“A trick I learned years ago when fishing dams is if you’ve really got one locked up and you don’t wanna motor over to it because you don’t wanna spook fish then let about 10-15 yards of line out. Let the current take the slack line downstream a when the line becomes taught again give it a good hard yank.”
This will get out about 90% of snags when fishing wing dams. Works with jigs as well.
For those out on P2… are folks getting fish upstream or downstream of St. Paul? Hoping to get out tomorrow morning for the first time in a while and looking to focus my search. Thanks!
Another vote for North Suburban Eye specialists. They did my LASIK back in April and I LOVE it! I saw Dr. Lobanoff. The entire process was well explained and I felt very comfortable throughout.
Here is the presentation video for those that want to watch. The video is well done, with the slides that go with it.
http://mediasite.uvs.umn.edu/Mediasite/Viewer/?peid=73416496987d4669b0ee498d308be6a6
There was also a TON of traffic out there from Thursday thru the weekend. Lots of houses getting pulled… plowing… and folks getting out on the ice. Not exactly helping either.
Very excited to see this discussed! Science has shown that releasing larger bluegills is the way to go to maintain quality bluegill fishing. Below are three articles that really demonstrate why releasing larger BG is so important.
Basically…. If you keep the larger males, the smaller males sexually mature more quickly to fill the void, and divert energy into reproducing rather than growing. For bluegills, keeping smaller fish is PREFERRED!
If a lake is left undisturbed from angling, the environment favors bigger bluegills because they have an overall reproductive advantage. Bigger males get the best nesting spots, are better at defending the nest, etc. When they are harvested, that’s when conditions favor smaller fish filling the void.
What others outlined above are probably good targets… keep those fish 7-8″. Let those fish 9″ and bigger go. Nothing wrong with doing that – in fact, it should be applauded, not looked down upon for keeping “small” fish. I hope someday many more anglers feel this!
Male Reproductive Competition and Sex-Specific Growth Patterns in Bluegill
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Besides the seasnake…how was the fishing? I was out late yesteday and got blanked.
Hope you did better than us Gary! I did catch my PB whitey…at 18″ and a full belly.
The kids and I were out for the last couple hours yesterday. Nothing stellar but did put a few fish in the boat. The biggest was probably 26″. Cranks seemed a bit better than plastics.
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I would really like to get the scoop on eDNA.
AND get the DNR fold back to tagging cats.
A few tidbits… eDNA testing is a water test that actually detects the presence of DNA that is shed off of fish. I think it’s fairly reliable in what it detects… but it has many limitations. We don’t know whether the DNA came from a live fish, dead fish, fish parts, etc. It also provides no reference as to how many fish might be in an area. And frankly, the relative number of positive tests isn’t even all that meaningful. We aren’t even sure how long the DNA can persist in the water before it can’t be detected. But real rudimentary tests suggest maybe 24-48 hrs.
The positive test could have come from live fish in the area sampled – wouldn’t be surprising as river conditions the last 12-18 months have been favorable for fish migration. It also may have come from other sources. I believe there is a fish market in Minneapolis that sells fresh dead Asian Carp.
The technology can work for low density fish that are always really hard to collect during sampling (for example, it would work well on endangered species that are usually low density). The problem is you don’t know exactly what you have…. and when you go out to get a real specimen for confirmation it is difficult to pull off. Asian carp are especially evasive of traditional fish sampling techniques. It’s like your chasing ghosts.
I wish the science was further along… and folks are working hard to improve the test. For now, this is all we have to go on.
It’s a nasty corner for navigation traffic, which appears to be getting worse due to increased deposition.
As of this morning, water at the 494 boat ramp was right at the top of the concrete slabs. The river is dropping fast – almost 0.4ft/day in South St. Paul. We’ll still have “higher” flows through fall, but at least the boat ramps should be in better shape.
Oh… and for 494 ramp specifically, that concrete median should become less of an issue. Watched a guy literally back his trailer right down the middle this morning, straddling the concrete with both tires 
Bottomed the trailer out, but looked like he escaped with no damage.
While the fishing will get better as we move in to fall, I’ve though the bite has actually been “OK” considering it’s late-August. At least this summer has seemed better than the last couple. I think Mike’s reference to flow is a good one – we definitely have some this year.
Another highly-anecdotal observation – I haven’t seen large amounts of gizzard shad as we have in recent summers. Maybe as flows (and temps) drop we’ll see more bait out near the main channel. Maybe the forage is there and I haven’t seen it. Just a thought…
That was probably us. Was I strangling my daughter? 
I like taking the kids fishing… but the chaos…
If you don’t mind the typical Pool 2 size, the smallies are pretty active for a change of pace. The kids and I had fun watching them chase topwaters this morning. Only briefly chucked cranks, but did connect on two smaller walleyes.
Water is still fairly murky, but should be on a slow, steady fall.
All:
The issue of native fish passage and the spread of invasive species is a difficult one. There are several different issues brought up here, and I’m not sure I can take the time to go over them all.
I can tell you the issue of both fish passage and the spread of invasives (asian carp and others) is something the Corps is very aware of, and in discussion with our partner agencies (USFWS, both DNRs). The issues can be conflicting – namely, how do you provide benefits to our native species through fish passage while also minimizing the potential spread of exotics.
The issue of “fish passage” is something that has grown tremendously in the last 10-15 years. The Corps of Engineers has been involved with several fish passage projects over on the Red River, and is currently building one up at Red Lake. There is also a potential project to implement fish passage down at Lock and Dam 22 on the Mississippi. I’ll note that the reasons to pursue a study up here at L&D 3 are complicated and I won’t go into them here, but you can certainly ask this at the upcoming meeting.
The concern with asian carp is very fair. It’s also very complicated, and I don’t mean that as a cop out. These fish are showing up in several places, and those places aren’t always connected. In other words, there are many vectors that are moving these things around. While implementing barriers on a river like the Miss may seem to be a sound idea, they are expensive to construct, operate, and their effectiveness on a river as large as the Mississippi is perhaps questionable. I’m not saying it shouldn’t be attempted, but it must be recognized what the risks are, as well as the likelihood for success. There are also tradeoffs with fish barriers, such as costs, impacts to our native fish, and social impacts to boaters.
As to the concern of whether fish passage will accelerate the spread of asian carp… perhaps. But asian carp are strong swimmers, and it’s likely they would be able to move through L&D 3 during spring highwater. It could be argued that we are better off using fish passage to try and enhance the health of our native fish populations in order to better ward off the threat to exotics.
As for the banter on this board, it’s fine to disagree on this, as the answers certainly aren’t clear. Also good to see lively discussion – means that people care.
Bring your questions and concerns to the public meeting. I won’t be there, but my colleagues will and would be happy to address these valid concerns.
Elliott Stefanik
Biologist
US Army Corps of Engineers, St. Paul District
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I think they pull the gates depending on river flow. I want to say that occurs when the river flow reaches 36,000 cfs.
That’s correct. Gates are adjusted based on flow, and pulled completely from the water at L&D 3 around 35-36kcfs. L&D3 is one of the first dams to have its gates completely pulled from the water.
Gentlemen:
I can add some additional information. This project is in fact being done strictly for the bennefit of fishery resources. As outlined in the document linked, the plan is to notch 30 wingdams. The hope is that these notches would provide additional flow into areas that have become silted in around wingdams. This would scour sediments, provide some bathymetric (depth) diversity, and also provide additional current seams and complexity that fish like.
Many of the areas targeted have become extremely silted in. The wingdam field below St. Paul Park is a classic example.
To be clear, the overall improvements here may not be substantial – but I do believe they will be meaningful. Some areas may respond better than others. And frankly, it is unknown, probably unlikely, that these notches will directly result in more walleyes (or catfish or other species) within the pool. Factors such as water quality, spawning habitat, and flow and temperature conditions during spawning are likely more important factors in determining population strength. That said, the overall project would be realtively in-expensive (by Corps of Engineers standards) and would provide some habitat improvement within main channel border areas that have limited value much of the year (We did do some very limited fisheries sampling around the proposed wingdams which confirmed this). In my mind, doing something positive in a degraded habitat type at a good price makes sense
The schedule is to hopefully do the action next summer. All depends on funding, but that’s our tentative plan. The activity mentioned around the rock closing structure is a separate effort – we won’t be getting to the wingdams as a part of that effort.
I’ll also add that the sidechannel site mentioned in the article is still under discussion. That part of the project has a few more issues that need to be resolved before we plan on that one moving forward. But everyone (us and the agencies) are all in favor of the wingdam notching.
Hopefull we can get these actions moving forward ASAP.
The public review period for this did officially close, but folks are always welcome to call if they have further questions on the topic. I can also try to address some issues here.
Elliott Stefanik
Biologist/Project Manger
U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, St. Paul
651-290-5260
Fished Sunday morning and found the walleyes/saugers cooperative. Not fast action, but lively enough, including a 26″ and a 28″. Caught the bigger fish on 4″ Sassy shads.
An absolutely beautiful morning weather-wise. The 494 launch was getting busy when I left at noon.
Mike, similar results for me as well this spring. I was down again this morning, and had good action – mainly casting wingdams and trolling shoreline rip rap. Still, very few 27″ plus fish for me this spring. I also have picked up more saugers this May in my “walleye spots.”
I’d add that this weekend was probably the best so far for wingdam fish. Prior, I had way better luck elsewhere. Flows are down now where fish will really start using wingdams, but it’s still a bit surprising how long it’s taken for the wingdam bite to take off.
The dock was NOT in at 494 as of earlier this week. But I haven’t been out for a couple days.
Windy days are often a battle with boat control and lure presentation, and I’m not sure there are many easy solutions. I honestly try to avoid fishing Pool 2 when the winds rippin’ from the south – especially with higher flows (which we still have). But you’ve gotta go fishing when you can, so try to minimize the battle as much as possible. Try to pick spots that may have some shelter. In addition to off-channel areas, shoreline spots can provide some break from the wind, and with higher flows, you may find more fish in these areas. Of course, shorter casts and heavier jigs come into play as well.
Also, have realistic expectations. Realize it’s often windier on the water, and realize you’ll need to be patient. Try to keep it fun, and don’t let it get to you.
I’ll be down on Sunday. With another front coming through, I’ll bet it’ll be windy out of the south ahead of the next front. But with a 3-month-old at home, beggers can’t be choosers, so I gotta get out when I can.
Also… be advised the river at St. Paul is forecast to rise significantly over the next week. Right now we’re around 25,000 cfs, and it’s forecast to be close to 40,000 cfs late next week. That’s a pretty good flow and will move debris around.
http://www.crh.noaa.gov/ahps2/hydrograph.php?wfo=mpx&gage=stpm5&view=1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1
Was out this morning – tougher bite than earlier in the week, but we did get fish. Nothing to write home about. However, the river is coming up. It’s getting muddy, and their was definitely an increase in debris. I bumped two good size objects while on plane that I never even saw. Be aware. Water temp was 55-56F.
Turk, I saw a presentation last fall that indicated Lake St. Croix has a summer thermocline. I can’t remember when or where the observations were made, but it seems the thermocline was relatively shallow (maybe at 15′). In addition, it had notable DO sags below the thermocline.
I can’t find the study posted on-line, but I believe the work was done by USGS and/or the St. Croix Research Station.
Rivers don’t normally stratify, but Lake St. Croix is a different beast. I’m guessing the observations may have been made in the deeper parts of the river (south of Hudson), but thats only a guess.
You may find this response elsewhwere on the web… 
Slower for me this morning. Fished around 494 between 9:00 and 11:30. I tried a few wingdams with little success. Caught a handfull trolling rock along the main channel. Nothing huge, but all fish between 20 and 24″. I would’ve kept on trolling, but only had a short window of fishing time this morning.
Fished both Saturday and Sunday. Concentrated on fishing wingdams and shoreline rocks with cranks. Saturday morning had better action. No huge fish, but did get three at 25″, and a half-dozen others between 20 and 23″. Sunday afternoon had a bit slower action around mid-day, but the pace picked up between 4:00 and 7:00. The quality on Sunday was a bit better. Got one at 26″ and one at 28.5″, with several others between 19″ and 25″. Throw in a handfull of channel cats and a few drum, and it was an enjoyable couple days.
I hope to get out a couple nights this week. Fishing should be good.
Mike, I was out this morning and did OK between 6:30 and 9:30 (maybe not coincidentally this was before the wind picked up to a full-gale).
I’ll be out tomorrow morning with my very young son, so not sure when we’ll get there, or how long we’ll last. I’ll be in the red lund w/ 60hp tiller. Feel free to stop by.
Slab hunter, I hit White Ash on Sunday. It’s one of the first lakes to lock up in the area — it only had about 3″ of ice. Quality ice, but still a tad thin. I thought with the colder weather it would be closer to 4″. I watched tip-ups a couple hours while listening to the Pack — nothing doing. I hope to be back somewhere in Polk Co. next weekend, so let us know if you have any info.
Oh… I didn’t do any other scouting. Deer lake was basically open as I drove past, and I would think that most of the other larger lakes probably are as well.
Mike, I won’t make it out this weekend, but did get out on Tuesday. Had a good day, not great. Best action was between 1:00 and 2:00 p.m. including a 27″. Not much around sunset – go figure. I had to head in around 5:30, so didn’t give it much of a shot after dark.
I would be stunned if there was some kind of floating boom or other blockage across the entire channel. I would think there would be some provision to allow a boat to navigate somewhere through the area.
Even if such an event were planned, I would think it would need to be after the end of the commercial navigation season which is usually in December. I’ll do some digging and let folks know if I come up with anything.
Good thing to stay aware of. Obviously, we need to have access to the good bite that’s already underway. 
Sweet news. Any hints as to the types of areas you found fish at? Thanks.
