Twins 2019

Ties it up in the 8th with a homer. May as well trade the fat kid now while his stock is high. They have no chance of making the playoffs anyway.

The amount that guy strikes out is astonishing, and very frustrating, but hes still been pretty productive. Even after this abysmal 1 for 18 w/ 12 k’s slump over the last week or so he still has a higher OBP and slugging percentage than Rosario does..

Sanos 162 game average for his career has him slashing .242/.334/.480 with 36 bombs and about 100 rbis. That’s pretty damn good, especially if that’s coming from your 7 hitter. Just have to somehow, someway look past that 40% strikeout rate

I hate it break it to all the analytics guys in here. But if you haven’t noticed the past doesn’t predict the future. Sure it can guide you, but I can’t believe people are still defending Sano. Do you even watch his at bats or just look at his numbers? He’s totally clueless up there. His strength has always been pulling balls that are middle in and now he’s missing those! He hits a home run yesterday because he FINALLY stopped trying to hit the ball over the left field fence every pitch.

I still want him gone for a good relief pitcher or a starter. We CLEARLY need that more than we need another .250 25-30 HR guy. We have about 5 of those currently.

eyeguy507 wrote:

remember David Ortiz? do we need another reminder

I’m not worried about that at all.

mahtofire14 wrote:

I hate it break it to all the analytics guys in here. But if you haven’t noticed the past doesn’t predict the future. Sure it can guide you, but I can’t believe people are still defending Sano. Do you even watch his at bats or just look at his numbers? He’s totally clueless up there. His strength has always been pulling balls that are middle in and now he’s missing those! He hits a home run yesterday because he FINALLY stopped trying to hit the ball over the left field fence every pitch.

I still want him gone for a good relief pitcher or a starter. We CLEARLY need that more than we need another .250 25-30 HR guy. We have about 5 of those currently.

I totally agree. Watching his ABs is tough to watch. Last night I caught some of the radio broadcast and Dazzle and Corey were talking about how he’s always been bad at swinging and missing at sliders, but now they’ve noticing how much he’s missing the fastballs, or getting under them and fouling them off. It’s concerning and I’m ready to dump him. I don’t care if he turns into Ortiz 2.0, which I really doubt he ever will.

You can’t have Dingers without K’s. With Sano you know what you’re getting.
I like watching guys that can legitimately change the outcome of a game with a swing of the bat.

Babe Ruth was the King of strikeouts.

mahtofire14 wrote:

We CLEARLY need that more than we need another .250 25-30 HR guy. We have about 5 of those currently.

Wait.. are you actually reading what youre saying? You want to see a .250 25-30 HR guy off the roster because the Twins dont need another one? Are people THAT caught up in their anti-sano nostalgia that they have become this oblivious? I ask you.. who is replacing him? Adrianza? Pull Marwin from his platoon role? Force Nick Gordon to play out of position when he arrives?

The Twins will be active in their bullpen search next month, but they had better not be trading pieces off the current roster to do it.

50 wins before the 4th of July.
Very impressive!

mahtofire14 wrote:

I hate it break it to all the analytics guys in here. But if you haven’t noticed the past doesn’t predict the future.

It doesnt tell you whats going to happen, but it absolutely helps predict it. Thats the whole purpose of it, actually.

Twins signing Cody Allen to a minor league deal. Some of you got your wish.

Oh boy. Glad they didnt sign him to the $8 or whatever mil deal in the winter. Still not glad they gave him his $500k now after being DFA’d. Maybe Wes Johnson sees something he can fix. Decent buy low-high upside candidate.. I guess.

Hope I’m wrong

Eelpoutguy wrote:

50 wins before the 4th of July.
Very impressive!

And 146 home runs. How many seasons did this team never break 100?

Eelpoutguy wrote:

You can’t have Dingers without K’s. With Sano you know what you’re getting.
I like watching guys that can legitimately change the outcome of a game with a swing of the bat.

Babe Ruth was the King of strikeouts.

This……..I have been watching his AB’s and they are pretty bad but I think this will humble Sano and bring out the best in him. the team is playing awesome right now and I can’t complain. I have noticed that Rosario likes to showboat a bit in the field and that would not fly with me if I was the coach. I know Rocco likes to keep it loose but I would remind Eddie what rung on the ladder he is on.

Eyeguy,
Here’s my take.
The twins have stunk so bad for so long I haven’t even been able to follow them the past 5 years or so. It’s fun to be able to watch and keep track of them now.
Rosario, I kind of like his Rickey Henderson ish showboating. Sano whether he strikes out or hits a homerun, we all have something to talk about. I can guarantee you one thing opposing pitchers don’t see Sano coming up to bat and say Here’s that fat kid that I’m going to strike out. If they are that stupid to think that he will surely hit one out of the park on them.

tbro16 wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>mahtofire14 wrote:</div>
We CLEARLY need that more than we need another .250 25-30 HR guy. We have about 5 of those currently.

Wait.. are you actually reading what youre saying? You want to see a .250 25-30 HR guy off the roster because the Twins dont need another one? Are people THAT caught up in their anti-sano nostalgia that they have become this oblivious? I ask you.. who is replacing him? Adrianza? Pull Marwin from his platoon role? Force Nick Gordon to play out of position when he arrives?

The Twins will be active in their bullpen search next month, but they had better not be trading pieces off the current roster to do it.

Yeah Tbro, I know what I’m saying. You left out the part where I said I’d rather have a quality relief pitcher or starter than another 250/30 HR guy because we have plenty of them.

The analytics team hasn’t been doing so hot at predicting where batters are going to hit the ball this year. It’s double digit games where they’ve given up runs because a shift was on. Not to mention they can’t seem to figure out to throw off speed, or inside when they are playing a pull shift. Basic baseball that gets overlooked when you just look at numbers. As I’ve said before, I don’t hate analytics. I just think it’s being overused.

mahtofire14 wrote:

Yeah Tbro, I know what I’m saying. You left out the part where I said I’d rather have a quality relief pitcher or starter than another 250/30 HR guy because we have plenty of them.

The analytics team hasn’t been doing so hot at predicting where batters are going to hit the ball this year. It’s double digit games where they’ve given up runs because a shift was on. Not to mention they can’t seem to figure out to throw off speed, or inside when they are playing a pull shift. Basic baseball that gets overlooked when you just look at numbers. As I’ve said before, I don’t hate analytics. I just think it’s being overused.

I think your analysis is incomplete though. You’re talking about 1.) ‘hits that should have been outs’ in your mind, had they been playing more ‘traditional’ positioning.

You’d have to find all the 2.) ‘outs that should have been hits’ to really say whether the analytics guys ‘are getting it wrong’.

If #1 is much greater than #2, then you have a point worth fighting! But if #2 is > #1, then, well, they are getting it right. But ‘getting it right’ in baseball doesn’t mean ‘works every time without fail’. It just so happens that it’s a lot more obvious when someone ‘beats the shift’ than when they hit a hard grounder between 1st and 2nd with traditional positioning.

As for pitching into the shift, that’s tougher to diagnose. I won’t try to diagnose that one, could be a combination of poor calls or missed spots.

philtickelson wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>mahtofire14 wrote:</div>
Yeah Tbro, I know what I’m saying. You left out the part where I said I’d rather have a quality relief pitcher or starter than another 250/30 HR guy because we have plenty of them.

The analytics team hasn’t been doing so hot at predicting where batters are going to hit the ball this year. It’s double digit games where they’ve given up runs because a shift was on. Not to mention they can’t seem to figure out to throw off speed, or inside when they are playing a pull shift. Basic baseball that gets overlooked when you just look at numbers. As I’ve said before, I don’t hate analytics. I just think it’s being overused.

I think your analysis is incomplete though. You’re talking about 1.) ‘hits that should have been outs’ in your mind, had they been playing more ‘traditional’ positioning.

You’d have to find all the 2.) ‘outs that should have been hits’ to really say whether the analytics guys ‘are getting it wrong’.

If #1 is much greater than #2, then you have a point worth fighting! But if #2 is > #1, then, well, they are getting it right. But ‘getting it right’ in baseball doesn’t mean ‘works every time without fail’. It just so happens that it’s a lot more obvious when someone ‘beats the shift’ than when they hit a hard grounder between 1st and 2nd with traditional positioning.

As for pitching into the shift, that’s tougher to diagnose. I won’t try to diagnose that one, could be a combination of poor calls or missed spots.

Your point is fair on whether or not the shift works, I haven’t looked at all the numbers. However hitters are FINALLY starting to realize how easy it is to beat the shift by not directly hitting into it. Amazing. We’ll see when/if the Twins adjust too.

It’s not tougher to diagnose the pitching however. All you have to do is look where the catcher was set up. I seen just about every game this season and I keep seeing Castro and Garver setting up outside and calling for fastballs while we have a pull shift set up. Shifting only works if you pitch to the strength of the shift. You have to make sure the guy pulls the ball. Either off speed, or inside. If you’re going to shift on every batter fine. But you better call the right pitches or you completely undermine the shift.

mahtofire14 wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>philtickelson wrote:</div>

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>mahtofire14 wrote:</div>
Yeah Tbro, I know what I’m saying. You left out the part where I said I’d rather have a quality relief pitcher or starter than another 250/30 HR guy because we have plenty of them.

The analytics team hasn’t been doing so hot at predicting where batters are going to hit the ball this year. It’s double digit games where they’ve given up runs because a shift was on. Not to mention they can’t seem to figure out to throw off speed, or inside when they are playing a pull shift. Basic baseball that gets overlooked when you just look at numbers. As I’ve said before, I don’t hate analytics. I just think it’s being overused.

I think your analysis is incomplete though. You’re talking about 1.) ‘hits that should have been outs’ in your mind, had they been playing more ‘traditional’ positioning.

You’d have to find all the 2.) ‘outs that should have been hits’ to really say whether the analytics guys ‘are getting it wrong’.

If #1 is much greater than #2, then you have a point worth fighting! But if #2 is > #1, then, well, they are getting it right. But ‘getting it right’ in baseball doesn’t mean ‘works every time without fail’. It just so happens that it’s a lot more obvious when someone ‘beats the shift’ than when they hit a hard grounder between 1st and 2nd with traditional positioning.

As for pitching into the shift, that’s tougher to diagnose. I won’t try to diagnose that one, could be a combination of poor calls or missed spots.

Your point is fair on whether or not the shift works, I haven’t looked at all the numbers. However hitters are FINALLY starting to realize how easy it is to beat the shift by not directly hitting into it. Amazing. We’ll see when/if the Twins adjust too.

It’s not tougher to diagnose the pitching however. All you have to do is look where the catcher was set up. I seen just about every game this season and I keep seeing Castro and Garver setting up outside and calling for fastballs while we have a pull shift set up. Shifting only works if you pitch to the strength of the shift. You have to make sure the guy pulls the ball. Either off speed, or inside. If you’re going to shift on every batter fine. But you better call the right pitches or you completely undermine the shift.

Pull hitters tend to roll over on outside pitches. Hence the shift and the pitch location.

Anyone hear if Buxton will be back for TB tomorrow?

Yeah, fat kid might need to drop down to the minors for a bit and figure out his timing.
Battimg under 200 with a whole lotta K’s is no good. Playing pretty good D though.

mahtofire14 wrote:

hitters are FINALLY starting to realize how easy it is to beat the shift by not directly hitting into it. Amazing. We’ll see when/if the Twins adjust too.

That easy huh? If it’s that easy to hit a 95 mph fastball where ever they want, why don’t they just teach them to hit it over the fence with every swing? Curious if you have any numbers to prove how “easier” it’s getting or just see that Carpenter double on ESPN last week and assume?

Funny how you single out the analytics team not doing their job as if they’re not a huge reason why the Twins are 52-28 right now. The shift only scratches the very surface of what analytic, data driven baseball looks like. Better get used to it, because it’s only going to grow from here.

I have to say it was nice to see Garver get pissed off after he hit into a double-play in the late extra innings yesterday, so many players show ZERO emotion when they fail in big situations…How many blank stairs have you seen walking back to the dugout after somebody strikes out with the bases loaded, my god throw out an F’ingheimer once or twice, break a bat…I know I sure am!

JoeMX1825 wrote:

I have to say it was nice to see Garver get pissed off after he hit into a double-play in the late extra innings yesterday, so many players show ZERO emotion when they fail in big situations…How many blank stairs have you seen walking back to the dugout after somebody strikes out with the bases loaded, my god throw out an F’ingheimer once or twice, break a bat…I know I sure am!

Agreed 100%, but Sano would need to buy a forest if he broke a bat every time he K’d Going 0-8 in yesterdays game has to be frustrating!!!

tbro16 wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>mahtofire14 wrote:</div>
hitters are FINALLY starting to realize how easy it is to beat the shift by not directly hitting into it. Amazing. We’ll see when/if the Twins adjust too.

That easy huh? If it’s that easy to hit a 95 mph fastball where ever they want, why don’t they just teach them to hit it over the fence with every swing? Curious if you have any numbers to prove how “easier” it’s getting or just see that Carpenter double on ESPN last week and assume?

Funny how you single out the analytics team not doing their job as if they’re not a huge reason why the Twins are 52-28 right now. The shift only scratches the very surface of what analytic, data driven baseball looks like. Better get used to it, because it’s only going to grow from here.

Can you two just agree to disagree already? I’m too lazy to look but i would guess you two have been at it since page 1 of this 17 page thread

crappie55369 wrote:

Can you two just agree to disagree already? I’m too lazy to look but i would guess you two have been at it since page 1 of this 17 page thread

I looked and basically since the thread was started, I’m sure one of them see the light and will flip sides soon….

crappie55369 wrote:

Can you two just agree to disagree already?

What’s the fun in that?

I know he knows baseball and I think he knows I know baseball. Just VERY different views- clearly. Sometimes I come off as an a$$ but I don’t mean to turn it into an argument (not on this thread anyway), I just enjoy the discussion!

I’m fairly down on the Twins trading any significant players for any rental, or even most players under team control for another couple years, mainly since they could have had Kimbrel and/or Kuechel just for $$$. HOWEVER they should give up whatever it takes to get Max Scherzer and the 2.5 years remaining on his deal. He’s such a beast, would strengthen both the starters and relievers since he always goes deep in a game, and is on an absolute tear right now. 6-0 in 6 June starts with a 1.00 ERA, 5 walks 68k’s and 45 innings in those 6 starts. C’mon Falvine and the Pohlad’s the time to COMPETE is now!!!

Get ready to catch hell for your post Werm. Competing now means the Twins might not have all the pieces and/or money they want in 7 years, and some people just can’t stomach that.

Yeah I’m with you in that they need to make a huge move. Not just to make a move, but because it’s possible and necessary. The team’s time to win is now, they have the currency to do so, and could use that boost to compete with legit teams.

Side note, one of the best Twins teams in my lifetime just got….2 players named to the all-star team? That is a huge joke. I don’t think anyone puts too much legitimacy/stock into being “voted” into the AS Game but that’s still extremely frustrating to see them claw their way to one of the best records in baseball and not have the AS game roster reflect it.

Dan wrote:

Side note, one of the best Twins teams in my lifetime just got….2 players named to the all-star team? That is a huge joke. I don’t think anyone puts too much legitimacy/stock into being “voted” into the AS Game but that’s still extremely frustrating to see them claw their way to one of the best records in baseball and not have the AS game roster reflect it.

At first glance I thought that was ridiculous too, but when you look at the players who were chosen over any of the Twins players, there aren’t any real glaring snubs. I think Kepler deserves a spot and could replace Betts or Meadows, but Betts had an incredible year last year and he’s a big name (that really matters, unfortunately) and Meadows is have a really solid year. Rosario is worthy as well, but he’s injured. And Berrios is a worthy candidate, but who would you take off the current list of pitchers, especially when each team must have a representative?

blank wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Dan wrote:</div>
Side note, one of the best Twins teams in my lifetime just got….2 players named to the all-star team? That is a huge joke. I don’t think anyone puts too much legitimacy/stock into being “voted” into the AS Game but that’s still extremely frustrating to see them claw their way to one of the best records in baseball and not have the AS game roster reflect it.

At first glance I thought that was ridiculous too, but when you look at the players who were chosen over any of the Twins players, there aren’t any real glaring snubs. I think Kepler deserves a spot and could replace Betts or Meadows, but Betts had an incredible year last year and he’s a big name (that really matters, unfortunately) and Meadows is have a really solid year. Rosario is worthy as well, but he’s injured. And Berrios is a worthy candidate, but who would you take off the current list of pitchers, especially when each team must have a representative?

Yeah, All Star game nominations are pretty meaningless to me, I mean Ron Coomer made it one year…you could make a case that Kepler and/or Rosario should be starting over either or both of the Houston guys, but it’s a popularity/name recognition contest and they just don’t have that going for them yet.

tbro16 wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>crappie55369 wrote:</div>
Can you two just agree to disagree already?

What’s the fun in that?

I know he knows baseball and I think he knows I know baseball. Just VERY different views- clearly. Sometimes I come off as an a$$ but I don’t mean to turn it into an argument (not on this thread anyway), I just enjoy the discussion!

Hey I see the good in the fact that at least SOMEBODY is talking about the Twins these days.

I have no ill will towards tbro or his wonderful opinions on analytics. I am a self admitted baseball purist and they drive me crazy. Nothing wrong with a good old debate with no end in sight every now and then…..

And by the way….if I could hit a 90-95 mph fastball where I wanted as a VERY average college player, I think it’s fair to say a professional should be able to do it as well.