In case any of you needed another reason to start throwing this rig here it is. Surprisingly I couldn’t buy a bite (other than pike who kept stealing my Jackhammers) on a moving bait in this tournament. Switched to the neko and started getting fish after fish. After the cold front came in I think they wanted slower moving, subtle presentations.
The annual neko thread…
I actually like the length and release format better.
The annual neko thread…
I actually like the length and release format better.
I don’t particularly care for it but it was something different and it allowed us to have a tournament before opener so I can’t complain.
Looks like you made a nice adjustment on the fly. Too bad you didn’t have the pike stealing chatterbaits on camera. 
Looks like you made a nice adjustment on the fly. Too bad you didn’t have the <strong class=”ido-tag-strong”>pike stealing chatterbaits on camera.
Oh I did…..Can’t give them the satisfaction of 30 people watching them on video. 
The annual neko thread…
I actually like the length and release format better.
Agreed. Culling shouldn’t be legal. I can’t roam around with 3 fish all day to then decide to throw them back, tourneys should be no different.
30 fish on the neko that’s solid, didn’t look like the Chisago size average was to great. Lots of those 2 pounders? That last fish was good for sure, that lake holds lots of hogs. Grubson and I fished it that next day and had a very good for size day on swim jigs. That’s my home waters. Been fishing it since I was a little boy on shore.
I never throw a neko, but I might have to rig one up. What size weight do you add ?
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Agreed. Culling shouldn’t be legal. I can’t roam around with 3 fish all day to then decide to throw them back, tourneys should be no different.
I don’t quite understand why the bass realm hasn’t moved to it all the time already. Walleye tournaments are almost exclusively catch, measure, photo, and release now. Muskie tournaments have always been measure, photo, and release. Kayak bass tournaments do it (although they do not have a livewell). It has to be so much easier on the fish to release it right where its caught than it is to haul it around in a livewell, keep it out of water to weigh it, and then release it at a completely different location wherever the weigh in is. Mortality is probably low right now because of the water temp, but it obviously goes way up in midsummer when the water is warmer.
Its like they can’t get over the glorification of holding a bass or two up for the camera at the weigh in.
State law used to prohibit culling. Now its perfecting legal. I see some people even toss fish on a stringer or in a bucket and then try to release them later! Gimme a freaking break.
A recent issue with smallmouth bass on Green Lake near Spicer further cemented the idea of jamming bass into a livewell. It was literally causing a fatal virus to spread unnaturally. Of course the bass guys initially blamed walleye anglers for it too when in reality is was the tournament bass guys that caused this very problem.
Maybe I’m a little to up tight about this issue but the idea of catching and releasing later just to have it weighed or take a photo just doesn’t sit well with me. I personally think that measuring a bass versus weighing it is quicker and easier, with less stress on the fish too. And unless everyone is using the same scale, weights are never going to be fully accurate comparing one fish to another. What my scale says and what yours says are going to always be different. When you measure it, length is the same for everyone. 18 inches on my ruler is 18 inches on yours too.
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Bearcat89 wrote:</div>
Agreed. Culling shouldn’t be legal. I can’t roam around with 3 fish all day to then decide to throw them back, tourneys should be no different.I don’t quite understand why the bass realm hasn’t moved to it all the time already. Walleye tournaments are almost exclusively catch, measure, photo, and release now. Muskie tournaments have always been measure, photo, and release. Kayak <strong class=”ido-tag-strong”>bass tournaments do it (although they do not have a livewell). It has to be so much easier on the fish to release it right where its caught than it is to haul it around in a livewell, keep it out of water to weigh it, and then release it at a completely different location wherever the weigh in is. Mortality is probably low right now because of the water temp, but it obviously goes way up in midsummer when the water is warmer.
Its like they can’t get over the glorification of holding a <em class=”ido-tag-em”>bass or two up for the camera at the weigh in.
State law used to prohibit culling. Now its perfecting legal. I see some people even toss fish on a stringer or in a bucket and then try to release them later! Gimme a freaking break.
A recent issue with smallmouth bass on Green Lake near Spicer further cemented the idea of jamming bass into a livewell. It was literally causing a fatal virus to spread unnaturally. Of course the bass guys initially blamed <strong class=”ido-tag-strong”>walleye anglers for it too when in reality is was the tournament bass guys that caused this very problem.
Maybe I’m a little to up tight about this issue but the idea of catching and releasing later just to have it weighed or take a photo just doesn’t sit well with me.
Mortality rate in bass tournaments is almost non-existent. I think I have witnessed one or two bass die during all of my tournaments. If I was harvesting bass (which is 100% legal) they’d have a much higher mortality rate 
so I’m not sure how a 1% mortality rate is justification for that change.
The whole Green lake problem where bass anglers were blaming walleye anglers was not in regards to the disease, it was in regards to smallmouth showing up on show with slit gills. Just so happened to be after the big walleye tourney over there. Happens year after year on that lake.
It’s not all about the glorification of pictures, if you’ve ever caught decent bass in your life you would know that an 18″ bass could be 2 lbs or it could be 5 lbs, but in catch measure release it’s all worth the same. We want the better bass to actually be worth more in competitions….
Mortality rate in bass tournaments is almost non-existent. I think I have witnessed one or two bass die during all of my tournaments.
I appreciate the response Matt. Just because you only actually see one or two bass die, doesn’t mean none of them die later. There is this thing called delayed mortality.
The whole Green lake problem where bass anglers were blaming walleye anglers was not in regards to the disease, it was in regards to smallmouth showing up on show with slit gills.
Perhaps in the past that may have occurred. The most recent issue there was not the case. Smallmouth bass were found with gashes in their head, not their gills. It was from a virus and was compounded by placed bass in close proximity to each other in livewells during a tournament. The DNR conducted an investigation into to and confirmed the virus.
We want the better bass to actually be worth more in competitions
So catch a 19 or 20 incher then. Not a difficult concept and far less subjective way of scoring fish in general, not just bass.
I wasn’t necessarily just referring to competition either. In general, placing a fish in a livewell, on a stringer, or in a bucket with the intention of potentially culling it later when you catch a more “keepable” fish should be prohibited. You either keep it or release it when you catch it.
I appreciate the response Matt. Just because you only actually see one or two bass die, doesn’t mean none of them die later. There is this thing called delayed mortality.
Perhaps in the past that may have occurred. The most recent issue there was not the case. Smallmouth bass were found with gashes in their head, not their gills. It was from a virus and was compounded by placed bass in close proximity to each other in livewells during a tournament.
So catch a 19 or 20 incher then. Not a difficult concept and far less subjective way of scoring fish in general, not just bass.
So where is your data on delayed mortality? I assume you have researched this and have data on it since you’ve come to this conclusion about weigh-ins killing bass. I guess delayed mortality is why there’s hundreds of dead bass floating around our lakes…
The slit gills is not all in the past, this is as recent as last year. The DNR claim this virus creates knife like cuts in the gills, give me a break. The DNR would kill every bass in every lake if meant keeping the godsend Walleye population growing. If you’re naive enough to believe that BS then I think I’m done trying to convey logic to you.
I’m not sure how measuring a fish myself is less subjective then someone else putting a fish on a scale that read’s a single number, I can’t pinch the tail of a fish to make it weigh more. Catching bigger fish was not the point of my example, my point is that not all 18″ fish are created equal (same applies for your 19 and 20 inch fish) but a 5lb fish is a 5lb fish, no matter what.
I don’t agree with culling but that’s beside the point.
What weights do you use in the neko. Nail weights? And what size typically, obviously changes in 30 ft or water. But if I’m in 8 to 15 ft.
The slit gills is not all in the past, this is as recent as last year. The DNR claim this virus creates knife like cuts in the gills, give me a break.
The knife like cuts are in the head. Not the gills. Here is the most recent information from the DNR as of last October on the subject.
Clues in the lab
The DNR started to artificially prop up the lake’s walleye by releasing tens of thousands of fingerlings every year. The stocking efforts have had mixed results.
All was quiet until Dudek pulled what looked like a knifed bass out of the lake this fall.
“Without a doubt this was intentional,” he said. The bass fishing goes through its own peaks and valleys on Green Lake, he said. After the heavy pressure in the early 2000s, the quality and size of the bass catches dropped off for nearly a decade. Over the past couple years, it’s been excellent again, he said.
Bass tournaments are still held in the summer and fall.
After Dudek and others reported seeing scattered dead bass, the DNR was able to net some as they were dying on the lake. They sent them to a lab in St. Paul to be analyzed. What looked like knife wounds on the fish is more likely the sign of a nasty virus, said Isaiah Tolo, a fish health supervisor for the DNR.
“The confusion may be due to the lesions caused by the virus and secondary bacterial infections,” Tolo said.
The pathogen can eat away the skin in a way that looks like a knife wound.
The DNR confirmed Wednesday that largemouth bass virus has been affecting fish in the lake. The virus has only been found in big, keeper-sized fish — the kind that would be caught and put in a live well during bass tournaments. The virus rarely spreads in the open waters of a natural lake, but it spreads quickly inside a live well, when stressed fish are kept close together.
Besides Bearcat’s question on the nail weight, what rod and line setup are you using? Are you keeping it light fishing away from cover? Or, do you up the rod power and line so that it can be fished in a bit of cover?
The knife like cuts are in the head. Not the gills. Here is the most recent information from the DNR as of last October on the subject.
Yes, I read the article when it came out. Like I said, if you’re naive enough to believe a virus caused knife like wounds shortly after a large walleye tournament on a lake that has had previous issues with walleye fisherman killing smallmouth (going so far as to admitting to it) and now does not have the issue anymore, then the discussion has come to its end.
In case any of you needed another reason to start throwing this rig here it is. Surprisingly I couldn’t buy a bite (other than pike who kept stealing my Jackhammers) on a moving bait in this tournament. Switched to the neko and started getting fish after fish. After the cold front came in I think they wanted slower moving, subtle presentations.
I need to get better at trying new things. I tried the neko rig once… I couldn’t keep the gills from messing with the wiggly tail so I gave up and haven’t gone back. I always default to what I’m comfortable with but you have proven it catches bass. Maybe I’ll give it another go this year. You fish it mostly out on deeper weed edges, correct??
Lot of questions to answer here and I’ll try to hit them all.
-First off Bearcat, the size was a little small for Chisago. Everyone said they caught a ton of 12-14 inch bass. Big bass was only 19 inches which I was a little surprised with. It also sounded like I was the only one that got on a school. Everyone else was picking off one here and there.
-Tackle. I use a 7 ft medium fast rod, 12 lb braid to 10 lb fluoro leader. 1/16th oz nail weight. I don’t fish it in heavy cover but will throw it around docks. The most common areas I’m targeting with it are shallow and deep weedlines. Either casting parallel to the edge or casting into the weedline and bring it out of the edge. This is typically on main lake points and humps.
As far as culling, obviously fish in bass tournaments and I think there is no better feeling than walking up to the weigh table with a fat sack of bass. That being said, I get the concern. However, I don’t think the delayed mortality is very high because if it was you’d see a lot more dead bass floating the day after tournaments. You do run into a tourney that isn’t run well or has some not so respectful anglers in it where it does happen. Personally though, I think the bass community is the last one that should be criticized for not taking care of fish. It’s leading the fishing world in catch and release and it’s not even close. My two cents.
Yes, I read the article when it came out. Like I said, if you’re naive enough to believe a virus caused knife like wounds shortly after a large walleye tournament on a lake that has had previous issues with walleye fisherman killing smallmouth (going so far as to admitting to it) and now does not have the issue anymore, then the discussion has come to its end.
I believe what the lab says. I don’t purposefully think the DNR would analyze dead bass and then indicate that a virus is present and being compounded by holding fish in a livewell together.
It certainly is possible that walleye anglers were responsible for it at one point (which is sad and downright cruel). I don’t have any evidence of that and neither do you. Not like there is a tournament full of walleye anglers that came out and said they did that. Its pure speculation without any evidence.
Personally though, I think the bass community is the last one that should be criticized for not taking care of fish. It’s leading the fishing world in catch and release and it’s not even close. My two cents.
Agreed, to the point that there’s quite a few lakes that could benefit from Bass anglers actually doing some selective harvesting.
However, I don’t think the delayed mortality is very high because if it was you’d see a lot more dead bass floating the day after tournaments. You do run into a tourney that isn’t run well or has some not so respectful anglers in it where it does happen. Personally though, I think the bass community is the last one that should be criticized for not taking care of fish. It’s leading the fishing world in catch and release and it’s not even close. My two cents.
I don’t disagree with that. I just personally think that if we can do better, we should. Would you agree that an immediate release is better for the fish than holding it in a livewell on a warm summer day, weighing it, and then releasing it later? That’s all I’m saying in regards to a tournament format.
The holding of fish in a livewell for photo glorification purposes later (not a tournament) is on a whole different level of ego.
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>mahtofire14 wrote:</div>
However, I don’t think the delayed mortality is very high because if it was you’d see a lot more dead bass floating the day after tournaments. You do run into a tourney that isn’t run well or has some not so respectful anglers in it where it does happen. Personally though, I think the bass community is the last one that should be criticized for not taking care of fish. It’s leading the fishing world in catch and release and it’s not even close. My two cents.I don’t disagree with that. I just personally think that if we can do better, we should. Would you agree that an immediate release is better for the fish than holding it in a livewell on a warm summer day, weighing it, and then releasing it later? That’s all I’m saying in regards to a tournament format.
The holding of fish in a livewell for photo glorification purposes later (not a tournament) is on a whole different level of ego.
Sometimes its actually better for the bigger fish to be in a livewell (when it’s a good live well with an aerator or circulator) to let it rest after a big fight. Most boats these days have very safe livewells so again, I really don’t think it creates as much stress as people think. Look at the steps bassmaster has gone in keeping those fish healthy. It’s incredible. Now of course in most cases just releasing it right away is best but I really don’t think the mortality rate is very large from livewells.
When it comes to putting them in livewells just for pictures that is one that drives me crazy.
Look at the steps bassmaster has gone in keeping those fish healthy. It’s incredible.
They do a fantastic job. I’ve seen it in person at an Elite event in 2015 and 2015 at Mille Lacs. Theirs is the gold standard. The problem is that not every local amatuer event or club derby is at that standard, and some are down right terrible at it.
Mahtofire – What stage do you think most of the bass in your area are in right now. Pre, spawn, or post spawn. Catching fish like you were would lead me to believe most of the fish are already post spawn. If the fish were still spawning I would think there would have be more larger fish in your tourney.
First off Bearcat, the size was a little small for Chisago. Everyone said they caught a ton of 12-14 inch bass. Big bass was only 19 inches which I was a little surprised with. It also sounded like I was the only one that got on a school. Everyone else was picking off one here and there
Thanks for answering. All big fish we caught were in schools, like lit up the graph like a cloud of crappies does. All small ones we caught were on the bank. Crazy no one figured that out. Could be back to it being my stomping grounds. Where do you find the nail weights.
For a rod I throw those on a 6ft9 Loomis ml xf. 12 lbs braid to a 8 lbs flouro leader.
Mahtofire – What stage do you think most of the bass in your area are in right now. Pre, spawn, or post spawn. Catching fish like you were would lead me to believe most of the fish are already post spawn. If the fish were still spawning I would think there would have be more larger fish in your tourney.
Post spawn in the Chisago area. The small fish average is opposite of what we found the next day.
Mahtofire – One more question for you. I could not tell on the video, do you fish a bright colored braided mainline. If so what brand? I’m going to fish some bright colored Braid for the first time this year. Mainly for my weightless stick worm setup. I think the same setup may also work well for the Neko rigging. Heading out this afternoon and may have to throw the Neko rig around some.
Mahtofire – One more question for you. I could not tell on the video, do you fish a bright colored braided mainline. If so what brand? I’m going to fish some bright colored Braid for the first time this year. Mainly for my weightless stick worm setup. I think the same setup may also work well for the Neko rigging. Heading out this afternoon and may have to throw the Neko rig around some.
I know this was for mahto but I throw bright yellow 832 main line on any finese like the neko or senko
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>fishthumper wrote:</div>
Mahtofire – What stage do you think most of the bass in your area are in right now. Pre, spawn, or post spawn. Catching fish like you were would lead me to believe most of the fish are already post spawn. If the fish were still spawning I would think there would have be more larger fish in your tourney.Post spawn in the Chisago area. The small fish average is opposite of what we found the next day.
Ya I think the metro fish are a few weeks ahead of us here around St. Cloud. I think for the most part our fish are mostly still Pre-spawn with some just starting to pull up. I think a few warm days will change that quickly. I’ll have a little better idea after getting out there this afternoon and tomorrow.
I know this was for mahto but I throw bright yellow 832 main line on any finese like the neko or senko
That was what I purchased as well. I have several Rods in being repaired. Once I get them back I’m going to spool up a rod with the Hi-viz 832 line and give it a try.
I think the fish were mixed during that tourney. Water temps were 61-64 and though the majority of the fish were short they were very fat. So I think some were prespawn and some were post.
For the nail weights I will make a shameless plug. I go with the Swagger Tungsten nail weights because I’m partnered up with them. All tungsten weights are basically made in the same factory in China but these guys are based in Oakdale and I like the owner, so I went with them. If you go to http://www.swaggertungsten.com and put “SWAGGER22” in the promo code spot you save 15%. And if you put “Pete Scholl” in the order notes section I get a little closer to getting a $5,000 sponsorship. Good for both of us! I use the 1/16th oz most often.
My hi viz braid is Power Pro yellow. The Suffix 832 Bearcat mentioned is good stuff too. I’m a line watcher so I like to see that line jump when I get a bite.
The problem is that not every local amatuer event or club derby is at that standard, and some are down right terrible at it.
Obviously local derbies don’t have the means to have that kind of set up. But the majority of them have the big sinks and tables that allow you to dump the bass into the sink from your bag to be weighed quickly and mostly stress free. After that it’s right back to the lakes. My league we aren’t even allowed to trailer our boats before weighing in to limit the time the fish are in the livewell. I know other local events are similar. I think bass fishing is to the point where people that are serious enough to fish in local leagues or events have the same passion about caring for the resource. I think they are doing a pretty good job at making sure these fish are getting too stressed.
My dad has fished in the North Star league as long as I can remember.
He had brought up the pressure on them to not have cull tournaments.
I asked why they don’t just adopt the MLF format. He said they couldn’t get enough people to be weigh officials in the boats.
So I brought up why don’t the club buy X amount of scales. Before each tournament the scales are handed out.
You then take a time stamped photo of the fish and scale. The time stamp will include the time, date and location of the fish caught.
They then would enter the 5 biggest pics for there official weight for the tourney.
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