Sad sad news for all anglers and parents

This accident is one that could’ve happened to a lot of guys at one point or another. This guy’s luck just finally ran out. Many lives ruined forever. Just a tragic situation.

Very sad

Just a terrible tragedy. Prayers sent.
I also think a person should be allowed 1 mistake but that mistake should have severe consequences. No license for 6 months, $2500 fine, and prove you carry insurance of 1 million after you get your license back. 2nd offense penalties double.

My prayers go out. Sad Sad.

queenswake wrote:

This accident is one that could’ve happened to a lot of guys at one point or another. This guy’s luck just finally ran out. Many lives ruined forever. Just a tragic situation.

There was nothing accidental about this. Accident implies that what happened was beyond anyone’s control. A guy getting drunk and then getting on a snow machine and tearing around a lake with other people nearby doesn’t produce an accident, it produces homicide.

Grouse

shady5 wrote:

“Put in some laws with teeth that are public, embarrassing, and costly, without being life destroying,…”

I’m wondering what drunk driving victims’ families would say to that?

I think they would welcome public policy that significantly lowers the overall prevalence of drunk driving, and consequently the number of injuries/deaths. Stories like these are the catalyst behind many awareness and prevention campaigns.

If someone happens to kill someone on their first offense I’m pretty sure they are screwed even under our current laws (unless they are rich/connected).

tindall wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Shady5 wrote:</div>
“Put in some laws with teeth that are public, embarrassing, and costly, without being life destroying,…”

I’m wondering what drunk driving victims’ families would say to that?

I think they would welcome public policy that significantly lowers the overall prevalence of drunk driving, and consequently the number of injuries/deaths. Stories like these are the catalyst behind many awareness and prevention campaigns.

If someone happens to kill someone on their first offense I’m pretty sure they are screwed even under our current laws (unless they are rich/connected).

You’re probably correct, the families would be entirely content with the person being embarrassed, especially publicly, just not punished too severly so it doesn’t ruin THEIR life.

From what I could find, the typical sentence in Minneslovia for vehicular homicide is ten years with six served in a facility and the remainder on supervised release. Doesn’t sound too “screwed” to me.

Drunk driving is an entirely conscious choice, why go light on these people?

shady5 wrote:

You’re probably correct, the families would be entirely content with the person being embarrassed, especially publicly, just not punished too severly so it doesn’t ruin THEIR life.

From what I could find, the typical sentence in Minneslovia for vehicular homicide is ten years with six served in a facility and the remainder on supervised release. Doesn’t sound too “screwed” to me.

Drunk driving is an entirely conscious choice, why go light on these people?

There are two different topics here: one is drunk driving, the other is vehicular homicide.

I don’t think families who lost someone to a drunk driver will find contentment from any legislative source. And honestly, I don’t know how to quantify “screwed”. The people I worked with who had 6-10yrs in prison and felonies were pretty limited in their future prospects for employment, relationships, etc, but it is certainly fair to claim they didn’t pay their debt to the victim.

But as for my original statement about drunk driving arrests, I still think much stronger punishments then presently exist could change behavior, and that most people could support that. We could push for completely destroying the life of everyone who was pulled over drunk, but it likely wouldn’t find widespread support. From my experience and study working with public safety (college alcohol use & college sexual assault) changing the culture of public opinion and policies doesn’t generally go from a crappy lax system to El Salvador overnight.

Heck, look at a bunch of comments on this thread – many still think there should be 1 or more slap on the wrists for “mistakes”, even in light of this story. If I was a betting man I’d wager that some people have driven drunk at some point in their life, or had a DUI, or know a family/friend who did (I can personally think of 4 off-hand that I KNOW about). So, despite a consensus that the act of drunk driving is bad, for whatever reasons there is reluctance in saying we should destroy every first time offender.

Maybe as a first step, a truly acute penalty for first time offenses that doesn’t necessarily have life ruining enduring effects would find widespread support, lead to fewer repeat violations, and serve as a deterrent for others.

Tindall,
For the most part, I agree with your last post. What we haven’t defined is “destroying someone’s life”, but I am not particularly interested in pursuing that topic.
In summsry, I don’t proclaim to have the answer, I just know the following:
1. A DUI today is already expensive (relative to the median family income).
2. There is already an element of public embarrassment (your name and offense are published in local media, you have to attend a MADD meeting as the enemy, you have to display a ‘whiskey plate’ on your vehicle, etc.).
3. There continue to be entirely too many deaths caused by these people.
I believe you’re correct about the prevalence rate creating resistance for meaningful change; each of us absolutely knows someone personally that has benn convicted with DUI. That in itself is alarming and should galvanize our society to address this more seriously, but I don’t believe we’re seeing that. The only answer I can conceive is ratcheting up the punishment until the risk isn’t worth it.

Terrible tragedy…….Senseless tragedy! One DUI is not acceptable. We can all make smarter choices. Believe me I have made mistakes in my life as well. Time for tougher punishments that make a person think before displaying the risky behavior. Thoughts and prayers to the family.

God bless that little man, taken way too soon.

My heart aches for the family, it will take a long time, but the pain they feel will lessen.

And to all of you guys out there, the family still needs some financial support. Every dollar helps.

I understand the stong emotions, one may want to take the same view with TEXTING and DRIVING. Oddly public sees this as a serious matter but they wont support tougher laws but will rail on dwi offender. Its laughable when someone kills while text and driving how minimal the consaquences are. For second or third offences just as laughable.
I’m not downplaying the severity of driving under the influence but a death is a death either by dwi or distracted driving.

The National Safety Council reports that cell phone use while driving leads to 1.6 million crashes each year.
Nearly 330,000 injuries occur each year from accidents caused by texting while driving.
1 out of every 4 car accidents in the United States is caused by texting and driving.
Texting while driving is 6x more likely to cause an accident than driving drunk.
Answering a text takes away your attention for about five seconds. Traveling at 55 mph, that’s enough time to travel the length of a football field.
Texting while driving causes a 400% increase in time spent with eyes off the road.
Of all cell phone related tasks, texting is by far the most dangerous activity.
94% of drivers support a ban on texting while driving.
74% of drivers support a ban on hand-held cell phone use.

Ditto Grouse So damm sad.

B-man wrote:

And to all of you guys out there, the family still needs some financial support. Every dollar helps.

My buddy and I are working on a fund raiser. More details will come soon.

Terrible and tragic.

No level of punishment has solved this problem to this point. People continue to think they won’t get caught, even if they’ve already been caught once (or more) and suffered the “consequences.” We need to stop thinking about what we can do to try and make people make better decision; instead the decisions need to be made by a completely objective party — a machine.

In my opinion. One DUI = interlock breathalyzer installed on all your vehicles for life. You don’t get the choice anymore. You are caught driving a vehicle without interlock, you go to jail for a long time.

TheFamousGrouse wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>queenswake wrote:</div>
This accident is one that could’ve happened to a lot of guys at one point or another. This guy’s luck just finally ran out. Many lives ruined forever. Just a tragic situation.

There was nothing accidental about this. Accident implies that what happened was beyond anyone’s control. A guy getting drunk and then getting on a snow machine and tearing around a lake with other people nearby doesn’t produce an accident, it produces homicide.

Grouse

Yep. We all know and see guys constantly plastered when out fishing. It’s just part of the outdoors experience for a lot of them. It’s only a matter of time before your luck runs out.

I get nervous driving a sled or ATV when I am sober even when there is no one around. These are dangerous machines to operate under any condition. So fast and one wrong move and you are off the sled or worse. Add drinking and people all over the place and you are asking for it. People are right on top of each other on so many lakes.

pool2fool wrote:

In my opinion. One DUI = interlock breathalyzer installed on all your vehicles for life. You don’t get the choice anymore. You are caught driving a vehicle without interlock, you go to jail for a long time.

Constructive problem solving you have there but there are ways to circumvent that solution by buying an inexspesive vehicle every year that has time on the tabs. Sure one is supposed to make sure the car is transferred when selling the car, do you penalize the seller for not doing so and do those penalties get tougher with a repeat offense.
I am not an advocate for tougher penalties except for the habituals. I lean towards of changing behavior programs, that do not use AA as base for teaching, with intense probation monitering that includes breathalyzer so the person can be productive in society and have self worth to continue to be a part of society.

I would also submit a version of the breath analyser in all new cars that prohibit any alcohol fumes detected in the car rather than focusing on one demograghic. Quit installing instruments like wifi and hands free cell phone or any other distractive equipment created before the internet. This way has it faults but any aproach will have faults and consequences. With the exploding population I see no valid remidy but I see $$$ signs in many peoples dreams for a remedy and all it takes is money grubbing politition to push it through.

1hl&sinker wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>pool2fool wrote:</div>
In my opinion. One DUI = interlock breathalyzer installed on all your vehicles for life. You don’t get the choice anymore. You are caught driving a vehicle without interlock, you go to jail for a long time.

Constructive problem solving you have there but there are ways to circumvent that solution by buying an inexspesive vehicle every year that has time on the tabs. Sure one is supposed to make sure the car is transferred when selling the car, do you penalize the seller for not doing so and do those penalties get tougher with a repeat offense.
I am not an advocate for tougher penalties except for the habituals. I lean towards of changing behavior programs, that do not use AA as base for teaching, with intense probation monitering that includes breathalyzer so the person can be productive in society and have self worth to continue to be a part of society.

I would also submit a version of the breath analyser in all new cars that prohibit any alcohol fumes detected in the car rather than focusing on one demograghic. Quit installing instruments like wifi and hands free cell phone or any other distractive equipment created before the internet. This way has it faults but any aproach will have faults and consequences. With the exploding population I see no valid remidy but I see $$$ signs in many peoples dreams for a remedy and all it takes is money grubbing politition to push it through.

…

Anyone ripping on a sled at dusk should be arrested. I barely have faith in a truck at noon on a lake. Some people are wired different.

Just so people know. The spot that this happened at was an extremely popular area, lots of houses and fisherman in a narrow area.

Just plain stupid…..

Just an FYI here has been a go fund me page started for the family.
https://www.gofundme.com/helpalanjr

Browsed through all the BS and de-railment quickly and did not see it posted, but if it was, excuse me.

There is a fundraising fishing event THIS WEEKEND (2/10) on Chisago Lake in Lindstrom. There will be a silent auction, raffle and food for purchase. It’s a pretty quick and informal event. $5 donation is encouraged for all in attendance. This is a fishing EVENT, not a tournament. The event runs from 12pm-4PM and will be held just outside of the landing on Chisago lake.

For anyone wanting to attend and also donate an item for the silent auction or raffle, please have the items to the event by 10:30am so they can get it sorted and laid out for display.

I have no affiliation to this event, I am just relaying the message. I will hopefully be in attendance.

404 ERROR wrote:

There is a fundraising fishing event THIS WEEKEND (2/10) on Chisago Lake in Lindstrom.

This will be a great event and 100% of the money will go directly to the family. All the people working on this event are donating their time for free! Come and show up with a rod and I will be happy to punch a hole for you.
https://www.facebook.com/events/176491763115920/?ti=cl

Bump
Hope to see/meet some of you there
https://www.facebook.com/events/176491763115920/?ti=cl

Tuma wrote:

Bump
Hope to see/meet some of you there
https://www.facebook.com/events/176491763115920/?ti=cl

Thanks for your work on this. Hope they raise a ton of cash!

Check your PM after lunch.