E-Callers or Full Bodies??

Just picked up the new DU magazine and read the article on decoying snows close. The jist of the article seemed to indicate that if you use more full bodied decoys, the better you’ll do. I don’t doubt this however, this group was funded by Avery and was using anywhere from 500 – 1700 full bodies. Ouch, I don’t even want to try and estimate the cost of approaching that level.

The other thing that makes me skeptical is that they used high quality e-callers that are legal in the spring but not in the fall. It would have been interesting to see the results had they not used e-callers. We could have then seen a true comparison to the rags/socks to the full bodies.

Anyone else read this? What are your thoughts? Would they have gotten snows to tornado and commit with just the full bodies and manual calls?

I’AM NEW TO THIS FIELD HUNTING SITUATION,BUT I’M TRYING TO LEARN FOR OUR NORTH DAKOTA TRIPS (THREE SO FAR)

BUT I CAN JUST THINK THAT MORE OF ANYTHING IS BETTER,
BUT LIKE WHAT YOU SAID THIS WAS SPONSERED BY AVERY, AND OF COURSE THEY WILL SAY THAT MORE HARD BODIES IS BETTER BUT WHO CAN AFFORD $4,200.00 FOR DECOYS (500=42DOZ X 100.00 PER DOZ)
WELCOME TO SOME OF THE THINGS I DON’T AGREE WITH IN REGUARDS TO DU, THEY WILL TRY TO GET YOU TO FALL FOR THE BIG MONEY, AND NOTICE ALL THEIR HUNTS ARE ALLWAYS WITH THE BIG MONEY OUTFITTERS, WHAT ABOUT US PEOPLE THAT HAVE TO DO THIS WITH OUR OWN RESOURCES ?? BUT THEY WILL SURE TAKE OUR MONEY AT THE BANQUETS DON’T THEY FOR THEIR OFFICERS TO GO ON THESE HUNTS.

SORRY I WILL GET OFF THE SOAPBOX NOW, AND END IN SAYING (WHICH IS BACK TO THE THREAD) I THINK THAT IF ANYONE OF US COULD AFFORD THAT NUMBER OF FULL BODIES AND A E- CALLER WE ALL COULD DO AS WELL, BUT THAT IS NOT THE CASE IN THE REAL WORLD.

I’AM NEW TO THIS FIELD HUNTING SITUATION,BUT I’M TRYING TO LEARN FOR OUR NORTH DAKOTA TRIPS (THREE SO FAR)

BUT I CAN JUST THINK THAT MORE OF ANYTHING IS BETTER,
BUT LIKE WHAT YOU SAID THIS WAS SPONSERED BY AVERY, AND OF COURSE THEY WILL SAY THAT MORE HARD BODIES IS BETTER BUT WHO CAN AFFORD $4,200.00 FOR DECOYS (500=42DOZ X 100.00 PER DOZ)
WELCOME TO SOME OF THE THINGS I DON’T AGREE WITH IN REGUARDS TO DU, THEY WILL TRY TO GET YOU TO FALL FOR THE BIG MONEY, AND NOTICE ALL THEIR HUNTS ARE ALLWAYS WITH THE BIG MONEY OUTFITTERS, WHAT ABOUT US PEOPLE THAT HAVE TO DO THIS WITH OUR OWN RESOURCES ?? BUT THEY WILL SURE TAKE OUR MONEY AT THE BANQUETS DON’T THEY FOR THEIR OFFICERS TO GO ON THESE HUNTS.

SORRY I WILL GET OFF THE SOAPBOX NOW, AND END IN SAYING (WHICH IS BACK TO THE THREAD) I THINK THAT IF ANYONE OF US COULD AFFORD THAT NUMBER OF FULL BODIES AND A E- CALLER WE ALL COULD DO AS WELL, BUT THAT IS NOT THE CASE IN THE REAL WORLD.

I’ve read the article and the numerous posts on other duck hunting sites talking about the issue…..and I’ve seen the pictures…..they are amazing!!! What these two guys were able to do was truely remarkable (avg. 70 birds a day ).

Under normal conditions, and on a day to day basis, I think it is pretty clear that you will have better success at getting snows to decoy CLOSE with a spread of full bodies then you will with a spread of rags/windsocks……no argument there…..Cost and transportation are going to be the limiting factor for most people (OBVIOUSLY )……who can afford to spend $5000-10,000 on a decoy spread? not to mention the multiple full size pickup/trailer rigs, atvs, $3 gas and whatever else you’d have to have to deploy such a spread ……just not in the realm of possibilty for most people (especially those of us who have to travel to hunt them….only a couple trips a year).

My real question would be, what is the lowest number of full bodies one could get by with and still out produce a spread of 1500 windsocks? Would a spread of 200-300 full bodies be large enough? Because 200-300 wouldn’t be that far out of the realm of possibility…..get a couple reliable friends to buy a hundred each, and you’re right there……Heck, The guys in Roch are running that many canadian full bodies all over town. Just not sure if 200-300 decoys would be enough (especially in the spring durning peek migration when you’re competing with flocks in the mind boggling numbers).

Unfortunatly there is really only one way to find out….and that would be to jump in the game head first……pony up the money NOW and get at em….because after all, none of use really no how long this snow goose thing is going to last

I’m not sure the original question of wether or not they could have done this well in the fall (w/out the e-caller) means much……The answer- probably not quite as well, but they still would be kicking the butts of all the other guys running the 1000 sock spreads who also would not be using e-callers.

I’ve read the article and the numerous posts on other duck hunting sites talking about the issue…..and I’ve seen the pictures…..they are amazing!!! What these two guys were able to do was truely remarkable (avg. 70 birds a day ).

Under normal conditions, and on a day to day basis, I think it is pretty clear that you will have better success at getting snows to decoy CLOSE with a spread of full bodies then you will with a spread of rags/windsocks……no argument there…..Cost and transportation are going to be the limiting factor for most people (OBVIOUSLY )……who can afford to spend $5000-10,000 on a decoy spread? not to mention the multiple full size pickup/trailer rigs, atvs, $3 gas and whatever else you’d have to have to deploy such a spread ……just not in the realm of possibilty for most people (especially those of us who have to travel to hunt them….only a couple trips a year).

My real question would be, what is the lowest number of full bodies one could get by with and still out produce a spread of 1500 windsocks? Would a spread of 200-300 full bodies be large enough? Because 200-300 wouldn’t be that far out of the realm of possibility…..get a couple reliable friends to buy a hundred each, and you’re right there……Heck, The guys in Roch are running that many canadian full bodies all over town. Just not sure if 200-300 decoys would be enough (especially in the spring durning peek migration when you’re competing with flocks in the mind boggling numbers).

Unfortunatly there is really only one way to find out….and that would be to jump in the game head first……pony up the money NOW and get at em….because after all, none of use really no how long this snow goose thing is going to last

I’m not sure the original question of wether or not they could have done this well in the fall (w/out the e-caller) means much……The answer- probably not quite as well, but they still would be kicking the butts of all the other guys running the 1000 sock spreads who also would not be using e-callers.

Here’s one for you guys about the cost—- A buddy and I were Bull to a guy about waterfowling, where we had been huntin’ before, etc. and then we started talking spreads. The guy asked if we fished and we confusingly said yes and if we had a boat, I said, “ummm not a true fishin boat I guess but a duckin’ boat that doubles as a fishin boat” anyhoo he siad that he doesn’t fish and instead of buying a nice fishing boat for a fisherman the duck hunter took out a loan out for decoys, him and a couple of his buddys each took out $10,000 for hunting ducks and geese . He said they start in Canada and work their way south, granted he is retired, but they put serious time and money into their hunts and it pays off. Really makes a guy think again about getting a fishing only boat though I’ll tell you that.

LARS

Here’s one for you guys about the cost—- A buddy and I were Bull to a guy about waterfowling, where we had been huntin’ before, etc. and then we started talking spreads. The guy asked if we fished and we confusingly said yes and if we had a boat, I said, “ummm not a true fishin boat I guess but a duckin’ boat that doubles as a fishin boat” anyhoo he siad that he doesn’t fish and instead of buying a nice fishing boat for a fisherman the duck hunter took out a loan out for decoys, him and a couple of his buddys each took out $10,000 for hunting ducks and geese . He said they start in Canada and work their way south, granted he is retired, but they put serious time and money into their hunts and it pays off. Really makes a guy think again about getting a fishing only boat though I’ll tell you that.

LARS

Many good points here. The last one made me think and while its true I have a $20k boat plus gear for fishing, I can’t spend that amount on hunting equipment as the boat has a dual purpose with the family and their enjoyment of it.

For anyone new to hunting fields in ND, I’d be happy to share all that I’ve acquired over the years in terms of info and tactics. When I take MN/WI hunters to ND, they return home in awe, not only on the numbers of birds, but of the tactics. They are as different as night and day.
I’ll save any more details for another post, closer to the season.

Jake: A question and a point on your post. The point that I’m disappointed in with the article is that when you experiment, you can’t have two variables and then determine your success was due to just one of them. Since 90% of people hunt in the fall, I would have liked to see them lose the ecaller to see if the full bodies were truly the difference. Then and only then, would I run out and buy 200 decoys.

My question for you. If you had 200-300 full bodies, would you just use them or mix them with rags/socks and other types of snow decoys? It would not make for a good experiment ( ) but I’d be hard pressed to leave my current 500 unit spread at home.

Thanks again for the discussion!

Many good points here. The last one made me think and while its true I have a $20k boat plus gear for fishing, I can’t spend that amount on hunting equipment as the boat has a dual purpose with the family and their enjoyment of it.

For anyone new to hunting fields in ND, I’d be happy to share all that I’ve acquired over the years in terms of info and tactics. When I take MN/WI hunters to ND, they return home in awe, not only on the numbers of birds, but of the tactics. They are as different as night and day.
I’ll save any more details for another post, closer to the season.

Jake: A question and a point on your post. The point that I’m disappointed in with the article is that when you experiment, you can’t have two variables and then determine your success was due to just one of them. Since 90% of people hunt in the fall, I would have liked to see them lose the ecaller to see if the full bodies were truly the difference. Then and only then, would I run out and buy 200 decoys.

My question for you. If you had 200-300 full bodies, would you just use them or mix them with rags/socks and other types of snow decoys? It would not make for a good experiment ( ) but I’d be hard pressed to leave my current 500 unit spread at home.

Thanks again for the discussion!

We couldn’t afford spreads of 1500 hard body snows either.What we do is put out every thing we can scrounge up including hard bodies, rags, silhouettes, home made dekes, half an ice cream bucket with plywood heads, and honkers and mallards off to the side. This gives us a big spread and seems to work for us.

We couldn’t afford spreads of 1500 hard body snows either.What we do is put out every thing we can scrounge up including hard bodies, rags, silhouettes, home made dekes, half an ice cream bucket with plywood heads, and honkers and mallards off to the side. This gives us a big spread and seems to work for us.

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Since 90% of people hunt in the fall,

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Not sure about that number……I’d say more like 90% of the people that hunt SNOWS hunt them in the spring

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If you had 200-300 full bodies, would you just use them or mix them with rags/socks and other types of snow decoys?

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I think I read a good point on this on another site……when you look at a flock of geese, they all generally look the same…..as in size, shape, color of the bird….if you’re truelly going with the ultra-realism approach, then I would JUST use the full bodies……Setting out magnum shells next to windsocks next to fullbodies just doesn’t work in the ultra-realism approach. I don’t remember which pictures were in the DU article, but if you take a look at the spread pics on the Avery site, you’ll see that their spread of completely full bodies looks right!!!

I do think movement is still a key factor, so the moition stakes on EVERY decoy like these boys had would also be a plus.

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Since 90% of people hunt in the fall,

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Not sure about that number……I’d say more like 90% of the people that hunt SNOWS hunt them in the spring

Quote:

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If you had 200-300 full bodies, would you just use them or mix them with rags/socks and other types of snow decoys?

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I think I read a good point on this on another site……when you look at a flock of geese, they all generally look the same…..as in size, shape, color of the bird….if you’re truelly going with the ultra-realism approach, then I would JUST use the full bodies……Setting out magnum shells next to windsocks next to fullbodies just doesn’t work in the ultra-realism approach. I don’t remember which pictures were in the DU article, but if you take a look at the spread pics on the Avery site, you’ll see that their spread of completely full bodies looks right!!!

I do think movement is still a key factor, so the moition stakes on EVERY decoy like these boys had would also be a plus.

Interesting since I now use rags, socks, silhouettes, kites, flags, and shells. I’ll bet I have 10-12 different variety of decoys with varying degrees of color even between the blue phase decoys. The plastic texas rags in the blue phase are really brown with blue accents vs. some of the silhouettes in the blue phase are a dull gray vs. some stake decoys I have in blue phase that are a dark gray.

Not sure if I’ll ever get to the bottom of this debate. I doubt I’ll ever scrap everything I have. I’ll run this debate past some of the guides when I go back home (ND) this summer and get their take on it.

I still think the e-caller had a HUGE influence on those birds!! Since I don’t hunt in the spring I’ll never experience that.

Thanks again,

Interesting since I now use rags, socks, silhouettes, kites, flags, and shells. I’ll bet I have 10-12 different variety of decoys with varying degrees of color even between the blue phase decoys. The plastic texas rags in the blue phase are really brown with blue accents vs. some of the silhouettes in the blue phase are a dull gray vs. some stake decoys I have in blue phase that are a dark gray.

Not sure if I’ll ever get to the bottom of this debate. I doubt I’ll ever scrap everything I have. I’ll run this debate past some of the guides when I go back home (ND) this summer and get their take on it.

I still think the e-caller had a HUGE influence on those birds!! Since I don’t hunt in the spring I’ll never experience that.

Thanks again,

Just to keep the discussion going……

Here’s a couple comparison pics

First is a real flock of snow geese (random picture I pulled off the internet)…….quite a few juvies in this pic, which does show the variation in color of the birds.

Just to keep the discussion going……

Here’s a couple comparison pics

First is a real flock of snow geese (random picture I pulled off the internet)…….quite a few juvies in this pic, which does show the variation in color of the birds.

and here’s a pic of the spread in question (taken from a thread on Avery’s Website )

Here’s Another link with pictures

I’m not intentionally trying to promote Avery….just showing everyone what the fuss is about

and here’s a pic of the spread in question (taken from a thread on Avery’s Website )

Here’s Another link with pictures

I’m not intentionally trying to promote Avery….just showing everyone what the fuss is about

I wonder where their e-callers were, this year in my hunts it seemed they wanted to approach downwind of the call but circle and land behind them. Anyone else?

That spread looks pretty damn good, but then again so does their spot.

LARS

I wonder where their e-callers were, this year in my hunts it seemed they wanted to approach downwind of the call but circle and land behind them. Anyone else?

That spread looks pretty damn good, but then again so does their spot.

LARS

Can’t help on the caller question as I have never had the opportunity to go in the spring.

The spot looks good for spring and perhaps early fall. My experience in the county I hunt in ND, is to avoid permanent bodies of water however later on in the season. I’m not talking about standing water in what was a barley field, but watering holes that hold water all year. 1, that would be a potential roosting area for snows, 2) we hunt near a refuge so when they are going to feed they aren’t looking or needing water, 3) permanent bodies of water also have alot of vegetation nearby and that spooks the birds late in the year. I’d set up in the field next to the permanent water and try to lure birds from their roost.

Also interesting to see the cows in the background, most farmers don’t want you in the same field with cattle. We set up once on some standing water, that was holding ducks the day before, in the pre-dawn darkness and when the sun came up the famer rotated his cows right into this field not realizing we were there. We graciously picked up but it was not fun trying to keep my dogs from chasing the cows around.

The live picture does show alot of color variation from pure white all the way to the darker blue. This article in DU and sponsored by Avery, in my opinion, leaves to many issues unresolved.

Can’t help on the caller question as I have never had the opportunity to go in the spring.

The spot looks good for spring and perhaps early fall. My experience in the county I hunt in ND, is to avoid permanent bodies of water however later on in the season. I’m not talking about standing water in what was a barley field, but watering holes that hold water all year. 1, that would be a potential roosting area for snows, 2) we hunt near a refuge so when they are going to feed they aren’t looking or needing water, 3) permanent bodies of water also have alot of vegetation nearby and that spooks the birds late in the year. I’d set up in the field next to the permanent water and try to lure birds from their roost.

Also interesting to see the cows in the background, most farmers don’t want you in the same field with cattle. We set up once on some standing water, that was holding ducks the day before, in the pre-dawn darkness and when the sun came up the famer rotated his cows right into this field not realizing we were there. We graciously picked up but it was not fun trying to keep my dogs from chasing the cows around.

The live picture does show alot of color variation from pure white all the way to the darker blue. This article in DU and sponsored by Avery, in my opinion, leaves to many issues unresolved.