more factor to the better electronic, better equipment is also better information. Sites like these help people tremendously to hone in on fish locations. In the old days I would fish every week but more times than not the next time out would still take a 1/2 day to re-find them or zero in on the fish. Family, kids and work keep me from fishing like I used to but most of the time I can read a couple of reports and know where to go and what to do. I don’t think it’s a bad thing at all just another factor to more successful fishing going on.
I’m hesitantly O.K. with your limit suggestion just because some springs I’m only able to make one spwaning crappie trip and would like to take my 25 home. My version would be 25 panfish with no more than 15 of one species. The thought process being that I like the number 25 and you have a pretty good chance at combining on the bluegills and crappires but to go look for a 3rd species of panfish is a tall order for most anglers.
I also wouldn’t be so quick to sell yourself short on being a biologist. Intelligent outdoorsmen with a lifetime of experience know and understand their ecosystems. They also have real information and data to support their hypothesis. I love to hear from other outdoorsmen on what they think about a situation and why. Your good at it and I’m sure you will, but please continue to share your thoughts.
Great report and conversation.
Natural cycles in populations are going to happen regardless of regulations. No argument from me there at all.
Putting good, solid regulations in place will never eliminate natural fluctuations but they could smooth that out and help the crappies recover more readily.
Stocking fish – I don’t see that as a very good option for Lake Wisconsin. Crappies can be prolific at reproduction under normal spring weather conditions and barring bad weather during the spawn, this lake does have the capability to produce plenty of fish entirely on its own.
Habitat – this is something we may be able to enhance. 20+ years ago cribs were planted all over the lake by a fishing club who went through the dnr permitting process. Most of those cribs are gone now but its an option that should be front and center in my opinion.
Updated regulations – most of our current panfish regulations were put in place a long, long time ago. If we could get it change to 10 or 15 fish per day with a sunset clause attached perhaps, would still be a start and would also give local fisheries biologist a chance to see the results. For that matter, it would give all of us “arm chair” biologist a chance to see the results first hand as well. Just like the current slot limit for walleyes did.
Educating the public – muskie anglers did it with there fellow anglers but its awfully hard to compare crappie fishermen to musky fisherman. They generally have totally different agendas. I’ve yet to see a musky fishermen looking to put a meal on the table or freeze a couple more meals for later in the year.
Many of those stocking there freezers have been doing so for generations and changing that attitude would be a monumental challenge.
More than likely, it would be far easier to get some sort of regulation change pushed through.
If something could or would be done to help these crappies along through the tough years, I honestly believe Lake Wisconsin could become known for world class crappie fishing. The genetics to produce 13-15″ crappies is there. The food source is also there in the form of gizzard shad.
I’ve repeatedly seen 3 to 4″ gizzard shad puked up by crappies in the live well so there is no doubt in my mind what they are capable of eating.
Down south, its common to see a 10″ minimum size limit and daily bag limit of 10 fish. Many of those lakes have tremendous crappie fishing. From what I understand, those big crappies feed primarily on threadfin shad.
It doesn’t seem like big reach for a body of water like Lake Wisconsin to do the same if given a chance.
What would you be willing to sacrifice for a chance to go out on any given weekend and put 10 crappies in the boat between 13-15″ long?
One little side note – it only takes six 13″+ crappies to stuff a 1quart freezer bag full of crappie fillets. (12 fillets)
I’ve cleaned enough of these fish for clients to know that first hand.
If you think my clients should be releasing all crappies that size, that maybe you should trying guiding for crappies. Let me know how many clients you have after a year or two of enforcing that rule in your boat.
For me, I will suggest it to those who I feel may be receptive to that idea. Especially in the spring when you know those fish are loaded with spawn. Often, that idea goes over pretty good in the spring. In fall, not so much.
How many people can you feed with a 1 quart freezer bag stuffed to the hilt with crappie fillets?
My personal belief is the crappie population is influenced 75% by spring weather / spawning success, 24.5% by over harvest by a certain group of locals that anyone who fishes Lake Wisconsin often could list by the boat they drive, and 0.5% by Joel Ballweg’s insane ability to pull fish from anywhere.
You can’t control the weather, so you will forever have some year classes that are just poor. It is just a fact of nature. Other factors can be controlled though. A better presence by the DNR so some of the guys that make multiple trips in a day and go home with limits on every trip would help. Calling the TIP line doesn’t seem to get it done.
I would be in favor of a more restrictive limit on panfish by species as suggested, but without enforcement, it would mean nothing. In my years of fishing that body of water, I have seen a warden once, and have never been checked.
I do honestly believe the biggest influence is spring conditions. A couple good stable springs and we will see another period of spectacular crappie fishing a few years later.
Agreed! However, better regulations may make it easier for the crappies to rebound after a tough year or two, or three.
Agreed again – I frequently get ask by clients how often I see a game warden on Lake Wisconsin. Not knowing many of these people well enough……..I admit to telling a bold, white lie and answer frequently.
That’s what we’re all hoping for!
Thanks to everyone who posted there opinion. Always good to hear what y’all think.
I was on the lake this past Friday… and over the years I have seen the huge swing in crappie fishing… I also remember maybe five years ago, dozens of boats crappie fishing the shorelines and keeping fish, all this added attention following two back to back years where a popular dells area guide talked about how easy it was and showed proof on the Woods and Waters show. Heck they were there, in the same spot again this season… showing how it was so “easy” to catch and keep all the eaters. And this guide is definitely not into promoting conservational thoughts. Same thing happened on Delavan Lake. There is a weed line that would have a couple boats on it for sure. That spot was very much revealed on the tv show, and for the next two weeks it was like a parking lot.
I have a buddy that I always argue with about keeping certain fish, and numbers of them in general. The discussions always go over the top when he suggest, if I put it back, someone else will just keep it. On Lake WI… I release anything 13″ and over… hoping good karma will get me a 16-17 for the wall someday.
After years of these keeping fish conversations, this past Friday my buddy looks over after catching a nice 12″ fish, and says, you know they could cut the limit to 10 or 15 on these fish here and that would plenty. I was shocked, and happy. We took home 14 between the two of us that day, changing over to another fish type after getting a good meal each.
As mentioned, it doesn’t work everywhere… there are smaller lakes up north that are over filled with 8″ crappies… and I think taking 25 out of there often is maybe even a good thing.
Joel… I think you hit it on the head… seasons and weather are huge for all fish, crappies maybe as much or more than anything.
I think a water body by water body set of limits would be perfect – but tough to enforce, and more importantly, keep current.
I would favor a 15 fish of one species and 25 fish in aggregate bag limit for pan fish. However I do wonder if there are lakes that would suffer with that regulation because they contain small (?stunted) fish where harvesting helps the rest of the fish.
Rather than a 10” minimum size, limit fish harvest of >12”(arbitrary size choice) to 5 crappie in the 15 fish aggregate. That brings to mind the question regarding the size of the most effective spawners. It’s my understanding that walleye >28” are far less fertile than say the 20-24”. I wonder if similar changes occur in mature crappie and keeping the big girls no more of a problem then a 10”?
John’s point regarding spring spawning conditions is well taken. The extensive records of young of the year perch population for the Bay of Green Bay and walleye year classes on Lake Erie demonstrate that.
Joel’s proposed regulation changes for Lake Wisconsin makes sense for that lake but state wide might be an issue. The DNR has a funny way of implementing regulations of certain bodies of water that can be confusing. However when the general public makes similar suggestions the DNR balks: too confusing for the general public. I think the slot limit for walleye harvest on Lake Wisconsin was a grand and successful idea. While we are at it let’s add 1 sauger over 24”.
Michael
I love that attitude!
I’ve personally released many, many 13, 14 & 15″ crappies hoping for a true 16″ or better to put on the wall someday.
Even though that has not yet happened, I have no regrets over releasing those big crappies.
I couldn’t agree more and have stated such in the past on other threads.
A single set of regs for all lakes just doesn’t work well.
That’s a whole nother can worms and it doesn’t appear as though WDNR has any interest in it what-so-ever.
Habitat – this is something we may be able to enhance. 20+ years ago cribs were planted all over the lake by a fishing club who went through the dnr permitting process. Most of those cribs are gone now but its an option that should be front and center in my opinion.
Any thoughts on how we could approach this? I would imagine some kind of permit is required. Their are lots of different ways cribs can be made and I have access to lots of pallets.I would happily volunteer time & sweat toward this endeavor.
Gary – gotta do some research yet regarding new cribs but I love the idea.
Having guys like you, John Schultz, Greybeard & others contribute there ideas on exactly where to place them would be very beneficial though.
This is a great discussion regarding self-restraint, and built into the fishing report, is something that’s near/dear to me. Panfish populations have long been viewed by the sport-fishing public as nothing but a food item, and to Randy’s point of stopping the greed, I think the answer does lie in changing some of the daily/posession limits. Look no further than over the river here, and 10-fish limits are the norm, with special waters having a 5 fish limit and/or slots. While it’s difficult to prove that these regulations have ultimately led to better fishing, it’s very easy to prove (historically and otherwise) that relaxed regs and over-harvest lead to poorer fishing.
When it comes down to it, 10 panfish of almost any species make for quite a meal. No, it won’t feed extended family or a neighborhood fish fry, but typically you’re fishing with at least one partner anyway. Not to mention, it deters people from “opportunity-bagging” and taking big bags and only fishing when they’re at they’re most vulnerable.
Either way, thanks for starting up a good thread on the topic, and I hope there’s a way to make this discussion an actionable topic within the WDNR.
Joel
Two of our more popular fishing lakes in this area : One in Eau Claire – Altoona, one in Menomonie – Menomin, both have special 10 panfish regulations. That is you only can keep 10 total of perch, gil and crappie. Both are known as producer’s, both are heavy pressured lakes in town. This is certainly part of your solution to man’s effect on the system. Will as many guy’s plunk down the cash to pay you for a 10 fish limit? Probably not, that would be a downside for you, unless the trpohy potential takes off. The upside for your lake is the meat hunters referred to earlier will find a 25 fish limit lake to fill there so called needs. In the end as population grows and continues to strain our natural resources this will become the standard. I really don’t know how to go about getting the limit implemented on your Lake Wisconsin. Either way I don’t ever see the DNR putting in a size restriction on panfish. They need to stick to numbers vs. size standard to not overly complicate the regs like they did with hunting – look at the overall hunting numbers in our country. Down, down and down some more. In my case and the case of many others the complicated regs doesn’t justify the means. Slippery slope that can be.
Canada did this awhile ago on all there lakes protecting the long term tourism for those looking for higher quality fish. It works and most people keep coming for the high standard of the fishing. Those who don’t come because of the limited meat they can take home are better off somewhere else in my humble opinion.
Nice job Joel!
Great read, Joel – Your report has inspired me to go whack some Lake Menomin Crappies soon! Every time I read what you write about Lake Wisconsin I get the vibe it’s very similar to Menomin, just on a larger scale.
I’ll also echo bigpike’s statement about the 10 panfish limit we have here on Menomin and other area lakes. Without these reg’s, our lakes would be devastated. It’s really important for ice fishing as these lakes explode with shacks.