My WI deer season is done, but creates a lot of questions

Had a good season and more than anything, enjoyed the time with my daughter, Dad, and some great friends.

Opening day, while one of our guys was walking to his stand, he chased a few does and one of our target bucks out into the field in front of me. By a freak chance the buck was confused on where to go and made the fatal mistake of procrastination. I patiently waited for the clock to roll up on legal shooting time and then sent a 140gr barnes bullet through the pump house of a nice 5×4. 1 minute into season – 1st buck down.

Olivia and I proceeded to sit and watch a few yearlings and about 15 bucks pass by. Two huge mature bucks made their way through and never presented a good shot. Had to pass. In hopes of another encounter with these one of these two, we passed up everything else. One I mis-judged and passed on proceeded to walk up on my buddy Brian and he took it down with no second thought. Beautiful 4×4 with plenty of ground growth (unusual!!) I was pleasantly surprised to see how much larger he was while on the ground Vs walking through saplings.

On a neighboring property, someone shot the lower front leg off a yearling and I spotted it hobbling across our field. Couldn’t stand the thought of it going to waste, so I put it down. Next day, had a similar situation with a doe that had been shot and I did the same.

But, this season left me with plenty of questions.
Since the eruption of CWD, the over-reaction by the DNR, and the gross greed of neighboring hunters I have watched the local herd dive to near extinction and rebound back to a plentiful state. We have put a huge amount of work into our property over the last 20+ years to create a habitat to hold does/yearlings year round.
Brief description of the land:
100+ Acres= 17 acres of sanctuary, about 34 acres of food plots and crops (corn, oats, late oats for winter stand, hay/alfalfa, and more) 19 acres of forestry restoration with cherry, white oak, bur oak, and white pines, and remaining in mature woods.

After the mass slaughter of does in the “earn-a-buck” days, my neighbors came to realize that if you keep shooting does, you don’t see any deer. Each year, were watched significant improvements. Instead of seeing nothing or 1 or 2 deer a day, we saw 5 a day, then 8-10 a day, then it was up to 30 at a time in my plots.

However, I’m seeing a trend that I don’t understand. Very few old mature does and pattern changes around mid Sept. I have about 16 trail cams out which nets about 125,000 pictures a year. Its obvious that the herd is “healthy” as most of the does are dropping 2 to 3 fawns and I see a very high survival rate. All year long, including gun season, we see mostly fawns. Over the last 3 or 4 years, I see the more mature does beginning to vanish around late Sept/early Oct. Very strange is I still see the fawns frequent the plots, with NO signs of momma around. This is true in live observation and backed up by the trail cams. Additionally, I’m seeing a drop in the frequency of mature bucks passing through during the rut. 5 years ago, I would see the same buck pass through 2 or 3 times a day. Now, once every 2 or 3 days. However, the lessor bucks are staying (fawn to 2-1/2 year olds)

Come late Dec or early Jan, I see a distinct increase of mature does return. Then they remain as residents until Sept again. My first suspicion was trespassers and the neighbors taking a lot of does again. Well, if it was people on my land, I would have pics – none. Most of my neighbors are hunting less, and I see many of them frequently. They are excited with the increasingly high numbers of quality bucks and are on board with the no to very few does shot. I believe and trust they are not slaughtering the does. Plus I see the increase around Jan.

So, where the heck are they going? Why? I’m sure that more of the mature bucks are following them? Its crazy to see 16 fawns, 13 bucks (all little guys) and maybe 1 to 3 mature does for sitting 11 hours a day. Then by mid week, see 6 fawns, 3 little bucks, and no mature does.

Few pics

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Nice buck.

I’ve noticed in high deer areas like mo, the mature does can be as mythical as big bucks. You know they exist but they just seem to hide.

I’m curious on your turkey numbers. I’m reading up on how turkeys and deer cohabit with one another as turkeys are really moving into our area. We are seeing some behavior changes for sure but it could just be a number of things…but I am hear that the two don’t really get along.

FWIW on the topic of turkeys and deer, as this pic shows, I had a doe and 2 fawns walk in amongst a flock of 18 turkeys feasting on some shelled corn. Neither seemed to mind the other.

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Could you have neighbors heavily baiting/feeding that draw in the mature/dominant critters and keep them around – essentially making them nocturnal and private? Then in January when they quit feeding, the deer return?

Any standing corn will draw mature deer, hunting pressure or not. Got any around you Randy? I have seen a near identical situation where I hunt with plenty of visible smaller does and fawns during the first couple hours of daylight and again beginning the last hour of full daylight. The big does we see after sunset. Bucks of all sizes may be seen the first day of the season but a few shots lobbed their way and into the thick they go.

On the property I hunt there is a steep hillside on about half of it that is covered with cedar, prickly plum and buckthorn. Deer love the stuff and head right into the stuff when the neighbors start shooting so we let them have it. Our daytime stands are found on the more open woods on the other side of the ridge where we get shooting from deer coming to this thick stuff from yet other neighboring farms with shooting taking place. Our day stands offer open shots so we can wait on deer to pick our best shot. Notice I said shot. Our key is to not sound like we are an army at war. I hunt a muzzy and the nephew by choice puts two shells in his pump. In essence our woods is a quiet woods and we get lots of daytime opportunities to choose from, thanks to the neighbors, as deer are trying to get to that cedar/buckthorn thicket.

Every year is different and every year we see subtle changes in the deer’s behavior. I am of the opinion that if I am where I need to be and stay quiet it will be the deer that screws up, or hunters from another property. I hunt in the open, whether on a ground stand or in a tree stand. I can’t stand having less than 240 degrees of visibility while sitting and just standing up affords me the other 120 degrees with a minimum of movement. On the opening weekend I’d bet that 90% of the larger does and bucks I see are spotted as far away as 400 yards as they sneak thru travels lanes they’ve used for forever to get to this slope from he// on the other side of the ridge from us. Fro 3 oclock on until near dark we find the deer sneaking over the ridge and back out the way they came in unless a radical wind shift has taken place. In that case we shift our evening sits to play the wind. And it pays off.

One of the issues where I hunt is a small cluster of home sites with property that draws does and fawns like a magnet. They start to transition to this area about the time we see our first frost. We see them head into that location in the early morning hours and see them emerge about an hour before dark. Wind is about the only thing that really causes the to wander far or change their habits because its a hunting no-mans-land….bleeding hearts. This is where our thicket comes into play in the late afternoon as deer coming out after being settled undisturbed all day come out to join the others at the far end of the field. Just before dark is when we take our best does and almost always right as they step into the field to study it.

Turkey and deer get along just fine. Bad for the hunter though. More keen eyes watching you.

No baiting or heavy harvests by neighbors. Weve been comparing pics. Everyone is very upfront and they are seeingbthe same.

I have same amount of standing corn as most neighbors.

Usually we see the mature does back in the woods while the fans are out. The does come iut later. Even my cameras in the woods are not getting the big does. Strange

What I have noticed over the years is as our trees are maturing there is less ground cover so I am seeing less dear every year when we get into winter. I may have to do some cutting to let some sunlight in to get the under brush growing again to give them more cover.

Seen similar situation. I think the does seem to disappear because they get hassled by every buck and spike buck alike.
Un less you are in the thickets they are hard to find because they do not want to be found until after breeding and males leave them alone. The higher the buck population the more they hide.
I had a change in my thinking that the deer care less about human activity then I once thought. They have more on their minds then me.

Shoot some of the bucks. The does are getting harrassed too much. They go into hiding or leave the area. The bigger bucks will go with them. The young bucks will stay with the fawns. They are in your sanctuary I’m betting or a neighvors sanctuary if they have one.

They are way smarter than one thinks.

That has a lot of logic and makes sense. We have had a strong increase in the buck numbers, and we have a lot of mid-aged bucks 2 to 4 years old

riverruns wrote:

Shoot some of the bucks. The does are getting harrassed too much. They go into hiding or leave the area. The bigger bucks will go with them. The young bucks will stay with the fawns. They are in your sanctuary I’m betting or a neighvors sanctuary if they have one.
They are way smarter than one thinks.

Totally agree and I think this is exactly what’s happening. The does are tired of being harassed by all the frisky young bucks and they just leave the area until they are out of heat and the young bucks cool off.

I watched this bow season as young bucks would enter the plots and just run the mature does ragged. One spike buck that (no offense), I named Randy, would enter the plot and he was obviously looking for one doe that was showing signs of coming in. He took a run and chased EVERY SINGLE doe off the plot, one at a time. The mature does had obviously had it up to here with him because when he came at them, they would blow at him and then just run out of the plot and be gone until the next day.

I think there’s a myth out there that only Mr. Big gets to breed does. No way, if the frisky young bucks get the chance, they’ll get-r-done, so nothing on earth is going to stop them from trying to get lucky while Mr. Big is, ah-hum, tied up elsewhere. They know a hot doe is a limited time offer, so they’re going to try early and often.

Start taking out some younger bucks and I’d bet the situation with the does changes.

Nice buck, BTW! Good work.

Grouse

Grouse, I agree on the litle bucks getting yo breed. In one day, we watched 1 doe get bred by three different bucks. Poor girl could never leave an area with one of them stuck to her like stink on a turd

I shot a doe three years ago that was with another doe and a couple fawns. And a dink buck. He had his nose half way up her hienie and was pawing her flanks when I shot her. The other doe and fawns flew off when the bang came. That fool buck had to be chased off and then he was never more than twenty yards away as I dressed her out. I was seriously thinking he might tear into me but when I finished and went to pick up my day stuff he finally wandered off a way further but was there yet when I started her down the hillside.

I saw quite a few juniors this season hanging with groups of does right at sunset or very early morning. Didn’t see any breeding but I know they were just hanging there for the first poke, so to speak. Of course the 4 point rule kept any shooting off them but they’re the ones that need thinning.