It’s not the fault of the people who bought the guns or used them, it’s the manufacturers and retailers fault again evidently!!! I can’t stand this BS
https://kstp.com/kstp-news/top-news/ellison-to-announce-legal-action-for-gun-trafficking/
I share your frustration. And what is he doing to ensure the actual criminals are put behind bars? zip, zero, nada. What a crock!
He’s got to do something to draw attention away from the feeding our future scandal, if you haven’t looked that one up yet, check out ALL the other names besides Aimee Bock. I’m sure they’re living a luxurious lifestyle back in the Middle East somewhere
I have sold literally thousands of firearms in my years working in gun retail…I can about guarantee I have unknowingly completed straw sales on dozens, if not hundreds. It’s not impossible to detect, but it’s not easy unless they buy them all the time…I have turned down many suspected straw sales, some involving police arresting the individual for assault after being rejected by my sales staff. It happens way more often than you think.
Honestly, 80%’s pose a greater risk than straw sales do IMO. The new 80% law did almost NOTHING to stop the production of them.
I hope he loses this fall. Never liked him.
It’s not the fault of the people who bought the guns or used them, it’s the manufacturers and retailers fault again evidently!!! I can’t stand this BS
I share your frustration. And what is he doing to ensure the actual criminals are put behind bars? zip, zero, nada. What a crock!
Looks like all the purchasers referenced have been dealt with already 
Gabriel Lee Young-Duncan, 27, pleaded guilty Wednesday in U.S. District Court to one count of conspiracy to make false a statement in the purchase of a firearm.
Horton, who was arrested shortly after the Oct. 10 shootout at the St. Paul food hall and bar that killed a bystander and injured 15 people, was charged in the scheme on Oct. 20 and pleaded guilty March 3.
Elwood was sentenced last month to a year and a half in prison after pleading guilty to helping straw purchase close to 100 firearms. Also convicted in the scheme are Jeffrey Paul Jackson and Geryiell Lamont Walker II. They were sentenced to four and five years in prison, respectively.
What a POS!
Good chance Ellison loses … at least it appears to be a race this fall.
MFF is just the flag bearer for this one. There are enough databases out there to allow larger retailers to flag and slowdown potential “straw sales” participants.
There is nothing here to impact those buying an occasional gun for themselves.
Ellison undercover at FleetFarm
Ellison needs to go…for a wide range of reasons.
Unfortunately I’ll believe he loses when I see it. Polls are well within the margin of error showing a virtual tie or miniscule Ellison lead. Let’s hope for positive change.
As more information comes out. The purchases were spread between 4 different stores. Usually 1 – 2 gun purchases. On the radio they said if you purchase more than 1 gun they are required to notify some government body. Apparently, they did that. The FBI approved all the purchases. No criminal laws were broken.
Hopefully this gets tossed by the first judge to hear this case.
Ellison desperate and needs to show the voters that he is tough on crime. With our tax dollars.
As more information comes out. The purchases were spread between 4 different stores. Usually 1 – 2 gun purchases. On the radio they said if you purchase more than 1 gun they are required to notify some government body. Apparently, they did that. The FBI approved all the purchases. No criminal laws were broken.
To me that just suggests the current laws are completely insufficient; they failed to prevent the guns winding up with criminals who used them to commit murder.
Numbnuts can’t change the law or the second Andmendment on his own so he’s going after the few box stores that are left to stop future gun sales.
The government should have a way to filter this stuff out on their own and it shouldn’t be an employee or the box stores responsibility at the time of sale.
To me that just suggests the current laws are completely insufficient; they failed to prevent the guns winding up with criminals who used them to commit murder.
Laws are only good if they are enforced. To me this isnt at all about insufficient laws, but rather an inept enforcement agency the FBI. Add this to the list of all the other failures or overreach by them.
On the radio they said if you purchase more than 1 gun they are required to notify some government body. Apparently, they did that. The FBI approved all the purchases. No criminal laws were broken.
Yes, that’s correct. There is no law that says a legal, law-abiding citizen can’t purchase more than one firearm. As long as they pass a background and mental health check, they can continue purchasing. If the FBI stepped in and said “no you can’t buy X many guns” to a legal buyer, that would be grounds for a lawsuit because its directly against the 2nd amendment. Realize that even someone on the FBI’s no-fly list as a domestic terrorist can still legally purchase a firearm. The FBI does not have legal authority to just step in and halt the sale of firearms to a legal buyer.
To me that just suggests the current laws are completely insufficient; they failed to prevent the guns winding up with criminals who used them to commit murder.
To me it suggests Ellison’s claim of “if they didn’t know they should of known these were straw purchases” is fairly baseless.
On the radio they said if you purchase more than 1 gun they are required to notify some government body. Apparently, they did that. The FBI approved all the purchases. No criminal laws were broken.
Multi-sale reports are required to be sent within 5 business days…They do not approve or deny a multi-sale. It’s done after the fact.
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Dirty Water wrote:</div>
To me that just suggests the current laws are completely insufficient; they failed to prevent the guns winding up with criminals who used them to commit murder.To me it suggests Ellison’s claim of “if they didn’t know they should of known these were straw purchases” is fairly baseless.
I’m not arguing that point at all. I think he’ll lose the lawsuit. That doesn’t change the fact that the existing laws and requirements to purchase guns in this state do not adequately deter straw purchases, which is contributing to violent crime in this state. You said it yourself, all laws were followed, yet the guns ended up with bad guys who used them to kill innocent people. If we had a system that was capable of stopping this, then the attorney general wouldn’t be wasting his time with a lawsuit against the man’s mall.
That doesn’t change the fact that the existing laws and requirements to purchase guns in this state do not adequately deter straw purchases, which is contributing to violent crime in this state.
Well, it looks like the straw purchasers were caught, convicted and sentenced to prison time. I guess it’s up to perp to decide if the current laws are a deterrent. They are for me.
I’m all in for increasing the penalties.
Increase penalties would be a start but I have a feeling it wouldn’t mean much to the victims of these crimes. You know, cuz they’re dead and all.
I’m not pretending to know the answer and I am not anti-gun. But this system isn’t working.
Increase penalties would be a start but I have a feeling it wouldn’t mean much to the victims of these crimes. You know, cuz they’re dead and all.
I’m not pretending to know the answer and I am not anti-gun. But this system isn’t working.
Sometimes there is no political solution. If you’d like to keep voting your rights away, then by all means.
I have no issue with someone owning as many guns as they desire.
In state private party gun sales are legal and I have given or sold guns to family or friends. I have also received many guns from family that no longer want the gun or via inheritance. I have NOT bought or sold a gun to someone I did not know.
Maybe some guns (example: handguns) should only be resold through someone holding a FFL.
Why should I have to go through the full background check at a retail outlet and those on the street ? well …
AG Ellison should be focused on the millions of dollars lost in fraud in our MN State Departments of ____
One of the many $tupid things about this is the person that made the straw purchases got off with a slap on the wrist. She should have been charged with the same crimes as the people who used the guns.
Another thing is that going after stores and manufacturers is the new more “subtle” forms of gun control.
What I find interesting is it’s always the guns fault. Always somebody else’s fault never the criminal. I would like to think there’s no case here but I’m worried. Think back on all looting and fires and shootings and they arrested some and then just let them back out in the streets. Ellison is just doing this to help out his re election bid as others have stated. Also the government is never at fault even though the paperwork was all filed through them. Just like building inspectors are supposed to enforce code but if they miss something or let something slide it’s on the builder, not the fact the guy that is in place by government to enforce code didn’t do his job.
Also the government is never at fault even though the paperwork was all filed through them.
This. The 4473 was designed to put the burden on the purchaser, not the seller. If they lied while answering the questions on the 4473, how is it the stores fault? There’s even language on the 4473 stating it’s the purchasers fault and they will be held liable if any questions are answered incorrectly. Good work Ellison…
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Wreaks of racism too.
Absolutely zero chance this case moves forward beyond the first hearing.
There is nothing in state or Federal law that lays out the legal requirement for how/when/why a dealer “knows or should know” that a purchaser is likely to be straw purchasing unless the buyer says or does something during the purchase process to so indicate. Which is NOT what Ellison is alleging happened in this case.
Ellison seems to be trying to say that multiple purchases alone should be combined with some kind of unspecified profiling such that a dealer should have somehow concluded straw purchasing was going on.
In other words, Ellison is saying because the purchaser was a woman and because she made multiple purchases, this forms a “profile” that they should have concluded was a straw buyer.
Ellison. Recommending the implementation of profiling. Yeah.
Absolutely zero chance this case moves forward beyond the first hearing.
There is nothing in state or Federal law that lays out the legal requirement for how/when/why a dealer “knows or should know” that a purchaser is likely to be straw purchasing unless the buyer says or does something during the purchase process to so indicate. Which is NOT what Ellison is alleging happened in this case.
Ellison seems to be trying to say that multiple purchases alone should be combined with some kind of unspecified profiling such that a dealer should have somehow concluded straw purchasing was going on.
In other words, Ellison is saying because the purchaser was a woman and because she made multiple purchases, this forms a “profile” that they should have concluded was a straw buyer.
Ellison. Recommending the implementation of profiling. Yeah.
There is precedent for a civil lawsuit like this in Badger Guns. Straw purchased guns were used to shoot policeman and the seller was sued for negligence. It did go to jury trial and they were found liable.
I also think you are missing a lot of what is being alleged. In the actual complaint the first example given is Jerome Horton, it’s not just Sarah Elwood making the purchases. There are examples in the complaint about specific “red flags” beyond just multiple purchases alone.
This would be like a liquor store being liable for legally selling beer to someone over 21 and who then gave the beer to minors who drove drunk and killed someone.
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