ABA Advantage Series

Hello all,

I need help making some decisions concerning next year. I’ve been on here enough that most of you have probably become familiar with the ABA (American Bass Anglers). Normally we have a $55 entry fee and run a draw format. In 2005 we are rolling out a few regional tournaments with higher payout. These are called the ABA Advantage Series.

The Advantage Series will have $100 entry fee and 80% payback with $1000 to 1st place with just 30 anglers. Other than these changes normal ABA rules apply. Such as:

-Must be ABA member ($25/yr)
-Guaranteed boat use to all boaters
– New Change Non-boaters are no longer entitled to trolling motor use

With this in mind I’d like to know if any of you would want to fish these and I’d like suggestions on pools and times. We will stay south of most of you unless there was overwhelming support for this farther north.

For now we are looking at April 30th on pool 12 or 13 and June 5th on pool 16,17 or 18. Please let me know if there are conflicts that I may not know about.

Thanks for your time. Here is a link to the press release for the Advantage Series

I like all the changes Bring that trail to pool 7-8-9.We have a tournament trail thats about to or should i say needs to die out.I wont name no names but it’s a World known trail in the Sport of Bass fishing

ok let me get this straight a non boater now pays 100 bucks to fish against the boater and gets no trolling motor rights?

so why would a non boater fish this circut

Although the Non-Boater doesn’t get to run the trolling motor, they do have some say in the water that is fished. That is something that you won’t find in the BFL.

Isn’t that how it works in the Federation tournies? (Boater runs his boat but Non-Boater has some say on where they go part or the day) I have never fished the Federation so I could be wrong but I thought that’s what I was told. Is the Federation split up into two divisions (Boater and Non-Boater) or is it just everyone against everyone? Not that it really matters all that much since we are talking about ABA.

I never really liked the old rule allowing total strangers to run my boat. It used to make me sick watching people ram my $800 Minn Kota into stumps and other underwater obstacles. Yes I know, “that’s what insurance is for” but why should I pay a higher premium (not to mention a $500 deductible) because someone I barely know just trashed my trolling motor?

I think the rule change and the new Advantage Series will both be great for the ABA. When I was a Director I used to hear a lot of negative comments from interested anglers about the trolling motor issue. Now it isn’t an issue.

The Advantage Series will combat the problem ABA had with lower payouts. Now if only 30 anglers show up the winner gets $1,000. Not bad for beating only 29 people. In most bigger money tournaments, if you only beat 29 people you go home with nothing more than an empty wallet.

I don’t think so much emphasis should be placed on the Boater and Non-Boater competing against each other. It really isn’t that big of an issue. Think back to how many times you have fished from the back of someones boat and really put it on them. I know I have won my share of tournaments from the back deck. I took a guy fishing on pool 12 a couple of months ago and I was glad we weren’t in an ABA tournament because he really put it to me.

Being in the back, you don’t have to worry about boat positioning or fighting the current. All you have to worry about is catching fish. If your partner doesn’t position the boat where you can fish properly, simply remind him of the rules. If they still choose to unfairly position the boat all you have to do is make a formal complaint to the tournament director and appropriate action will be taken.

With that being said, Ken I think your tournament should be on pool 12 or 13. I don’t really have a preference. I believe the Quad Cities District’s Advantage Series tournament has been scheduled for pool 16. (that doesn’t mean you can’t lock up or down)

JT Bagwell

pool 16 thats thw worst fishing of the 3 pools

as for illinois federation they have a boater no boater side as does the bfl

now if a federation tournament 8 man the non boater gets controll of the boat half the day if he so desires it because its all against all

now if we was on pool 18 for example and i decided to fish an aba tournament id expect the trolling motor half the day because if i drew some one just there to try to win the money or the points i fish it all the time im not taking some one putting them on my fish just to have them beat me or even front end me (it will happen i fish draw team tournaments and still get front ended when we are fishing as a team)

that being said a non boater should be liable for tearing up a trolling motor if hes running on high smack into crapi dont believe a non boater should take some ones trolling motor unless hes experienced knows where he is at

half the time in the 8 man i wont take it cause there not my fish or im not comfortable where im running it at

i feel it would be better if they had a high and a low side that way the guy in the back isnt fishing against the guy in the front and fighting over the same fish and i believe there will be less hard feelings at the end of the day

look at what bass has done with their rules for next year there even adopting some incentives

Dusty all I can say if boat operation means that much to you then you better get a boat. I think it would be very hard to find any organization that will require the boater turn over the trolling motor to the non-boater. It is encouraged by some trails but not required. It may still happen in ABA but it is up to the boater. Even when we had the rule the non-boater very rarely asked for it, but we always try to share the time between spots.

In reality most non-boaters aren’t nearly as familiar with the water as the boater and the attend to learn. There are exceptions to this I know. Going as non-boater is a very cheap way to get into tournament fishing. Only paying $20 for gas is very cheap when compared to what the boater has to pay for everything to provide the boat for the day.

The ABA is simply trying to satisfy as many people as possible. We have made 99% very happy and upset a small number. You can’t satisfy everyone as you know. This change brings us more in-line with other trails. Even the 8-man you mentioned doesn’t guarantee non-boater use of trolling motor. Here is the quote from the IL bass Federation.

Quote:

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Boat partners should discuss and agree to a schedule concerning the operation of the boat, trolling motor, seating arrangements and the selection of fishing locations. It is suggested this be done on a 50/50 basis

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With that said the non-boater is still entitled to calling the water for half a day and the boater has the option of giving up the trolling motor but if he choses not to then he must be sure to position the boat correctly so as not hinder the non-boater’s chances.

One last thing to keep in mind. The old rule was a big problem for ABA to recruit boaters. They simply didn’t want inexperienced anglers tearing up the trolling motor. It didn’t matter to them that it very rarely happend. If we can’t get enough boaters I think the non-boaters will be even more upset. I had to send away 2 people once because we didn’t have enough boats. I sure if you had been one of them that would have made you even more unhappy.

So maybe the ABA isn’t for you but if you want to fish with us some more you’re welcome in my boat and I take it personally if my non-boater doesn’t catch fish. I’ll give you the best chance I can and it might even mean running the trolling motor.

the last 8 man i fished you could have a boater dqd for not giving up control of the boat

i do own a boat but since im an unemployed college student i cant afford a boat that is tournament legal
16 foot with a tiller

ken when i was with you i didnt catch any fish oh well i didnt know where i was at so i had no business running the trolling motor

but a 100 dollar entry fee for a non boater to pay to fish against the boater i feel would detour more people from fishing

i am going to be president of the galesburg bassmasters next season

for a non boater to fish our tourneys its a 30 dollar entry fee and half the gas and lodging they do not have to fish against the guy in the front of the boat because they fish as a team and split all winnings 50 50

this is the way to go for a new guy cheaper easier and learn alot of local water

aba will benefit people that want to learn new bodies of water and are experienced enough to be able to fish out the back of a boat and catch fish

the system i just feel could be alot better so that the non boater and boater arent in competition it makes for a funner less stressful day on the water for both people

Dusty,

I see where you are coming from with the Boater Vs Non-Boater thing. While it may sound like a logical thing (to have seperate divisions) in reality it wouldn’t be very popular. Our fields are here in the midwest are not as large as they are in the southern districts. The anglers that we do have fish mainly fish as boaters. Let’s say we have a tournament with 20 members. I would estimate at most 5 of them are going to be non boater (this is probably a little high).

So if we had two divisions (boater and non) you would have 15 in one group and 5 in the other. The payout would obviously be significantly lower for the non-boaters, as would the points earned towards the Nationals. I wouldn’t think that would be too appealing to a non-boater.

There will always be new ideas and possibilities presented each year to try to make ABA grow. While all of them may sound good, some are just not possible. That is not to say they will not be possible in the future.

In a year or two we might just have two seperate divisions, who knows.

For the time being, it is what it is. I would personally like to invite you back up to the QC to fish with us. The more the merrier as far as I am concerned.

JT Bagwell

I get the impression this is the overall aba rule

I do see your point to the low draw for our area i still dont understand why it dont draw any better then it does

this new format of the advantage series should draw a few more boats maybe as time progresses youll be able to draw a full field on the reputation of the bassfishery itself (18 and 19 are about 1/2 of what they used to be) but 4 years ago they wasnt even close to what they are now

In our bass club we dont have enough boats to go around cause people with out the tournament worthy boats are joing because it is a cheaper alternative to learn and to compete.

Maybe aba should stress the benefits to come and fish as a non boater for learning new water
i hear alot of people are now fishing as non boaters in a few tournaments to learn pools even better with the limited time people have these days to explore new areas

just a thought
dusty

Dusty, yes that new trolling motor rule is nationwide.
My opinion of this-
I think that learning new water is one benefit of ABA and the “random pairings”. I fish as a boater, but i have had non-boaters including Bagwell with whom i explored new areas (actually new to both of us in some cases). Last year when he didnt have a boat we fished about 3 times together and learned lots of areas together. Many of those areas helped one or both of us this year to wins or big bass. I am happy to take non-boaters in my boat, and i think most secret honey holes are often actually community spots that are not really a secret. I think that in team tourneys you COULD get stuck in a rut- same partner fishing the same techniques in the same spots year after year. I have fished ABA as both a boater and a non-boater. Ive beaten my boater and been beaten as a boater. I think its nice to share ideas/spots/techniques/etc. When we stop wanting to learn we are doomed. Also- i dont know of anyone in this area, on this board or any other board who has it all figured out- some may be close, some think they do, but we all have stuff to learn. Even BASS and FLW pros often admit that the co-angler or a competitor helps them with something.

Those fishing ABA, BFL, Team supreme, BWS or club tourneys for the most part are either 1) having fun 2) enjoy competition 3) trying to learn 4) (very rarely) earning a living solely by fishing. That is why it is nice- i could fish with dusty, ken, jt, or anyone else-maybe dusty helps me out with 18 or 19, i help him with 16 or 17 or whatever, but its give and take. I might learn something that helps me and vice-versa. And i think that the honor system protects many of our “secret spots” (not in all cases). If i take you in my boat to one of my spots, i dont expect to see you there with your boater the next time we fish. I know dusty was good about not giving up Mikes spot that you 2 did well in, but the secret got out with the help of a 3rd party. anyway, my 2 cents- i think that the draw tourneys are nice for those of us who want to learn new water, new techniques, and meet new friends who share our love for fishing. More people would be nice, i think patience and tweeking the rules some could help. Its also nice when you get paired with someone who is willing to work together- Id rather have you win from the back of my boat than get beat by Ken, JT or a different boat – after all, if my non-boater wins at least i can claim some of the glory (LOL). anyway, enough from me.

thats a good way to put it all in perspective mike and i’s secret wasnt very secret it was the only spot on the pool i knew its just not the safest place ot take a 30,000 rig

in all honesty there arent many secret holes left in our bass club we all catch on sooner or later and with our limited back water down here isnt hard to find out

one boater in our club had a spot for about 3 tournaments he was weighing big fish off of well it came to pass as community hole well this year me and him was paired and he wouldnt go there cause he figured it was fished out well we culled out 3 fish there and won the tourney

i took the same boater to one of my holes i had never seen a boat in before well needless to say the word before the last tourney was he was on 3lb fish in my area when he got there some boat not in our club was there all day so he didnt keep my secret very well but oh well life goes on i have had 4 boaters there now so its community stuff

but there are holes on 18 thats comunity that have to be fished just right for them to bite

Exactly, its not just the spot all the time- you have to know how to work it correctly- thats why i would not hesitate to take a co-angler i didnt know to my spots-i would hope he/she would keep it between us, but if not there are many variables that make that spot work at that time, not necessarily at any time. i think as long as expectations are communicated ahead of time most people will respect what you ask of them (maybe im a little too optimistic of our society). Anyway, its a different type of tourney but one that has both advantages and disadvantages. I think the new ABA advantage improves payout % (although for higher entry fee) and may draw more ABA members from other districts or increase our local turnout. only time will tell.