Unwritten Rules on WOT on P4?

I get it, you have a big boat with plenty of gusto and you’re in a hurry to move out of that one fishing hole you’re not catching anything in to another you won’t catch anything in (because of wake-induced Karma). But when I’m sitting in my low sided jon boat on Pool 4, do you really need to run WOT just 20-50 yards from the rest of us that are fishing? Any “unwritten” rules about being kind to other people fishing when we are all in tight quarters on P4? Just a friendly reminder that not all of us have a 90 inch+ beam.

She..oot, I only have a 25HP Yammy and I even slow to no wake speeds when anywhere near another boat…Really, what’s the hurry? Am I too sensitive?

Am I too sensitive?

Yes and no.

This has happened since gasoline engines replaced oars.

Last Sunday when I was out touring and slowed to no wake speeds for the three groups I encountered heading up to the dam area, I said to myself “why am I slowing down? No one else does”.

Spring time on Pool 4…

* Everyone should be watching out for the other guy.
* Being polite will allow a more pleasurable experience.
* Few people wake up in the morning and say “what can I do to urine someone off today”.

* We are all out there to enjoy the fishing and camaraderie.

I hope all that venture out have a great time (fish or no fish) and please do no sink my buddy JD!

There is a lot of dumb stuff out there like that right now. I had two different boats anchor between us and the shore right where I was casting and catching fish. Almost got ran over by another guy that thought he owned the river. Some people have no ethics or just don’t care. That said the majority of folks still get it.

I also fish in a Jon boat but the guys running wfo is a lot better then the guys slowing down to make a bigger wake while going through a crowd. I had a guy a couple weeks ago with his 20′ yarcraft come by plowing the biggest wake that boat could make all morning long. I had to spin my boat into the wave every time so I did not take water on because of his wake.

JD, you are dead on with your post. This not only applies on P4 it should apply to all bodies of water. I can’t count the number of times guys go wide open next to or through groups of boats fishing.
I have have experienced this countless times on Miil Lacs.
Common sense on common courtesy seems to be laking at times, especially when this happens.

JD Winston wrote:

I get it, you have a big boat with plenty of gusto and you’re in a hurry to move out of that one fishing hole you’re not catching anything in to another you won’t catch anything in (because of wake-induced Karma). But when I’m sitting in my low sided jon boat on Pool 4, do you really need to run WOT just 20-50 yards from the rest of us that are fishing? Any “unwritten” rules about being kind to other people fishing when we are all in tight quarters on P4? Just a friendly reminder that not all of us have a 90 inch+ beam.

She..oot, I only have a 25HP Yammy and I even slow to no wake speeds when anywhere near another boat…Really, what’s the hurry? Am I too sensitive?

I would much rather have them run by me at WOT then at 10-20 pushing a giant wake.

Angler II wrote:

I would much rather have them run by me at WOT then at 10-20 pushing a giant wake.

I get that and agree. But when I say WOT, I really meant anything above no-wake speeds. I will be more clear next time.

There is one advantage to all the rockin’ and rollin’ my boat does on these busy days in that my dead stick rod with a jig and minnow get plenty of jigging action without having to attend the rod. So all is not lost.

I always slow down to no wake when approaching crowds of boats on P4. Plenty of others just WOT right through the group, irritates me too, just slow down for a minute and enjoy the day.

Yesterday morning I pulled into the biggest gap between a group of anchored boats along the shoreline, it was probably a 70 yard gap, so I split the difference. Checked to make sure they were anchored and I wouldn’t be cutting off their path if they were drifting down river. Everybody was casting towards shore, I’m not cutting them off from shore either. Then one boat yells at me for being too close, about 35ish yards away, sees where I cast, then he casts far off the side of his boat to purposely cross my line, of course we got tangled then. I left that spot, yes he “won” but it’s not something I need to deal with when fishing. Plenty of other fishable water around. I noticed a few other boats pull up into that area and also leave, really thought he owned the water.

mnrabbit wrote:

it was probably a 70 yard gap,

You were plenty fine with that gap. Sat night we were all stacked up pitching to the shoreline with only a few boat lengths between us all and no one got bent out of shape. Too bad that dude was a %&*%&.

I got brothers who will give guys dirty looks for passing close and/or at high speeds when there is plenty of room for them to run around us at a good distance.

I’ll be driving in the boat with these same brothers who will end up doing the same and in my head I am thinking go around, swing out more bro!

My worst offence would be anchoring in front of a boat that is trolling a shoreline toward me who is at the least 100 yards away. I can feel their eyes on me and all I can think of is well maybe you should have started your troll here.

There are far too many people in all walks of life and situations who think that they are the center of the universe.

Lol. Ya’ll should be on the Rainy in the spring. That’s Insane boat traffic. Plenty of Jon boats out there too.

I fish the croix a lot. Big tuna boats. A guy just has gotta learn to fish in big boat wakes…Because that’s going to be a constant in your fishing experience. 2cents

Speaking of P4 ethics. Last time i was there (Few weeks ago) we were the first boat on the water ~5am. Get to our wingdam, spot lock, fish for 20 minutes and here comes boat #2. They spot lock anchored 2 rod lengths MAX from our bow and fished the same wing dam. Literally only us two out there, and i could have spit into their boat…LOL. Didn’t let it bother me. It is a major reason why i don’t frequent these fishing areas though. That’s not typical “ethics”. But it is to be expected in some areas – P4 is one of them.
I hoisted two nice eyes in front of them and we scooted out before sun-up to less pressured areas.

Not that it answers your question but there are a lot of written rules at USCG Rules.
My personal “unwritten rule” is to slow down when passing other boats unless I can stay far enough away that my wake will have little impact. It only delays the trip by a couple of minutes so it’s just not worth the possibility of causing harm.

FishBlood&RiverMud wrote:

I fish the croix a lot. Big tuna boats. A guy just has gotta learn to fish in big boat wakes…

Agreed. Last fall I was fishing the can line at the head of Pepin and those “Tuna Boats” were flying by throwing huge waves. But I didn’t mind so much as that area is a major through-way for a lot of traffic and for a lot of reasons. But I would respectfully contend that from the Vermillion outlet to the dam, that is much more like a little bay than a through-way.

But I get it and I will live with it. 4 trips out so far this spring and thought I’d toss this topic out there and learn a little from others.

With you guys on this one. Another one that grinds my gears is when there is a conga line drifting a river, and someone decides that line is where they want to anchor up thus making said conga divert around them.

Problem is, any idiot can run out and buy a boat whether he/she knows how to use it or not. I guess rules of the road do not apply to those with unlimited funds. Too many people simply do not care.

it is no worse with the bass boaters during a tournament. They own the river and you are in their way.

It is all about common sense.

Like Ron White says you can’t fix stupid.

That many boats out there; there’s bound to be a few idiots out there.

Once upon a time I almost got my 16 foot boat (was anchored fishing near the narrows between two lakes out of the way of main channel/ as to not impede any other boats going through the narrows in anyway) swamped by a jack @rse who decided to open up his 300+ hp right as he was even with my bow maybe 10 feet away from us. Had the kids with me in the boat they almost went over. Only reason they didn’t was they sat down right away when they heard him roared his motor. Worst of all was he only went about 30 yards and anchored.

mnrabbit wrote:

Then one boat yells at me for being too close, about 35ish yards away, sees where I cast, then he casts far off the side of his boat to purposely cross my line, of course we got tangled then.

That’s what one rod/reel spooled with 80# braid is for

I just don’t get how one guy in a brand new ranger “Cough cough” can get mad that people are not getting out of his way while he is the only one trolling up and you have 15 boat taking turns drifting down. Sometimes its best to just go with the flow no pun intended.

If your going to fish P4 this time of year, you need to be able to fish in big waves. I generally have no problem weaving through people when you have boats stacked up in the middle of the channel for 2-400 yards. With that said, if I see a small 12 footer with 6″ of freeboard, I’ll slow down to no wake so I don’t tip them over.

Dale Rueber wrote:

Not that it answers your question but there are a lot of written rules at USCG Rules.
My personal “unwritten rule” is to slow down when passing other boats unless I can stay far enough away that my wake will have little impact. It only delays the trip by a couple of minutes so it’s just not worth the possibility of causing harm.

I’m glad there a few of you guys out their with my 15′ boat, I don’t care for the rock and rolling and often have to sit down and wait for the wake induced waves to run there course. Hassle when you stand and cast.

Lets just say “YOU CAN’T FIX STUPID!

Expecting boats to slow to no-wake every time they pass another boat on pool 4 is an unrealistic expectation when there are hundreds of boats on a small stretch of river. Bitch all you want about waves, but it isn’t going to make guys idle for 2 miles. I don’t want to sound like a dick, but maybe the stupid thing is taking a 14′ boat with 6 inches of freeboard on the river when there are a couple hundred boats running around. I don’t run close by guys wide open, and I’m not advocating that. BUT, if you go out on crowded water in a dingy, you better expect to get tossed around because its going to happen. Your worst enemy is the guy that slows down to plow speed because he thinks he’s being nice.

A – Aron wrote:

I just don’t get how one guy in a brand new ranger “Cough cough” can get mad that people are not getting out of his way while he is the only one trolling up and you have 15 boat taking turns drifting down

That isn’t limited to guys in rangers. Had a guy in a pontoon pulling three ways through 40 boats drifting a couple weeks ago. He had the same problem with getting mad at people for not moving.

I only throw intentional wakes at 1 crowd…That that is those in dingys.

All day long i have tuna boats half plane going by my boat, i used to have a smaller 16′ alumacraft and the tuna boat drivers would laugh and grin when they see my boat rockn from their wake….Well, come supper time when their boat is tied off to the beach and they’re headed to the bar in their dingy…I give them a taste of their own medicine!!

Otherwise, i don’t worry about my WOT plane unless it is close enough to effect someone’s fishing experience i.e. i won’t fly over a shallow area if someone is pitching it…But boaters need to learn how to fish with traffic. I’m one of the sturgeon fisherman who doesn’t wait for the traffic to calm down on the Croix and i’ll anchor right up in high traffic areas. Just gotta learn how to work around it – or go to areas to avoid it if you are in a small boat.

John Schultz wrote:

Expecting boats to slow to no-wake every time they pass another boat on pool 4 is an unrealistic expectation when there are hundreds of boats on a small stretch of river. Bitch all you want about waves, but it isn’t going to make guys idle for 2 miles. I don’t want to sound like a dick, but maybe the stupid thing is taking a 14′ boat with 6 inches of freeboard on the river when there are a couple hundred boats running around.

My thoughts exactly. Thank you John for stating this. You cannot expect guys to spend 15-20 minutes at no-wake when 3-4 minutes at 25 mph will get the job done. I don’t WOT and trim her up and weave in and out, that’s beyond dumb, but I will put my boat on plane and get where I need to go, and on P4 right now, that will take you within 50 yards of boats that are fishing, no way around it. I usually run between 2/3 and 3/4 throttle and make sure I’m paying attention. I try to stop well away from other boats and do everything I can to be considerate of others.

John Schultz wrote:

I don’t want to sound like a dick

Well, you kinda do sound like that BUT no one said I was “mad”. And I appreciate your opinion. But suggesting that I get a larger boat…for what is essentially the bay of a river…is a little silly. Just my opinion. My jon is 18 feet and I don’t ever worry about tipping. I just see guys coming from down below the dam WOT up until just about the top wing dam and then slamming on the “brakes”. Normally, no big deal if just a few are out there. But there are a LOT of boats out there and the real issue is not defending our “rights” to do whatever the hell we want because it’s a free country. It’s about common courtesy during an unusual peak period in a congested area. And perhaps if a bigger boat wants to fish a congested area and share the space with smaller boats, perhaps the owness SHOULD be on them to adapt. How come the smaller boats have to buy bigger boats to enjoy the resource? Sounds a little elitist.

Using that logic, I should have the right to drive 200+ mph on the interstate because I have a Ferrari and all those other suck heads driving their Beatles and Hondas should just get a faster car so they can enjoy my interstate the way I do. After all, at 200MPH, it is not MY responsibility to consider the lower performing cars may want to pass each other and get in MY passing lane from time to time. It is their responsibility to either get a faster car or stay off the interstate.

Let’s play a game. I will assume, since you are a guide, that you have a boat around 20 feet or so. So I go out and buy a “Tuna Boat” and she is a glorious 34 feet. I feel like fishing Pool 4 today so I untie from my slip and head up to Pool 4 WOT. I just happen to see you and your clients enjoying a day jigging right at the Y. But I reserve my right to get up to the top wing dam in record time. Who knows, there may be a blue ribbon there for arriving in first place. So I keep on the throttle hot and pass you at 20-30 yards. The wake in your 20 footer is not enough to capsize you but certainly enough to put the fear of going overboard in your heart. Are you going to tell me that you would look at your clients and say

John Schultz wrote:

Bitch all you want about waves, but it isn’t going to make guys idle for 2 miles.

Or maybe you tell your clients

John Schultz wrote:

BUT, if you go out on crowded water in a dingy, you better expect to get tossed around

I think you get my drift (pun intended). Just because you have a larger boat doesn’t mean we all need to upsize to accommodate your lack of common courtesy.

A fella can do whatever he wants out there and no worries. But if I were parking in a parking lot for the fair, I will adjust my awareness and caution as there may be a little kid dashing from nowhere into the traffic. If just grocery shopping late at night at my local Cub, I will drive and park with a little less caution. I’m only suggesting we adapt to the situation and use extra courtesy and caution when the pool is loaded. Is that such a wild infringement on your rights as a larger boat that it would ruin your fishing experience to drop to 5mph for maybe a mile?

I have attached a measured map for reference to the area I am talking about.

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cougareye wrote:

You cannot expect guys to spend 15-20 minutes at no-wake when 3-4 minutes at 25 mph will get the job done

Well, for the 1 mile in question, I would say yes, we should expect to do that. And 1 mile at 5mph is more like 12 minutes…not 20. When you go to the fair, do you expect to wait in line for food or parking or rides? Sure, it is a part of life. When it is busy, we all wait our turn and act like civilized people.

Do as you please, but as for me, regardless of what boat I’m driving that day, I will keep her at no wake speeds in that stretch on a busy day because I believe even YOU deserve a great day on the water and I’m never really in that big of a hurry when fishing.

JD,

The scenario with 34′ tuna boats plays out every weekend on the St. Croix. Every serious fisherman I know refuses in most situations to fish the Croix after 10 am on a weekend day. I don’t run back to my computer and bitch about it, I chose to avoid it. What’s the solution, that the entire St. Croix go no wake to accommodate my boat?

In your question above ” Is that such a wild infringement on your rights as a larger boat that it would ruin your fishing experience to drop to 5mph for maybe a mile?” My answer would be yes. One mile at 5 mph is 12 minutes and my boat throws a fairly good sized wake at 5 mph, so for me it is around 4 mph which is 15 minutes. If I make these types of moves several times a day, that is a serious amount of time wasted not fishing.

If you do not feel safe in your craft in wavy water, much like all of us do on the Croix in the summer, then unfortunately you’ll have to make decisions such as what I’m forced to make on the Croix.

I don’t let waves bother me that much. But that’s just me.

I spend Friday through sunday on the Croix every single weekend from september through early november. Want to see traffic. Anchor south of 94 bridge on labor day You won’t get much sympathy from me. I’ve learned TONS about boat control from fishing 4′ tuna boat wakes.
P4 fishing traffic is nuttin.