Wheelhouse 12 volt trouble

So I like to run the generator sparingly. Only to top off the batteries for 6-8 hours mid day then I shut it off for the evening/overnight. Never had a problem for two years in this house and 3 years in previous house. I installed 2- group 27 interstates in previous house, and 2- group 31 AGM’s in this house. I have cigarette lighter plug ins at the TV and a couple throughout the house. I plug in those cigarette inverters to run the TV, and another one to run the bubbler on the minnows. Like I said never had a problem. Before I could probably run a couple days without generator if I had to. Recently when the generator is off and my furnace kicks in the voltage drops so low that it kicks out both plug in inverters. Not a big deal, just have to reset both inverters. But if I’m sleeping when this happens then my minnows go without the bubbler and I’ve killed a bunch because of it. I pulled the 31’s today, checked the inverter charger on the fish house I’m getting 13.6V, the batteries alone are 12.5 ish. I put my boat batteries in (2-group 27 interstates) same problem. Kicks out small inverters for tv and bubbler. Any ideas on what could have changed? Do you think the onboard inverter/charger is going out?

MNdrifter wrote:

But if I’m sleeping when this happens then my minnows go without the bubbler and I’ve killed a bunch because of it.

Well this surprises me?

I’ve just been using one of those battery operated bubble boxes that I turn on and off throughout the day. I’ll let it run for 10-15 minutes before I go to bed and it stays off all night until the next morning and I have very minimal minnow mortality even after 3 days.

This is with fatheads and suckers, maybe you’re having shiners die?

Anyway, sorry I can’t help at all with your electrical problem. I’m still trying to figure out how to change the light bulb with the ceiling fan spinning.

Resting voltage of the batteries should be 12.7 volts. Not sure what size of charger you have but your batteries might be faulty. Need a little more info to trouble shoot the problem. Do you leave the house out all winter or are you taking it home weekly. If you are leaving it on the ice you should make sure before you leave that the batteries are fully charged before you leave. When batteries are not fully charged the batterys can sulfate. This will decrease the amount of potential the batteries will have. It would help if you had a solar panel to keep a trickle charge on the batteries while you are gone. Not fully charged batteries do not do well in the cold. On the other scenario if you take it home and the batteries are fully charged when you leave and this problem is happening it could be your batteries or you are not getting enough charge to recover.

I bring it home, and plugged into garage outlet when not in use. They SHOULD be fully charged every outing. I’d do a solar pannel but I don’t see much good as I run my generator mid day anyways to top off batteries then shut it down early evening. Used to work just fine but not anymore. 🤷‍♂️ I pulled the 31’s and am going to bring them to batteries plus to test them. We shall see. Thanks.

Correct if you bring it home there is no use for a solar panel. Sounds like you verified that the charger is working so my guess is the batteries. In the past couple of years I have seen brand new batteries that have been faulty. Let us know what you find out.

If same thing happens with boat batteries, has to be something else I would think. Wire or connection between batteries and inverter maybe?

MNdrifter wrote:

Recently when the generator is off and my furnace kicks in the voltage drops so low that it kicks out both plug in inverters.

Well there’s the biggest clue to me to what it might be. I’m going to suggest the blower motor in your furnace is slowly going bad. It’s drawing excessive amperage to start and that’s what’s drawing down the amperage and kicking out your inverters.

Check your voltage and if possible your amperage draw both before and when the furnace kicks in I’ll bet you see a big spike in amperage draw and a dip in voltage when the furnace is kicking in. Record the readings.

I would try to strip down the furnace until you can get to the blower motor and lubricate the bearings. Dry bearings will cause excessive strain on the motor trying to get started. Then recheck the readings for voltage drop and amperage draw.

It’s likely not your batteries because you verified the problem still exists when you changed out to a different set of batteries.

Grouse

Can’t you just use a 12V DC power source for the aerator, and eliminate that inverter altogether?

https://www.frabill.com/browse/open-water/aeration/aeration-systems/premium-whisper-quiet-portable-aerator

HRG

Good idea Grouse. I will try that. You may be onto something there. Because it happens immediately when the blower kicks on before you hear the gas control valve snap on.

Hot Runr Guy wrote:

Can’t you just use a 12V DC power source for the aerator, and eliminate that inverter altogether?

https://www.frabill.com/browse/open-water/aeration/aeration-systems/premium-whisper-quiet-portable-aerator

HRG

That looks like a nice unit. Have you tried it? I’m a little leary on aerators, the one that came with the Engel cooler is so loud it’s hard to sleep when it’s running.

MNdrifter wrote:

G
That looks like a nice unit. Have you tried it? I’m a little leary on aerators, the one that came with the Engel cooler is so loud it’s hard to sleep when it’s running.

Sorry, no experience with it, I was just looking to see if there was a 12V DC option available.

HRG

MNdrifter wrote:

Good idea Grouse. I will try that. You may be onto something there. Because it happens immediately when the blower kicks on before you hear the gas control valve snap on.

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Hot Runr Guy wrote:</div>
Can’t you just use a 12V DC power source for the aerator, and eliminate that inverter altogether?

https://www.frabill.com/browse/open-water/aeration/aeration-systems/premium-whisper-quiet-portable-aerator

HRG

That looks like a nice unit. Have you tried it? I’m a little leary on aerators, the one that came with the Engel cooler is so loud it’s hard to sleep when it’s running.

Drink more busch lite ?

I just kept 2 scoops of fatheads in my Engel cooler for 3 days without a single casualty without a Aerator. I add slush or snow to it every couple hours to keep the water cold and they last forever.

I likely buy way too many minnows as my buddy is a minnow trapper. I buy in bulk for 3-4 weekends worth. A couple sizes of Suckers,shiners,rainbows,jumbo Fatheads. An aerator is a must. We almost had a catastrophe on Red a couple weeks ago. Just in the time we went to shore for a fish fry, when we got back to the fish house 1/2 of my minnows we’re almost dead.

Overcrowding minnows is a surefire way to end up with dead minnows. Maybe only buy enough for 2 weeks instead of a month. Just a suggestion. Good luck.

Do i have a good battery?

Use a load tester.
$25

Good thing to own.

Marine metal makes a bait aerator from a bilge pump. Run them on a timer, 30 seconds every 5 minutes. You can’t over crowd a bucket with that system.
FYI

That’s what i use when i have 30 BIG suckers to keep alive!

Hot Runr Guy wrote:

Can’t you just use a 12V DC power source for the aerator, and eliminate that inverter altogether?

https://www.frabill.com/browse/open-water/aeration/aeration-systems/premium-whisper-quiet-portable-aerator

HRG

I have that one. I wouldn’t call it whisper quiet but it’s not bad. I like the option between 12 volt plug in and the batteries.
DT

MNdrifter wrote:

Good idea Grouse. I will try that. You may be onto something there. Because it happens immediately when the blower kicks on before you hear the gas control valve snap on.

I’m thinking that the furnace is an RV furnace and it runs on DC, correct? If so, most guys don’t have a meter that will test DC amperage as that feature only tends to come with a more expensive meter. If you don’t have a meter that will test DC amps, just hook the meter up to the battery and watch the voltage drop when the furnace kicks on. My guess is the motor is straining hard to get up to speed with dry/dirty bearings and is dropping the voltage below whatever voltage the “low battery” feature on the inverters is set to kick off the inverters.

My guess is that if you get into the blower unit and spin the fan, you will feel resistance because the motor bearings are either full of dirt or are just plain going bad.

You can often save the bearings by cleaning and lubercating with a liberal dose of Deep Creep or other penetrating oil, but just a note it’s best to remove the motor and take outside for cleaning. Don’t just start spraying lube all over with the motor in place or you’re going to be smelling it in the house for the next hundred years. Remove the motor if possible, clean and lube the motor and get her running smoothly and then clean up the excess spray on the motor as much as possible.

If that doesn’t solve the problem, I’d strongly suspect your blower motor is going bad. I doubt this is an expensive enough part to justify having the old motor rebuilt, so just order a new one.

BTW FBRM is right. A battery load tester is a fantastic tool to own.

Harbor Freight for $20. Absolutely love this tool, no more guessing and tests battery, alternator, and starter in one tool. How many guys have replaced batteries only to find out the alternator is the issue? This tester will pay for itself.

Grouse

If the bearings are going bad do yourself a favor and replace the whole motor. You can lube the bearings and it might seem better but the same problem will come back to haunt you. I’m guessing there small sealed bearings like most blower motors have

Ding ding. You were right mr grouse. I tore it down reached in with a screwdriver and could feel it catching slightly every 1/4 turn of the blower wheel. So I tore it apart got the motor out. Gonna see if I can find one tomorrow after work in St Cloud. Thanks grouse. I would have never thought of that! I’ll buy you a beer someday if we ever cross paths. Even a hipster beer if that’s what your into.