Wolf de-listing imminent

buckybadger wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Angler II wrote:</div>

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Matt Moen wrote:</div>
Have wolves in your area Bucky? A dog? If so, ever let it out in the yard on a chain? That’s where these dogs were when they were killed…South if Isanti…

Ever seen one on the hoof? Chasing deer? Watch your hunting area go from a high density of deer to almost none?

Easy for you to say that our neighbors cattle getting killed is a dumb argument when you don’t pay for them.

So you want to kill the wolves because they kill the deer that you want to hunt? You do see the flaw in this logic, right?

People that own cattle and animals where there are predators know the risks.

If you just want to shoot a wolf admit it but your arguments for it are thin.

If hunters want an open wolf season stop trying to position it as a herd control, saving cattle and dogs, etc. It’s a sport and trophy hunt. That’s what it is. There is nothing wrong with that and it’s easier to argue the population can sustain a sport hunt then saying we’re saving all the helpless cows and puppies.

Do you guys have wolves in your hunting areas? Do you hunt? I didn’t see an answer?

Do I hunt, Yes. Are there wolves here? No. I choose not to hunt in an area with wolves, so I don’t get your confusing argument.

If I chose to hunt in an area with wolves, I’d quickly come to realize and accept that the deer population may be impacted, dogs could be in danger in the woods or rural areas, and that I’m the one recreating in a wolf territory.

I want a closely managed season on wolves and would probably even put in to pursue one. I do not want to hear sob stories about domesticated animals (dogs, cattle) being killed in wolf territory though. Those living and hunting there made that choice. If they’re oblivious to those risks then it’s on them.
[/quote]

I see a common theme here….

Wolves were basically wiped out of Wisconsin and many other areas by settlers and farmers. Men(DNR) reintroduced wolves back into many areas. They didn’t come back to these areas naturally just like deer and many other wild animals didn’t come back naturally. Man should be able to control what we created in the woods.

What do you think the outdoors would be like if all hunting ceased? Does anyone think it would be all right and no problems? I think it would be a mess.

Yes, let’s open a managed hunt on wolves. I’m all for it (for about the third time).

I just get sick of the “they’re killing domestic animals” argument when 99.9% of the time a human made a choice that lead to the situation. I wouldn’t let my child swim in a shark tank. I also wouldn’t raise domestic animals in wolf territory in Northern WI for a living (or leave my dog outside with wolves around). All are decisions with obvious risks. If you make those choices, live with the outcomes.

Where do I get a wolf tag? I’ll admit it’s truly a trophy hunt and would love to have some sort of mount someday. No, I won’t bring my dogs, cattle, or young children along either.

buckybadger wrote:

I’ll admit it’s truly a trophy hunt and would love to have some sort of mount someday.

I think some people fail to realize that hunter success when pursuing wolves is extremely low. I believe hunting success is less that 5%. Trapping has a higher success rate.

mxskeeter wrote:

What do you think the outdoors would be like if all hunting ceased? Does anyone think it would be all right and no problems? I think it would be a mess.

I think it would be fine…for the critters. They would either eat or be eaten and it would play out.

The conflict here is humans, take us out of the playing field and no one would be there to witness any problems or declare it a mess because we’re the one’s that cause the mess. Yes/no?

If animals could talk they’d say that humans are the scourge of the planet. They’d have a valid argument.

If animals could talk they’d say that humans are the scourge of the planet. They’d have a valid argument.
[/quote]

I don’t disagree BUT should we get rid of humans and let the animals balance out nature on their own?

mxskeeter wrote:

I don’t disagree BUT should we get rid of humans and let the animals balance out nature on their own?

Well…no, I confess. A warm sunny Saturday and the beer was going down too good.

This morning I no longer “identify” as an opossum.

Personally I haven’t seen the reason for not hunting them. In fact I don’t see a reason for them at all. But, thats likely just me.

Dutchboy wrote:

Personally I haven’t seen the reason for not hunting them. In fact I don’t see a reason for them at all. But, thats likely just me.

And it’s not just you.

I get plenty of trail cam pics of wolves on our property west of Browerville MN. Actually found a kill the other day. I wish they would eat my parents dog…..(sarcasm), big can of worms there. I would love an opportunity to harvest one. Trophy hunting, well, I suppose if I’m not intending on eating what I shoot, it would be. That or pest control. Don’t see any reason there’s not a 1000 lottery tags a year. With success rate around 5%, no one would even notice the few missing wolves. I tried to participate in the hunts years back, but had no success.

riverruns wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Dutchboy wrote:</div>
Personally I haven’t seen the reason for not hunting them. In fact I don’t see a reason for them at all. But, thats likely just me.

And it’s not just you.

X3

Walleyestudent Andy Cox wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>mxskeeter wrote:</div>
I don’t disagree BUT should we get rid of humans and let the animals balance out nature on their own?

Well…no, I confess. A warm sunny Saturday and the beer was going down too good.

This morning I no longer “identify” as an opossum.

I thought the word was possum…

ClownColor wrote:

I thought the word was possum…

Dude…no, I live here in America not Australia

“Opossums and possums are different animals. Opossums live in North America, while possums live in Australia and other countries. Both animals are marsupials, but possums are more closely related to kangaroos.”

Walleyestudent Andy Cox wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>bob clowncolor wrote:</div>
I thought the word was possum…

Dude…no, I live here in America not Australia

“Opossums and possums are different animals. Opossums live in North America, while possums live in Australia and other countries. Both animals are marsupials, but possums are more closely related to kangaroos.”

Dude…its a quote from commercial…you know, a “joke”. But I love that you looked it up!

ClownColor wrote:

Dude…its a quote from commercial…you know, a “joke”. But I love that you looked it up!

Uhhh, I don’t remember the commercial so I missed the “joke”

But I was being serious, I no longer “identify” as an opossum.

Wolves were extirpated from the landscape by our ancestors to be able to take care of their existence back in the day. Wolves may have been reintroduced in certain areas, but it seems to me that an issue not talked about is how they were introduced… that is they were forced out of their pack, mostly males and took over another area for their territory to start another pack.

It seems to me that wolves came to WI from MN and MI, they weren’t reintroduced. But they were allowed to repopulate areas provided numbers were or would be manageable. Then the Federal Delisting came about because of lower numbers and an opportunity to bring an animal back into existence on our landscape. Still good with that… Once our animals were at the quota from the WDNR and the first delisting took place, were able to try to manage them. Then the lawsuit brought lising of them again. Numbers took off and we are where we are right now with delisting and control/management.

I’m ok with the argument that they will balance themselves. My argument is that in the natural world if there is not enough room for them, they will spread out. And Wolf territory will become places where humans, farmers and in-town communities were without wolves. so now what do we do???

By managing their population, hopefully we can create areas of safe haven for humans and wolves. I know that they have been seen in packs all the way to the Illinois border…

Mark

It doesn’t seem that large of an apex predator should be tolerated in populated areas. I don’t think there’s room anywhere in Wi and very little of Mn. Even more so with cougars. Bounty on both. Wipe them out.

Next thing you know “groups” will want to introduce Great White Sharks into Lake Harriet cuz they are cute.

Shoot the Wolves. 50 years from now nobody will ask where they went.

buckybadger wrote:

Yes, let’s open a managed hunt on wolves. I’m all for it (for about the third time).

I just get sick of the “they’re killing domestic animals” argument when 99.9% of the time a human made a choice that lead to the situation. I wouldn’t let my child swim in a shark tank. I also wouldn’t raise domestic animals in wolf territory in Northern WI for a living (or leave my dog outside with wolves around). All are decisions with obvious risks. If you make those choices, live with the outcomes.

Where do I get a wolf tag? I’ll admit it’s truly a trophy hunt and would love to have some sort of mount someday. No, I won’t bring my dogs, cattle, or young children along either.

What I get sick of is City people that tell us its our fault when wolves kill our cattle and dogs etc. Wolves used to live where you live too. Lets trap them from here and turn them loose in your neighborhood and watch the crap storm on the news. Wolves are NOT endangered… there are tens of thousands of them in the northern states, Canada and Alaska. When my Grandfather owned the farm there were no wolves here. This is where we farm and make our livelyhood. We don’t need outsiders who don’t know anything about farming telling us what we should of shouldn’t do. Sorry for the rant… I’ll shut up now!!!

I of course don’t want a wolf hunting season because they are just bigger fluffier dogs, and I like dogs. Sometimes I pretend that my dog is a wolf and she chose a sheltered/domesticated life because of the bond that we forged, that day in the alaskan wilderness, after the plane crash.

But other times I pretend she’s not mine when she poops in someone’s yard and I don’t want to pick it up.

So in that sense, if the wolves are pooping too much in my yard I’d probably want some sort of fecal control team(FCT). I think the FCT is an organization I could get behind. I mean how cool would it be to tell our grandkids that we were there when the FCT started AND we got to see the creation of Space Force. #Blessed.

We have dominion over all animals, fish, plants and the earth but we are also directed by God to take great care of them. They all deserve our care but God also said to be fruitful and multiply. Human population growth will also mean conflicts with animals.

I thought I would put a bit of scripture in this thread to make it interesting.

DTW

God also said, thou shalt not kill.

Hows that working out?

suzuki wrote:

It doesn’t seem that large of an apex predator should be tolerated in populated areas. I don’t think there’s room anywhere in Wi and very little of Mn. Even more so with cougars. Bounty on both. Wipe them out.

Maybe we start with wiping out woodticks, deerticks, n mosquitoes. $.01 bounty on each one.

slowpoke wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>buckybadger wrote:</div>
Yes, let’s open a managed hunt on wolves. I’m all for it (for about the third time).

I just get sick of the “they’re killing domestic animals” argument when 99.9% of the time a human made a choice that lead to the situation. I wouldn’t let my child swim in a shark tank. I also wouldn’t raise domestic animals in wolf territory in Northern WI for a living (or leave my dog outside with wolves around). All are decisions with obvious risks. If you make those choices, live with the outcomes.

Where do I get a wolf tag? I’ll admit it’s truly a trophy hunt and would love to have some sort of mount someday. No, I won’t bring my dogs, cattle, or young children along either.

What I get sick of is City people that tell us its our fault when wolves kill our cattle and dogs etc. Wolves used to live where you live too. Lets trap them from here and turn them loose in your neighborhood and watch the crap storm on the news. Wolves are NOT endangered… there are tens of thousands of them in the northern states, Canada and Alaska. When my Grandfather owned the farm there were no wolves here. This is where we farm and make our livelyhood. We don’t need outsiders who don’t know anything about farming telling us what we should of shouldn’t do. Sorry for the rant… I’ll shut up now!!!

1. Our family owns two farms and leases land to Farmers while living in the country. We live in a very rural area.

2. I don’t recall saying wolves were endangered, nor seeing anyone stating that.

3. We will have to agree to disagree on fault when a wolf kills a domestic animal. If people settle in an area, they need to know the dangers. Build a house in a floodplain, issues may happen. Move into a crime riddled neighborhood, issues may happen. Raise cattle near wolf territory, issues may happen. Have a dog outside in wolf territory, issues may happen.

Don’t use the “plight of domesticated animals” as the argument for wolf hunting or the threat to humans. Your dog is probably 100x more likely to be hit by a car than killed by a wolf. If my dog was killed by either, I’d be the first to take the blame. As for human deaths, there have been exactly 2 confirmed in all of North America. If these statistics are too scary, you are likely quarantined from the Coronavirus in your basement with 18 years of TP.

The deerpopulation argument? Fine. Desire for recreational/trophy hunting? Sure. Open them up to a closely managed hunt so I can get a tag…just stop spewing the fear mongering crap about some wild animal killing someone’s domesticated animals who put them in wolf territory by choice.

wkw wrote:

In my opinion they are a predator that needs to be controlled. Ask a rancher what he thinks of them when he finds a calf with his hind-end ate out. They kill just for the sport of it, and I think a rancher should be able to do the same.
WKW

Ya know, fewer cows is a good thing. Seriously that rancher is do far more harm to the environment and deer habitat than a pack of wolves. They were here with the deer before the cows, deer are still here.

My cousin is a rancher in the Western UP, heart of wolve country, hasn’t lost a calf yet because he’s smart enough to have donkeys.

Did somebody post the reason for having Wolves? If so I missed it.

Lets try this scenario…

What, say, if you’re a muskie angler. You love fishing for them more than any other sport there is. Now what if some politician came along and said that another critter is living in the water where your muskies live….and in the whole state’s waters and that you can’t fish muskies because the disturbance is up-setting the other critter. Somewhere along the line you come to find out that this other critter’s favorite food is none other than the muskies you love so. The other critter is NOT endangered but under some bogus federal protection something or other, and your precious muskies’ numbers start to dwindle big time.

Would you expect others from the outdoor community to understand your issue and support you or maybe they just tell you the other critter must be important and that your muskies can take it on the heel.

In the case of the wolves, their numbers are way out of wack with what the state’s carrying capacity is supposed to be. They’ve diminished a resource, deer and moose, in many areas because they’ve been living with their numbers unchecked and/or controlled. Nobody is suggesting total elimination of them. People just want to see the numbers brought into a healthy perspective so the deer and moose can also exist in the same areas.

buckybadger wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>slowpoke wrote:</div>

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>buckybadger wrote:</div>
Yes, let’s open a managed hunt on wolves. I’m all for it (for about the third time).

I just get sick of the “they’re killing domestic animals” argument when 99.9% of the time a human made a choice that lead to the situation. I wouldn’t let my child swim in a shark tank. I also wouldn’t raise domestic animals in wolf territory in Northern WI for a living (or leave my dog outside with wolves around). All are decisions with obvious risks. If you make those choices, live with the outcomes.

Where do I get a wolf tag? I’ll admit it’s truly a trophy hunt and would love to have some sort of mount someday. No, I won’t bring my dogs, cattle, or young children along either.

What I get sick of is City people that tell us its our fault when wolves kill our cattle and dogs etc. Wolves used to live where you live too. Lets trap them from here and turn them loose in your neighborhood and watch the crap storm on the news. Wolves are NOT endangered… there are tens of thousands of them in the northern states, Canada and Alaska. When my Grandfather owned the farm there were no wolves here. This is where we farm and make our livelyhood. We don’t need outsiders who don’t know anything about farming telling us what we should of shouldn’t do. Sorry for the rant… I’ll shut up now!!!

1. Our family owns two farms and leases land to Farmers while living in the country. We live in a very rural area.

2. I don’t recall saying wolves were endangered, nor seeing anyone stating that.

3. We will have to agree to disagree on fault when a wolf kills a domestic animal. If people settle in an area, they need to know the dangers. Build a house in a floodplain, issues may happen. Move into a crime riddled neighborhood, issues may happen. Raise cattle near wolf territory, issues may happen. Have a dog outside in wolf territory, issues may happen.

Don’t use the “plight of domesticated animals” as the argument for wolf hunting or the threat to humans. Your dog is probably 100x more likely to be hit by a car than killed by a wolf. If my dog was killed by either, I’d be the first to take the blame. As for human deaths, there have been exactly 2 confirmed in all of North America. If these statistics are too scary, you are likely quarantined from the Coronavirus in your basement with 18 years of TP.

The deerpopulation argument? Fine. Desire for recreational/trophy hunting? Sure. Open them up to a closely managed hunt so I can get a tag…just stop spewing the fear mongering crap about some wild animal killing someone’s domesticated animals who put them in wolf territory by choice.

If you want a wolf management, why fight any argument to do so?

Time to break out some popcorn for this show.

Donald is serving…

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Angler II wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>buckybadger wrote:</div>

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>slowpoke wrote:</div>

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>buckybadger wrote:</div>
Yes, let’s open a managed hunt on wolves. I’m all for it (for about the third time).

I just get sick of the “they’re killing domestic animals” argument when 99.9% of the time a human made a choice that lead to the situation. I wouldn’t let my child swim in a shark tank. I also wouldn’t raise domestic animals in wolf territory in Northern WI for a living (or leave my dog outside with wolves around). All are decisions with obvious risks. If you make those choices, live with the outcomes.

Where do I get a wolf tag? I’ll admit it’s truly a trophy hunt and would love to have some sort of mount someday. No, I won’t bring my dogs, cattle, or young children along either.

What I get sick of is City people that tell us its our fault when wolves kill our cattle and dogs etc. Wolves used to live where you live too. Lets trap them from here and turn them loose in your neighborhood and watch the crap storm on the news. Wolves are NOT endangered… there are tens of thousands of them in the northern states, Canada and Alaska. When my Grandfather owned the farm there were no wolves here. This is where we farm and make our livelyhood. We don’t need outsiders who don’t know anything about farming telling us what we should of shouldn’t do. Sorry for the rant… I’ll shut up now!!!

1. Our family owns two farms and leases land to Farmers while living in the country. We live in a very rural area.

2. I don’t recall saying wolves were endangered, nor seeing anyone stating that.

3. We will have to agree to disagree on fault when a wolf kills a domestic animal. If people settle in an area, they need to know the dangers. Build a house in a floodplain, issues may happen. Move into a crime riddled neighborhood, issues may happen. Raise cattle near wolf territory, issues may happen. Have a dog outside in wolf territory, issues may happen.

Don’t use the “plight of domesticated animals” as the argument for wolf hunting or the threat to humans. Your dog is probably 100x more likely to be hit by a car than killed by a wolf. If my dog was killed by either, I’d be the first to take the blame. As for human deaths, there have been exactly 2 confirmed in all of North America. If these statistics are too scary, you are likely quarantined from the Coronavirus in your basement with 18 years of TP.

The deerpopulation argument? Fine. Desire for recreational/trophy hunting? Sure. Open them up to a closely managed hunt so I can get a tag…just stop spewing the fear mongering crap about some wild animal killing someone’s domesticated animals who put them in wolf territory by choice.

If you want a wolf management, why fight any argument to do so?

…because people outside of this tiny forum who deal with laws and federal regulations are going to want factual reasons for them to be managed/hunted for long term management and seasons. Wolves are not ripping someone’s mutt off the foot of their bed while they sleep at night, nor are they mowing down herds of cattle every night in MN or massacring kids. If that’s the argument put forward, it will be an ongoing battle to keep a season on wolves. Quit with the BS fear mongering and argue wolf management based on the positive economic impacts of it (protecting moose/deer populations which brings in big $$$ or simply trophy hunting with a lottery system). Politicians and those involved in federal regulations don’t give two $h*** if lassie is killed in someone’s backyard when they let them outside in Northern MN or any other random domestic animal. They will care if you can promote wolf hunting and management through dollar signs, which is all they care about. For every person here that argues for wolf hunts or extermination based on their poor pet animals or cattle being threatened, there’s another equally uninformed person out there who sees wolves as some peaceful harmless animal. Good luck with that battle.