Hey there John. Been Wondering about you. Wanted to get a hold of you this summer for ‘guide’ info up there but just didn’t work out. I’ll be off work for quite a few days coming right up, so, maybe we can get to gather out there – or on the Illinois. I’ll be in a different boat… the plate boat idea just didn’t work out for us. Brown V bottom with a Yamaha on it.
I’ll be in touch!
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Just got done talking with our CO. He said he didn’t know for sure what year they changed the rule but saugeye are no longer classified with a walleye on the Iowa side of the river. And there is no size limit but bag limits do apply. And he also told me he was not the co who wrote a ticket for a short saugeye and never heard of one being written.
Hey Herb, did you get that in writting and then notarized? 
That’s good news. Thanks for the info haasjj.
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but in most of these situations they already have their minds made up on what they intend to do and the public meetings are probably required and also to make you think you have some input.
Yup. I’ve been down this route. the IDNR knows stuff we don’t, we’re all uneducated hicks good for only paying taxes and their wages. Netting is good, boat docks are bad, and, we must all sacrifice to save polar bears.
Down here in the lower lands of 17 & 18 everything is just peachy too. John Swank and I got to be the only ones on 18 today. The fishes had nowhere to go but to our livewell.
Down here in the hinterlands of Pool 17 & 18 it’s been tough. A few fish, some really large fish, but, we’ve had lots of current and high water to contend with. Levels are dropping along with the flow now though, so, things will get nothing but better.
It’s going to be a pretty busy place.
The Genuity™
River Rumble
MISSISSIPPI RIVER
June 11-14, 2009
Weigh-ins at 5 p.m. ET
One easy thing that can be done is to write your State Legislature:
Perhaps they will reopen market hunting for ducks and geese, maybe open it up further for pheasants and quail. I’d like market hunting made avaliable for trophy deer as well. And, too, the entire river just as well be opened up for netting all year round – why should only Iowa and Illinois have all the fun.
Jeff, I’ll either be down here on the New Boston pool or up at Muscatine for the next few weeks. Most likely I’ll be one of those boats running around not catching much! : )
Hope to see you out there this year!
Hope it clears up and slows down by next week – when I have some days off to fish. Any commercial nets set yet?
Sturgeon netting has become very profitable. So, market hunters had nets strung across the New Boston pool completely covering the areas sport fishers have fished in the fall for generations. You’d have had to seen the amount of nets to have believed it. Two or three crews of out of state commercial netters practically blocked the river for sport fishing. Below is an explanation of the new rules from the IDNR.
Bass fishing probably won’t be hurt as much as walleye and sauger – yet anyway.
____________________________________________________________
Mr. Toland
I did hear from one other angler who said you had emailed him. I also talked with a local commercial fisher that confirmed what you said about the high number of nets in the 17 tailwater. Internally there has been a lot of communication going back and forth between the biologist and the upper chain of command. So I want to assure you that this issue has not been dropped. We are attempting to get some addition information from Illinois about there commercial harvest and will be analyzing that when it is available hopefully by mid January.
To answer your question if Ill and Iowa share regulations and license fees being the same. In general the two states try to keep the regulations the same both for commercial fishers and sport anglers. We have joint meeting between the two states and try to come to agreement
on regulations that will be used. However, it is not always possible
to do this. In the case of sturgeon commercial regulations what Iowa has in place.
1. Harvest slot from 27 to 32 inches
2. Harvest season from Oct. 15 to May 15
was what was agreed to during our meeting with Ill. We were able to get these regulations in place. Illinois has not because of opposition by the commercial fishers association in Ill. Currently Ill does not have a season or harvest slot for sturgeon. The commercial fishers like the sport angler are required to follow the more restrictive regulation so both resident and non resident commercial anglers must follow Iowa’s rules when fishing in Iowa water.
Ill is currently working on a package that has the following regulations.
1. Harvest slot from 24 to 32 inches
2. Harvest season from Oct. 1 to May 31
3 roe harvester license and roe buyer license.
As far as economics go they play very little part in regulator decisions. We first look at the need of the resource and then the impacts to the fishers. We try to take into account as may factors as possible but it can get troublesome when yo attempt to figure all of the economic, social, and even political consequences of a regulation. As far as the out of stater versus the resident I would say we lean toward the residents when it comes down to a call between them.
I doubt that the resource could sustain 20 additional commercial anglers in Louisa and Muscatine counties
Hopefully I addressed your concerns if not pleas contact me again.
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One a side note…check out the caviar in the ads on the right side…Bowfin???
http://www.sciencenews.org/articles/20060304/food.asp
The prices listed on the links from this URL certainly show why there’s so many nets in the river this last several months. Some of the guys fishing down here have snaged paddlefish and remarked on how puckered and mis-shaped their anal opening (how’s that for polite terminology) is. Perhaps they are being ‘milked’ before being returned to the river. Of course there is no way of knowing since I have never seen any enforcement on the river except during the summer season.
Just additional information but below is a reply I got from a gentleman with the Iowa Fisheries dept last fall. It wasn’t good news – Illinois is pressing for even less stringent regulations for market hunters. I’ve got tons of correspondence regarding this subject but the news has gotten continually worse with each mailing. Seems the sport fishers are taking a back seat to the market hunters.
“Ill is currently working on a package that has the following regulations.
1. Harvest slot from 24 to 32 inches
2. Harvest season from Oct. 1 to May 31
3 roe harvester license and roe buyer license.
As far as economics go they play very little part in regulator decisions. We first look at the need of the resource and then the impacts to the fishers. We try to take into account as may factors as possible but it can get troublesome when yo attempt to figure all of the economic, social, and even political consequences of a regulation. As
far as the out of stater versus the resident I would say we lean toward the residents when it comes down to a call between them.
I doubt that the resource could sustain 20 additional commercial anglers in Louisa and Muscatine counties
Hopefully I addressed your concerns if not pleas contact me again.”
I’ve been writing letters since last fall but I have absolutely no influence over anyone. Policy is dictated by a select few unelected state officials of which the tax payers have no say – no say as to whom is appointed and no say as to what regulations are put in place. This is just a total disgrace. The DNR will check your boat for any possible violation, can ruin your life if you drink a beer on the water, will fine you if you forget your fishing license, will fine you if miscounted and tossed an extra crappie in your live well or mis-measured a fish by an eighth of an inch yet they sponsor and endorse gill netting, hoop netting, and trammel netting of migratory fish.
I’ve fished and hunted since I could walk. Obeyed every rule to a fault. With the new commercial regulations it’s pretty much been a waste of effort. The river has been getting better and better the last several years – both in ‘cleaning itself up’ and in the fish populations. In just a few years the nets placed during the spawning cycles will have to have a terrible effect on everyone’s efforts towards improvement.
What good is a slot limit to a gill netter?
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Neil–read with great intrest your letter to the DNR–It is truly hard to believe this is allowed particularly if they are useing gill nets–I have never seen one used but I would think it would be hard to release a walleye ,bass,northern with out injury to them if in fact they are releaseing them, Would surely like to see the dnrs response to your question. Keep after them and good luck–gene shay (snagged)
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Neil, you meantioned sturgeon. Is that what’s being targeted? Is there a weight limit. I guess I’m surprised that they allow out state commercial fishing?
Certainly brings up many questions.
From what I’ve seen on P 4, they stay with the nets until they are pulled out…I would guess these are called seine nets. Are they useing the same down there?
Sturgeon are being targeted for roe. The caviar market has apparently gone through the ceiling due to over harvesting in Europe. The Iowa Conservationist Magazine had an article last fall about the money to be made from this harvest. Below are the regulations from the DNR’s site:
Sturgeon Regulations:
The minimum fork length for shovelnose sturgeon is 27 inches. No shovelnose sturgeon longer than 34 inches fork
length may be harvested from waters of the Mississippi River bordering Wisconsin. Shovelnose sturgeon is closed to
harvesting from May 16 – Oct 14. Shovelnose sturgeon must remain intact until the fish reaches the final processing
facility or business. For the purposes of this section, final processing facility does not include vessels or vehicles.
And, below are the regulations for checking nets:
Gear Attendance:
The licensee or a designated operator must be present when lifting commercial gear. All commercial gear shall be lifted
and emptied of catch at the following time intervals, except during periods of inclement weather. Inclement weather is
defined as that threatening to life, health or safety.
a. Constant attendance by the licensee or a designated operator of seines, trammel nets and gill nets is required
when the gear is fished by driving, dive-seining, seining, floating or drifting methods.
b. Hoop nets shall be attended at least once every 96 hours and slat nets at least once every 48 hours during open
water conditions. Hoop nets shall be attended at least once every 20 days during the ice cover conditions.
c. Trap nets and trotlines shall be attended at least once every 24 hours.
d. Gill nets and trammel nets shall be attended at least once every 24 hours during open water conditions, and at
least once every 96 hours during ice cover conditions.
As you can see, the sportfish have plenty of time to become stressed out and die between checking intervals.
All the regulations can be found at:
http://www.iowadnr.com/cs/files/542-0255.pdf
From a roundabout source I understand that one of the individuals setting these commercial regulations on the Illinois side is them self a commercial fisherman. If this is true then we can pretty much write off all the progress that’s been made on the river down here.
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Shimano, just Shimano.
unless you’ve still got any Cardinal 4’s.
Muscatine has a really nice new ramp within 1.5 miles of the dam. I haven’t been up there in a week or so, but, I’d bet a couple gold Rapalas that it’s open water – with these temps.
If you turn at the stoplight towards the old city ramp, cross the tracks then hang a left going upstream on the frontage road you’ll come to the new ramp.
good luck! my boat is in the the shop or else I’d be up there too.
More Netting correspondence
Mr. Toland
I did hear from one other angler who said you had emailed him. I also talked with a local commercial fisher that confirmed what you said about the high number of nets in the 17 tailwater. Internally there has been a lot of communication going back and forth between the biologist and the upper chain of command. So I want to assure you that this issue has not been dropped. We are attempting to get some addition information from Illinois about there commercial harvest and will be analyzing that when it is available hopefully by mid January.
To answer your question if Ill and Iowa share regulations and license fees being the same. In general the two states try to keep the regulations the same both for commercial fishers and sport anglers. We have joint meeting between the two states and try to come to agreement
on regulations that will be used. However, it is not always possible
to do this. In the case of sturgeon commercial regulations what Iowa has in place.
1. Harvest slot from 27 to 32 inches
2. Harvest season from Oct. 15 to May 15
was what was agreed to during our meeting with Ill. We were able to get these regulations in place. Illinois has not because of opposition by the commercial fishers association in Ill. Currently Ill does not have a season or harvest slot for sturgeon. The commercial fishers like the sport angler are required to follow the more restrictive regulation so both resident and non resident commercial anglers must follow Iowa’s rules when fishing in Iowa water.
Ill is currently working on a package that has the following regulations.
1. Harvest slot from 24 to 32 inches
2. Harvest season from Oct. 1 to May 31
3 roe harvester license and roe buyer license.
As far as economics go they play very little part in regulator decisions. We first look at the need of the resource and then the impacts to the fishers. We try to take into account as may factors as possible but it can get troublesome when yo attempt to figure all of the economic, social, and even political consequences of a regulation. As far as the out of stater versus the resident I would say we lean toward the residents when it comes down to a call between them.
I doubt that the resource could sustain 20 additional commercial anglers in Louisa and Muscatine counties
Hopefully I addressed your concerns if not pleas contact me again.
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Do you know what the differance is between the IA netting and the WI or MN netting?
No I don’t – yet. I have only read up (so far) on Iowa and Illinois. I hope to read as much of the reg’s on all of Iowa’s bordering states this winter.
Kind of an odd situation here in Iowa. On the one hand we’ve closed at least one dam to fishing during the fall season but removed restrictions on commercial netting on the rest of the river.
If nets were placed at strategic locations that blocked off access to the wintering holes of Channels and Flatheads, just imagine the long term effects on the fishery. It’s happening now with the sauger & walleye run due to Sturgeon netting.
Thanks for your interest.
If anyone is so inclined, the Iowa DNR would appreciate any input regarding commercial fishing in this area. I just received the following:
Mr. Toland
Please don’t feel it is necessary to apologize for asking questions or being concern about Iowa’s natural resources. It is the job of the IDNR to address questions or concerns any citizen has about our natural resources.
To answer your question you are on the correct route right now. The DNR and especially the Fisheries Bureau values the input of Iowa’s anglers. Because of your input this problem is now on the radar of not only fisheries but also the Law Enforcement Bureau. This morning Marion Conover, Chief of Fisheries, sent an email to request input from us field troops as to how best to address this issue and what if any changes can be made. We of course want to consider both the sport anglers and commercial anglers in trying to address this conflict between the two interest. Fishing regulations are set by Administrative Rule and unfortunately this is not a fast process. It often takes 6-months or longer even after a course of action is decided on for regulations to work through the system. That means no matter what is decided it won’t be possible to change anything before the river freezes over. Field staff will be sending recommendations into Marion and all 3 of us management biologist assigned to the Mississippi have already today began discussions as to what options should be considered.
My recommendation is that if you have any suggestions as to how this issue might be addressed that you send them me and I will add them to the list for consideration. If you know of other anglers that have an interest in this we would also value their input.
Again, thank you for your interest in the natural resources of Iowa.
Bernard Schonhoff
Fishery Biologist
Fairport Biology Station
3390 Highway 22
Muscatine, IA 52761
Phone 563-263-5062
email [email protected]
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One question, is it legal to camp at the landing? Where is this guy from down south staying at night?
Sent you a PM thingy Herb… just hate discussing all this publicly. If folks knew what was actually going on there might be a riot… As a pacifist democrat raised in the 60’s (albeit reformed in my old age) this really riles me up.
Just now received this from the Iowa DNR:
Dear Mr. Toland
Marion Conover has asked that I respond to your concerns about commercial nets set below locks and dams 17 and 18. I have contacted the local conservation officers and been assured that the nets are set below the required 900 ft. mark. The rules state that commercial gear cannot be set closer than 900 ft. below any dam. The nets are also all legally tagged as required. Although the nets are required to be tagged they are not required to be buoyed. I can understand that this can sometimes cause problems when anglers get there lures and jigs hung up in the nets. I am assuming the nets are set to capture sturgeon as the commercial season just re-opened on October 15th. As you are probably aware commercial fishers are not allowed to take walleye or sauger or any of the sport fish species. The DNR has recently made changes to the season and size limits for sturgeon and we are currently conducting studies to see if these regulations are working or if they need to be modified.
The closure of some dams to sport fishing in the winter was done because of high mortality rate on walleye and sauger released by anglers after being captured in deep holes below these dams. We are currently studying the effect of these closures to determine if there are other dams that may need to be closed.
Thank you for your comments and concerns about the fishery of the Mississippi River. If you have any questions you can contact me using the information provided below.
Bernard Schonhoff
Bernard Schonhoff
Fishery Biologist
Fairport Biology Station
3390 Highway 22
Muscatine, IA 52761
Phone 563-263-5062
email [email protected]
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Commercial fishing on upper pool 4 has been restricted for a long time.
so much for my publicity seeking idea…
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But when trammel or gill nets are used, those fish released are very stressed. I mean VERY STRESSED, plus their protective slime is nearly all removed.
I’d never see how fish were removed from trammel nets until talking with the fellow from Illinois the other day. He was cradling that big (6 to 8 pounder) between his arms and chest as he used a hooked tool to scrape along the fish while pulling the netting over it. During this process he dropped the fish a time or two onto the floor of his boat. After he finally got the gal untangled he dumped it over the far side of the boat – which I couldn’t see. Tossed it like it was a hunk of 2 x 4. I was so sickened after watching this I purposely averted my attention from the guy “releasing” the other 8 fish from the nets and just talked to the older gentleman in the boat with him (these were the fellows with the Illinois license).
Lets get commercial licenses next year Herb, head up to pool 4, and see how things go! : )
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I have probably spent over an hour so far closely watching them pull in nets (less than 15 yards away) and have yet to see a walleye or sauger in the nets.
One more last word. Today I was flagged over by the gentleman (he was indeed a Gentleman) that is commercial fishing with an Ill license. Was about 0800 and he had just pulled up to his first net. I was about 50 yards away or so, wondered what he wanted, pulled in my rig and motored down to him.
He just wanted to tell me where the walleyes/saugers were.. right there where he was pulling up his net. He had 9 gamefish in it within 30 yards. One was a walleye that would have gone between 6 to 8 pounds and the rest were 1 to 3 pound saugers. I was an arm’s length away talking to him as they pulled the net in.
I counted 32 bouys marking nets within one mile of the dam. There were several more bouys on farther downstream near the fourth wingdam.
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I am in no way in favor of a closed season. I don’t believe there is a problem with sportfishing on the walleye population as long as the present laws are followed. If there is then adjust the laws before closing the season. This is my favorite time of year. Something needs to be done but closing isn’t it. Maybe limiting the number of commercial nets within 1 mile of the dam. Commercial guys have to make a living too. I have probably spent over an hour so far closely watching them pull in nets (less than 15 yards away) and have yet to see a walleye or sauger in the nets. It may hamper the migration but it doesn’t seem to hurt their numbers.
I’m not in favor of closing a season either but I’m also not in favor of allowing one or two commercial fisherman to block the channel and 1/2 of the area that we’ve fished over the decades with nets.
It’s the consensus here from several locals (with hundreds of years combined experience fishing this pool) that this is the toughest November in memory.
But, I’m getting off my soap box and dropping this thread. Commerical fishermen gotta make a living too!
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Did you notice today that another guy is netting now.
I did see a whole bunch of nets further downstream today but didn’t realize they were from a second commercial fisherman. This is disgusting. Maybe we should all get our commercial licenses and start putting in nets from New Boston to the dam. Or, do what was done in Muscatine and start pulling and cutting up the nets.
I’d vote for a closed season in order to get this stopped.
