Sad / Senseless Crime in Bemidji Minnesota

Riverrat wrote:

Thinking that 2 year old data is “old” is a great indicator of thoughtless people who will gobble up whatever rhetoric they think will help make an argument in their favor. It takes years to peer review studies. Anything that isn’t pure raw data should be at least 2 years old. Anyone who is using pure raw data should at least have a masters degree. I would say sorry for this not being relevant to the OP but that ship sailed awhile ago.

I don’t need a master’s degree to know that crime has increased dramatically in these last 3 years.
Don’t look at data. Talk to people, look around, use your brain and common sense. Try thinking for yourself and stop believing what they’re selling on the tv.
I think the thoughtless people are the ones standing up for our government right now.

grubson wrote:

I think the thoughtless people are the ones standing up for our government right now.

Spot on. There simply can’t be anyone who thinks what is happening now has been an improvement of any sort.

big_g wrote:

Who said it was “old” ? It is dated material and the dates in question are not represented. Did you type this out ?

No it was a canned response from the script.

(double post)

John Rasmussen wrote:

Spot on. There simply can’t be anyone who thinks what is happening now has been an improvement of any sort.

this is a total straw man. no one has said it’s an “improvement,” just that unauthorized immigration and the rate of violent crime are not linked.

Don’t look at data.

huh. well. that’s fine, it’s easy to be a critic when you don’t have to support your perspective in any meaningful way beyond, “common sense” and “look around.” i’m smiling at the image of you shaking your fist in the air as you say this. smh.

if anyone can get back to us with some evidence that unauthorized immigrants are increasing the rate of violent crime, i’m all ears.

i’ll wait…

And that last statement.. tells me a lot about your naivete or your ability to apply any common sense at all to the situation.

Hold your breath please.

grubson wrote:

I don’t need a master’s degree to know that crime has increased dramatically in these last 3 years.

No one doesn’t, nor does one need a degree to keep those figures within the context of this conversation.

We’ve all seen the videos of the riots, looting, carjackings, etc and subsequent actions/crimes of certain peoples thereafter, sure didn’t look like south of the border types to me, did it to you?

this is a total straw man. no one has said it’s an “improvement,” just that unauthorized immigration and the rate of violent crime are not linked.

Don’t look at data.

huh. well. that’s fine, it’s easy to be a critic when you don’t have to support your perspective in any meaningful way beyond, “common sense” and “look around.” i’m smiling at the image of you shaking your fist in the air as you say this. smh.

if anyone can get back to us with some evidence that unauthorized immigrants are increasing the rate of violent crime, i’m all ears.

i’ll wait…
[/quote]

As I said before. More people = more crime. Period.
We have enough crime problems without millions of law breaking illegal immigrants adding to the problem. Remember they’re all breaking the law just being here. If they’re willing to break one, how many more are they willing to break?
All the evidence you should need is in the first pages of this post.
A “Texan” with questionable citizenship status and multiple warrants and 11 illegal immigrants had 3 young girls tied up in their place of residence. If that’s not enough to make you think im not sure there’s any hope for you.
Common sense isn’t so common anymore I guess.

Deuces wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>grubson wrote:</div>
I don’t need a master’s degree to know that crime has increased dramatically in these last 3 years.

No one doesn’t, nor does one need a degree to keep those figures within the context of this conversation.

We’ve all seen the videos of the riots, looting, carjackings, etc and subsequent actions/crimes of certain peoples thereafter, sure didn’t look like south of the border types to me, did it to you?

Did I say that they were all immigrants? Don’t put words in my mouth. I’ve said multiple times, I guess once more wont hurt. We have enough crime problems without the help from the millions of immigrants who obviously aren’t worried about breaking our laws.
You guys are something else. Keep grasping at nothing and spewing your script like good little sheep.

Common sense like paying attention to the story and seeing that it changed to two girls in the apartment, one of which was an adult and was there voluntarily?

Bemidji Police Release New Info on Investigation into Rape of 11-Year-Old Girl

How about the fact that at no point has the chief of Bemidji police held a press conference or publicly asked for more information? Pretty sure he’s not an illegal immigrant but he sure is around an awful lot of crime for a small town.

Riverrat wrote:

Does that make it better? A little girl was assaulted….
I wouldn’t consider bemidji a small town either imo.
Bemidji is a self proclaimed progressive city with mostly democratic leadership. Im not surprised one bit that crime is bad there. Im sure the corruption runs deep. Yet another example of why we don’t need illegal immigrants adding to our problems as a country.

A “Texan” with questionable citizenship status and multiple warrants…

what makes someone from Mission, Texas have questionable citizenship?
dog whistle.

…and 11 illegal immigrants had 3 young girls tied up in their place of residence.

one girl, not three. (still bad!)
and the reports are that none of those 11 people were identified as suspects. their gender is not described, but they are in Bemidji freaking Minnesota living in cramped conditions and they don’t speak English. when you’re familiar with these issues you recognize that it’s a real possibility some of them are also victims of human trafficking. obviously i don’t have proof of that in this exact case, but it is a much more plausible possibility than the idea of a gang of child rapists.

If that’s not enough to make you think im not sure there’s any hope for you. Common sense isn’t so common anymore I guess.

yeah…thinking is hard, eh?

Of course they’re the victims my bad. WTF.
We’re they tied up? Did they try to escape? Did they report the rape? Did they try to stop him?
Unless all of those answers are yes they don’t seem like victims to me.
Law abiding citizens or just generally good people would do something about a girl being raped right?

The rapist was from mission Texas which is located directly on the border with Mexico. It was mentioned earlier in this thread that his citizenship was in question. I’ll admit I’m going on a hunch there. Regardless he’s a wanted felon piece of trash. I’d bet he was the driver hauling and hiding these people.
Just go by the “facts” that you read or heard on the news. They’re never dishonest at all. They’ve done nothing but lie and hide the truth the last 3 years.

I think we all can agree that for whatever reasons something needs to be done to control the border.

grubson wrote:

Of course they’re the victims my bad. WTF.
We’re they tied up? Did they try to escape? Did they report the rape? Did they try to stop him?
Unless all of those answers are yes they don’t seem like victims to me.
Law abiding citizens or just generally good people would do something about a girl being raped right?

well, at a minimum you’ve made it very clear that you have a deep and compassionate understanding of the issues and pressures they face.

Dutchboy wrote:

I think we all can agree that for whatever reasons something needs to be done to control the border.

Dutch based on some of the people commenting here I don’t think that’s the case. They are fine with the free for all that this administration has allowed.

Michael C. Winther wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>grubson wrote:</div>
Of course they’re the victims my bad. WTF.
We’re they tied up? Did they try to escape? Did they report the rape? Did they try to stop him?
Unless all of those answers are yes they don’t seem like victims to me.
Law abiding citizens or just generally good people would do something about a girl being raped right?

well, at a minimum you’ve made it very clear that you have a deep and compassionate understanding of the issues and pressures they face.

11-12 MEN who according to the victim at least four of them were in the room at the time of the assault.
My compassion went out the window long ago for this group.
As far as my compassion for others? All I’ll say is you don’t know me so fly a kite for your judgment.

Riverrat….

Because you missed other press releases regarding this, here is just a couple of them. The TV news reports very little or just pieces of information from up north. Still an active investigation.

Press Release
On 09/23/23, the Sanford Bemidji Medical Center’s Emergency Department called the Bemidji Police Department for an assault complaint. Sanford medical personnel reported to law enforcement a juvenile female presented at the Emergency Department and stated she had been sexually assaulted.
Officers with the Bemidji Police Department immediately responded and spoke with the adults who brought the juvenile to the Emergency Department. Officers were given several possible addresses where this sexual assault occurred in the City of Bemidji.
Through the investigation, officers and detectives identified 1821 America Court NW, Bemidji, as the location of the sexual assault and a search warrant was executed at this residence. During the execution of the search warrant a 22-year-old male identified as Oscar Ernesto Luna, age 22 was arrested on an warrant from Hennepin County and also charged with 1st degree criminal sexual conduct in Beltrami County.
There were several other individuals located and identified at 1821 America Court NW, eleven of which were transported by US Border Patrol to be processed as illegal immigrants.
This is an ongoing investigation.
The Bemidji Police Department was assisted by the Beltrami County Sheriff’s Office, Minnesota Bureau of Criminal Apprehension’s Crime Scene Team, US Border Patrol, and US Dept of Homeland Security.

Bemidji Police Department
October 4 at 12:15 PM
·
PRESS RELEASE UPDATE:
On September 23rd, 2023 Bemidji Police officers responded to the Sanford Medical Center’s Emergency Department of a report of an assault. Responding Officers learned that a juvenile female had been sexually assaulted. Through investigation, Bemidji Police Officers and Detectives were able to identify 1821 America Court as the location where the assault occurred. Bemidji Police Department Detectives executed a search warrant at that address and located one of the suspects described by the victim. Oscar Ernesto Luna, age 22 of Texas was arrested and has been charged by the Beltrami County Attorney’s Office with 1st degree Criminal Sexual Conduct.
During the search, twelve (12) other individuals were located and identified. The U. S. Border Patrol was requested to assist because of a language barrier. None of these individuals could be immediately identified as suspects in this case and eleven (11) were turned over to the custody of the U.S. Border Patrol. Any involvement they may have in this case is still actively being investigated.
During the continued search of the area, one of the females described by the juvenile victim was located. This individual was identified as an adult and did not report being assaulted. This individual further reported that she was not aware of a third victim. During the execution of the initial search warrant, Bemidji Police Detectives confirmed that there was not a third victim still in the residence and continue to investigate the possibility of a third victim.
With the assistance of the Minnesota Bureau of Criminal Apprehension Crime Scene Team, the residence of 1821 America Court was processed for more than eight hours in an attempt to locate any evidence in this case. Since this incident was first reported, Bemidji Police Detectives and Agents from the Bureau of Criminal Apprehension have been diligently investigating this case to ensure there are no other victims and that those responsible are arrested. This incident does appear to be isolated.
As the investigation continues, the Bemidji Police Department asks that everyone recognize the trauma and respect the privacy of the juvenile in this case. The Bemidji Police Department is collaborating with numerous agencies across this state with the steadfast focus of solving this case and keeping all of our communities’ children safe.
Anyone with information regarding this case is encouraged to contact the Bemidji Police Department at 218-333-9111
Mike Mastin, Chief of Police
Bemidji Police Department

Michael C. Winther wrote:

well, at a minimum you’ve made it very clear that you have a deep and compassionate understanding of the issues and pressures they face.

At minimum you have made it really clear that you are a total F-ing idiot. Why haven’t you been bringing all these great people into your home with all of your understanding and compassion. They are living smashed together like the inside of a clown car and could use your nice place. My guess is that even as an idiot you would know that’s a bad idea.

Onthewater wrote:

At minimum you have made it really clear that you are a total F-ing idiot. Why haven’t you been bringing all these great people into your home with all of your understanding and compassion. They are living smashed together like the inside of a clown car and could use your nice place. My guess is that even as an idiot you would know that’s a bad idea.

wow, fun. hello, friendly person!

yes, living smashed together is incredibly bad. and no one willingly chooses this because they just love it so much. perhaps if you’d read my previous comments instead of skimming, swearing, and name-calling, you’d notice my hypothesis that this was not their choice, but rather that some/many of them were being trafficked. it’s just a hypothesis, but it’s very possible that being taken into custody by immigration saved them from exploitation.

Michael C. Winther wrote:

you’d notice my hypothesis that this was not their choice, but rather that some/many of them were being trafficked. it’s just a hypothesis, but it’s very possible that being taken into custody by immigration saved them from exploitation.

Michael. I like how you use a hypothesis like the fact that they were being trafficked as a Valid one but have a hard time with the Hypothesis that the Persons who was arrested may possibly not be a legal citizen or the one where its possible that one or more of the illegal people people in the house may have had a roll in the crime of rape. It funny how all of your hypothesis are valid while everyone’s else’s are invalid without proof. One person asked you if you have opened your door to all these exploited immigrants you feel so strongly about. I have yet to see your response to that question. Or are you just fine with it as long as it only effects other people and not you. I truly believe if you feel this strongly about Illegal immigrants being fine you should be willing to help them out in any way that you can.

Not worth the effort to try to debate someone who calls them “unauthorized immigrants” That’s like calling a murderer an unauthorized life taker.

big_g wrote:

Not worth the effort to try to debate someone who calls them “unauthorized immigrants” That’s like calling a murderer an unauthorized life taker.

You are probably correct. I just often find myself wanting to know why it is that someone thinks the way he does about these things. Maybe he is a unauthorized immigrants himself, or has a family member who is. Then I could at least understand his point of view some.

…but have a hard time with the Hypothesis that the Persons who was arrested may possibly not be a legal citizen

the news article went out of its way to make a distinction between the person who committed child sexual assault being from Texas, and the 11 people in the home who were detained by immigration. i suppose i don’t view them stating that distinction as a coincidence.

…or the one where its possible that one or more of the illegal people people in the house may have had a roll in the crime of rape.

if there were any evidence for this, they would have been arrested by the police and not turned over to immigration. i suppose i don’t view that as a coincidence either, although the police leave wiggle room by saying they continue to investigate those individuals for any role. (which could include failure to protect.)

…if you feel this strongly about Illegal immigrants being fine you should be willing to help them out in any way that you can.

i’ve stated – repeatedly, if you care to go back and re-read it – that immigration is a serious problem that needs to be addressed. it’s just a different problem than violent crime, and conflating the two issues is unhelpful. saying “take them into your house” is a straw man argument.

…Not worth the effort to try to debate someone who calls them “unauthorized immigrants”

that’s just the language used by the Dept of Homeland Security. they define unauthorized immigrants as: “…all foreign-born non-citizens who are not legal residents.”
politically correct language can go way too far. way, way too far.
but i do find it helpful to use person-centered language. our word choice reflects and shapes our view of others, and “illegal alien” is dehumanizing, something that makes it easier to not care about them or be thoughtful about related issues. i choose to see the person first, and the issues second. i suppose for some that makes me bad guy, or a “total F-ing Idiot”?

Michael C. Winther wrote:

the news article went out of its way to make a distinction between the person who committed child sexual assault being from Texas, and the 11 people in the home who were detained by immigration. i suppose i don’t view them stating that distinction as a coincidence.

…or the one where its possible that one or more of the illegal people people in the house may have had a roll in the crime of rape.

if there were any evidence for this, they would have been arrested by the police and not turned over to immigration. i suppose i don’t view that as a coincidence either, although the police leave wiggle room by saying they continue to investigate those individuals for any role. (which could include failure to protect.)

So where in the story does it state that the 11 people who were detained by Immigration where being trafficked ???

Michael-
Are you not going to answer their question?

Being so compassionate for others, I’ll assume you’re more than willing to open your doors to them?

fishthumper wrote:

So where in the story does it state that the 11 people who were detained by Immigration where being trafficked ???

I fail to find that correlation as well. Regardless, if illegals committed a crime, deport them. Dont put them in our prisons for them to be mooching off our dimes. Send them back to wherever they came from.

CaptainMusky wrote:

if illegals committed a crime, deport them. Dont put them in our prisons for them to be mooching off our dimes. Send them back to wherever they came from.

Not a Big fan of this idea. If you deport the criminal Illegal immigrants they will simply walk back across our border the next day and will be right back in the country and will most likely commit another crime. I say Jail them under the same conditions that a US citizen would be jailed in if they commit a crime in Mexico. I think its safe to say their jail conditions are far worse than ours.

fishthumper wrote:

I say Jail them under the same conditions that a US citizen would be jailed in if they commit a crime in Mexico.

The problem is that they’re using taxpayer dollars and resources at a federal prison though.

A lot of illegal immigrants aren’t originally from Mexico either. Yes, that’s where they cross, but the majority of them, at least right now, are coming from Central America or Venezuela. I would just prefer to deport them back to their country of origin instead. Our federal prisons are at or near capacity already.

So where in the story does it state that the 11 people who were detained by Immigration where being trafficked ???

it doesn’t. as i’ve mentioned – repeatedly, if you care to go re-read it – that’s just a hypothesis. but it’s a theory based on having an understanding of the kinds of forced sexual labor that is taking place and how it occurs. another possibility is that they’re being forced into seasonal farm work. someone takes your passport, makes you promises, and you don’t speak English…
no one has presented an alternative theory other than shouting “bad immigrants” over and over. what’s yours?

Being so compassionate for others, I’ll assume you’re more than willing to open your doors to them?

yes, i think we should provide a better path for legal immigration and integration into American society.
and no, i don’t respond to straw man arguments.

The problem is that they’re using taxpayer dollars and resources at a federal prison though.

state prison, not federal. this is determined by the nature and location of the crime, not someone’s legal status. federal prisons are for federal crimes, typically something that crosses state boundaries such as drug trafficking, internet crimes, or financial issues. they don’t generally put people in prison for immigration status violations.
but to your point it’s being funded by taxpayers and state prisons are over-crowded too. the rate at which we place non-violent offenders in prison is probably one of the least cost-effective things we do as a society.