Managing hunting property – Ultra-low pressure vs Human presence conditioning

I’ve noticed an interesting split in approaches that is emerging with deer hunters and hunting property managers and I’d love to hear some discussion about which way IDO members are trending.

For years now it seems the predominate approach (or at least the one that got the most coverage/attention) was the “Ultra-low Pressure” approach. Obviously, there are significant differences in how different hunters and property managers used this approach, but the gist of it was to take great pains to avoid any and all movement or presence on the hunting property that wasn’t absolutely necessary.

And when the hunter or manager HAD to be on the property, extreme measures were taken to avoid leaving any scent or making any unnecessary disturbance. Rubber boots, de-scented sprays and clothing, silent clothing, gloves, even breathing masks were used to conceal scent and mask noise.

Within the last couple of years, I notice that another approach has gained more followers and gotten more coverage. I’m calling this the Human Presence Conditioning approach.

With this approach, the concept is to get the deer on a property used to a certain level of human presence. You want to condition the deer to believe that humans are noisy, smelly, and predictable. The idea is for the deer to learn (or believe they have learned) that when humans are present, they will get plenty of “warning” by hearing and smelling us and then when we’re not making any noise or laying down scent, it’s because we’re not there and therefore there is no danger.

One of the more common uses of the Human Presence Conditioning approach is always using an ATV or a vehicle to get dropped off at a deer stand or to move around the property. Yes, the deer both hear and smell this vehicle approach and the scent it leaves, but if they are conditioned in advance to the presence of vehicles, they believe that vehicle gone = human gone. Even if scent remains.

This approach has been ramped up in other areas of property management, the idea being that being present on a property and having the deer know it is actually a good thing. The only bad thing is that you never want to have a surprise encounter with a deer. You want every deer to believe that people are “those smelly, noisy things” that are easy to avoid and don’t represent any real danger because humans are so noisy we couldn’t sneak up on a freight train.

I’m not presenting this as “there’s a right and wrong approach”. I’m sure it’s highly situational, but I’m wondering if others have noticed these seemingly divergent trends?

Personally, I’m believing more and more in the Human Presence Conditioning approach.

I was trying my best to follow as much of the Ultra-low Pressure approach in past years, but for several reasons I was starting to question whether this approach was really right for a small, intensively managed hunting property like mine (80 acres) in an area where hunting pressure is high. It basically felt like I was trying to have it both ways.

So now I’m thinking more and more about the conditioning approach and how to both develop the property and the methods around that approach. For example, I want to expand all my trails so that I only check cameras by driving the ATV to them.

And I’m also trying to start any visit or work I do on my property by driving the ATV and making noise to alert the deer to my presence. I actually want to push them away and eliminate “chance” encounters as much as possible

Have others noticed this divergence in approaches and what are you trying to do on your property?

Grouse

Well, here are a few things I’ve encountered over the years that make me believe that deer can become conditioned to human presence. On many occasions, I have bow hunted stands on field edges where the farmer was harvesting crops. As a matter of fact, this last fall during the youth hunt, guys were cutting a fall hay crop 20′ from our stand when we got out there. We got in the stand, the tractor left maybe 10 minutes later, and within 5 minutes, 3 does walked out maybe 50 yards away to go eat that freshly cut hay.

I was helping another landowner cut wood in the middle of the Wisconsin rifle season years ago (They cut wood all the time). We had been cutting wood (with chainsaws) for about 20 minutes, when out of the woods walked a nice 8 point buck. He grabbed his gun from the truck and shot the buck who was just standing on the field edge watching us.

The one thing these do have in common though, is these were all noises these deer heard often. They were very used to tractors running around those farms, and chainsaws cutting up down trees etc… I’ve also seen the opposite. My dad shot a 191 buck during the WI rifle season years ago. We both got in the woods well before daylight, because we knew the rest of the hunting party would be going out later, so we anticipated that their late arrival (they used atvs, we didn’t) could kick deer our way.

We heard the atv go by in the open field above us, not 2 minutes later, that big buck came from the direction the ATV had went on a trot. He was moving with a purpose, to get away from that atv/people. I chalk some of that up to him being an old dominant buck, who had played the game before. I’m guessing him being as savy as he was, he would move undetected almost any time he heard those noises. Does and smaller (even regular shooter bucks), didn’t seem as phazed by it.

So, after all that, if I lived on the property and could spend time getting from place to place via atv, or walking certain trails etc… I would. I just don’t know how much good it does though, if you’re only there for limited time. I think that a weekend of exposure, then a few weeks without would be more confusing than anything.

Ah, a real sore spot with me. I would love to and have wanted for many years to try a low pressure approach on our 240 acre farm. The reality is, it just isn’t going to happen. Our farm isn’t just a deer hunting property. it’s also duck camp, turkey camp, a summer hang out and chore camp among other things. It just isn’t feasible to expect nothing to happen on the property except deer hunting and foot travel only.

Dad is an avid duck hunter. He has buddy up all fall to duck hunt. Part of that is taking the wheelers from the cabin to the lake to hunt ducks. He is also very proud of the farm he worked his tail off to purchase, and rightfully so. So after a duck hunt Dad and the buddies tour the property via ATV.

Other than the 17 acre sanctuary, you can get to just about every part of the property via ATV. Convenient yes, but maybe a little too convenient.

I also do a lot of food plot work during the late summer and fall. This means ATV and tractor travel thru the property. Bottom line, low pressure ain’t happening.

In the last couple years I have changed my theory to “just do what we do” and the deer will figure it out and act accordingly. That seems to be exactly what they do. I can sit in stand and have someone come by on a wheeler and 5-10 minutes later have deer come by walking a trail. I have even had deer near me when I am in stand, the wheeler comes by and they stand motionless and watch. Once the wheeler has passed they go about their normal routine.

Mature bucks can be different or a little more conservative, but they too will learn the behavior and adapt. I have watched mature bucks thru my binos across a field, they are watching an ATV drive along the wood line a couple hundred yards away. Once the danger has passed they continue with feeding and don’t give it another thought.

Bottom line is you have do what works for you on your property. Sometimes the approach you want just isn’t going to work.

I have to wonder does the ultra-low pressure approach ultimately lead to deer that are more skittish and harder to hunt? Essentially, it trains the deer to expect zero human interaction and therefore ANY detection of human presence sends them fleeing because the slightest hint of humans = run for your lives.

The theory is the opposite, that an undisturbed deer is at ease in his castle and therefore as easy to hunt as he’ll ever get. But is the opposite really what ends up happening?

Sticker, I have a similar situation to yours. I just like messing around on my property, so I guess that’s why I’ve been looking for a way to have my cake and eat it too.

This year, I’ve noticed that we had so much of a presence established that if the deer were in the food plots, they would “head for the exit” but instead of leaving in a tizzy, they would stop right by the exit door and wait. If the ATV or tractor moved on by, they would watch it, and then resume feeding when it was gone, but clearly keep track of it in the distance. It was definitely a thing that they wanted to keep track of, but IMO the meaning of it seems to have changed.

Grouse

I see it both ways. For the fun of it, I am going to hang a sweaty shirt by my deer cams all summer to see what happens. Guys do it all summer long baiting bear (along with rags doused with bug spray) for years. I had a friend that every night would take a ice cream bucket of corn to his stand (73 steps from his front door). Dump the corn, light up a smoke and leave when the cig was done. For hunting he would climb up in his stand, light a smoke and the deer would come cruising in. He shot more big bucks than you can shake a stick at.

think I have been making deer hunting way to complicated…..

I bow hunt some of the cleanest woods in Stearns county. They are that clean because the land owner is constantly working and cleaning up his little slice of heaven. I have been on stand and had deer all over the place unbothered while he was chainsawing and running his tractor a few hundred yards away. Additionally at my office in EP the deer are so tame to humans, they let you get super close and even then just keep a 10-20 yard distance while in plain view. So the human presence conditioning is certainly real imo, and possibly better than low pressure.

I am somewhere in the middle. My main farm that I hunt, I live on year round and its only 30 acres. 16 of which is AG field , and maybe 6 is my yard and buildings.. Are the deer used to my coming and going.. yes.. but they dont memorize my schedule. I bump them almost daily, and they still run out of sight. I still fire the diesel truck up every morning at 5 am and come home every night around sundown. But because of the routine “pressure” , it is very seldom that they deer BED on my property, only in bad blizzards will they hold up in my trees. This is everyday, twice a day for 2 years… and they still interpret the truck as danger and flee.

I think Does and Fawns condition really quickly and are more tolerant of disruption, but big Mature bucks I think, aside from metro populations, will not stand for continued human disturbance. Its impossible to say anything with 100% confidence with deer because some of deer’s habits are individual. But if you surveyed upper Midwest deer hunters I think a majority would agree that repeated human disturbance deters mature bucks movements.

Obviously I am trying to “buck” the trend, no pun intended. I am trying to get mature bucks on my tiny property with continued human disturbance via FOOD and DOES (during rut). Every buck will throw caution to the wind in certain circumstances. That is what I am playing on.

But there is a reason why the bucks have vacated my property for property up the road half mile after the rut. I see them all out there scavenging a disc over corn field for tiny morsels, instead of eating my standing beans and my corn field. Its because they dont get human interference over there. They feel comfortable there during day light.

This conditioning plan has alot of grey area to it. My buddy and I argue this one all the time. He is a 4 wheeler guy, and gets nice pictures of bucks 95% of the past legal time. So he’s got nighttime pictures he thinks hes doing good and the bucks dont mind him tearing around on his 4wheeler “scouting”. I dont think just because you have bucks on your camera after legal shooting time, that they are “conditioned” to your 4 wheeler or truck. Unless the mature buck shows during legal time within range and is either KILLED OR PASSED… he still has the upper hand IMO. He has you figured out. He knows that 99% of the time if I show up after dark I never get any humans around to spook me.

I am trying to do it, but my definition of “conditioned” for my individual situation. .would be Mature bucks showing up during legal time pretty frequently. Which is not the case as of right now.

This is a very interesting TOPIC.. good one GROUSE!
I think overall it is EXTREMELY situational and depends on each guys individual deer herd how much they will put up with.

GROUSE,
To your question that sparked this thread from the TRAIL CAMERA POST…

I try to limit my time at the cameras when I check them because my property is so small that my best travel routes and pinch points.. (are just that..the best spots) So alot of the camera locations is also where I have my stands. So that is the reason I dont like to linger around the cameras leaving alot of scent there.

Great conversation Grouse, through the years I am becoming a believer in the conditioning approach. We have adopted taking guys to stands via truck or ATV and same with picking up. I believe that’s what several of the “pro/tv” hunters do as well. They often talk about checking trail cams every day, how can anyone possibly check cameras every day and maintain low pressure? Good read

sktrwx2200 wrote:

But there is a reason why the bucks have vacated my property for property up the road half mile after the rut. I see them all out there scavenging a disc over corn field for tiny morsels, instead of eating my standing beans and my corn field. Its because they dont get human interference over there. They feel comfortable there during day light.

Excellent post Skt.

The part I’m quoting brings up an interesting question for me.

First a bit of background for those who don’t know. If I’m recalling correctly, Sktrw’s home place that he references in his post is in far North Western Iowa, just across the boarder from South Dakota.

So in an area that is as relatively sparsely populated as this, I’d have to wonder bucks will ever allow themselves to be conditioned to more human interaction?

In the area where my property is, it’s very difficult for the deer to AVOID people. The farms are smaller, closer together, and most are cattle operations so there is a lot more daily human activity working cattle than there is in areas where it’s mainly rowcrop farming.

I’d have to wonder if there just isn’t enough contact possible because, basically, total avoidance is so easy?

Grouse

To sktrwx2100 point, there could be other reasons the deer vacate your property post rut as well, primarily cover. Post rut, the leaves are all down and the ground cover is non-existent. If they move to your neighbor’s I would tend to say it’s more for the cover than the pressure you have put on during the rut. just my .02 worth. Plus, it sounds like you might only have 8-10 acres of woods, big mature bucks tend to be solitary animals in the fall and that size of woods may not be enough to give a buck his comfort zone. Hard saying without knowing more about it.

I think both have their place, depending on the specific ‘environment’ of the property in question. I grew up on and mainly hunt on the patchwork wooded/farmland ‘coulee’ country of western wisconsin. It will never be as isolated as say the big Northwoods and deer/human interactions will happen. Can it hurt to go real low impact, probably not, but in an area like that I just don’t think you have anything to loose by giving up a little ‘impact’ for the added opportunities/information operating a little more dangerously shall we say will provide. I’ve tried going both options and honestly I’ve not seen any adverse effects by being more ‘active’ in/around the woods versus years I’ve not been. The best year I ever had for seeing big bucks I was probably more active than any other. At the same time the area is a patchwork of 40 to 200 acre properties so there are more people than just my own family interacting with the same deer.

I have next to no experience hunting it the more remote areas like norther wi/mn, but I have a hunch it would be much harder to ‘condition’ deer up there who are not used to the occasional human interaction. So in a situation like that, perhaps low impact is the way to go. But I really can’t speak intelligently on big woods deer hunting.

EyeHunter wrote:

FULL DISCLOSURE… I’m not sure this works for bucks, I’ve never drove the ATV or walked up on a buck, all does. Although we had 15+ different bucks on camera this fall. Seems the bucks are mostly nocturnal due to the pressure.

I would agree, from what I’ve seen on cams at my place, the buck movement for most of the year is independent of either approach. 95% of the time, when we get a big boy on camera outside of the rut, it’s at night. As far as I can tell, the bucks simply prefer to move at night not because of what I’m doing, but because that’s just how they roll. There is no more or no less daytime movement on my property since I’ve started trying to condition the deer to more presence.

Overall, I think that the bucks are going to do what they do. This past season was the first season that I had good numbers of deer on my property and my observation was that if the does are there, sooner or later the bucks will be there. We had a 6 pointer with one side broken off that we had never seen on cams show up this season and start calmly eating in a food plot at 10:30 AM on a Sunday during the firearms season. He wasn’t showing any signs of being freaked out or having been chased. This is a buck that should have “known better” than to be strolling around in broad daylight during the season, but there he was. I’d have to think this was a 2.5 year old at least so he’d have survived 3 seasons.

Bucks in my areas just seem to do what they do and there’s no predictable way to pattern anything during the season and the rut.

Grouse

Grouse
“First a bit of background for those who don’t know. If I’m recalling correctly, Sktrw’s home place that he references in his post is in far North Western Iowa, just across the boarder from South Dakota.”

You are pretty close Grouse, But actually you’ve got it backwards. Actually I live in Extreme SE SOUTH DAKTOA, and NW Iowa is right across my river frontage property. I can throw a rock over into Iowa.

You theory on sparse population may have some traction. But I live on a section that has roughly 7 acreages in about a 500 acre area. Some larger than others, all maybe 30-100 acres in size. But I suppose compared to you guys that is very sparse! haha.

Pete,
Yes it is true that I do not have “sanctuary” bedding cover on my property. But my river frontage timber on my farm is connected on both sides by more timber that runs along the river to the north and south. Where the deer go the ground is pretty close to mine, same river frontage timber type ground that meets harvested ag fields. Only difference is that MY ground has alot of food available and more human traffic. They may be better thermal cover up there or some other factors that I am not aware of.

Im with you EYEHUNTER.. Bring in as many does as you can.. and then once the BUCKS show up, hunt them hard during the rut and see how the chips land at the end of the year. I think thats about all I can do on my small farm. Its a very fun and challenging process.

We go the “shared” land route with the animals. We run wheelers, lawn mowers, bikes, etc. from March through October on our 300 acres (back to 9000+ acres of state forest) in Northern MN. We target, skeet, pistol shoot all year. Lost of kids running around screaming also. Deer come in almost every day to the back field (100 yds from the fire pit) and don’t seem to care. A few of us hunt out on the public land where we run the trails all year also.

Old, but an interesting topic. If deer were truly bothered by human scent our ladies wouldn’t be howling about deer eating their tulips or the vegetable garden. I do think that deer might use some odors people drag into the woods with them to “keep track of where this person I smell” actually is and most often its an odor associated with breathing and, well we have to breathe, so it cannot be covered up. Onions, garlic, alcohol and several other ingestibles metabolize slowly and are worn on the breath for several hours, maybe even a couple days after consuming and can be a way for a deer to pin-point exactly where the person is even though the person is fully camoed and wrapped in scent guard and thirty feet up a tree…..the person still has to breathe.

I honestly think that deer won’t pay much attention to a person in the woods if the person doesn’t broadcast where he is with odors caused by last night’s dinner or party time. Deer are social animals that exists in the midst of humans, but like humans, can smell things that are not a part of daily life, like garlic laced breath or breath full of alcohol after a bender. I think more known and unknown shooting opportunities have been lost to bad breath than any other single element in the scent thing with deer and deer hunting. You can manage property to minimize human scent. You can dress from head to foot in clothing to cover any odor from smelly feet to arm pit sweat, but you cannot cover up what comes from inside you thru the breath. Maybe that great Italian pasta dinner or two bowls of chili is more of a problem than you think. Maybe those four drinks after dinner are going to come back on you. Do you really know?

I love garlic and onions but I don’t handle them well and will carry them for a couple days. I know this so I avoid onions and garlic like the plague for a week before and during the entire season unless I have filled my tags. I’ve had a couple too many instances in the stand where all the stars lined up but the deer still stopped and stared a hole in me well out of range with me knowing that the garlic was to blame. Humans have everyday smells that deer get accustomed to but if your friends can smell your breath full of garlic or alcohol imagine what a deer will smell and just how far away the deer might detect it, wind or no wind.

You can cover up a world of scent but you still have to breathe.

I am convinced they know what I smell like and have been doing a lot this year with plots, trail maintenance and spraying gly. They do not care at all when I’m working. They actually seem curious to what we are up to. Use to try to be stealthy, but when you think about it, anything involving management isn’t stealthy at all imo. Now I just do what needs to be done when weather and time allow, even pre and in season. It matters to big bucks I’m sure, but last year had a hot doe on the property and it didn’t matter I’d been in the area brush hogging like a crazy man the weekdays right before opening weekend. The bigger bucks were out in daylight hour’s chasing her around the same day I was working and the rest of the week. Totally convinced they know what happens a week or two after the ground gets worked and seeded. Mowers, diesel tractor, multiple atvs, camp fires, generator noise, sighting in guns, they stay in close proximity to the plots. We have an infinite amount of security cover, water and food, so that play’s a huge role. In area’s with minimal security cover or food it’s probably way different.

Good topic!

But……….
—- if I have a carbon mask over my mouth, take the scent free vitamins daily, shower and soap down with scent free soap, dry off with a scent free towel, use scent killer spray, chew the scent killer gum, use cover scent on my boots, use the scent free body lotion, and use scent killer intermediately throughout the sit…. will the deer still be able to tell I ate spaghetti and garlic bread the 20 hours before???

But seriously..I think alot of guys give the deer too much credit.. Yes they have a great nose.. but they aren’t in-tuned specifically to garlic scent, or onion, or alcohol. ANYTHING that is unnatural will raise the flag of caution. If you are there frequently enough with your onion sandwich they will soon learn that onion breath poses no danger to them, until that onion breath sends a slug though their rib cage that is.

Conditioned deer or not…play the wind, that is the most important thing you can do. Its your #1 friend and #1 enemy. Try to stay as scent free as you can in regards to your body, your clothes, and your equipment. Also the Ozonics unit that I bought last year worked amazing. Also the dry wash system with the ozonics was very impressive as well. That system has allowed me to be more aggressive in regards to hunting “marginal” wind, or the times they come from a direction im not expecting.

On our past and present property which are rural and would be un-disturbed all year if it wasn’t for us go the conditioning route. It works but haven’t tested as how the low impact style would work. we camp on our property for deer season, at night we play cards park the trucks next to the cabin, friends and family will swing by so lots of noise and smell. I think if we were to continue to conduct deer camp in this manner with the low impact style of land management we would more than likely see less deer. We will see how this works with our new property that borders approximately 1,500 acres of tax forfeited land that is open to public hunting but does not seem to get pressured too much.