Flippin and Punchin

Going to finally try some punching this season… We have some lakes in the past few years up here that have become heavy with Eurasian Milfoil…growing down to 15 fow…

I know there is some flippin and punchin done on this forum.

What do you like for tackle set ups? Rod/Reel line hooks baits?

What do you “punchers” like for skirts and plastics?

Tom –

I do alot of this in the Minneapolis Lakes.

I use a Broomstick of a Rod – I like the Loomis GLX Rods.

50 – 80 LB Braid –

I do tie on Flouro Leader -20-25 Lb Test.

I use a 1-1.25 oz Tungsten weight and the best two baits – by far are the Berkley Chigger Craw and there is a Missle Baits Craw that was outstanding too.

I love the straight shank – heavy flipping hooks wtih the built in plastic keeper. They are made for the HEAVY hook sets. They don’t flex.

I also have a lighter set up for later in the year – when the Milfoil begins to break up. 1/2 oz weight with a straight tail worm or slimmer profile craw type plastic.

Dog

Heavy to XH rod. Longer than 7′.. 1 oz to 1.5 oz weight.. Tungsten is good.. also look at either the strike king combo of skirt and sinker or just a punch skirt like a paycheck baits one.. Then a plastic profile that will not get hung up easily. Devils spear (havoc), Pit Boss(Havoc), D-bomb (missle baits) are three examples of baits I have used. A reel with good drag and higher rate of retrieve. And 50-65 lb braid. once you feel them hit it set the hook and just keep reeling until they are out of the cover.. Have fun I have caught some of my biggest fish flipping/ punching

Oh and forgot.. VMC and Lazer Trokar make good flipping/ punching hooks they are heavy guage with a straighter shank and plastic keeper.

Lots of companies with punching rods out there. I have an American Rodsmiths and a Powell. Really like the powell rods. Punching rods are generally rated up to around 2 oz weights.

I have revos for reels.
3/4 – 1.5 oz tungsten weights
65 lbs Sunline braid

I punch everything from 3″ craws to 12″ worms. Smaller and thinner baits get down through the stuff alot easier, but like all things, it depends on what the fish want.

Ok, I’ll bite. Please explain punching in at least some detail…I get the jest of it.

Flippin Stick…

Heavy Line(Flouro if you’re serious)…

Heavy jig..

Punchin is a weed type presentation,typicaly you use a flippn stick,7 1/2′ rod 65 lb braided line,3/4 to 1.5 oz weight and heavy hook w a plastic bait with out a lot of appendages to get hung up in heavy cover. you look for heavy weeds that top out in 5 to 15 fow underneath the weeds tops there is an open area that bass live in. You just drop the bait thru the weeds and the heavy weight take in to the bottom,oh you peg you weight so it doesn’t seperate from the bait, normally you flip or drop the bait w only 8 to 15 ‘ of line out,drag tight its heavy cover fishing so you want as little line out as possible and jerk the fish out of there,the big fish have the advantage in that stuff and you get kicked real bad if you’re late on them. I tryed heavey floro but you can’t handle big fish w it,the braid cuts the weeds better and doesn’t streach. I hope this helps answer your questions. Have fun fishn. come on warm water!
Stan

Excellent explanation. Thx Stan!

I like a Dobyns Champion 805 Flip/Punch Rod, 25lb Fluoro or 65lbs Braid, High Speed 200 size Reel, I like straight shank flipping hooks with Tungsten Flipping Weights, 1oz usually, Favorite Baits Evolve Kompak Craw, Big Show Craw, Sweet Beavers and baits like that

Flouro for this presentation is a joke. 50 or 65lb. braid is what you need.

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Flouro for this presentation is a joke. 50 or 65lb. braid is what you need.

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How’s that?

The braid cuts the weeds and you have to move the fish, also the fish will move and anything less than braid streches too much and the weeds act as a fulcrum point so they have the advantage and you don’t get a hook in them,it doesn’t take much,on bigger fish they can hang on and you don’t even move the bait in there mouth.
Stan

I prefer more bites and less breakoffs. I’ll stick with fluorocarbon.

My venture in the Milfoil (which is not super dense) will be with a Dobyns 7’9″MedHvy Fast action stick…40# 832 Camo Braid on a Lew’s Super Duty reel. Starting with a 1 oz slip jig…I will adjust accordingly…
I guess I will be a finesse puncher…

Why is flipping and punching in the same sentence? I would not use any of my flipping rods for punching, nor would I use any punching rods for flipping. Flipping for me is done with 3/8-1oz weights. Flip/pitch around brush, weed pockets, docks, etc. Punching is 1-2oz weights, punching through the milfoil.

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My venture in the Milfoil (which is not super dense) will be with a Dobyns 7’9″MedHvy Fast action stick…40# 832 Camo Braid on a Lew’s Super Duty reel. Starting with a 1 oz slip jig…I will adjust accordingly…

I guess I will be a finesse puncher…

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Not going to work worth crap. Too light of a rod, you won’t be able to turn them fast enough. The second you hook up you need to power them to the surface and out of the water. You do not fight fish at all when punching, not one bit. Rip em out and in the boat. If they fight you will lose them. The 40# braid is also too light, if you do get one buried you will never get him out.

65# braid is a minimum. For a rod I would suggest at least a 7’6 H or XH Fast action.

My dad uses a GLX844 and 20lb XT, and does fine. He can’t fish lures heavy enough to elicit a good reaction strike, but he does fine, rarely has problems getting fish out of heavy Mtka milfoil.

Old guys can’t handle heavy rods/baits. They also can’t swing hard enough to get a fish moving on a hookset. So there’s no point trying!

I use IMX904’s with an ounce Balancer…and they are tiring to use for hours on end.

Line, I prefer Gamma or BPS FC’s. 20lb. I tried 25lb and didn’t like the lure action or rate of fall. Plus, I have yet to break a bass off on either of these lines in 4 years.

I use braid in reeds, rice, docks, etc. And flippin/pitchin with braid, you need a softer rod. I will break 50lb all day on short line hooksets with a 904. Flippin milfoil on clear lakes…I get bit 5 times more with FC. I tried braid, for a very short time.

And lastly, retie often. Always be ready because when you hit a school you have to capitalize before they spook and bail out. It may not seem likely, but just your line rubbing on milfoil will wear it down, I retie at least every 25-30 minutes of use, regardless if I catch something or not.

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My venture in the Milfoil (which is not super dense) will be with a Dobyns 7’9″MedHvy Fast action stick…40# 832 Camo Braid on a Lew’s Super Duty reel. Starting with a 1 oz slip jig…I will adjust accordingly…
I guess I will be a finesse puncher…

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Probably work fine, though there is no benefit to the 7’9 rod. You get more leverage with shorter rods. Also, i’d suggest experimenting with a fluoro leader, and with that particular setup, I personally wouldn’t use anything more than 3/4 oz. Bigger weight/bigger lure means you need a more power at the hook on a set, mainly because you a pulling a bigger object through their mouth. Fishing lighter is fine, you just have to adjust lures if you think you need a fast, clean drop. I’ve caught more than I can recall in heavy milfoil with a 3/8 oz weight and a Helgie with 15lb line.

I prefer to fish fast and cover water. You’ll find key spots,but from what i’ve found over the years is that a high percentage of the fish you’ll catch are nomadic.

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You get more leverage with shorter rods.

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That is not true.. did you take a physics class in school? The longer the lever (yes a fishing rod is a lever), the more leverage you will get.

No, I didn’t.

Why don’t big game anglers use 12ft rods? 20ft?

The lever is not rigid. Plus, the fish has the advantage being on the long end of the lever,with the reel being the fulcrum. A shorter rod increases your advantage. Shorter rods equal more power at the fish.

Thanks for sharing your knowledge.

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No, I didn’t.

Why don’t big game anglers use 12ft rods? 20ft?

The lever is not rigid. Plus, the fish has the advantage being on the long end of the lever,with the reel being the fulcrum. A shorter rod increases your advantage. Shorter rods equal more power at the fish.

Thanks for sharing your knowledge.

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Onto something…or on something?

Well said, I really think you’re on to something here. I’m going to flip heavy milfoil with a 2 foot rod from now on, more power at the fish that way. For line I’ll go with 30lb. Mono, because that slices through grass just great.

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Why don’t big game anglers use 12ft rods? 20ft?

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Well I don’t know what you consider big game, but no musky angler would be caught using a 6′ rod. As for saltwater anglers, they don’t use long rods because they are using the reels as winches to bring the fish in, they do not use the rod to pull the fish. For this the rod length does not matter.

Every professional angler alive will tell you the longer rod the better for flipping, pitching, and punching. Most have gone to 8′ and longer now.

A rods main functions are casting and hook/lure presentation. They do not add power or leverage between the reel and the fish. They do serve as a safeguard for for catching slack line on a hookset or fighting fish.

Just stating the facts. Unless “the pros” changed Physics when I wasn’t looking.

I don’t consider a musky as “big game”.

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A rods main functions are casting and hook/lure presentation. They do not add power or leverage between the reel and the fish. They do serve as a safeguard for for catching slack line on a hookset or fighting fish.

Just stating the facts. Unless “the pros” changed Physics when I wasn’t looking.

I don’t consider a musky as “big game”.

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Those are not the facts. You have never punched before have you? You use the rod to pull the fish out, you get 2, maybe 3 cranks on the reel at best and only after the fish has broken the surface. The reel is only used to pick up slack line, you fight the fish out with the rod.

Maybe i’m different, in fact, I know I am. And maybe I do it all wrong. But my physics are correct.

For me, the rod only serves for hooksets. I set the hook as hard as I can, which is harder than most people(reason I break braid too much), then just turn the reel handle. There’s no fight involved, just wind ’em to the boat. After setting the hook, the rod is pretty much useless.

If people like to use longer rods, or lighter rods, whatever fits their preference, go for it. Personally, if someone made a 6-6 rod with an action similar to the 7-6 904X’s I use, i’d buy them. For fishing deep milfoil, there’s no need to make a pitch more than 10 feet from the side of the boat. No need for a longer rod for presentation, like you may for punching heavy mats or fishing docks…where you may not be able to position your boat very close without alerting fish.

I spend over 100 days on the water a year, 75% of the time I have a flippin’ stick in my hand. Been that way for many years, it’s my preferred way to fish. I have the way I fish fine tuned, others do it different.

Flipping and punching are two TOTALLY different things. One you use the reel, the other you use the rod.

Actually they’re very similar. Circumstances may vary, but very similar. Jr. Bassmasters like yourself may feel the need to complicate things, and confuse yourself, but ultimately they are the same presentation. Here in the midwest, it’s a presentation used in a range of situations ranging from less than a foot of water, to depths nearly 20ft. But no matter how you swing it, it’s all the same.

Now for people slow-witted like myself, we just call it flipping…whether punching, pitching, or actually flipping(the original presentation, before it gained a half a dozen different names). And it’s not uncommon to do all three on three consecutive casts. I learned to flip well before you were born.

You should stick with giving us Physics lessons and saltwater angling tips…are there even fish bigger than 5lbs in Iowa?

Have you noticed nobody else has said to use a short rod? Its because they have actually punched before. If you try and punch with a short rod you are going to just get a bass full of crap every time. Hopefully the line is heavy enough to cut through the weeds and WINCH him out with your REEL. But when I use a LONG ROD I can yank them right out of the place I punched through, rarely coming out with more than 1 or 2 weeds on him. You will NEVER see any of the pro’s use a short rod for punching, because it is STUPID. Yup, I said stupid. It is stupid. Maybe if you were flipping sparse vegetation it would be okay, I’ve flipped with a 5’6 before. It works. But you will never be able to punch with a rod like that with any sort of success. You probably have never even punched before, if you are flipping to the weeds you are not punching. Punching is done less than 15 feet from the boat, you just peel out enough like and let the bait drop like a rock right through the crap. Punching is done where the weeds are so thick you cant flip to it.

Flipping, Pitching, and Punching are three totally different things. The fact that you classify them as one thing shows how inexperienced you are. You may have been doing it for 50 years, but just because you are old does not mean you know what is best. Ever hear of the saying “Stuck in his old ways”? That would be you. Same guys throw spinnerbaits on 5′ rods because back in the 80’s that was the way it was done. Yup, it works.. but a 6’6-7′ works a whole lot better.

Puching is flipping but with shorter distance and heavy weights. You need the long rod to set the hook, pull up the slack, and pull the fish to the surface at one time. Ever see Shaw Grigsby punch? He uses an 8′ rod and when he sets the hook he runs towards the back of the boat until the fish break the surface, then he reels up on it and swings it in the boat or grabs it. He is one of the best punchers on this planet.

I’m willing to bet what you call punching is just flipping in vegetation. Way different than punching.

I’ve stayed out of this for a while but pitchn flippn and punchin are simalar but different! I started with bait casters that didn’t free spool and steel rods! I still have a couple of pisol grip rods 5’6″ to 7’6″ flipn sticks each rod has advantages and disadvantages,short rods for close in work,long rods for flippn-to deeper presentation. Long rods take up more line which is more forgiving and you can move fish out of places where they can kick your but. What is long for 1 person isn’t for another because of physical size,I’m 6’4″ 330#s and my fishing partner was 5’8″ and bearly 145#s he passed away 3 yrs ago,he used a 7′ rod for flippn because he would get wore out w/ a bigger rod. I have over the years gone to longer rods.I throw 6’6″ to 7’2″ rods now and feel that I have better control on the fish,I have 4 different action in 7’6″ flippen sticks for everything from soft action for deep cranking to heavy for only plunkn!
Stan

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Ever see Shaw Grigsby punch? He uses an 8′ rod and when he sets the hook he runs towards the back of the boat until the fish break the surface, then he reels up on it and swings it in the boat or grabs it. He is one of the best punchers on this planet.

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Well gotdam…you could have just mentioned that earlier so I wouldn’t have been questioning my techniques for the last 4 days…or should I say, lack of technigue.