Now that DNR has screwed up walleyes and big notherns, smallies are next.

For us bass fisherman I think we need a topic on how the DNR now has sites set on screwing up small mouth fishing.

The DNR should have known that mainly the big norhterns would be speared. Their only creel surveys from open water showed very few of the smaller norhterns were being kept by fisherman. What ever made them think that the spearer’s would take small ones is unbelievable.

I mention this because I believe the DNR is off base again in regards to small mouth with the number that can be kept. A weekend ago I witnessed a boat bobber fishing on one side of 3 mile markers. I pulled up on the other side and started using plastics. In no time the boat saw my results, moved over, anchored next to me, through out the bobbers and started hauling them in. Everyone I saw caught went into a fish basket, including one that I know was +20.

I also see the folks fishing along my doc and putting the smallies in the live wells. For a 100% catch and release person this is hard to swallow.

For you folks that want to invite tournaments here is what I saw at Hunter’s last summer. They had one cow tank with no oxygen or fresh flowing water. After weigh in, the fish were all dumped into the tank. From the long walks down the doc, waiting for turn to weigh, measuring the fish, by the time they hit the tank the majority were belly up. After weigh in, carried back out the dock and dumped off the end. Dozen’s near 18 and over 18 were floating belly up. I mentioned to one of the participants who comments, no problem there are plenty more in the lake.

Since I saw that, I have always wanted to discuss with Hunter’s that they could do a better job by just adding some fresh water and maybe pumping in some oxygen. So one day this spring when there were only a couple of folks in the bar, I asked the bar tender if the owner was around and if there was going to be a bass tournament this summer. The bar tender exploded. Commented he could give a poop about bass. This was a walleye lake and he and his buddies stuck a knife into every bass they caught. I got up and left and have not been back.

The reason for telling this story is that for many, a decline in bass is just what the doctored ordered.

It’s entirely possible that Mille Lacs has a culture problem in terms of how the majority of anglers (and netters) think of the fish resource.

Isn’t it possible that, as human beings, we all need to do a better job of taking care of the resources that nature has given us?

Ok, I can’t take anymore of the DNR bash. This is state government!!! You have shot callers at the top that decides how high the ( Mille Lacs) team jumps. By complaining about the DNR they will find a hard working employee and throw them under the bus. This will not affect anyone with control. The commissioner is appointed so your vote is the only voice that makes a difference. This fish rots from the head. Both my wife and I are government employees. We advocate hard for what’s right with tax paayers money. If you do go to meets be education and able to talk there lingo,buy this I mean buzz words ( change the culture, best management practices, etc.).

Drives me nuts how Mille Lacs is advertised as a ‘keep everything’ fishery now. One species is down the hole, so keep as many of the other species as you can!! I don’t get it.

Frustrating situation on that lake. Problem is, only one species gets the love out there and I think we all know which one…

gonefishin wrote:

Everyone I saw caught went into a fish basket, including one that I know was +20.

I also see the folks fishing along my doc and putting the smallies in the live wells. For a 100% catch and release person this is hard to swallow.

It’s legal to keep smallmouth bass on on Mille Lacs so I don’t think those people should be ripped for it.

3 mile used to be a great spot to catch Walleye. All summer long you could go out there and catch walleyes. Now in the last 5-6 years all you get is smallmouth. They have pretty much run the walleyes off the reef and many other reefs that used to hold a ton of walleyes. I personally don’t have a problem with a few smallies being kept. Maybe that is part of the problem, walleyes can’t spawn cause the smallies took over some of the prime spawning grounds.

brad-o wrote:

Ok, I can’t take anymore of the DNR bash.

X2

The folks of the DNR are not the problem. Just an easy place to incorrectly put blame.

One large bass tournament or multiple tournaments would help the local economy.

Bass anglers, what regulations would you propose to attract a major tournament while protecting the resource?

Chuck Melcher wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>brad-o wrote:</div>
Ok, I can’t take anymore of the DNR bash.

X2

The folks of the DNR are not the problem. Just an easy place to incorrectly put blame.

Really Chuck? Did you just move here from from Florida? If the DNR isn’t the problem who is?
Who set the slots? DNR.
Who conducts the meeting between the DNR & GLIFWC? DNR.
Who sets the limits? DNR.
Who changes the policy and limits for all species? DNR.

The DNR is charged with the MANAGEMENT of the states fisheries including Mille Lacs. There is no 2 ways around this…..it’s the DNR’s mess and they will need to clean it up.

Fife wrote:

One large bass tournament or multiple tournaments would help the local economy.

Bass anglers, what regulations would you propose to attract a major tournament while protecting the resource?

Fife

As far as what regulations are needed. I think all that is needed is the normal statewide regulations. No culling issue, No slot limits, no 1 over BS. Major tournaments and tourney fisherman do a excellent job of taking car of the fish. Mu guess is a 4 day Major tourney would result in far less mortality than takes place on a normal weekend by livebait fisherman and those who GUT or BONK every smallmouth they catch ( Because THEY all know that smallmouth are the cause of their beloved walleye decline ) Due to past issues from the state and local people as past Bassmaster and FLW events held in the state, I don’t think it is likely that they will return anytime soon. Not without a major pitch and desire from the state. Its a shame because the coverage and $ from a major event would go along ways to aiding local businesses both short term and long term

Dutchboy wrote:

Really Chuck? Did you just move here from from Florida? If the DNR isn’t the problem who is?

OK… I forgot, the DNR is not directed by anyone… not influenced by anyone elected to office or in a position of power and already in someone else’s influence. They never have to live with the laws set by treaties…. nothing, they just make all their own decisions, and without any concern or reasoning. I love people that sit back and act like government is always the problem. Wake up…

As a strong supporter of the DNR I really question there decision to try and attract large bass tournaments to the lake by only allowing culling for Smallies under 18 in. , the National events aren’t going to come for just one over 18. They either need to get rid of that regulation or let permitted catch and release tourneys to weigh five big fish.

Chuck Melcher wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Dutchboy wrote:</div>
Really Chuck? Did you just move here from from Florida? If the DNR isn’t the problem who is?

OK… I forgot, the DNR is not directed by anyone… not influenced by anyone elected to office or in a position of power and already in someone else’s influence. They never have to live with the laws set by treaties…. nothing, they just make all their own decisions, and without any concern or reasoning. I love people that sit back and act like government is always the problem. Wake up…

Chuck

I am a little unclear what you are saying here. So are you saying its the elected people who are the cause of the problem? Are you saying the DNR is totally controlled or influenced? It looks to me like you believe the Elected people ( Government ) is the problem. But then you say ” I love people that sit back and act like government is always the problem. Wake up… ” By the way it was elected people who made the treaties. Just so we are clear. Who / What do you believe is the cause of the problem? Surely if everyone else is wrong as to the cause of the problem. You must know or have the solution? I’m curious to what you thoughts are.

I’m wide awake Chuck. My vision is very, very clear. Being a former tax payer of Mille Lacs county and living only 45 minutes from the lake I have a pretty good handle on whats going on. You keep defending the DNR and I’ll keep slamming them for the job they do.

The DNR’s only defense is that they are bound by the treaty to maintain the lake in the best interests of all involved. On that front there has been a historic failure.

The governor set an agenda and tells the commissioner what tools are on the table. The only tools liky on the table where slot limits. That is all the dnr could do. Then when people say the dnr is not listening, real do your views line up? Some where there is a email with the answer to the problem and I mean the right answer. Not a hand picked agenda study that only looked at what they wanted.

“Now that DNR has screwed up walleyes and big notherns, smallies are next.”

I think the screw up is well under way…..

-J.

brad-o wrote:

The governor set an agenda and tells the commissioner what tools are on the table. The only tools liky on the table where slot limits. That is all the dnr could do. Then when people say the dnr is not listening, real do your views line up? Some where there is a email with the answer to the problem and I mean the right answer. Not a hand picked agenda study that only looked at what they wanted.

Sorry Brad, you lost me, I don’t know what your point is.

The commissioner is appointed, there for the higher ups that are not appointed better fall in line or fined a new job.
You can yell as loud as you want but your idea are different then the governors. That is why many people feel they voice is not heard.
The commissioner keeps pointing to a independent survey. What was looked at and what was not in this survey. Some where a biologist emailed a high up the right answer. It was not politically popular though. I hope this helps.

brad-o wrote:

The commissioner is appointed, there for the higher ups that are not appointed better fall in line or fined a new job.

Good to know our government is run by yes men, and any opposing view for what may be right gets you fired…

fishthumper wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Fife wrote:</div>
One large bass tournament or multiple tournaments would help the local economy.

Bass anglers, what regulations would you propose to attract a major tournament while protecting the resource?

Fife

As far as what regulations are needed. I think all that is needed is the normal statewide regulations. No culling issue, No slot limits, no 1 over BS. Major tournaments and tourney fisherman do a excellent job of taking car of the fish. Mu guess is a 4 day Major tourney would result in far less mortality than takes place on a normal weekend by livebait fisherman and those who GUT or BONK every smallmouth they catch ( Because THEY all know that smallmouth are the cause of their beloved walleye decline ) Due to past issues from the state and local people as past Bassmaster and FLW events held in the state, I don’t think it is likely that they will return anytime soon. Not without a major pitch and desire from the state. Its a shame because the coverage and $ from a major event would go along ways to aiding local businesses both short term and long term

@Fishthumper, you would be in favor of the state 6 fish limit with no slot size for bass?

Regardless of the limit, I don’t see any fisherman having a significant impact on the population. In regards to fisherman intentionally killing bass, has anyone seen a dead bass floating or laying on the bottom? I haven’t.

Fife – A 6 bass limit would be fine with me. Once again major tourneys are always full release tourneys and the fisherman and organizations running them tend to take excellent care of the fish caught.

As far as the seeing bass intentionally killer I’ve see it happen on several lakes. Mille lacs and also Green lake. Last year I witnessed a boat fishing walleye near me bounce several smallmouth bass against the side of the boat as they threw them back. They did this on every bass caught. Several in the area were later seen floating on the surface. I’ve also found smallmouth on mille Lacs with their belly’s cut open. I know other fisherman who have also witnessed the same action on Mille Lacs in the past. Sorry to say but it happens. Some idiots ( I will not call them fishermen ) just don’t have a clue. Someone hears someone say that Smallmouth are the cause of the decline in walleye #’s and they believe it. They think its their duty as a walleye idot ( once again not a fishermen ) to kill all the bass they can. I’m not saying all Walleye fisherman are Idots. I myself, as well as many friends fish walleyes. Like everything there are a few who just don’t get it. I’m sure true fishermen of any type would not refer to these kind of people as fishermen.

“In regards to fisherman intentionally killing bass, has anyone seen a dead bass floating or laying on the bottom? I haven’t.”

Unfortunately, I have seen it. I did not witness them killing the fish, but I had a couple guys fishing with slip bobber, leech and a hook just off the end of my dock. They stayed until they had caught and kept 2 limits of smallies. In talking to them they had no intention of eating them. Their plan was to take them home and bury them. They said; “we’re cleaning the smallmouth out of the lake to make room for walleyes”.

brad-o wrote:

The commissioner is appointed, there for the higher ups that are not appointed better fall in line or fined a new job.
You can yell as loud as you want but your idea are different then the governors. That is why many people feel they voice is not heard.
The commissioner keeps pointing to a independent survey. What was looked at and what was not in this survey. Some where a biologist emailed a high up the right answer. It was not politically popular though. I hope this helps.

Thing is that the Governor by his own admission doesn’t know what is going on, so he relied on the DNR to handle the situation. Last week Dayton went on his own fact finding tour and found out that the locals and the business owners on Mille Lacs disagree to the policy prescribed by the DNR management. The independent study you are referring to I think was called the Blue Ribbon Panel? If so not 1 I repeat not 1 of those panel members even set foot on the shore of Mille Lacs. They made their recommendation based on numbers provided by the DNR, who, by the way is the same agency that paid them. So is it any wonder that people laugh at the DNR and their dealings? Please understand that nobody (that I know) think any one person with the DNR is a buffoon, many, many people believe that the DNR is acting the fool. You can’t keep messing things up and INSISTING your management is sound when it clearly is failing. Many people on Mille Lacs want the DNR to admit they are in over their head, admit they are ham strung by politics, admit they are throwing mud against the wall in respect to Mille Lacs. Finally, the people want transparency, if you insist on dealing with GLIFWC behind closed doors then prepare for the shi7 storm headed your way.

ptc wrote:

Their plan was to take them home and bury them. They said; “we’re cleaning the smallmouth out of the lake to make room for walleyes”.

This is not an uncommon occurrence. Some of these people really believe they are doing the right thing. I’ve heard the same comment or other like > “This is what the DNR wants us to do” or even “We heard it was illegal to toss them back”.

-J.

Jon Jordan wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>ptc wrote:</div>
Their plan was to take them home and bury them. They said; “we’re cleaning the smallmouth out of the lake to make room for walleyes”.

This is not an uncommon occurrence. Some of these people really believe they are doing the right thing. I’ve heard the same comment or other like > “This is what the DNR wants us to do” or even “We heard it was illegal to toss them back”.

-J.

If this is witnessed TIP should be called for blatant wanton waste. No?

At the lake simple possession is not illegal. Nothing to report. These people are not going to toss them in the garbage at the landing!

-J.

I also know a few people personally that blamed the smallmouth for eating all the walleye fry… and then opened up some bellies only to find crayfish.

Everyone wants a scapegoat and I’m not sure its the smallmouth, at least not entirely. Other issues were more to blame IMO…

And I don’t care for the mentality of – well they screwed up a world class walleye fishery, so let’s screw up a world class smallmouth fishery…

Dutchboy wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>brad-o wrote:</div>
The commissioner is appointed, there for the higher ups that are not appointed better fall in line or fined a new job.
You can yell as loud as you want but your idea are different then the governors. That is why many people feel they voice is not heard.
The commissioner keeps pointing to a independent survey. What was looked at and what was not in this survey. Some where a biologist emailed a high up the right answer. It was not politically popular though. I hope this helps.

Thing is that the Governor by his own admission doesn’t know what is going on, so he relied on the DNR to handle the situation. Last week Dayton went on his own fact finding tour and found out that the locals and the business owners on Mille Lacs disagree to the policy prescribed by the DNR management. The independent study you are referring to I think was called the Blue Ribbon Panel? If so not 1 I repeat not 1 of those panel members even set foot on the shore of Mille Lacs. They made their recommendation based on numbers provided by the DNR, who, by the way is the same agency that paid them. So is it any wonder that people laugh at the DNR and their dealings? Please understand that nobody (that I know) think any one person with the DNR is a buffoon, many, many people believe that the DNR is acting the fool. You can’t keep messing things up and INSISTING your management is sound when it clearly is failing. Many people on Mille Lacs want the DNR to admit they are in over their head, admit they are ham strung by politics, admit they are throwing mud against the wall in respect to Mille Lacs. Finally, the people want transparency, if you insist on dealing with GLIFWC behind closed doors then prepare for the shi7 storm headed your way.

I have a tuff time believing that Governor Dayton does not meet monthly with commissioner. I have a tuff time believing Mille Lacs was not discussed. I am no expert on Mille Lacs lake. That is why I would want to see all emails regarding this from all the players. The folks I have listen to about this issue all say walleyes are not making it a year. Seems like a simple issue to study follow the fry and find out when the die and by what.

There’s an awful lot of energy put into the anti-netting effort. Maybe some effort should also be put into educating ML anglers so they’ll behave more responsibly? There aren’t a lot of muskie fishermen that keep muskies on ML because of the effort that community put into encouraging responsible harvest that preserves the resource (in the case of muskies “reasponsiblee harvest” is often zero harvest). Of course, if everyone insists of killing as many walleys as they can on ML anglers and netters will have to put up with bad harvest years and good harvest years going forward.

So following the fry will satisfy you but the simple fact that late ice out the past 2 years and now having a strong class of Walleyes in the lake says nothing to you about nets?

I guess we have nothing further to talk about.