So MN DNR is looking for input on Mille Lac Smallmouth

wow

blank wrote:

wow

Well, there are plenty of people out there who would rather see Red a Crappie mecca. If the DNR wants Mille Lacs to be a SMB mecca, then open up walleye to unlimited harvest and stock the hell out of the bass. They seem to want both. Probably will never happen for the long term. Just like crappies on Red.

-J.

Both species co-habitat in ML and thousands of other lakes in MN and Canada just fine. There is no need to try and make the lake one or the other.

And like those other lakes, need no special protections.

-J.

Water clarity has changed the lake. Never had a problem catching smallmouth or walleyes all through the 90’s.

I’m talking about 1990 and prior. Should have said the 80,s….

Water clarity has changed the lake. The fish have moved to different locations because of that.
Lake has been full of smallmouth for a long time.

It’s not ever going to be solely a walleye lake again. The water is too warm, it’s too clear, and unless you have mystery solution on how to reverse climate change, it ain’t happening. Get used to it being a smallmouth lake. If you don’t like it, go fish another one of the 10,000 lakes. Encouraging people to harvest smallmouth is downright disrespectful and your only doing it purely out of spite, Jordan. The smallmouth are not a renewable resource. They take way a long, long time to grow to trophy status this far north.

gimruis wrote:

It’s not ever going to be solely a walleye lake again. The water is too warm, it’s too clear, and unless you have mystery solution on how to reverse climate change, it ain’t happening. Get used to it being a smallmouth lake. If you don’t like it, go fish another one of the 10,000 lakes. Encouraging people to harvest smallmouth is downright disrespectful and your only doing it purely out of spite, Jordan. The smallmouth are not a renewable resource. They take way a long, long time to grow to trophy status this far north.

I don’t see it as being anymore disrespectful than you keeping Walleye for a meal. JJ and many others have a financial investment in the area and are entitled to their opinions as much as anyone else. It’s comical to think enough smallmouth would ever be kept to make a noticeable difference up there. If you are so sure the trophy smallmouth are so fragile I urge you not to use live bait and pinch down all the barbs on all your hooks.

I don’t target them for a meal. I don’t use live bait either. So your assumptions are inaccurate. And claiming that the bass have displaced the walleyes is completely false. The bass primarily eat crayfish and they don’t hardly eat anything for half the year because it’s too cold.

Jon thanks for adding your comments as they contributed a lot to the intent of this posting. There are plenty around ML that share your narrow mind set including an employee from Hunters who informed me that himself and all his buddies stick a knife in every smallie they catch.
In regards to LL survey results showing decline for last three years. This is different than DNR data shared at the meeting with the size structure not changing.
Dutch boy as you appear to be an expert what in your wisdom is leading to the decline from LL survey? From what I gather you don’t even fish the lake so really looking forward to your wisdom.

Have a friend with a cabin on the lake,him and his guests keep whatever legal smallmouth they can catch since they cant keep any walleyes.Id do the same if it was my cabin and I wanted a fish dinner.The smallies cut and cubed make an excellent chowder,or smallie stew as he calls it.

gonefishin,
What is the LL survey?

gonefishin wrote:

I don’t see it as being anymore disrespectful than you keeping Walleye for a meal. JJ and many others have a financial investment in the area and are entitled to their opinions as much as anyone else. It’s comical to think enough smallmouth would ever be kept to make a noticeable difference up there. If you are so sure the trophy smallmouth are so fragile I urge you not to use live bait and pinch down all the barbs on all your hooks.

Which part of this did you take as being a expert opinion?

Dutch boy as you appear to be an expert what in your wisdom is leading to the decline from LL survey? From what I gather you don’t even fish the lake so really looking forward to your wisdom.

You can gather anything you like. You don’t for a fact know if I fish the lake or not. You for a fact don’t know if I fish Bass, Walleye or Pike or maybe even Muskie. You know only what you read or think you have read. My opinions are just that…..opinions. I have no more proof then you do about your opinions. There are people like JJ who have a vested financial interest in the area. I don’t see why he wouldn’t be entitled to his opinions. I have clients who have businesses on the lake for many many years who also are entitled to their opinions. Even the occasional weekend warrior is entitled to their opinion.

Each year the DNR releases a report on the status of the lake officially called LARGE LAKE SAMPLING PROGRAM ASSESSMENT REPORT FOR MILLE LACS LAKE. It includes all their data from netting, electro shocking, etc. for all the species they track and can be obtained from the Aitkin Office.

Dutchboy guess what I actually have a place on the lake so probably have a vested financial interest also. But regardless the topic of this post was for input in regards to smallmouth recommendations for the DNR, not Jon’s walleye centrist opinion. He could have started his own walleye centrist posting and kept his comments out of this post as they added nothing related to the topic but turned it into a poop fest.

They are still his opinion on smallmouth management. Not only smallmouth anglers opinions matter.

Jon Jordan wrote:

Personally, I’d like to see the SMB population as it was circa 1990. A rare catch. The SMB have pushed walleye off their traditional areas, especially on the south end of the lake. And probably a significant reason walleye test net numbers have changed. Note I said changed, not declined since test nets are always in the same spot year to year. Now sitting in areas vacated by walleye. Not to mention the competition for the same food – perch. Which I can count on one hand the number I caught this year…

When In- Fisherman started talking about this topic (for shield lakes)the general suggestion was that walleye and smallmouth do not competed and each species assumes different areas in a given lake. Also, and this was 25 years ago the general idea was that smallmouth did not spawn every year due to cold water temperatures.

I no longer see this as the case (and again) this is my opinion. I think warmer waters have definitely benefited smallmouth over walleyes. I also believe that warmer water has lead to consistent spawning success for smallmouth. Which would suggest that generally smallmouth populations have increased and warmer springs and extended falls have kept lake temperatures high leading to longer feeding periods for bass and increased growth. Smallmouth are aggressive and are not lethargic feeders which would suggest this might have a detrimental effect on traditional walleye locations and yes, I agree that this would lead to walleyes being pushed off traditional feeding locations. Having fished for both my thinking is that smallmouth would move walleyes over walleyes moving smallmouth.

One thing I have seen from this tread is just how important “The Pond” is to Minnesota anglers and how much anglers want whats right and best. Many times with complex problems we look for simple solutions such as the DNR is completely incompetent and really doesn’t listen to input from the angling public. Another is claiming that a persons view is simply self interest instead of thinking that maybe the opinions one disagrees with are actually stated as a way to talk about what is really important for all that being a quality and sustainable fishery.
The more we argue the less opportunity emerges to find common ground.

I do have one question: is there any research to suggest that smallmouth or walleyes disturb or interrupt the spawning of the other species?

One smallie per tomato plant in the garden and talk about a bumper crop!

I would be happy as well to go back to 1990’s smallmouth populations. Personally I hope they go away. We have way way to many predators and no forage. Now that the lake is clearer that favors the predators. I would say keep all smallies and snot rockets.

MnPat1 wrote:

Water clarity has changed the lake. The fish have moved to different locations because of that.
Lake has been full of smallmouth for a long time.

This is BS and I am tired of hearing it. I am still seeing and catching walleyes in 3 feet of water in the middle of July in the super clear water. That has not changed one bit, they have NOT moved because of the clean water. The SMB have run the walleyes off many of their old stomping grounds period!

matt wrote:

Have a friend with a cabin on the lake,him and his guests keep whatever legal smallmouth they can catch since they cant keep any walleyes.Id do the same if it was my cabin and I wanted a fish dinner.The smallies cut and cubed make an excellent chowder,or smallie stew as he calls it.

I do the same, but I like smallie fillets with my eggs for breakfast, I really do and I am not saying that to antagonize, but I am not going to hide it either. Call it disrespectful for keeping SMB, that is hilarious!!

I believe Jon’s opinion on the SMB input was that he would like the population to go back to what it was. Isn’t that input on “Mille Lacs lake smallmouth”, the title of the thread? I certainly believe it was, but it wasn’t what some of you wanted to hear so you jumped his sh!t, no cool.

There is a healthy Walleye and Smallmouth population. Both should be open to harvest.

I don’t support Bass tournaments treating ML as their playground. The rules should be the same whether fishing for fun or tournament angling. Walleye tournaments follow the rules of the lake.

I’ll stick with my previous comments about Jon’s post and jumping in Jon’s poop is that is what you want to call it. Not trying to speak for Buzz but the first sentence in his post. “Looking to hear from Bass anglers on the Mille Lacs Fisheries Management plan.” I called him out because I don’t believe this post was for the SMB haters to provide their negativity but to get input for the DNR meeting to better protect the SMB. Guess what all the folks at the meeting were SMB supporters. You guys could have showed up and voiced your concern, instead choosing to hi-jack this post.

My last post on this wasted thread. I will start a new thread for SMB support only and you guys please keep your comments out unless it is to support SMB. Start your own thread on reducing SMB. I’ll make sure to stay out of your thread.

gonefishin wrote:

I’ll stick with my previous comments about Jon’s post and jumping in Jon’s poop is that is what you want to call it. Not trying to speak for Buzz but the first sentence in his post. “Looking to hear from Bass anglers on the Mille Lacs Fisheries Management plan.” I called him out because I don’t believe this post was for the SMB haters to provide their negativity but to get input for the DNR meeting to better protect the SMB. Guess what all the folks at the meeting were SMB supporters. You guys could have showed up and voiced your concern, instead choosing to hi-jack this post.

My last post on this wasted thread. I will start a new thread for SMB support only and you guys please keep your comments out unless it is to support SMB. Start your own thread on reducing SMB. I’ll make sure to stay out of your thread.

Why should only catch and release anglers have their voices heard? I don’t get this elitist mentality. It’s a fish that people eat. Just because you don’t want there to be harvest doesn’t mean there shouldn’t be any.

The DNR asked for input regardless of what side of the fence you’re on..

Maybe someone can start a smb support group for this guy.From what I have seen smb seem to multiply quickly and become overly abundant.Take the upper portions of the Mississippi above the metro for example,you cant keep the dang things off your line whether your fishing for them or not.Even If everyone filled buckets filleted and fried there will still be plenty to go around.

It’s pretty obvious which people in this thread bass fish and which ones are walleye anglers. The voice of the walleye guys is that of meat hunters and the voice of the bass anglers is that of passion. Bass are not a renewable resource this far north. It takes them 10 years to grow to trophy size. Harvesting them at a rate similar to other commonly consumed fish would decimate their population so quickly. Just think, if you kept 3 bass of trophy size, you literally just removed 30 years of growth and age. I suppose we should start harvesting more muskies too, huh?

I enjoy your comments, gonefishin. Well played.

BTW, there is nothing out there that says smallmouth bass push walleyes out of their territory or spawning grounds. That is pure nonsense. They don’t even actively target the same prey. The only fish overpopulated in that lake and many others are northern pike. Go harvest some of those slime bags.

matt wrote:

Maybe someone can start a smb support group for this guy.From what I have seen smb seem to multiply quickly and become overly abundant.Take the upper portions of the Mississippi above the metro for example,you cant keep the dang things off your line whether your fishing for them or not.Even If everyone filled buckets filleted and fried there will still be plenty to go around.

That section was not always that way. Bass groups fought for those regs that are now in place to protect them decades ago. Was a special place, with those regs in place for years now it’s extraordinary.

I don’t fish mille lacs enough to have a dog in this race. The people who show up are the ones who get listened to at least, not internet forums.

I’ll ask again, did MNFISH have a rep there?

I was not going to add any more poop to this poop show but can not help myself. Gimruis hit the nail on the head. Part of the reason for the growth in the B.A.S.S. population and decline in walleye population has to do with the way so called B.A.S.S. fishermen and walleye fisherman manage their chosen target. Most so called bass fishermen do so for the enjoyment and sport and do so with artificial lures. A larger portion of so called walleye fishermen target their fish with the intent of harvesting a limit as often as possible. And do so with live bait. If harvest is not the primary intent then why all this fuss. Most all the walleye fishermen I know say the walleye fishing on Mille lacs is better than ever right now. All the anger is over not being able to keep a limit of fish to eat. As far as keeping and eating a few bass I don’t have a problem with that at all. I myself keep a few meals worth ever year. when taken early or late in the season both SM and LM bass are just as or more tasty than walleye in MY opinion. I really believe that selective harvest is the key to all fish management. When I want a meal of bass, I target lakes with a large population of smaller sized bass.

gimruis wrote:

The only fish overpopulated in that lake and many others are northern pike. Go harvest some of those slime bags.

Wooo wooo wooo

As head director and CEO of the great northern pike alliance, I’d appreciate it if you’d also leave our species alone. What makes SMB or walleye any better???

SAVETHEPIKE.org
#pikearefishtoo
#releasetheslime

Just an observation guys-I haven’t seen anyone say they want people to harvest all SMB or trophy SMB. I think most people support some type of protected slots on SMB and Walleyes.