Future of Spear Fishing?? Your thoughts??

So I’ve kicked around the idea of adding a couple spear houses to my guide service over the past couple years. I just can’t wrap my brain around whether I am for it or against it. On one hand I like the combination of Hunting/fishing for the biggest and baddest, but on the otherhand I never keep the biggest and baddest when fishing hook and line, and am freaky when it comes to making sure the fish is unharmed. I’m always concerned about preserving the fishery, and know that even though I’m 1 angler I lead many others to the biggest and baddest fish. I personally haven’t ever Speared, but know from my love of hunting that I probably would enjoy the sport. From other more experienced guys here on IDO I’m very interested in a FRIENDLY discussion on this to see what the general viewpoints are on Spear Chucking?? Here are a couple of my questions?? If your a guy who would insist on releasing a trophy pike in the open water season would you find yourself sticking the same fish through the ice?? Do Spear Fisherman let big fish go?? Do you mount 15lb pike or do you pickle them?? I know the sport has a long rich history, and I like the Les Kouba?? Spearhouse series of prints, and know my grandpa hucked spears. What do you guys think?? For example if I promote SPEAR FISHING through my guide service we’ll kill a lot of big fish?? I’m just going to lay back and listen……..I know hard for me to do.

Chris I would think that if you offer spearing that in a few short years you would see a decline in those giant gators that we all love to see pictures of. Spear fisherman take the biggest of the pike and for a guy like you I would think that’s not a good thing. It makes me sick when I see pics of big gators with holes in them.

As you said it is hard to CPR a fish with a spear stick. Not telling others what to do but I would not…

Just set your own rules or quota and let people know before they pay and you and the fish should be fine.

Whatever you decide-but please dont post the pictures.

Scott

I spear and don’t think spearing has a great impact on the populations of pike. My reasoning is this most spearers do not take a limit and are selective about which fish they harvest. That means a spearer watches the fish he dosn’t want to harvest. They are not touched. On the other hand you set out tip ups and and land 20 pike in a day with your buds even if you release them you have mortality from hook damage putting them in the snow at 20 below or taking pics at temps that freeze slime and eyes etc. They swim away so we get a warm fuzzy feeling but no matter how careful we are some die. I love to tip up fish and do it more than spearing. I release most of the fish. But yes some die later. So a spearer takes 3 fish in a weekend. Who hurt the resource more? There are not many spearers compared to anglers. Many lakes with special pike regs and spearing bans such as Millelacs have not resulted in much of a population change. Food for thought.

Mwal

Many lakes with special pike regs and spearing bans such as Millelacs have not resulted in much of a population change. Food for thought.

Yeah look at milacs and Cass where no spearing takes place they both have a great population of giant pike then look at Winnie good luck getting big pike. What’s the diffrence betwen them? Spearing bans

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Whatever you decide-but please dont post the pictures.

Scott

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I have never speared but would like to try it, but why wouldn’t I post a picture
I love hunting and I don’t see any problem posting a picture of a harvested animal, why would a fish be differnt?
Just my to cents…thats all

The problem I have with spearing is that you can’t release a 20# pike, which is one of the most important pieces in a balanced ecosystem. Top of the line predators (i.e. large pike and muskies) have a huge impact on the population structure in a lake. Theoretically, a guy can take out a 20# pike and it’s no big deal. But if even a few guys do that every year it won’t be long until the lake becomes chock full of hammerhandles and small largemouth. I’m essentially for 100% catch and release of big pike and muskies — maybe some ridiculously high size limit would be OK.

Spearing small pike (<25″) is totally cool with me, but I imagine it’d be difficult for most people to hold back on a big pike under their toes.

In the end, I think you could have a significant negative impact on the fishery, even a big one like Rainy, by offering spearing shacks. Why introduce C&R anglers to spearing when you could introduce spearers to C&R angling?

I’m not against it, it’s a great way to get out and enjoy the winter. It’s been going on way longer than angling, so in that sense it could be considered “traditional” and part of Minnesota heritage.

As for making any money off it as a side business, somehow I gotta believe they type of guy that’s into spearing isn’t cut from the cloth that he’s going to hire someone to take him and put him in a spear-house somewhere…it really isn’t necessary. You could try it though, ya got nothing to lose.

From your posts and advertisements though, you come across as being a man on the move. Spear-houses don’t seem to fit you the way that a portable towed behind a sled/four-wheeler does. Do you think it will cramp your style?

One last comment in defense of spearing. A spearer has the ability to look down the spear hole and make the decision to spear a fish or not. He alone is in control of whether that fish lives or dies. On the other hand, an angler can do what he wants to minimize HOOKING MORTALITY, yet he is not 100% in control of whether or not he kills a fish. Not saying an angler intentionally sets out to kill a fish, but it does happen, and Mille Lacs is a perfect example of this. In addition to hooking mortality there is also the subject of proper handling of fish, letting them bang around the bottom of the boat, reeling them in from deep water too fast, keeping them out of water too long, dropping them on the gunwale of the boat upon release, eyeball holds, deep tight holds on the gill plates, etc. The list goes on and on, and although not intentional, all are examples of how fish get killed. So, if you want to make an argument for or against something you must first be sure that your method isn’t as detrimental also. And, the way I see it, spearing is harmless until the spear is actually driven into a fish. Angling is a crap-shoot, even to the most expert/knowledgable anglers out there.

This is a good post with lots of good questions. But I do agree with Castaway. Chris, if you do decide to move forward on the idea of taking out guys to spear, set your own guidelines for these guys and let them know you are strict about it. I have done my fare share of spearing and gotten a few slimers to show for it, but I’ve also watched many fish to go on and swim another day. I guess I look at it like hunting, you take your pick on what deer your going to harvest, some make it, some don’t. I know for myself, seeing a 20# pike, just like seeing a 150 class buck, would be very hard to pass up on.

If it is legal on your water…. plenty are doing it already. 15 lber, is pickled. Over 40″ on the wall. Spearing is much more “intimate” than placing a tip-up in a hole and watching for a flag. The spearhole will mesmerize after a few hours I haven’t done it in a long time, but if you never have, it is hard to describe. It is pretty close to bowhunting in a heated shelter You have to be close and you have to stay calm. Most people who spear, are harvesting 3-8 lb northerns, the giants you speak of are there, but few and far between. You will always hear about the big ones, but rarely will the 6 lber make the paper, which is the norm. They don’t get big and old by being dumb. This is probably more of a business decision for you, rather than a passion, as you have never done it before. Weigh out the positives and negatives and make the best decision for yourself. I find it hard to believe your spear guiding will diminish the Rainy too much. I would like to see a study, how many big fish die off, from natural causes, compared to harvested per year Probably some interesting numbers.

big G

Like Big G said spearing will memorize you. It is like bow hunting over a hole but almost more intense in my experience. I hope spearing never gets banned. It is a single man sport like bow hunting where you can make a good plan, have what you think is the perfect spot and nothing happens. Then you have that one day where it all comes together. I love to spear. If I had to choice I would rather spear than angle in the winter. This was the method of fishing before angling came along. I am not sure how to convince people of how intense that feeling can be. You must try it first before you make your decision.

I also would argue that because spearing has a bad rap in many anglers minds, spearing has little impact on the overall population of a lake with giants in it. Just like tip up fishing it is not everyday you see one over 40″ in fact I have never speared one over 40″ never had the chance. I have seen them blast through my hole taking my decoy and roughing in up. However I have caught with hook and line a few fish over 40″ with a trophy on the wall.

I say give it a try. You will be “hooked”. And I would come up for a guided spearing trip to try it out!

I have speared for over 30 yrs. It is my favorite winter pastime – hands down. I have hook-n-lined a lot of nice pike ….. at least a couple dozen over 15 lbs in MN. I have spent far more hours spearing than angling for pike and my biggest pike with a spear is only about 15 lbs. It isn’t as easy as the anti-spear crowd would lead you to believe.

I truly do not believe that the spearers in the state are decimating any fish populations. There just are not the numbers of people doing it. For every spear fisherman that takes a 15lb pike, there are many vacationing families from Iowa, Indiana, or wherever that kill a fifteen pound fish because it is the biggest they have ever caught.

I can think of quite a few lakes that were speared heavily for years and years and are still great pike water….. LOTW, Red, Rainy, Kab, Leech, …..all of these lakes have rich historys of spearing and they all still keep on kicking out the nice fish.

Chris – if you want to try poking something, we could probably work out a deal…….

Tim

Many interesting points brought up here, and that’s what I wanted to hear. Certainly pros and cons to be considered. There is some demand for spearhouses. I think at this point I’ll likely refer those potential customers. Yes I do understand that there isn’t as many spear fisherman as hook and line anglers, but dont’ kid yourself there are a fair amount of spear chuckers on Rainy Lake. I couldn’t tell you how many fish they harvest, or the magnitude of the fish. I will say I doubt they let big fish swim. Again I’m not necessarily for it or against it, but I think I’ll stay focused on Hook and line for now. Thanks everyone for your personal input without a bloody battle!! Nice to see people can sit on opposite sides of the fence on a issue, and keep civil.

I have tried it a few times just to see what it was all about. It is harder then people think. Very similar to bow hunting deer. Any idiot can sit in a tree, and once in a while shoot a deer, but the guys who can consistently shoot big deer have an inate ability to do the little things correctly, and this is much easier said then done. Spearing is the same way.

I am interested to hear from the spear guys how many large pike they take from a lake in any given year? My gut says it is less then you would think.

Johnny P if your out there reading this thread, I would like to hear your thoughts. I know you know just a little about Pike!!!

It’s great what catch and release has done for our fisheries. However, it has created and elitist attitude towards harvest. Whether with a spear or rod/reel or a net. I see it in myself. I’m the first to jump on someone when I see them holding a 25 inch walleye for the table.

Look at some of the responses here: “Just don’t post pics” I’m not saying we can’t have our opinions, but why shouldn’t the guys that spear lobby for hook/line boycotts on certain lakes? Spear only lakes? Seems fair, right?

In my opinion, it’s pretty sad you can’t spear in some of Minnesota’s most storied waters just because the musky fisherman have voiced their opinions the loudest. Yet, many of those same waters are netted heavily each spring and fall. I’m 100% against nets, kind of makes me a hypocrite, doesn’t it??

I haven’t speared for years, but I think it’s a great part of our sport that should be preserved. It should be allowed to evolve as have other regulations in our sport.

There are lots of things that used to be legal but no longer are including fishing with jugs and dynamite. I don’t like netting either. I protest that by never ever buying it. I might not book someone if they advertise they offer spearing. It might be fun to do but not very sporting in my humble opinion.

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It might be fun to do but not very sporting in my humble opinion.

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Not sporting? Have you ever tried it?

No I can’t say that I have.

Spearing doesn’t seem to bother the indians. Would rather see a guy with one 20lb Northern than 10 15-25lb muskies on the ice.

Myself. I don’t take many during the season. If I do take some… I gauge the size of the pike by knowing the length of my decoy. They usually line up vertically level with it in the water column before taking a snap at it. And I only take the smaller pike to pickle. I say – set a length limit if you guide a shack or two.

I love the thrill, the making of my own decoys and that final pike meal. As far as its future? Here is some worthy data. Spearing licenses sold in MN, from 2005 back to 1957. Draw your own conclusions. I hope it stays and managed well.

2 bits

– Boogs

Res Spear from Dark House Lic. sold

15,005 (2005)

15,347

17,485

18,222

16,850

19,261

18,076

16,297

19,834

15,833

18,940

20,770

17,957

21,182

21,888

23,604

24,577

24,509

30,926

34,420

27,625

32,933

29,340

36,218

40,334

43,634

38,142

39,593

37,849

52,766

37,385

43,722

39,002

40,070

40,186

37,000

36,790

45,387

49,372

47,348

46,743

53,691

47,879

46,827

55,118

52,802

54,514

54,557

50,534 (1957)

Anyone with a calculator handy?

Figure the average rate of decline of spear fisherman. Figure what year that the decline would eventually hit one.

I am currently a super sexy 39 years old… and wondering how old I will be when I am the last spear fisherman standing.

thx
-Boogs

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I am currently a super sexy 39 years old… and wondering how old I will be when I am the last spear fisherman standing.

thx
-Boogs

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Boogs – You’ll have to outlive me to be the last one…..lol.

I too would hate to see a sport so rich in tradition fall by the wayside. I make all of my own decoys and use a very old (80yrs or so) spear that is a hand-me-down. It is a pretty satisfying pasttime. I hope to be able to pass it on to my boy.

Tim

14.05 years. A deviation of R^2 at .90 is great but Thats fairly linear over 50 years

LOL!!

matt, the trend goes down, not up, but I get it, you are one smart cookie with too much time on your hands, go fishing and put some hard earned meat on the table.

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matt, the trend goes down, not up, but I get it, you are one smart cookie with too much time on your hands, go fishing and put some hard earned meat on the table.

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Would you believe I’d rather be working?!? Sure I’ve been fishing 3 of the past 6 days but trust me, its getting old. I guess in my spare time I clean fish and cook dinner Just finished cutting up 6 walleye, 10 crappie, and 12 perch,……..Now what? stare at IDO until its time to cook dinner and go over to Kooty’s for Garage Logic. Trust me, I’d rather be working