Every anti muskies or lake owners association meeting about muskies I have been to has had someone from the MN Darkhouse Angling Association there talking about how bad muskies are. Why does this group hate muskies so much? Is it because they can’t spear muskies? That group sure puts in a lot of time and effort fighting against muskies.
I will be interested to see if you get a response from anybody who is a member. I don’t know how tight the organization is. For example I don’t know if they have a written Mission Statement as a organization. If they do the answer maybe right in the Mission Statement. It also could be they have a very small membership but those involved are very, very active and make sure they attend every meeting.
Good question, lets see if they appear.
I didn’t see anything about muskies on their page.
Edit by BK: Link to About
I would not say the MDAA hates muskies. While the MDAA’s public stance is to be “anti-muskie”, it is not a shared feeling throughout the organization’s members or even each individual chapter.
Example (per MDAA East Central Chapter FB Page):
The official position of the East Central MDAA as it pertains to SF-3319 is that muskie sotcking and darkhouse spearing have little to do with each other… therefore we do not support this bill that ties the great sport of darkhouse spearing with the muskie stocking.”
The MDAA FB Page recently posted a statement supporting SF-3319 and it got so much negative feedback from its own members that they deleted the post.
These two groups should not be enemies and there are many sportsmen who are members of both groups. I think with time, patience, and eventual new leadership we will see the anti-muskie sentiment fade out of the MDAA. There will always be loud members against muskies but in time they will not be allowed to speak for the entire organization.
Now on to the reason(s) why they are publicly against muskie stocking. It’s two-fold… History and Poitics.
History: For many years MN lakes classified as muskie waters were closed to spearing. This obviously caused a rift between the two organizations and I certainly cannot blame the MDAA for that. I feel it was an unjust law and it was rightfully repealed a few years ago. I think a fair comparison would be closing lakes to all fishing while walleye season is closed because some people might still be targeting and keeping walleye.
Politics: The Senator who spearheaded (pun intended) the bill to open muskie waters to spearing was none other than – you guessed it – Senator Bill Ingebrigtsen. The MDAA sold their soul to the political devil and they are now located firmly in his back pocket.
The MDAA FB Page recently posted a statement supporting SF-3319 and it got so much negative feedback from its own members that they deleted the post.
If MDAA removed their stance on the bill from facebook because of how members felt why did a lobbyist from MDAA still went to support SF-3319 like the group was all in favor of it? I wonder if MDAA members still want to call themselves anti-muskie since they are no longer kept off musky lakes. Seems to me to be the only reason why they would have been anti-muskie. It would be nice to see MDAA and Muskies Inc work together.
It’s more than Muskie’s. It’s also Northern Pike. IMHO it’s a combination of things: Catch & Release vs Harvest, Pro DNR vs Dislike DNR, Age of avg Darkhouse guy vs Muskie guy, Metro based anglers vs Rural guys. I’d speculate that more Darkhouse guys fish walleye, panfish while many Muskie guys/gals are exclusive to Muskie’s. Put all of these together and it’s a complexed puzzle. Too make a bad joke about it is; The Darkhouse Assn has a chapter in evey northern MN bar !!
History: For many years MN lakes classified as muskie waters were closed to spearing. This obviously caused a rift between the two organizations and I certainly cannot blame the MDAA for that. I feel it was an unjust law and it was rightfully repealed a few years ago. I think a fair comparison would be closing lakes to all fishing while walleye season is closed because some people might still be targeting and keeping walleye.
Politics: The Senator who spearheaded (pun intended) the bill to open muskie waters to spearing was none other than – you guessed it – Senator Bill Ingebrigtsen. The MDAA sold their soul to the political devil and they are now located firmly in his back pocket.
In regards to the history section, I think your analogy fails because even to this day there are people incapable of identifying muskies, pike, and hybrids despite the numerous resources available. I think the assumption was that people could possibly mistake one for the other. An actual fair comparison would be like having a closed sauger season when walleyes are closed.
In regards to the politics, many MDAA members moved on to the MMPA I believe. Either way, the real issue here is that the lakeshore associations want control of public waters, do not fall for the bait of pitting fishermen against each other. They’ve also attempted to spread propaganda to the walleye fishermen in order to trick them into siding with the lake associations.
It’s more than Muskie’s. It’s also Northern Pike. IMHO it’s a combination of things: Catch & Release vs Harvest, Pro DNR vs Dislike DNR, Age of avg Darkhouse guy vs Muskie guy, Metro based anglers vs Rural guys. I’d speculate that more Darkhouse guys fish walleye, panfish while many Muskie guys/gals are exclusive to Muskie’s. Put all of these together and it’s a complexed puzzle. Too make a bad joke about it is; The Darkhouse Assn has a chapter in evey northern MN bar !!
I can assure you that musky guys aren’t just sitting around waiting for June to begin fishing, most of us fish for whatever species is in season.
It’s more than Muskie’s. It’s also Northern Pike.
Why would they be against pike if they can only spear for northern pike, catfish, whitefish and rough fish?
Tuma, I thought that I would need to clarify that statement. They aren’t against Pike, but oppose many of the regulations that are being used to fix the small pike problems. They threatened to oppose the new Pike regulations, it seems that many “not all” are interested in Big Pike, any sized Pike and just don’t like any and all Pike regulations – period. And the harvest of big Pike is part of the problem causing an increase in smaller Pike. So, the DNR bought them off, first by allowing Pike spearing on Muskie lakes, then with the new Pike regulations, they get to keep a “bonus or accident or poached) Pike (however you choose see it). This fascination with big Pike isn’t unique to just spear’ers, it is endemic to many anglers. As I understand it Mother Nature has a plan, if the larger Pike are over harvested, Pike production switches to reproduction rather than growth. This reproduction results in over production, partially due to the lack of large Pike (who eat many smaller pike).
I think a fair comparison would be closing lakes to all fishing while walleye season is closed because some people might still be targeting and keeping walleye.
Wait they don’t close the lakes when it’s not walleye season??? I thought that’s why we can’t bass fish or fish for pike or anything other than panfish anytime other than “walleye season”.
In regards to the history section, I think your analogy fails because even to this day there are people incapable of identifying muskies, pike, and hybrids despite the numerous resources available. I think the assumption was that people could possibly mistake one for the other. An actual fair comparison would be like having a closed sauger season when walleyes are closed.
Ok that’s fair, but my point was there are plenty of sports where identifying your game before “taking the shot” is necessary.
On 24″-36″ size restricted lakes you can spear a 23″ pike, but not a 24″.
On 24″-36″ size restricted lakes you can spear a 37″ pike, but not a 36″.
Deer antler point restrictions.
You can hunt sharpies in areas where you’ll also see plenty of hen pheasants.
You can hunt mallards in September when they’re all brown but can only shoot a limited number of hens.
If you’ve ever seen a muskie through the ice, they look like a glow stick. It’s not hard to tell the difference between a muskie and pike if the intent is there. The law was put in place because of the fear spearers would intentionally spear muskies.
The law was put in place because of the fear spearers would intentionally spear muskies.
And that they do! The muskie guides in my area have pictures with spear tine holes in muskie very frequently. I think the guys that hate muskie are very open about it too. One guy bragged about spearing 15 muskie in one winter and yes he was in a bar as Buzz assumed a guy like this would be.
It’s not hard to sit in a local watering hole and get guys to admit to spearing or killing muskie. Spearing is an outdated practice and in my opinion there is no place for it. Years ago we could use massive punt guns to water swat 50 ducks at time but as times progressed they knew this had to stop. The fact that spearing is still legal baffles me. MDDA is embarrassing to the state of MN.
I have to add that I think the sport is a blast! I wish our lakes could sustain such practices but it’s 100% obvious our lakes cannot!
Spearing is something I really enjoy and try to do it as much as I can in the winter. I have previously been close to signing up for a membership with the dark house association. Everytime I talk myself out of it when they make comments on facebook starting fights with the muskie crowd. I have zero interest in spearing a lake that has muskies. If I hit a muskie accidentally I would’ve wished I didn’t go. Their comments are so aggressive and harsh towards not stocking muskies theres no finding a middle ground. I have a fair amount of frieds that muskie fish and I feel we should both be able to do our hobby without attacking each other. As for how a lot of people can be so opinionated on muskie stocking how does anyone really know the long term affects we’d have to wait to see what actually happens. why not draw certain zones on a map and have a certain percentage of lakes that muskies can be stocked in? A muskie guy should be able to fish somewhat close to where he lives but doesn’t need muskies in every lake in his county.
The best thing that can save spearing is get guys to start spearing the pesky hammerhandles and small ones. let the monsters go.
If a guy showed a limit of hammerhandles out of the lake other anglers would be carrying him off the lake.
The new slot in my are the central zone sucks and prevents this unless you want to get just ones under 22″. should’ve went a limit of 6-8 of them 26″ and under. Break out the pickled northern recipe!
I find it interesting that this group has such pull that it can even get special regulations for different limits on fish.
Slip Bob, there is an excellent article in this months In Fisherman on Pike cannibalism. The protected Pike slot in the Central Zone was set at 22-26 on purpose, because those are the eaters. Pike between 22-26 eat more small pike 5-12 inches then other sized Pike. The plan is to use the 22-26 to control the over-population of small Pike.
From toothyfish:
For those interested, Ingebrigtsen has apparently finally gotten his way. And no, its not to do an actual scientific study(anyone who actually believed that Ingebrigtsen was interested in science just hasn’t been paying attention), they’ve stolen $100,000 from the legacy fund to do a survey about how people feel about fish stocking. No actual science will be used because science doesn’t support Mr. Ingebrigtsen and Mr. Majkrzak’s stances so they refuse to use any actual scientific methods. Instead propaganda, lying, intimidation and they even went so far as to somehow tamper with the WBLLA’s website to help push their insane bill. Sadly it appears to actually be working.
Is the the Legacy dollars? I heard in was the G&F fund, right out of our fishing license dollars?
Legacy funds require a vote. He can’t steal anything there unless approved by committees.
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