Line for eyes in current on a spinning reel

Good buddy Kendall(KWP) and I had a discussion on fishing lines for river eyes tonight. I told him about the tv show (next bite) where Kav eye ez and King were winter fishing red wing with plastics and Brett says that mono is key for his system, for the main reason that it allows him to know when his jig is on bottom(which I agree with). This is where a lot of questions were raised by Ken about pros/cons of different line types and which truly is the best. I know some of this has been covered before but most posts on this board broach subjects which have already been discussed ad infinitum. Here we go.

Superline/Braid: best casting distance,thin, best tight line sensitivity, no stretch, most freeze up in cold weather. We both agreed that nanofil is the best superline out there for walleye fishing the river. It casts farther than any other common braid and does not freeze up like any other braid we’ve tried. If someone says powerpro or 832 is a better line, they simply haven’t fished nanofil. I’m not saying the other lines are bad, but that nanofil does it better.

Mono: Elastic, larger diameter, less sensitive.

I’ve done a lot of river walleye angling since 2012 and have used many different lines. Like most equipment decisions in the sport of fishing, much of it comes down to what the individual angler is most comfortable and confident in. When it comes to fishing plastics the bite is not very subtle. I don’t think the sensitivity of braid makes any difference detecting bites. I do believe on nights when the fish and not overly aggressive using braid will lead to many “short strikes” which in reality are caused by a walleye approaching a bait, flaring its gills, and attempting to suck it in, which does not happen because the bait is held back by the line. With mono the elasticity allows the bait to enter a fishes mouth, even during a non-aggressive strike. The largest advantage with braid we could come up with is the ability to bomb long casts, even with relatively light jigs which are the norm during this type of fishing. Not every cast needs to travel the proverbial “country mile,” but during a long day/night of fishing there will most likely be times when some extra distance on your cast will be the difference between catching and not catching a fish.
I told KWP how I’ve read from other IDO’ers that they prefer mono for river eyes because it allows the jig to sweep better in the current. He brought up that in swift currents braid seems to cut the water better and allow a lure to get down to the fish faster. At this point I felt like we were going around in circles.

In conclusion I am pretty sure KWP sticks with straight nanofil on his plastics rod. I myself throw nano about 90% of the time or more(10 or 12lb. test). It is strong stuff and I bet I’ve caught over 1000 walleyes on it and broken it on a fish very few times(too lazy or cold to retie). That being said I often have a mono rod laying around simply to get a different drop speed, for those rare nights when it seems the nano is costing me hookups, if I’m dragging two lines and want to experiment, etc. I’ve bought some good 6lb. mono I’ll be tossing a lot in three months so perhaps I’ll make some new revelations. Thoughts and experiences from other good members on this site are encouraged and appreciated.

C.daddy,
Nice long post and decussion.
For vert jigging I’m pretty much an 8
pound mono person. And I do not use braid for
that any longer. Early Spring before the water
gets a little color in it, and is at it’s clearest,
6 lb mono would be preferred for pitching, dragging,
and vert. jigging over the 8 pound.
On casting light jigs I feel the most important
factor is having an XL fast tip rod. A fish inhales a
jig with a stiffer rod, the lure won’t be inhaled
nearly as far as if an XL tip rod is used. Extra Fast tip Rod
easily flexes with the bite, and the bait will be
further inhaled. ( I”ve learned that the hard way).
Jack

Braid just isn’t a choice for me in winter. Went through many different lines and 6# sensation is far above any other line out there for cold weather fishing.

I put back braid on a mlxf I picked up earlier this year and still haven’t got use to it. I feel like I do get alot of short strikes, and the wrapping around your rod tip, the lure, etc can be maddening.

At this point I feel braid offers absolutely no advantage when it comes to bite detection, and may even hinder with the short strikes. But what it does do is offer excellent feel for the bottom, which correlates to less lost lures(which gets more time in the strikzone), detecting how well your baits are trolling (weeds, bottom, etc), and the way it allows to present a bait (such as blades)

For these reasons only braid sticks around for me.

Edit: I should add I’ve watched that episode maybe a couple dozen times so far, and Mr.King chooses mono because it allows the bait to flutter naturally in the water. Like you mentioned braid tends to cut more, and mono will sort of hover it above bottom with the buoyancy that comes from the line. Such an awesome episode, found some spots locally similar to that they were fishing and going to give it a go this late fall.

nhamm wrote:

Braid just isn’t a choice for me in winter.

For these reasons only braid sticks around for me.

Huh?

Braid for me on a softer tip rod. Pretty tough to go back to mono. Some guys like mono because they say braid sinks to fast in low current. Beef up the braid in size.

Looking forward to trying Nanofil this fall.

My biggest problem with braids and superlines is that it’s too hard to see and detect a bad spot or nick in the line. It also seems to rot on the reel. I watched my Fin-tech pro staff partner try to tie knot after knot using Fireline and see the line pull apart in his hand lightly pulling a knot tight. That’s not where you want to be on a tourney night. It’s so much easier to see and feel any bad spot on any mono line and definitely know when it’s time to retie.

Get spooled on a snag dragging and that braid/superline just got expensive. Re-spooling mono is just a couple bucks.

I fish in a pretty snarly river system and even with all that junk 6# Hi-Seas Grand Slam mono has been more than adequate and the smaller diameter cuts current fine to get me straight down and quickly on the bottom even on the toughest days.

crawdaddy wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>nhamm wrote:</div>
Braid just isn’t a choice for me in winter.

For these reasons only braid sticks around for me.

Huh?

Braid goes away in winter BC it freezes up, and fish activity gets lower by the day and want a line to stretch in case that Gill flare ain’t what it use to be in summer/fall. Haven’t used nano yet, might try it out.
But in summer it has its attributes as pointed out, which I use it for still.

I tend to use more of the super lines when I vertical jig but when I am casing or trolling I really prefer the mono. I tend to be more “touch” than sight when I jig straight up and down and the braid helps with feeling the hits. I will not use braid with any kind of float.

Lines can be a real fussy topic and in the end I honestly think that everyone should rig according to personal preferences for each situation that fishing brings to them. I know, I know…..lots of spare spools for reels or lots of rods to carry each rigged differently. If I plan a crappie trip I will always have at least one rod set-up with braid along with three doing mono. If I am going to the river digging for sauger or walleye I will likely be bringing five rods: two with braid, 2 with mono and one for crappies with mono….just in case.

For crappies, braid to me means #3 or #4 Nanofil. The river and walleyes will see either power pro 8/2 or 832 in 6 pound. Crappies see spinning gear 100%, while my vertical jigging reels/rods for walleye/sauger are casting.

crawdaddy wrote:

I do believe on nights when the fish and not overly aggressive using braid will lead to many “short strikes” which in reality are caused by a walleye approaching a bait, flaring its gills, and attempting to suck it in, which does not happen because the bait is held back by the line.

nhamm wrote:

want a line to stretch in case that Gill flare ain’t what it use to be in summer/fall

So you believe a walleye’s gill flare is strong enough to stretch the mono and get the bait into their mouth? I’m not too sure about that, I feel the mono stretch comes into play once the bait is in their mouth, the stretch delays the hookset enough for them to get a hook in the lip where braid wouldn’t. Gill flare could impact if there is slack in the line, but that wouldn’t matter between braid or mono.

It could be more the mono tends to bow up in the water a little bit or not have as much of a direct straight-line connection, either way I think we can agree mono generally allows a fish to take the bait deeper.

Great discussion!

I tend to use 6lb Fireline Crystal for braid on the river and really like. For crappie and some eye applications, I switch to 6lb Sensation mono and really like that too. It’s plenty strong as I’ve caught gigantic sheephshead and northern with it. And pretty sensitive. Tom, what lb test for mono do you use for crappie?

One drawback to me with braid/mono for jigging on the river is it can be a pain to retie braid when you’re in a hurry. Beyond that, I like both and it’s sorta how you feel that particular day.

shockers wrote:

Great discussion!

Agreed

BigWerm wrote:

So you believe a walleye’s gill flare is strong enough to stretch the mono and get the bait into their mouth?

Going off the OP, in cold water, absolutely.

We have all seen some of those engorged pool 4 walleyes, even pool 2 as well come winter time. Stuffed to the freaking gills! So awesome! But that tells me these fish ain’t chasing down no pods of baitfish. They are just to fat, plain and simple. They are chilling along bottom, seeing a dead or dying baitfish swim by them and say, heck why not just get a taste. They flare em up and down it goes. Much different attack than summer/fall.

In the end will either line work, for sure. But these discussions are about the fine tuning and if a guy were to fine tune I would say this is one of them circumstances.

I agree that superlines can cut current better than their equal pound monos. But, if fishing for eyes with a jig plastic combo and the current is really going, I am probably fishing in the wrong spot.

FDR

shockers wrote:

Great discussion!

Tom, what lb test for mono do you use for crappie?

4 pound 99% of the time. I have a spool with some 3 pound ice mono that gets some use if I drop into the 1/64 or 1/80 ounce size jigs under a float but that doesn’t happen often. My line is always clear and always XL. I change out line often depending upon the amount of use. In an average season a 1000 yard spool of 4 pound XL is just enough to make it. Another 4 pound line I like is Vanish crystal clear as long as all I am doing is casting without a float or some quicky vertical jigging stuff. Vanish can develop issues if jigging hard a lot so it only has a specific window with me but at times its very useful.

Thanks for the info!

I swore off Vanish after my lures kept ‘vanishing’. But I might try 4lb Sensation for crappies at some point. Thinking in current it might get the jig down a bit better than 6lb.

I allways run 6-8 lb mono.I run braid on one heavier rod for trolling crankbaits,even then I find that if Im not running a bait that digs deep and pulls hard I will go back to a rod with mono.The more snags with less recoveries starts to get spendy,I can fill a reel a few times with a 300 yrd spool of mono for 7-8$.I have a tougher time tying a knot with braid as well,its more time consuming being as its so limber just a p.i.a for me I guess.Just never cared much for braid since I first used it years ago.

I use 6 lb Nanofil all winter. I used to use Suffix but made the switch a couple years back and haven’t found anything better. I fish pretty extreme temps and it doesn’t freeze as bad as other lines. I can hardly wait to get out there this winter. Plastics all the way!

I don’t like using braid if I’m fishing somewhere snaggy because breaking a jig off with 12 lb braid on is a pain in the ass. Most of my river fishing is pitching jigs to wingdams and rock piles though, I lose a lot of jigs.

philtickelson wrote:

I don’t like using braid if I’m fishing somewhere snaggy because breaking a jig off with 12 lb braid on is a pain in the ass. Most of my river fishing is pitching jigs to wingdams and rock piles though, I lose a lot of jigs.

Completely agree.

Grab some 6lb mono, tie it on with a modified Alberto and the mono breaks away from lure every time. Used 8# mono but 6 is strong stuff, and 8 can be a biatch to break off as well. I have 8#PP to 6# sensation and works really well. You can dwindle down the mono from breakoffs all day long.

Must use 12 wraps of the braid though, with that small of diameter. I said in some other post I didn’t have issues using less wraps, well I did, and has been solved.

shockers wrote:

Thanks for the info!

I swore off Vanish after my lures kept ‘vanishing’. But I might try 4lb Sensation for crappies at some point. Thinking in current it might get the jig down a bit better than 6lb.

I don’t have good luck with the sensation. lol

Vanish is a strange line. I used to spool 6 pound Vanish on my Lake Superior casting rod [spinning reel] and it seemed to work ok but it was prone to scuffing pretty bad. I had to constantly cut and re-tie and that of course meant more new line and Vanish is not cheap. I tried 8 pound Vanish and that was where headaches really took of and on the trip that the Vanish came off I could only find XL to go back on and I have been using the xl on that rod ever since. As mentioned, I do have a crappie rod or two spooled with light Vanish, I think 4 pound but it could be 3 pound too, and when the real light jigs come out so do those rods. The Vanish aids in getting them down fairly fast after the line has been wetted.

crawdaddy wrote:

In conclusion I am pretty sure KWP sticks with straight nanofil on his plastics rod.

You are right, I am pretty much 100% Nanofil on any river spinning rod for Walleyes. I have tried Flour., Mono, and all the braids and nothing seems to work as well as Nanofil. I do agree that whatever PowerPro and 832 do, Nanofil does it better. The casting distance Nanofil has over the every other line is such superior. Also, because it doesn’t have “woven strands” it doesn’t have the extra surface area for ice to build up and freeze like PowerPro and 832.

I know many pros/cons have been discussed using super lines but for me the ease of casting light 3/32 oz. jig heads with Nanofil is such a huge plus.

One note on Nanofil that hasn’t been discussed is the breaking strength is what the line is rated for. For example, 10 lb Powerpro or FireLine might break at 14 to 15 lbs, while 10 lb Nanofil will break at 10 lbs (slightly less after tying a knot). Also, with Naofil you need to tie the “Nanofil knot” or double loop palomer knot.

I think I might experiment more this Fall and try to use both mono and Nanofil. Maybe even on the same wingdam when the fishing is good too.

Great discussions though….

KWP….Are you noticing any issues at all with Nano in the 8 or 10 pound weights? Maybe it was just something that was present in the line when it was introduced but the lines above 6 pound for me were miserable….stiff, broke way too easy for the weight rating, wanted to walk off the spool in multiple coils. The lighter lines I had zero issues. I do have one walleye jigging rod that carries 6 pound Nano and it is as carefree as the lighter stuff I use for crappie jigging vertically or for throwing the super lightweight heads and plastics of 1/64 to 1/80.

I like Nano for the reasons you’ve mentioned but have just shied away from heavier than six pound for the reasons I mentioned. For sensitivity I don’t think any braid can equal what Nano offer in a comparable weight and if the issues I had early on with lines in the 8 to 10 pound range have been resolved I’ll give the Nano a go again on those rods. The cold performance of Nano puts the braids to bed.

Tom Sawvell wrote:

KWP….Are you noticing any issues at all with Nano in the 8 or 10 pound weights? Maybe it was just something that was present in the line when it was introduced but the lines above 6 pound for me were miserable….stiff, broke way too easy for the weight rating, wanted to walk off the spool in multiple coils.

No, I haven’t noticed any problems you mentioned above. I have had 10lb Nanofil spooled on 2 reels for 2 years now. The only issue I have noticed with it is the occasional line wrap around the tip but this is common with all braids/superlines.

One comment on it’s perceived weakness or ease of breaking is you need to upsize the strength you normally use with other lines. For some reason, Berkley rated Nanofil at its line strength and others (ie. fireline) break at higher forces.

The other comment on nanofil is you must use the Nanofil knot. I have had a few knots slip when I tied the regular Palomer knot.

Are you guys using the superlines using a mono leader or do you directly tie to the bait?

I have now decided that I’ll always use a mono or floro leader with the nanofil. It seems the line to line knot strength is much better than the line to lure knots.

I was actually using it for Lake Superior thru the ice but I’ve removed all of it. I had too many issues with it icing up but the real issue is when you peel the ice off your line. It frays the line really badly.

I haven’t had this issue after I switched to a true braid.

I wouldn’t say Nano sucks by any means but I also wouldn’t say that Nano is better than every other braid in every way possible.
It certainly isn’t better than many other braids when it comes to knot strength.

Concerning knots, it does take some getting used to since are going to be using or tying knots somewhat different with Nano than with other braids.

I’ve haven’t used it enough to really know all I need to know about it yet but for sure, its going to be getting more time on more of my reels in the future.
One other thing I’ve noticed in my limited use so far is that Nano does not appear to be as durable nor does it have as much abrasion resistence as other top brands such as power pro or sufix 832.

Brad you rascal,any type of line will draw water through the guides. Keep using that cheap stren braid. It’s really limp. I always get a chuckle when you’re down in the bottom of the boat picking at a birds nest for 30 minutes because of a wind knot. Meanwhile I’m corking fat walleyes on nanofil. Don’t seem to remember losing any to break offs or bad knots though. Hmmmmmm.

crawdaddy – this quote was taken from you post above.

crawdaddy wrote:

I myself throw nano about 90% of the time or more(10 or 12lb. test). It is strong stuff and I bet I’ve caught over 1000 walleyes on it and broken it on a fish very few times(too lazy or cold to retie).

I realize any line, braid or other, can & will break when you neglect to retie when you really know you should.
My point with Nanofil is that when if comes to abrasion resistance, what I’ve already seen is that you will need to retie more often than you would with other quality braids.
And although I haven’t had to replace a spool of Nanofil yet, I’m betting Nanofil users will need to replace there line more often than PP or 832 users, which is going to make it a more expensive line to use.

No question in my mind though that Nanofil has a place in my arsenal. One area where I don’t see Nanofil replacing Sufix 832 is in vertical jigging or dragging. Not saying Nanofil doesn’t work for both of these techniques, just saying from what I’ve seen so far, it hasn’t proven to be better.

On Lake Wisconsin we have a fair if not a lot of snags. With 10# 832, I can back up and get most of my jigs & blades back with that 10# 832. So far, I have not seen that same return with 12# Nanofil.

For casting to shallow water, I’m not going to go in there and try and get my jig back anyway. This is where I really like not just the casting distance that Nanofil gives me but the ease of casting it also means my accuracy is generally better.

Joel I agree with you on the abrasion resistance. Nanofil does fray easily. Pounding wingdams on the mississippi I’ll retie about twice on a 5 hour trip. For jigging or dragging I would see most super lines being damn near identical. Nanofil would be better below 32 degrees though. I guess when the weather gets cold they put the boats away on lake wisconsin.

crawdaddy wrote:

Nanofil would be better below 32 degrees though. I guess when the weather gets cold they put the boats away on lake wisconsin.

Definitely not. I love fishing right up till ice up.
I have not fished Nanofil in really cold weather yet but I have fished several
other braids and most of them are just flat out terrible in below freezing weather so I look forward to using one that works well.