Over Promotion of Fishing

I have been fishing Pool 4 for 15 years and don’t think I have ever seen it as busy as it has been this last year. I am becoming concerned that the constant daily fishing pressure will eventually take its toll on our fishing quality or compel the DNR to make drastic changes. If this pressure keeps up, I expect there could eventually be Pool 4 regulation changes made to more closely match some of the MN/WI inland regulations (closed seasons, one line, slots, etc).

With the introduction of the internet and all the open sharing of information, I sometimes wonder if we haven’t over promoted Pool 4 fishing. I would hate for us lose the very thing we have promoted so strongly.

Dave Gulczinski

Dave,

May 10th and all will return to normal! Twentysix days and counting……

As I have stated before, I am all for regulation changes from the end of February Lake closings to the opener. I would like to see a Rainey River rule here. Two fish limit and none over 20. (Just during the period of the lake closures, then return to normal rules.)

Everyone who wants to can still fish, still catch, still keep a couple for dinner!

Jon J.

more than a couple would suit just fine, most people are feeding a family, 3-5 people, or are have a fish fry, so something on the lines of 4 fish per person or 10 total per boat sounds decent, all over 20 go back

Every time it gets crowded I hear talks about rule changes. Each year it gets more and more crowded as pool 4 is promoted as just about the only place in a several state area with open water and great fishing from October to May. Yes, I believe stricter regulations to protect the fish may help fishing. But what about the crowds – they are still going to keep coming and getting lager, regardless of minor fishing restrictions.

I am more concerned about possible accidents on the water as a result of the crowds. All it would take is a few bad accidents and public demand for something to be done. I know I would be very unhappy if Pool 4 was closed to boat fishing because of the crowds. How about a 10 HP restriction imposed on all non-commercial boats during high crowd months? Maybe a 25-MPH speed limit or a no-wake rule would be imposed from the head-of-the-lake to the dam. It would be very easy to just eliminate all tournaments. Don’t think it can’t happen.

I really don’t know what (if anything) may change, but as long as we keep promoting Pool 4, the crowds will keep coming and getting bigger until one day some very undesirable action is taken. At that time we will be taking about the good old days before the crowds arrived. Unfortunately, it will be too late.

Maybe I am just venting my frustrations a bit. But I live in a once small town that was promoted for growth, now we have to deal with all the problems of a large town. It makes me wish for the good old small town days. I think this is now happening to Pool 4 – we are promoting it so much that we will soon destroy the very thing we loved.

Dave Gulczinski

Thats what happens when ”everyone” realizes we have a ”world class fishery” here. Unusually warm weather with great fishing and we ALL want to fish. If this guy I know who just retired and has been constantly on the water and catching all those fish would back off alittle and not tell all his friends how good the fishing is it might not be so crowded. [couldn’t resist Dave]. Thanks for the concern. New rules could help the fishery stay great but have to be fair to all involved. Slot limits during spring time could help to keep the good spawners in the river where they belong. Thanks, Bill

This is a very good topic……….but as for making it more safer and less possible accidents may be a little harder to put into action. Logically, a speed limit SEEMS like it would work…..but it would never fly. How woudl it be enforced? :….cuz lots of boats dont got nifty speedometers……No wake would be more logical…..but i hate no-wake zones…..especially during the fall duck season . hehehe

On teh other hand…..a slot limit put into effect for that certain time could make it an outstanding fishery……Just my 2cents.

maybe those who have already spent 15 years on pool 4 should stay home and let some one else fish the next 15 years. that would certainly cut down on the pressure.

I am sorry if you feel that Pool 4 is being promoted and it will cause a decline in fishing but I want you to know that I was up their a few weeks ago and spent $52.00 for a lisence and doled out several hundred dollars for cabin gas and food for my son and a friend and we each brought home a limit of fish since it was my first time their and we released over a 100 fish in three days and just kept some small sauger to eat! If it take regulations to make you happy then go for it or better yet come down to pool 10 and eleven and see what it takes to catch a limit their and you to would rush back to pool 4. After I took my boat out I was approached my a few fellows the the big state of Mn and they to asked why I did not stay down at Guttenburg and fish! Thanks for the welcome guys as this was my first time at pool 4 and I want to come back but it will be a one trip yearly and yes it will be catch and release but if I want to bring a few fish home I think the money that I spend should help with the problems of the entire state not just pool 4 declineing fish population!

I have to agree with redman a bit. If I read it right he was given a hard time for either being here,or keeping fish. Neither actions are illegal. I also have to admit concern after the number of boats I saw on pool 4 the last two trips there. I know some may recall my position on rule changes based on personal opinion versus hard data,but it’s hard to argue with the insanely large number of boats above Redwing. If one fish per boat was taken each day of the weekends we would easily see 1000-1500 fish taken in two days. Of course this type of pressure is limited to a few weeks in the spring and there are scores more walleyes left than taken. For now. But what about accidents? Just Saturday I had to cut the throttle and veer hard left to avoid hitting a group of guys that decided to cross the river and the heck with the traffic. They never even looked before taking off,and don’t even know they were almost slammed into. That is an issue that needs to be drilled over and over as much as possible here in the boards. This is a good topic that will hopefully at least raise awareness to both issues. That alone will make a difference.

I would love to see a slot limit on walleye and catfish especailly flatheads… no walleye or sauger taken between 21-27 inches and one over 28 would be cool… and for flatheads no fishing/harvesting flatheads from nov till may 1st… no fishing within 150 yards of dam…. between nov-may as well… ESPECIALLY the scour hole….

You got it right Bill, you have to be fair to everyone. It never fails as soon as this subject comes up people want to start eliminating. No motors over 10hp, no tournies, no tourist. Gentleman this year has been a breeze, the big cruisers are not out yet. They are the ones we need to ban.
Pool 4 was touted as a world class fishery long before message boards came to be. The problem is not just with pool 4, I see it on the vast majority of lakes in both WI. and MN. The day of being the only boat on the water,for the most part are over. This could very well be the best thing for our sport.
Safety is a big concern with that many boats on the water. But maybe we all need to be a little more tolerant. As I am running up river, one boat wants me at half speed and the next boat wants me at full speed. To one I am an a– hole,to the other one I did the right thing.
Redman I am sorry that you were treated badly. You have right to fish anywhere you want. It sounds like you had some good fishing.

CRUISERS!……oh geeze!….. i LOVE cruisers!!!!!!! esspecially when they go 2-3 wide after being released from the damn!

And don’t forget the WAKE and trough they leave behind when bullying their way into position at the head of the lake as they head up the river, twin engines screaming at WOT! Generally they think they “own” the river….because their barges cost mega$$. I’d vote to put a 10mph rule on those things..

well you can add me to the list of people who would b*tch if I was hung with a NEW rope!…. the other day when I was out with Mike Huppert we were talking this very subject.. how we can never be totally happy with what we have…. I personally just LOVE to complain about SOMETHING…. anything… the weather, the crowds, boats too fast, boats too slow, boats too close, boats not close enough…. you name it!!
I used to think the fishing was pretty much equal in ALL pools from 2-13 or so….. but had I FISHED all those pools? nope…. Ive fished in 2,3,4,5,9,10,13,17…. and for SURE they are NOT all equal…. and to tell you the truth the only one Ive EVER seen come close to pool 4 is pool 2….. and its total catch and release.. and I figure thats WHY it comes close….
Ive said before.. I would like to see regulations to protect the pool 4 resource BEFORE there is a problem… but that is VERY unlikely to happen….
Fisheries wisdom is pretty much “environment is the main factor for spawn success and population recruitment”

but there IS some wavering in this stance and I feel we may see some new limits with slots come about on some of the southern pools where populations are NOT what they once were…. (just guessing here!)….
Im kind of worried about our spawn success for this year… and I never really got the numbers for last year… but I feel they might not have been too good either……
but so far this years environmental factors look very bad with low water and widely varied temps, quick warmups and cool downs… just about everything that is bad, were getting it along with pressure that is significantly smarter/more effective than any Ive seen so far…. its could spell trouble in the future…. only time will tell…..

If the good ol’ days were yesterday, the time to get busy is now! Busy educating ourselves and others. Busy buying fish instead of harvesting our own. Busy donating money to research instead of fancier boats and electronics.

Okay………..before this gets any uglier, understand that progress is progress! The stats show there’s fewer fishermen today but that they go more often and travel further willingly. We have better lures, better electronics, better boats…………you don’t expect that stuff to stay in the garage do you? As fishing prgresses, so must we. But always strive for a better tomorrow. Anything less is to have learned nothing at all.

I think the truth of the matter is we are ALL getting a little squirrelly. The weather,the crowds,the wind,the time till inland opener—you name it,it all takes its toll. I have been on Pool 4 the last two weekends and yes it was crowded and yes I saw some pigs go in livewells that I would have let go but overall I also saw alot of big fish released. I saw people smile when another boat took a good fish and I had pleasant conversations with a whole lot of other boats. Sure it could have better but it could have been a heck of a lot worse. Overall, life is good and we are a lucky bunch of people.

I have heard the topic that Dave brought up, by other people as well. One thing that we have to remember also is this: How many of you would be keeping the big fish you’re catching like many of you did (myself included) in the old days….if there wasn’t the huge push for Catch and release?…..which comes largely from the internet. I even caught myself yesterday (after my dad and I saw a walleye he was fighting, 8-9 lbs) that we have to get a pic and put her back right away…. because I wouldn’t even think of keeping one that big……unless he wanted to put it on the wall. I just thought “We have to put her back cuz everyone will think we’re ‘bad people’ if we keep her”. My point is that the internet has really changed peoples outlook on catch and release, so the internet is not all bad. Does it result in more fish being caught that normally wouldn’t….you bet. Can pool 4 sustain this current harvest?……the creel surveys and netting records say yes. Time will tell. Hopefully science is right on this one and I personally think it is. Hope I don’t eat those words!!!

I totally agree! I am amazed that pool#4 sustains the pressure it does and still puts out great numbers of above average Walleye and Sauger. The lack of excessive (commercial fishing) helps, but with out CPR and reasonable harvest of prime breeders(the big females) it could eventually decline.
I love to come and fish, take pictures of a piggie or two(if I’m lucky!), keep a few “eaters”. Thats the attitude I think we might promote.
For many years Little Bay de Noc was as good as pool#4 until over harvest eventually caused a severe decline in the numbers of fish over 20″. For the past 10 years the limit has been 4 fish 15-22″ and one to be kept over 22″. That really caused an increase of big surviving breeder females and anyone that regularly fishes the LBDN will tell you they are catch/releasing more and bigger piggies every year.
I’m no expert but something like that may be needed in the future for POOL#4. Now IS the time to promote conservation!!Not when the decline starts showing up. I think we are doing that with CPR.
I trust the EFN guys that fish it day in and day out. You know the health of the River better than anyone.

just my two cents

I was thinking along the same lines of what Steve posted. Yes, the internet is promoting pool 4 and other bodies of water, but it is also promoting C&R. C&R promotion is better than ever and needs to be.

I’m not pointing any fingers, but I know some guys that complain about the pressure and say fishing was much better 20 years ago. They then go out and take home the biggest fish they catch. One guy complains about all the fish being taken out of a particular lake and also blames bad fishing on all the Muskies in the lake. Yet, every time he goes out he’ll keep what he catches. He’ll keep walleyes 12″ to 30″………the little ones are just like a perch and the big ones have a lot of meat on them……..There is no convincing him to let some go.

We have the prime area to fish, the time, health and resources to enjoy it whenever we can. Why are we complaining? Try to keep what we have and maybe improve it-Great Goal. But let’s please keep all of this in perspective.

My wife wont clean my catch so I tend to let most fish go. Just getting older and more lazy. The two states are going to have to work togeather on this one, Maybe thats half the problem. To much goverment red tape, and arguing on what should be done.Has anybody talked to the DNR on this subject?

I don’t think its the internet as much as there are more people fishin now days.Ever try fishin a lake on a week end?one lake by my house only lets a boat go out when one comes in, the cops sit right there and watch.with more people on the riverthe inter net is a good tool to let people know what we have and to be smart sportspeople so we dont mess it up.The world just keeps gettin bigger and bigger{or smaller} and it is hard to see it get that way but thats life My point I guess is ,yes more people may know about the river now from the readings on the computer but we must use it as a tool to help keep what we have ,just as it helped on how to fish it.It will work, and post like this show people do care, to me that is half the battel

this years spawn will be a “bust”..It goes in cycles…the bigger concern would be the “crash” of avalible forage…It happens…and it will happen….then the “pressure” on the pool will decline …as the population Decresses….2 1/2 years to 16 inches…and next year is bad for spawing…then….2 years from now….and with decling forage …the pressure will be off the pool…..

I think the original intent of this post was with regard to the over promotion of fishing by the internet, which must include fishtheriver.com. One would have to agree that the internet has help lead to the massive crowds found the first few miles below the Red Wing dam. How else would you explain it away? Word of mouth that the fish were biting? The fact that the inland season is not yet open? Bull hockey. The internet, and some other factors may have contributed to this sudden rush.

Regarding other factors…Pre-2000, let alone pre-September 11, 2001, the world seemed to be a pretty cool place. All was well, we were making money, the economy was good and on and on… Someone could have told me that the fish were biting on pool 4, big ones, and I would have said that’s great. It would have gone ignored. Now, it’s like we better get to the river, before something really bad happens, because I will get to do something that I REALLY enjoy, (something that take my mind off all the problems) and that something that I REALLY enjoy is fishing. Case in point…the entertainment industry, such as gambling, took off after 9/11. The point…when times are tough people will turn to recreation.

Oh, and when I finally went on that fishing trip I put off so long (when times were “good”) I caught a ton of fish. Hmmmm… Guess I better go back and do that again. Hence, more boats.

Finally, pool 4 has an ace in the hole. It’s called Lake Pepin. The fish can move back down the river, once the spawn is done, and move away from the concentration of anglers. What better refuge could they have as compared to other pools? Lake Pepin is the key, (have you noticed how huge the place is?). Pepin is the ace in the hole. It should help keep walleye populations booming in order to keep up with future fishing pressure. Regardless of the internet and all the posts about how great the fishing is. When they are vulnerable, (the dam), they need to have slot/lower limits. This is where the internet can help.

I don’t mind the crowds of people and boats out fishing. It’s the disrespect that urks the hell out of me. When I have some ones line nearly landing in my lap makes my hair go up on end. A whole dam river and have to be that close. Has happened to me more than a couple times. And something else that bothers me is the ones that go out and get their limits of eyes or bass and then go home and come back again for more or any other limits of fish. Excuse me but I call them greedy hogs. Well that’s my 2 cents worth.

Hey sexy mamma!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!,
you can add your 2 cents worth anytime you like!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks son. Glad you approve.

Want to Add this….
HAPPY EASTER to all FTR members

Thanks Mary !!

And a Happy Easter to you as well !!

Hey Herb,
DOWN BOY DOWN! LMAO!!!!!!!

Hi Bigdog….
Im not sure the rush is all that sudden… Ive been fishing RedWing a long time… from the end of the inland season until the opener its always been a mad house down there… even years ago nice weather and a strong bite would bring 300 boats… we seem to have more tourneys now than then…. and that adds a few… but overall the pressure has always been great.. I think the thing that has MOST impressed me THIS spring is the distribution of anglers… they have positioned themselves in a much more informed way… (spread out to other good spots instead of from the dam to the Y)… and many are using superior tactics…. the numbers may be a bit greater.. but thats subjective and I would really need to rely on creel census for that….. but others have made equally great points… is that the internet is also supporting good sportsmanship and catch and release…. and with the friendly family setting we have here we are pretty effective at spreading those messages……