Large Trout Management

The MN DNR and Southeast Minnesota Trout Advisory Goup(a group made up of MN T.U., MN Trout Association, and local groups) are working on a plan to increase the numbers of large (over 15″) trout in SE MN streams. I had read a while back that they were looking at catch and release only on 20-30 streams that had potential for large trout. I for one am very excited about the proposal. Imagine being able to fish your favorite local stream and consistently catch fish in the 15″-20″ range. You can pick up a brochure at Whitewater State Park. Any plan of this sort looks to be at least a couple of years away. PLEASE support the efforts of the DNR and SEMTAG, and help move this plan along.

Todd Olson
The Fly Guys Guide Service
EFN Field Staff
[email protected]

Todd, I live in SW Wisconsin and am lucky enough to be able to fish some streams where they have catch and release sections. I think it not only makes for better fishing in the C&R sections but in surrounding water also. Designating an entire stream as catch and release worries me though. Would the trout be so abundant that forage fish would be wiped out? Would to high a population cause an 18 inch fish to be skinny as an eel? Will neighborhood kids have their fishing holes taken away from them? I’m not against catch and release sections, but classifying an entire stream as catch and release seems rather drastic.

birdman

Those are all good points. I unfortunately do not have all of the details, and would encourage you to just keep your eyes open for all of the info you can get on this subject (and share it in the forum it at all possible). What I do know is that they are doing ongoing research in SE MN to find streams that could in fact handle a large population of trophy fish. I personally have not heard of any situations where a stream, or section of stream, has been designated catch and release, and the trout were esentially stunted (much like panfish would). My experiences has been in fact the oppposite. Areas in Canada that have done this with brook and lake trout have had fantastic results. There are many streams out West that have also done this with success. I personally fish the Frying Pan in Colorado every year. They have a size limit of 16″ (no fish over 16″ can be take from the stream). This has worked wonders for the fishery. I am not sure that complete catch and release is the answer, but I would sure like to explore some of the possibilities. As I stated in my 1st post any plan of this sort is at least 2 years away. The concerns mentioned above are some of the reasons that the DNR is taking their time. Again I would like to encourage all to pay attention to this topic, and if anything new or exciting happens please post here. Both the MN DNR site and MN TU site have had info on this, and there is a borchure at the Stat Parks.

Todd Olson
The Fly Guys Guide Service
EFN Field Staff
[email protected]

I spoke with someone on the SEMTAG committee last night regarding LTM and a three tiered system that is on the table. At this time, there will be public input meetings on the issue of LTM and going to a stream classification system similar to other states. In March, the committee will not have recognized what streams will be classified into the three categories, however, those streams will be posted by May as there is a 90 day period for which those streams have to be posted before a second public input meeting is held in September of this year. LTM is closer than a few years away as the DNR, SEMTAG, TU, and MTA all seem to be in agreement right now regarding this management approach. All that is left is for the public to have their say and determine what streams will fall under each classification. If all goes without a hitch, LTM on a three tiered approach could be in place as early as 2004.

Bottom line: there will still be plenty of streams that will have harvest on them (just to alleviate any fears that anglers won’t be allowed to keep fish), however, stream regulations will take a significant change from what they are now, creating more fisheries with needed protection and offering anglers more streams with the potential to sustain larger trout.

Thanks for the clarification Dave. 2004 – That is great news!!

i think that this would be a wonderful idea. it would be great for some larger sized water to be designated as catch and realse only.

i would like to see the whole stream under these rules and not just sections. there are several year round catch and release sections now in place but i never seem to catch any bigger fish in them. i don’t no if its because it’s only a small section or because people just don’t follow the catch and release rule. i no i was at one last summer sometime and there was a whole family of our asian friend fishing it. i didn’t actually see any fish laying around but i can’t say i’ve ever seen them throw one back. i left with out saying anything, although i probalbly should have.

there are plenty of streams throughout SE MN for people to catch trout for dinner. set a couple a side for the folks that want a ligitimet chance at a big ol’ trout

First, I will comment about minorities and fish lying around. The reality is that most of the minority anglers I have run into on area streams aren’t usually on catch and release waters because they are there for harvest purposes. I hope that didn’t sound too racially biased because if they buy a license and follow the rules, I’ve got no problem with who fishes what streams and how they fish them. Harvesting too many fish or using set lines (as was the case on Garvin Brook last spring) due to such things as language barriers do not fly in my book. There’s a bit of selfishness involved with those that poach.

With that said, if you were out during the regular season (no early or late catch-and-release seasons, the only streams with a permanent catch and release reg. on them would be Crow Spring (Middle Branch of the WW) and a portion of Hay Creek. However, Hay Creek has a ton of fish in it and could be subject to change (a slot) to promote more harvest and thin out the numbers.

I look forward to being able to fish waters that are protected and are regulated to grow larger fish. Todd can vouch for this when I say that competent fly anglers can hit a hatch and literally catch an unlimited amount of trout in a day. However, most of those fish aren’t in the 14 plus inch class. Creating quality fisheries through LTM is very high on my list.

I think you actually will see some streams that are strictly catch and release. I have no doubt that those who regularly harvest fish from these streams will not like it initially; change and acceptance of change takes time.

Regarding some of these special regs areas and lack of big fish. I know first hand on Crow Spring that there have been some issues in the past with poachers. The poachers are there because the big fish are there. Crow Spring is very technical fishing for the most part and is a huge challenge to fish successfully. I know first hand it has large fish – and plenty of them, but they are pretty wily.

Later,

that was the stream i was on. i’ve never heard it called crow spring but it was on the middle branch. i’ve fished there quit a bit and usually catch fish, just never anything big.

i do agree with you 100% on minorities and fihing. most of them are there to catch food to eat, and thats just fine with me. but when they’re sitting there with worms and bobbers on a catch and realse section of stream i can’t beleive they’re doing it for the sport. i’m going to say that most people that fish this way for trout are there to keep them. it is a very effective way to catch fish and i’m sure that not all people keep them that fish this way but a lot do. i have no problem with it as long as they’re followig the laws.

It’s technically the Middle Branch as the Middle Branch dumps in from the west. However, it is called Crow Spring (you cross it on county road #9) as the srping is the actual area that TU has done massive amounts of habitat improvement. You should go along on an electro-shocking expedition on Crow Spring – very impressive numbers of trout, especially fish over 12 inches. As I stated before, the trout there are very selective, and the larger ones are a challenge to catch. If you want to tangle with big fish, I’d suggest doing some exploration on the Root.

Regards,

First, I think everyone needs to immediately step back in regards to the labeling I’ve begun to see here.
I have read in the past how people take pride in how this site is run professionaly and respectfully. Let’s keep it
that way eh?
Pointing fingers or even beginning to make blame with a certain population of fisherman isn’t even close to the subject nor a
major factor in creating streams and/or changing regulations, enhancing the average size of trout.

It is universal people! Since we have gone that way I need to say I have witnessed far more “caucasion” anglers breaking fishing regs and keeping
full limits of fish, including large trout. It is a delicate but necessary process that won’t be easy to get across to everyone. It will take time, but we all need to
do our part in educating others. We have a wonderful fishing resource in SE MN, let’s work together in maintenance, conservation with future planning to not only make it
a better fishery as far as large fish( there are already a lot of large fish people!!!), but a strong self sustaining ecosystem(if at all possible).

How do we get the message across to those with little English Speaking skills???? Good question!
WHere there’s a will there’s a way. LEt’s not point fingers, especially at a group of people, simply trying to make their way.

NO offense to the so-called elitist fly-fisherman(whatever that maybe), but regs need to address the fishery, plain and simple. It should never address or reflect techique or methodology in trout fishing.
We often stray from what is truly important for our resources.

One more thing. I am all for having a more consistent large fish catch, but I need to see how the end decision truly effects the fishery as a whole.
ALl catch and release? SHouldn’t there be a balance?

(If you or anyone wants to learn more about our Trout Resources in SE MN you are invited to
attend my 3rd Annual Trout Day in Forestville/Mystery Cave State Park. Seminars, fishing, free prizes. Free to all ages, race, religion etc. APRIL 26TH)

Keep the rods bendin’!!!

Jim W

My post is not intended to point fingers at minorities at all. As stated, I could care less who angles and how they angle as long as they (all persons) follow the rules. Mine was simply an observation about what I have seen in the past. Will it change?? Perhaps. I doubt I’m alone in my observations about who is angling and what thier intentions are. I wasn’t pointing fingers at people trying to make their way – I just wish they would make their way other than fishing with limiting out in mind.

The new LTM management proposals are not meant to limit those who perhaps do not fly fish. I have never considered myself elitist, just someone who prefers to fish with a fly rod. I doubt that there will be streams that are under strict catch and release that don’t desevere it. An example I can think of would be portions of the Root. How sweet would those marginal waters be if they were under some very stringent almost trophy like regulations? Other streams, however, definitely NEED more harvest. The nice things about a regulation is that it can be changed. If the regulation needs to be modified, it will be.

I apologize if I have offended anyone with racial undertones. It was certainly not meant to be that way.

A word of caution on many of the proposed changes on Minnesota steams, keep it simple! Here in Wisconsin we went through a similiar phase and ended up with all kinds of rules for different streams and in one case three classifications for a one mile stretch of one stream. Although the intentions were good the end result was many people gave up trout fishing because of the complex regulations. Now Wisconsin realizes their mistake and are simplifying their regs. I would encourage those of you involved with Minnesota’s proposed changes to remember that if the regs are too complicated many will walk away instead of trying to learn the new rules.

Good point. I would hope we would shy away from a complicated system of regulations. However, with a three tiered approach, anglers are going to have to read their rule book and signs at access points at bit more carefully. I’m hoping we don’t end up with the example you stated: one stream wiht three different regulations on it. I rather doubt that’s where this is headed.

Hey Dave, I think you took my post as an personal attack it was not. In fact I wasn’t replying “much” to your

post. In all honesty, I skimmed the thread and immediately picked up on a couple themes that stood out to me. Maybe I was too passionate in my post or something and in the future will try to spend the time to read all. Really wasn’t directed at one person at all. If it came across that way, oh well. I’m no

professional.

Keep the rods bendin’!!!

Jim W

No harm taken. I just wanted to clarify my position on the whole issue, which is probably not something that deserves a lot of discussion on a thread about trout management.

i guess that was directed more towards me then, huh.

well i was going to defend myself on this position but then i went back and read over my own post. i didn’t realize i was coming on so strong. i didn’t mean to offend anyone with anything that i said. i was only trying to get a point across. this was just an incident that stood out in my mind. the wording was probably inappropriate. next time i’ll be sure to read over it before i post to make sure i’m saying what i really wanted to say.

as far as what the post was ment to be about i think that i would like to see 2-3 main streams completely catch and release. the special size requirements and stuff gets too confusing. i’m sure that there is a lot more that goes into a desion like that but if it could happen that would be great. i do think the trout fishing around is pretty darn good for numbers of fish. i’m not real impressed with the size though. i have been trout fishing for five years now and spend a lot of during the summers doing it. i’ve taken floats down the root and hiked along ways to fish special sections of streams. i have not caught a single real big fish (18″+) and only a handful over 15″. i no that i’m a pretty good fishermen and if there was an over abundance of truely large fish around, i think that i woudl catch a few more. i hope that didn’t sound too ignorant.

I would tend to agree that we have great fishery for numbers of fish, but the bigguns are hard to come by. In recent years I have spent a LOT of time in the streams and have caught a handful of fish over 18″ and a few over 20″. Every year a few fish in the 26″+ range are caught. This info would lead me to believe that the streams are capable of large fish, and it is up to us to manage it. LTM – I cannot wait!!!

Todd Olson
The Fly Guys Guide Service
EFN Field Staff
[email protected]

I agree that the fish populations are very high in general. If you want to catch big fish, it takes a certain element of expertise and luck. I catch most of my larger fish in April and May or later in September. 95% of these fish are taken on streamer patterns – big presentations = big fish. However, I have had to do a lot of scouting, hitting and missing, and general pounding of a great deal of water to find out where these big fish lie. With LTM in place, the potential for routinely tangling with larger fish is very real.