Smoke & Mirrors 2022 edition

CaptainMusky wrote:

No offense to NDSU, but the Gophers playing them would only hurt the GOphers. If they win, well they should have, if they lose its really bad. It wouldnt help the Gophers chances at bowls or rankings so it wont happen.

So what you’re saying is that the risk it too big to schedule the Bison in case they lose? That’s a weak argument if that’s the case. Geographically, NDSU is only 3 hours away and they have an enormous fan base. They’re perennially the top team in D1-AA. Why not schedule them? Certainly would help more than playing teams like Bowling Green, New Mexico State, and these other cupcakes.

CaptainMusky wrote:

I just saw it reported that Kill said he will likely not shake hands with PJ after the game and said when asked if he thought PJ cared for the players he replied “No”. What a DB and I dont mean Defensive Back!

Jeez what a doosh. I really don’t even understand what Kill’s problem is? I know it started about PJ’s changing the culture, which PJ explained very politely that it had nothing to do with the previous culture and just about what they are doing going forward. Is there something else I’m missing?

BigWerm wrote:

Is there something else I’m missing?

Kill is upset at the U of M administration for firing his assistant and friend, Tracy Claeys. He thought that move was completely unwarranted because Claeys took them to a 9-4 record and then got canned because a few players got into legal trouble.

https://www.kare11.com/article/sports/college/minnesota-golden-gophers/coach-jerry-kill-returns-to-minnesota-to-face-gophers-following-fiery-radio-comments/89-d22ab511-0c5e-450f-a506-e500e9f4c7da

Jeez talk about sour grapes, that had nothing to do with Fleck, yet he’s still chirping PJ. For a guy I liked as the HC, Kill has done a total 180 and shown his true colors. Just classless. Also, Claeys was always the Interim HC, so no assurances on keeping him, and wasn’t the “few players legal troubles” actually a lot worse than that. Involving a # of players and sexual assault on campus?

I agree. I liked Kill and thought it was real unfortunate how his career was affected by his medical condition and wished the best for him. I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s sour grapes about the university & his situation combined with him disliking Fleck’s style, energy, and buzzwords just like many on here already hated him before his first game took place.

I wonder what his current locker room is like? His players have got to be reading about this too.

BigWerm wrote:

Involving a # of players and sexual assault on campus?

If I remember correctly, 4 players ended up in legal trouble. I do think that the coach bears some responsibility for that, which was Claeys at the time. Keep your players in line. Fleck has done that, Claeys did not.

As of today, Minnesota is favored by a whopping 37.5 points against New Mexico State. LOL its going to be a butt kicking. Minnesota may not cover that spread, but I’d be shocked if they didn’t win by at least 20 points.

gim wrote:

So what you’re saying is that the risk it too big to schedule the Bison in case they lose? That’s a weak argument if that’s the case.

There is zero benefit to the Gophers to play NDSU. ZERO. Yeah it would put a bunch of fans in the seats, but playing a 1 AA team is not going to benefit them in any way so why bother? Sure it would likely be more competitive than some of the teams on their schedule, but you dont see many power 5 schools lining up to play 1 AA teams at all.

CaptainMusky wrote:

There is zero benefit to the Gophers to play NDSU. ZERO. Yeah it would put a bunch of fans in the seats, but playing a 1 AA team is not going to benefit them in any way so why bother? Sure it would likely be more competitive than some of the teams on their schedule, but you dont see many power 5 schools lining up to play 1 AA teams at all.

It still counts, doesn’t it? It would simply be another win (or maybe not) that would count towards their goal of qualifying for a bowl with a record of .500 or better.

Maybe the Gophers are just afraid of losing to the Bison? I see a greater benefit to playing them than a team like New Mexico State.

A win in the 3 non-conference games are 3 wins… to play a team that can potentially make you 2-1… can affect any bowl bids… its simple math. If a team is of championship caliber and strength of schedule comes in to play.. yeah then worry about your 3 cupcakes. We used to play TCU… that stopped.

gim wrote:

It still counts, doesn’t it? It would simply be another win (or maybe not) that would count towards their goal of qualifying for a bowl with a record of .500 or better.

Maybe the Gophers are just afraid of losing to the Bison? I see a greater benefit to playing them than a team like New Mexico State.

Why dont other schools line up to get on their schedule? There is only 1 Division 1 team on their schedule and its Arizona which isnt much of a football program at all. It has nothing to do about being afraid to lose to them its because there is literally no benefit to them at all in doing so. If playing NDSU benefitted a Division 1 school in any fashion they would schedule games with them, but it doesnt so few do.

gim wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>BigWerm wrote:</div>
Involving a # of players and sexual assault on campus?

If I remember correctly, 4 players ended up in legal trouble. I do think that the coach bears some responsibility for that, which was Claeys at the time. Keep your players in line. Fleck has done that, Claeys did not.

I looked it up, 10 players including a recruit, 1 girl on campus. And then Claeys Tweeted his support of the players, ridiculous. And even more ridiculous of Kill to hang onto that this long.

gim wrote:

So what you’re saying is that the risk it too big to schedule the Bison in case they lose? That’s a weak argument if that’s the case. Geographically, NDSU is only 3 hours away and they have an enormous fan base. They’re perennially the top team in D1-AA. Why not schedule them? Certainly would help more than playing teams like Bowling Green, New Mexico State, and these other cupcakes.

Why would the Gophers schedule someone that is all risk and no reward? The NDSU following would do nothing but make a home game feel like an away game, they sell about the same amount of seats regardless. Lose and NDSU is using that against you in recruiting, win a close game same used against you, win big and you were supposed to, and win huge and you’re running up the score. Plus these non-confernece games expand your brand to outside of your home territory, playing someone already in your backyard does nothing. Like I said all risk, no reward.

I remember the Gophers playing a D2 (or whatever it’s called now) school in the past few years and they said that school would receive $800,000 just from playing the Gophers. Great for those teams, gets their players something to get up for and might even play against some future NFL talent.

I see both sides of this, I think it would be a great rivalry and add a lot to a non-conference game.

I read this past week, after Saban signed a huge contract, that in the past 15 years Alabama is undefeated in non-conference road games…at 3-0. So most of the major schools do it. Yeah you want to win the game, but it’s also a chance to not burn out your starters, let’s the coordinators not show all their schemes or playcalls right away, and it’s somewhat equal to NFL preseason.

I agree, it would be awesome to have more meaningful games in the non-conference schedule, but the vast majority of big power schools don’t.

BigWerm wrote:

I looked it up, 10 players including a recruit, 1 girl on campus. And then Claeys Tweeted his support of the players, ridiculous. And even more ridiculous of Kill to hang onto that this long.

I think Claeys’ effort was an attempt to keep the team unified and back his players, when a better approach might have been “we’re doing everything we can to cooperate with the investigation and will let a court of law make the decision.”

I believe one of those players was Antoine Winfield, Jr, who ended up having charges dropped or something like that. His dad (the former Viking) was so mad he wanted to pull Jr. from the Gophers. Interesting recent history for a guy that was a stud at the U, now plays with Tom Brady, is a super bowl champ, an All-Pro, and listed as one of the current top-100 players in the NFL.

Dan wrote:

I believe one of those players was Antoine Winfield, Jr, who ended up having charges dropped or something like that. His dad (the former Viking) was so mad he wanted to pull Jr. from the Gophers. Interesting recent history for a guy that was a stud at the U, now plays with Tom Brady, is a super bowl champ, an All-Pro, and listed as one of the current top-100 players in the NFL.

He was one of them, but I dont believe any players were actually charged, but it sure was a mess.

The Gophers will never ever play NDSU again…for sure as long as Fleck is there. They’re capable of upsetting the gophers and a win against them means nothing (to those who influence the polls).

The perception of the Big 10 West being solid, but not great lends itself to these teams having two paths for non conference……schedule cupcakes and get they hype train rolling when you’re 5-0 and have played nobody……or try to sign a top notch SEC power or a Notre Dame, Oregon, Clemson, etc to a non conference matchup to see where you stand and gain ground for playing them close or the longshot upset.

PJ is firmly in the corner of the first strategy. It fits his rah rah personality perfectly, and there’s nothing wrong with that.

I cannot stand the guy and his antics, but won’t say he’s a bad coach. He’s breathing life into MN Football and has fans often ducking the obvious ceiling that the program has. They will never be more than equal to the Iowa and Wisconsin programs…but that’s still noteworthy in my book.

gim wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>CaptainMusky wrote:</div>
No offense to NDSU, but the Gophers playing them would only hurt the GOphers. If they win, well they should have, if they lose its really bad. It wouldnt help the Gophers chances at bowls or rankings so it wont happen.

So what you’re saying is that the risk it too big to schedule the Bison in case they lose? That’s a weak argument if that’s the case. Geographically, NDSU is only 3 hours away and they have an enormous fan base. They’re perennially the top team in D1-AA. Why not schedule them? Certainly would help more than playing teams like Bowling Green, New Mexico State, and these other cupcakes.

No reason to play an FCS school when you are and FBS school. They just singed a 7 billion TV contract they don’t need Fargo fans.

Having a program that consistently signs 5 or more of the top 10 recruits in this state, sure is a nice change he brought. Rah Rah Rah !!!

Never understood the argument of closing the boarder for football. It’s not like Minnesota is churning out a bunch of NFL players. There is 80 kids in the program who cares if 2, 5 or 10 are from Minnesota. The transfer portal makes that even more insignificant IMO.

I guess getting all the best players from around the country doesn’t help Alabama and Ohio State… gotcha.

Huh? Are you comparing Alabama and Ohio state to the U of M. Why?

Ripjiggen wrote:

Huh? Are you comparing Alabama and Ohio state to the U of M. Why?

No I am saying, keeping the best kids in state is only “helping” the Gopher program. Very few college players from any program, make it to the NFL, but when a majority of them come from Alabama and OSU, it is because they have the cream from the whole country. Keeping our cream here was always a struggle for the program.

I can see that it in basketball and such football you just need so many players that I think it is overrated. Probably doesn’t hurt to keep some of the best local kids, but a 3 star is a 3 star wherever they come from.

Ripjiggen wrote:

I can see that it in basketball and such football you just need so many players that I think it is overrated. Probably doesn’t hurt to keep some of the best local kids, but a 3 star is a 3 star wherever they come from.

I think there’s some value in a culture of the best kids in state go to the U. Makes recruiting easier if you get a few homegrown kids that don’t think about leaving, you can focus more attention elsewhere.

Sure…just don’t think it makes it breaks a program like the U.

Ripjiggen wrote:

Sure…just don’t think it makes it breaks a program like the U.

Agreed, and honestly it was probably more important under previous regimes. PJ has increased the overall talent level of recruits to the point there’s fewer MN kids they’re likely interested in.

big_g wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Ripjiggen wrote:</div>
Huh? Are you comparing Alabama and Ohio state to the U of M. Why?

No I am saying, keeping the best kids in state is only “helping” the Gopher program. Very few college players from any program, make it to the NFL, but when a majority of them come from Alabama and OSU, it is because they have the cream from the whole country. Keeping our cream here was always a struggle for the program.

Agree. It’s always been a struggle, Fleck is changing that slowly but surely.

CaptainMusky wrote:

The other thing to consider is the UofM has some of the more stringent entry criteria for academics too. I believe Northwestern is the only BigTen school that is possibly higher. That means a lot. Many of the best athletes are terrible students and yet PJ has upped the Team GPA every year he’s been here. It will be interesting to see the on field interaction between PJ and Kill after the game next week. Couldnt be two more polar opposites in terms of personality. I liked Kill, but he sure burned the building down on the way out with his comments. I dont think he will get a real warm welcome.

Toughest Big Ten schools to get into:
1. Northwestern
2. Michigan
3. Wisconsin

The easiest schools to get into:
1. Nebraska
2. Iowa
3. Michigan State

MX1825 wrote:

Toughest Big Ten schools to get into:
1. Northwestern
2. Michigan
3. Wisconsin

The easiest schools to get into:
1. Nebraska
2. Iowa
3. Michigan State

MN, WI and Ohio state are all tied with same acceptance rate.

gim wrote:

I wish they would schedule better non-conference games though. The three opponents they play in non-conference every season is kind of a joke.

I think this holds true across most of college football (basketball as well). As a general rule I think the non-conference is more of a “tune up” to conference play. Even Alabama has LA-Monroe & Austin Peay on the schedule this year. Mind you these are home games as well. I don’t think these power five programs want to travel to play a tough opponent. The risk of a loss has end of season implications.

The chances of having a quality non-conference opponent on the schedule greatly decreased when the Big 10 went from eight to nine conference games a few years ago.