Jeremy,

I have not taken a stance against anyone. Read the complete thread. All that I did was answer questions. I included the sticker and patch in my 72% calculation. I never dreamed the posting of the actual cash payout would cause this hostility and I do apologize. It is a competitive payout so I do not see the issue.

Nevin,

First let me say there is no game being played here. The post was to inform those who do not know how to figure a cash payback the correct way to do so. Jeremy was having trouble with yours so I helped. This should not upset anyone! Thank you for verifying the numbers I used.

You were never mentioned as one who was deceptive with paybacks as I am sure you would never tell the angler your cash payback was higher than seen above. All trails have prizes that are awarded at each event but they are not figured into a cash payback and I’m sure you agree. Cash payback is money returned on entry and we told ours with no issue.

I just pulled a random event from Team Supreme’s website (6/5/2005 North Star). I am basing this on a $180.00 entry including big bass (not sure). I even included the draw prize sticker, which I believe is purchase necessary to win (not sure). I show a 72% payback. Maybe I have the entry wrong? If it is correct the paybacks are about the same…. The draw stickers make up the 2% difference and I guess we could pay back an additional 2 dollars on the hundred if we also sell stickers. How’s your nut’s

1st $1,000.00

2nd $779.10

3rd $519.40

4th $160.00

BB $336.00

2BB $144.00

Sticker $150.00

Patch $50.00

Total $3138.50

Total entries received 24×180=$4,320.00

$3,138.50 divided by $4,320.00 = 72%

The data used above available on Team Supreme website.

I want to stress that there are no trails that I know of that offer large classics and payback 80% or 85% unless the money comes from somewhere else. There are just too many cost involved in operation and prize expenses. Most angler’s understand this and a straight forward response is the approach we use.

Jeremy if you don’t mind I will answer this question for Dave. First let me say this, payback misrepresentation is becoming a real issue in tournaments. Here are just a couple of ploys used by some less reputable trails. Do not be fooled by these ploys!

1. Deduction and non-inclusion of boats into payback. (There are trails out there that actually do not count boats in the payback. They claim they are staff and deduct 100% of their entry from the structure) example: 30 boats fish an event but 3 are determined to be “Staff Boats” thus the organization pays back on 27. At a $100 entry fee this is $300 taken from the top without ever starting the event. Anglers Choice does not do this!

2. Adding draw prizes to payback percentage is yet another ploy used. They payback 65% but add draw prizes to the percentage. Anglers Choice does not do this.

The list is long but I will stop here for now. Anglers Choice pays 70% at the ramp. ALL BOATS COUNTED AND NO DRAW PRIZES COUNTED.

We feel it is our obligation to be straight forward with the angler and those being deceptive will soon be “called out”. I encourage everyone to take the time to put a pencil to what you are fishing. It’s simple and only takes a second. Add all place money together and get total. Add all entries paid and get a total. Then divide the places paid total by the entries totaled. You may be surprised.

$700 paid back divided by $1000 paid entries = 70%

I am not pointing out any one circuit but the issue needs to be brought to the forefront. Put a pencil to it!!

We award 4 fully rigged BassCat boats at our classic and 100% paid back entry (optional only entry fee)

Championship qualification is based on points and you must fish a minimum of five(5) events to be eligible. You must fish seven (7) events and meet the qualifying criteria to fish any or all of four (4) Championships.

Each team may use two alternates per year and is allowed to fish alone once for region 3.

Rule below

16. CHAMPIONSHIP POINTS: Qualifying will be based on a points and pound format beginning with 100 points for first place and descending down by one 1) point per place. In each event “First Place” will receive 100 points plus their weight, e.g., 1st Place = 100 points + 20.50 lbs. = 120.50 points, 2nd Place = 99 points + 20.00 lbs. = 119 points. This procedure will be followed for all teams weighing fish. The lowest team having weight will be the last points given based on the point’s structure. All remaining teams that fished but did not weigh fish will receive one-half (½) of the next possible points based off the point structure. Example: The last team weighing fish in a 45-boat field ended at 40th place with 2.0 lbs. They would receive 60 points + 2.0 lbs = 62 points. The remaining 5 teams without weight would receive 29.5 points each (59/2 = 29.5). No points shall be awarded to contestants that pay but do not fish.

17. CHAMPIONSHIP QUALIFYING: You must fish a minimum of 5 regularly scheduled team tournaments during the year to qualify for a championship berth based on points system. You must fish a minimum of 6 regularly scheduled events to qualify for a championship berth based on the “Wild Card” system. Championship qualifiers will be determined after the last regularly scheduled tournament in each division. Angler’s Choice reserves the right to allow alternate teams to participate in regional championships to ensure full fields. To qualify for a “Wild Card” berth teams must fish 6 of 7 qualifying events. “Wild Card” qualifying shall be determined by their finishing position in the last tournament of the year and after points qualifiers have been removed.

20 or less boat average will qualify 8 teams plus 2 wild cards.

21 – 25 boat average will qualify 12 teams plus 5 wild cards.

26 – 30 boat average will qualify 16 teams plus 5 wild cards.

31 – 40 boat average will qualify 18 teams plus 6 wild cards.

41 – 50 boat average will qualify 20 teams plus 7 wild cards.

51 – 60 boat average will qualify 22 teams plus 8 wild cards.

61 – 70 boat average will qualify 24 teams plus 9 wild cards.

71 – 80 boat average will qualify 26 teams plus 10 wild cards.

80 and above boat average will qualify 40% of average plus 14 wild cards

Angler’s Choice tells you prior to seasons start where the Classic will be. In 2006 it will be Table Rock Lake MO.

Slop,

The payback is one paid position for every six boats.

example: 18 boats = 3 paid positions.

Daves not around a PC….

Thank you for the welcome! Hopefully the benefits of Angler’s Choice Tournaments will soon be offered to the visitors of this board!