What Happened to the White Bass

I started going to Lake Pepin in 1989 to White Bass fish. The fishing was great almost every year until about 7 years ago. Now we hardly catch enough White Bass to justify the trip up to fish. We just got back from there on Friday (actually came home 3 days early) and did not catch one White Bass in 3 days of fishing. Back in the 90’s we would chase the gulls and dodge all the other fisherman (there would be 10-20 other boats out) usually limiting out after about 3-4 days of fishing. Now there is only a boat or two trying for White Bass and we rarely see the gulls diving during a White Bass feeding frenzy. One thing I know has changed is the weather. The temperature back then was a lot colder than now. We would almost always be fishing in coveralls….now we fish in shorts. We fish at the same time of the year as we did in the 90’s. So…..anybody know what might have caused the disappearance of the Whites?

Ya ate them all. And Seth would agree.

Nope, I don’t know how to answer your statements or implications.

What I can tell you is there’s an abundance of them. River is always changing and if you don’t, your catch rates will. I can’t imply what and where you went, you didn’t say.

Right now the flow is low, there’s bait galore, and if you spend any time on the water after dark in the schools of baitfish there isn’t a silent second where something isn’t busting surface.

Now, you’ve also seen a little erratic weather in the past week as well. Water was cold then jumped way up, then fluctuated, now big rain and… Hey what’s new there right! All that means is everything is moving when things are changing!

Sorry to hear your trip was a bust!!

riverruns wrote:

Ya ate them all. And Seth would agree.

I concur with Seth

We stayed in Pepin and fished from Deer Island to Reeds Landing on both sides of the lake. We do not fish after dark, so would not know anything about fish busting bait fish. We finally gave up White Bass fishing and caught a few Crappie and Blue Gills until the trim on my motor quit working and sent us home. Thanks for the replies. Apparently the fishing is just as good as it was in the 90’s and I forgot how to fish for them.

Might need to try when water temps cool down.

There’s a lot less of them on this the SCR I guarantee you that

rdgallo wrote:

Back in the 90’s we would chase….The temperature back then was a lot colder than now. We would almost always be fishing in coveralls….now we fish in shorts. We fish at the same time of the year as we did in the 90’s.

The climate has changed for one thing. We don’t see the sustained cold during the winters like we did year back. The summers are more moderate and the spring and fall weather is more variable.

Mike suggested you fish when the water is cooler and that’s likely the best advice. You mention fishing in coveralls back when and fishing in shorts should have been the clue. While chronologically you fished the same time period, you probably need to spend more time watching water temps and water levels to get back on the bite track. These two indicators are more important in finding the whites than moon phases or calandar dates.

Deer Island to Reeds leaves a lot of un-fished river/lake available so you may have simply cut yourself short. At this time of year with the water temps we have right now I’d have been looking for whites in more of a river setting below Wabasha [high bridge to Tipiota Point], Wisconsin side of the channel and I’d have been looking more for dead minnows washing along the shoreline than gulls diving. The white are notorious hunters and will often just attack shoals of minnows to randomly kill, leaving them to float away. Maybe sport to them?

Another thing to look for is the size of the whites you are catching if you are catching some crappies too….if they are small, under 5″-6″ and you’re picking up a black crappie here and there you likely won’t find keeper white bass nearby. Mature white bass are open water denizens and won’t much associate with black crappie schools. White crappies are open water fish and love to roam and will often tag along with white bass schools, usually in the wake of them, and feed on the wounded minnows the bass leave behind. Walleyes will do the same thing. Just being aware of who those bass like to hang with can often help eliminate water or indicate a need to expand a search area a little.

Thanks, Tom. Very good info. I appreciate your response.

I don’t get to fish the area, but enjoyed the thread…. Tom, I am always impressed with your insight.

rdgallo wrote:

Apparently the fishing is just as good as it was in the 90’s and I forgot how to fish for them.

I did not imply that at all did I.

Wouldn’t know what fishing the sippi was in the 90’s, but I do have a pretty good gauge on it today.

White bass are maybe one of those fish you’ll do better with by understanding how their forage and the water temps that affect that forage come into play in the annual cycle of the bass. Whites are minnow feeders and like their prey tend to segregate according to size….meaning the larger members of each species seek out similar sized bros and sisters to hang with. Larger member of, say a school of fatheads, will push smaller members away from the best food sources, most comfortable water temps, shade….a whole myriad of little preferences. The small fish become peripheral fish and are vulnerable to fish like crappies and sunfish that find them fairly easy pickings without a lot of energy expenditure. These lesser fish still need to feed and have the other influences to survive but because they tend to be misplaced also helps set up how the bass will relate to them. The bass prefer larger members of the forage chain that’s available at any one time and they will swim right past forage that isn’t of the size they want to eat or hunt.

Water temperature can be the biggest influence on the forage. Wide open very warm water fosters a lot of algae and plankton growth that the minnows feed on. As the water begins to cool the warmest is going to be found in secluded and protected areas and the smaller members of the food chain flock to these areas because they will not do well in the cooling water where current is constantly sweeping degrees away and downstream. These small fish gathering areas are where one will find crappies and sunfish en masse feeding and even small white will come in a feed with them. The larger, sturdier members of the forage will and can tolerate dropping water temps a bit more but they too will start a shift towards the shorelines where the ground itself helps buffer the heat loss. Whites like larger prey and will follow these schools to feed. The forage schools are very mobile and stay on the move trying to stay in touch with the dwindling algae and plankton sources which are now declining rapidly with dropping water temps. That’s why so many historic white bass fisheries have shown so much gull activity that has seemingly always accompanied a good white bite. Historically its climate and weather combined that help to determine where and when a white bite will occur.

It may help to understand the elements better too. Weather should be looked at as what’s occurring very short term. Weather can mess with a bite day to day and maybe even week to week. Fish adjust to weather changes rapidly. CLIMATE is a study of weather over a long period of time….years. Its a history of the weather during that time. Like the 4 seasons we enjoy, people can mistake calendar periods for climate when they should be looking closer at what the weather is actually doing in the short term. A minor cool down can make fish move a short distance to stay in a comfort zone or to stay with a food source reacting as well to the cool down. We know our climate is changing and with the change will come variables not yet seen on the fishing front that can influence the bite by a month or more. Rest assured, though, that historically our seasons change and with the change will come what has always been…..just at a different point in time.

If I had my druthers on the Mississippi River in pools 4 and 5, for jigging walleyes and for chasing crappies I’d like a sharper contrast between warm and cold water in the short term The shorter the period between warm water and cold water condenses predictable fish locations and feeding activity. Knowing how crappies and walleye/sauger react to temperature loss in the water also helps me to know where to seek out white bass because for the most part it will be in totally different water…..shoreline, channel or water column.

Ealier August when the weather was cold,alot white bass then but now Sept it’s too hot,you can wait abit maybe the end of sept it may colder then…

Tom, thank you for sharing your wisdom.

Those are long responses I wish were longer. Great insight and information!

Thanks, Tom. This is some really fine information. Sounds like we should have been adjusting when we went up there as the weather has gotten warmer through the years instead of continuing to go at the same time in Sept. Too bad I wasn’t smart enough to figure this out.

its not just p4. down here on 15 and 16 we used to catch them in bunches. we still catch occasionally but nothing like it once was. that being said i don’t know if when we used to clober them in the late 90’s to mid 2000’s was just a boon handful of years for us and we have just been dealing with normal amounts of fish the last 10 years or so.

rdgallo wrote:

Back in the 90’s we would chase the gulls and dodge all the other fisherman (there would be 10-20 other boats out) usually limiting out after about 3-4 days of fishing.

hnd, I started fishing pool 4 out of Pepin in 1989 and from 1989 until about 2009, we always had good fishing and got our limits. From 2010 until now, we have never limited out and this year I never caught a White Bass. I won’t be back anymore and am actually going to sell my Ranger boat as I was only using it once a year up there for the last 15 to 20 years. Anyway, thanks for your post.
Ron

Seth F wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>rdgallo wrote:</div>
Back in the 90’s we would chase the gulls and dodge all the other fisherman (there would be 10-20 other boats out) usually limiting out after about 3-4 days of fishing.

Now this is a curious post…?

What is curious about it?

rdgallo wrote:

What is curious about it?

Your better off not knowing.

Ok. Thanks.

rdgallo wrote:

What is curious about it?

Check the mille lacs forum and you will see

Tom hands down you write the best info on any subject/post that you reply on. My sincere thanks.

Thanks for the kudos guys!

Something I have not touched on simply because I am not that well schooled on it is loss of spawning habitat. I have seen a once dandy white bass population on Lake Zumbro [a reservoir] go straight down the toilet because of such an issue. Several years of high water events and siltation have all but erased white bass there. I still see a few white but most are not large like they were at one time so some limited spawning must be taking place but the big spring runs I remember are done.

The big river and Pepin are also under siege from siltation so it is conceivable that spawning habitat is coming under the gun from it and affecting the whites’ numbers but I have no way to validate the idea. If I am not mistaken I think the boys at the Fisheries Dept in Lake City have an active tagged fish program involving white bass. I may be mistaken though.

One other consideration should be the cyclic nature of white bass. Like grouse and rabbits they go thru cycles of high and low population densities. Black crappies can do the same thing. Size specific parasitic fish kills also tend to hold numbers in check every now and again. I’ve witnessed kills of this nature on the Zumbro in both black crappies and white bass. I’ve also seen both bounce back as long as their spawning habitat stays strong. The Mississippi River and Pepin are not exempt from these influences that swing populations one way or the other.

I try to stay positive when I start to see things get out of a state of flux. I may have to realize that things are changing but these fish have been in this river system for eons and the biological strength that’s inherent in the dna makes them super suitable to adapt. I still favor the water temp ideas I’ve laid out. Here we are on the first day of all and its 95 degrees here. And bright sunshine. And the river is flowing a bit low. A day like this can blow a hole in what the fish should be doing, but we’ve had a week of the same so imagine how long its going to take to get things to where we think they should be. At this rate I’ll open deer season in a T-shirt again.

One thing that Tom alludes to is that if everything in the enviroment stayed exactly the same you would still have significant population fluctuations (got a good explanation for why this is-kinda mathy stuff, explains the grouse thing)

To throw a topic similar to the white bass out there, does anyone remember the walleyes of the 70 and 80 into the 90 era? Early 21 century also. How about the huge crappies of that era also?

Of course this is pools 5-8. So not lake Pepin.

Things are changing. When the bite gets good at anytime, it’s lights out with people fishing hard and taking what they can. Don’t kid yourself.
Shawn

I first started fishing Pool 2 in 2006. I clearly remember watching tugs head up the river, and CLOUDS of gulls following them picking off Shad stunned by the props. I also used to “jump fish” the White Bass. Just idle along looking for blow ups on the surface, run over there and get a few casts in and pop some nice White Bass. All those fish were released, by the way. I had great fun for a couple of years throwing streamer flies and catching dozens of White Bass.

Then it ended very abruptly. I still catch the occasional Whitey, but I don’t see the large schools. And I certainly don’t see the Shad the was I used to. Something changed.

SR

Couple weeks ago I was out in frontenac area and there were swarms of shad trying to get away from what I presumed were white bass. I tried throwing all sorts of crap at them to no avail. I saw a few break the surface and they sure looked like white bass from the few quick glimpses I seen. I can tell you one thing that is for sure and there is no shortage of bait in pool 4 even after all the shad washed up on shore this spring. All summer up and down both sides of the river I have always seen shad breaking the surface and huge schools on the graph. Most of this is up river from Hok si la. I been fishing the river over 20 years and do not recall seeing this much activity on the surface. I think all the fish are getting fat and happy.