<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>mplspug wrote:</div>
we can’t stop the spread, even with the laws?
So give me (us…) your incredibly insightful thoughts on what should be done. Your the leader of the DNR: What would you do? This outa’ be good…
Glad you weren’t driving my glass boat. Glass n’ rock piles don’t get along…RR
Hey look at us. Page 6!
I should back out of here, I’ve said enough already and some I’m sure feel too much…but..
I’m frustrated that
*The Great Lakes Ships brought most of them over.
*They don’t have to clean up their mess.
*They can only be slowed and not stopped.
*The law(s) are written so that it’s impossible to comply to the letter of the law or at least we are at the whim of a CO. (that’s not a cut on CO’s, it’s a cut on humans)
*The penalties are written so we can be taken away from our families and jobs for trailering weeds/water not only from infested water to non infested water, but from infested water to infested water or from infested water to your home.
*We are guilty until proven innocent.
I think that about covers it…
No, just a couple more.
There are many including biologist that believe at least some of what we call AIS might be good or at least not as bad as they are made out to be.
And finally,
if I’m going to get at ticket for transporting AIS weeds, the CO better damn well know what the hell they are and that they are indeed an >Invasive< weed.
So in response, as I said it wasn’t a loaded question, I have some follow up.
First I should say why I am asking what I am asking. At this point the thread is going in circles. Much like a political argument, no one will change the other’s mind, so arguing is a pointless back and forth. So I am trying to understand the other side now, as apposed to argue.
I probably shouldn’t say other side, because I am more on the fence than I let on. I would like the spread to be slowed as much as possible. I also understand some of the laws and actions (launch closings, dam closings, bubblers) are unreasonable and expensive at best.
A.) I can see frustration with SOME COs. There are bad apples in every line of work.
B.) I THINK the laws are written broadly to make it easier to enforce and comply. IE. The law is you cannot have any weeds on your boat and trailer, invasive or native. Hasn’t that law been around a long time when millfoil first came up, before zeebs and silver carp?
C.) Are you sure the 90 days in jail and heavy fine aren’t for those who don’t pay the original fine/ticket?
As the OP points out, wouldn’t it be nice is everyone (pleasure boaters too) didn’t need laws to act responsibly? You know, people actually cared and respected the resource, which I am sure most anti-AIS law people do. Then you could leave the plug in and take matters into your own hands, instead of feeling nannyed into it? Say you got off the St. Croix one day in the rain. The next day you noticed standing water back by the bilge. You could drain it, maybe bleach it and spray it out with hot water before launching into a lake the next day?
We know there are a lot of bad eggs out there. Just look at any shoreline and all the trash that collects there.
C.) Are you sure the 90 days in jail and heavy fine aren’t for those who don’t pay the original fine/ticket?
If the fines go up because they are contested, I’m moving to Florida!
So Buzz or any of you guys that make it to the DNR meetings is there ever any talk about how many boaters have pulled the plug on boating due to these laws, fines, bad press, Ect?
Anyone ever seen or find out where they are doing the road side checks at?
The 2014 year-end report on tickets and CO activity is still being compiled. Usually it comes out in November. Compliance with rules was about 35% last year as opposed to 25% the year before (this is from spot-checks). If I get an update I’ll post it. It is like seat belts, it will take years to get a high compliance response. But the combination of education, interdiction and ramp inspections should help to slowing the spread.
Sorry Buzz. By pulling the plug I meant not boating anymore.
C.) Are you sure the 90 days in jail and heavy fine aren’t for those who don’t pay the original fine/ticket?
If the fines go up because they are contested, I’m moving to Florida!
No I mean like if you don’t pay a traffic ticket and they put a warrent out for your arrest. Not paying is not contesting.
Yeah I’m sure…see Dave’s post.
Well if simply contesting the charges, even if found guilty, can result in a higher fine/jail time that is completely wrong.
If I have a parking ticket I contest and lose, I simply pay the original fine.
Quitting fishing due to be required to pull your drain plug? I suspect there is no way to measure this. About all that could be tracked would be boat sales and fishing licenses. Neither seem to be showing more then normal fluctuation. if something like this drives someone to quit, I suspect they have more going on.
Well if simply contesting the charges, even if found guilty, can result in a higher fine/jail time that is completely wrong.
If I have a parking ticket I contest and lose, I simply pay the original fine.
My understanding a parking ticket would be considered a petty mistameanor, fine no more than $300. Now in Minnesota if you dont pay the fine chances are you lose driving privlages until paid up. Mistameanor as you can see more serious than a parking ticket.
I agree, being able to change an offense from a civil matter to a Criminal offense becuase one contest the charge is wrong.
LOL. All of a sudden folks are made aware of the complexity of MN laws and Statues. Where were you when we were dealing with this in the Legislature? In MN it is Petty Misdemeanor, Misdemeanor, Gross Misd, Felony. The AIS laws were Petty offenses up until a few years ago. The lakeshore lobbyists tried to go for Gross Misdemeanor which has up to a 5 year sentence. A Petty offense is not considered a crime but more of a violation. The Legislative Judicial Committee rejected the Gross Misd. level and raised it to Misd. Unfortunately the only way to get through to some folks is to hit them over the head with a hammer. Wish it wasn’t true. I can’t imagine a scenario where jail time might occur, maybe multiple repeated offenses combined with non-payment of fines and court costs. resulting in warrants. By the way if you do end up in jail for a Misd, you usually get billed for your stay there.
Sadly ive been in the system so I’ve been educated the hard way.
Where was I durring this?chances are working while the committe rammed this crud down our throats. My reps dont realy care so they just vote on what the committe sugests. Sad is’nt it. I try to educate the repusenatives but it goes on deff ears.
I don’t now how these committes are set up, sure looks like a committe with an agenda that not looking out for the general publics interst.
Sure would love the time to take off for these meetings but realisticly the amount of time needed I just can not afford. I’m sure that’s what these committees count on.
Quitting fishing due to be required to pull your drain plug? I suspect there is no way to measure this. About all that could be tracked would be boat sales and fishing licenses. Neither seem to be showing more then normal fluctuation. if something like this drives someone to quit, I suspect they have more going on.
Would guess tracking boat licensing might be one way to see a effect.
The AIS laws are a lot more than pulling the boat plug.
Take the older recreational boater that maybe uses his boat a few times a year or even a simple trip to the lake is work for him. Johnny law slaps him with a ticket for not seeing a weed on his trailer and he says *uck it. Im done with this boat. Take that same scenario with a young boater who is just trying to scrap enough money together to enjoy some time on the water. Johnny law slaps him with a ticket and he decides I got much better interests to pursue than opening myself up to this.
There had to of been some sort of talk on how these regs would reduce peoples interest and participation in boating? Heck Ive switched the main boat ramp I use due to not wanting to talk with the inspectors there and I know of others that have done the same. I can tell you I know of several people that don’t want anything to do with mille lacs due to the increased enforcement on that lake and risk of being pulled over just for towing a boat past the lake. Not really that far of a stretch to know some people will just be done boating all together for not wanting to deal with this or risk fines.
Quitting fishing due to be required to pull your drain plug? I suspect there is no way to measure this. About all that could be tracked would be boat sales and fishing licenses. Neither seem to be showing more then normal fluctuation. if something like this drives someone to quit, I suspect they have more going on.
I know of one for sure who gave up the hassle of boat ownership. He didn’t give up fishing; still goes icefishing, shore/pier fishing, and goes on launches/charters, with a guide, or with friends who still have a boat.
Would you like to pay for his evaluation to see what more he might have going on?
Maybe we all need to carry a GOPRo and start filming the second we get pulled over. Most these guys don’t know one weed from another anyway.
Like the difference between Okra and Cannabis !
There had to of been some sort of talk on how these regs would reduce peoples interest and participation in boating?
C’mon Mike, you’re giving them too much credit.
All I know is that the whole AIS ordeal has directly affected the enjoyment of my fishing to a pretty high degree. The bait laws have now progressed to the point in which every time I hit the water there could be an interpretation in which I am not fishing legally due to the bait I use.
Because of this, I have got involved and have tried to make my concerns and opinions heard. The DNR is listening but its a mighty slow process. Until then I guess I fish as a petty criminal.
A lot of you guys get to fish with artificials and bait isn’t a big deal, the way I fish, bait is the biggest deal and I don’t intend to sit by and watch the State take away every last one of my options to get bait.
Anyone notice the price of large suckers this fall at Thorne Bros? $15/ea. Yes, that’s not a typo $180 doz. Its out of control folks. We need to use some common sense here…
DTRO
Your angling methods are not the way you’re “supposed to” fish
All forces (both legal and economic) must be brought to bear until you comply with the superior acumen of your overlords
I want the old Brian back.[/quote] He’s still old…
Rub it in Belletaine, rub it in.
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In regards to the AIS laws…
Its out of control folks.
That might be then most true statement in the 6 pages.
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