It sounds like alot of people, think laws & regulations should be disregarded in tough times….. how hungry does someones family have to be, so armed robbery would be overlooked ??? Laws and regulations are what make us a society and civilized persons. There are food shelves and the like, to help the ones who truely need it. There are also government programs such as WIC to address a starving family. I see no way around this. Poaching is poaching. TIP line 1-800-652-9093.
big G
That is where my moral delima comes in. How far past that line is OK. To me poaching an animal is not equal to armed robbery. I’m not endangering someone else’s life, but now compare that to stealing. It seems more analogous. Let’s compare shoplifting at the store to poaching the deer…
And to all those claiming to be eager to call. You do also call everytime someone doesn’t come to a full stop at an intersection, has a kid not in a child seat, eats peanuts from the bulk bin in the grocery store, speeds by you above the speed limit, and everything else right? If not I’m not real interested in hypocritical statements. Someday the poverty gods may smile upon you and yours. While I hope it doesn’t I’d be curious to know how you react when the money is gone, truck is empty of gas, and the deer is standing in the field munching your clover you paid $100 an acre to plant.
I had this exact conversation with the farmer who lets us hunt his land last weekend. This is a guy who I have known for 15 years, and hunted his land that entire time. One of the most upstanding people you could know, and I have a ton of respect for him.
The conversation came up as to why he had sold much of his farm to the state for pennies on the dollar in the mid 80’s. (for the non-farmers out there, the 1980’s KILLED small farms in this country, and many farms and families left the land) His entire herd of cattle were hit with disease that meant he could not sell ANY until they were proven clean. His crops were sold and almost every piece of equipment he owned. He said it came down to feeding his family, or selling the land for half of what it was worth. He sold eventually, but told me that he had to take matters into his own hands to feed his children a time or two.
This guy was doing everything he could to keep his life, and the only life he had ever known. His Grandfather owned the land before him, and he had to sell everything to live. He is much too proud of a man (as are many farmers) to go to a food shelf when God has provided a resource he can use while he needs it.
If this is really the situation, you need to eat. But for the guy who is shooting for horns at midnight with a spotlight, I hope he falls out of his truck and dies. 
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If you can’t make ends meet and own a 1000 acres it’s time to sell the farm and move to town, maybe better planning, saving, and budgeting is the answer?
Have you ever farmed, been in an agricultural occupation, or had to live that lifestyle personally?
I am going to assume not with the above logic. I am not slamming on you so don’t take it personal.
It sounds to me like you are slamming the farmers with how they have to live sometimes. If so, please do not eat another meal unless it was harvested with your own hands.
The farmers are some of the best budgeters, planners, and resource conservationists in the world
On paper it sure sounds easy enough to “sell the farm and move to town”. Reality is it is not that easy to do. Many farmers have owned the land for 100 years or more and it is the only life they know. You don’t just sell the farm and move to town. SOmetimes you are forced to do things that you wouldn’t normally do. I know for a fact if I were down on my luck and owned the land, I wouldn’t lose a second of sleep over shooting a deer, elk, or whatever on my land. If people wanted to call me a poacher, so be it, it would be no sweat off my back.
Actually I grew up in rural Montana and worked on a cattle ranch till I was 16 and family finances forced us to move to Minnesota, so never assume anything it makes an “[censored]” of “u” and “me” My parents never poached animals to put food on the table. I guess if the farm “can’t” be sold, SELL or PAWN THE GUN you would use to poach deer. Once you cross the line, the line just keeps moving further and further away from laws and regulations. Way I see it, a poacher is a poacher is a poacher and they give all sportsman a bad name. Admitting you are a poacher in hunters clothing just tells everyone that you are willing to bend laws and regulations that the rest of us abide by.
Just my opinion, and I’m not offended, just amazed at how many people are poachers in disguise. if a farmer is too proud to get assistance from a food shelf or the govt that doesn’t give him the right to poach. Heck a farmer should have a cow, chicken, hog, corn, beans or something around to eat right? Way I see it there is no excuse.
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I guess if the farm “can’t” be sold, SELL or PAWN THE GUN you would use to poach deer.
Give a man a fish he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish he eats for life.
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Way I see it, a poacher is a poacher is a poacher…just amazed at how many people are poachers in disguise.
We’ve already covered the letter of the law. But it is a bold statement to call us who understand what it is like to be near the brink a poacher because we want to eat. This country wasn’t developed from men in a food pantry. But I understand those who have never experienced will likely never understand it until they do.
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If a farmer is too proud to get assistance from a food shelf or the govt that doesn’t give him the right to poach. Heck a farmer should have a cow, chicken, hog, corn, beans or something around to eat right? Way I see it there is no excuse.
Again for someone who has likely never farmed, had land value drop to less than half, income drop by 20-30%, interest rates on a half million dollar loan quadruple, and all the while have the bank standing there with their hand out I understand why your hypothetical is so far off base. But again this is a situation where one needs to experience it to understand it. I honestly hope you and your family never has to feel a pinch that tight though. It is incredibly difficult to say the least.
there’s endless excuses for illegal behaviour. There is no justifable excuse. SELL THE FARM, let them forclose, rent the land to the neighbor, cmon man you know what you’re saying has affected roughly 3% of our nations population, mostly in the 80’s. so it’s not mainstream. Ironically being the jack of all trades, master of none that I am, I worked in the banking/mortgage industry as well, there’s options, you just can’t avoid the phone calls/letters. There’s 1000’s of people who have lost their house in forclosure in 2008 alone, don’t see these guys in dress clothes out poaching deer now do we? Because they have the pride and respect for others to go get PUBLIC ASSISTANCE, because they are law abiding citizens.
BTW I have been in an unemployment line before, wondering how to feed my kids. so don’t try and act like you know me, you don’t. And i made sacrifices, I sold my possessions to put food on the table, i didn’t go illegally shoot animals for food, even though i could have so thanks very much for your input, but there is right and wrong regardless of the situation. if your ethics or lack ther of will let you poach go ahead, if i see you I will turn you in, I don’t need your sob story, I have 6 kids, a wife, 2 car payments, and a mortgage, we get by at my house but it’s tight, yet I don’t poach. there is no justifable excuse to poach.
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And to all those claiming to be eager to call. You do also call everytime someone doesn’t come to a full stop at an intersection, has a kid not in a child seat, eats peanuts from the bulk bin in the grocery store, speeds by you above the speed limit, and everything else right? If not I’m not real interested in hypocritical statements. Someday the poverty gods may smile upon you and yours. While I hope it doesn’t I’d be curious to know how you react when the money is gone, truck is empty of gas, and the deer is standing in the field munching your clover you paid $100 an acre to plant.
By this statement, I will disregard anything you have to say…. I am assuming you do not call on a rolling stop either, so therefore would look upon blindly at any crime being committed. Re-read what you typed please.
Kooty, I was gonna use shoplifting, but from there, where does it escalate too ??? Plus armed robbery gets the point across with a little umph. As far as lives being endangered, if people are deer hunting(poaching) year round, I suggest every hiker/bird watcher/anbody going near a woods and their kids wear blaze orange at all times…. laws are there to protect ALL.. for various reasons…
big G
I respectfully disagree with you. Who says the state owns that deer?? If I feed it and house it all year long, shouldn’t that entitle me to some benefit?? Who are you to judge me and what I do with my land and its inhabitants??
Just playing devils advocate here.
To all, I would like to point out, in the 80’s there weren’t nearly as many programs available to help people as there are now, certainly not where I grew up anyway. So comparing the 80’s to today is just not realistic or what I had in mind for this subject I guess. Although that government cheese was some good stuff. Funny what you can make with cheese. We raised 3-500 chickens a year, had a garden and canned a ton of stuff. Just to make it through the winter. I can’t remember a time when we had venison even though it wasn’t in season. It’s hard to judge my parents if they had to make that decison. How long does that money from the pawn shop for your rifle last/feed a family?? It’s easy to judge others without walking a mile in his/her shoes.
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If you can’t make ends meet and own a 1000 acres it’s time to sell the farm and move to town, maybe better planning, saving, and budgeting is the answer?
Have you ever farmed, been in an agricultural occupation, or had to live that lifestyle personally?
I am going to assume not with the above logic. I am not slamming on you so don’t take it personal.
It sounds to me like you are slamming the farmers with how they have to live sometimes. If so, please do not eat another meal unless it was harvested with your own hands.
The farmers are some of the best budgeters, planners, and resource conservationists in the world
On paper it sure sounds easy enough to “sell the farm and move to town”. Reality is it is not that easy to do. Many farmers have owned the land for 100 years or more and it is the only life they know. You don’t just sell the farm and move to town. SOmetimes you are forced to do things that you wouldn’t normally do. I know for a fact if I were down on my luck and owned the land, I wouldn’t lose a second of sleep over shooting a deer, elk, or whatever on my land. If people wanted to call me a poacher, so be it, it would be no sweat off my back.
It might not be any sweat off your back, but it would more money out of your pocket when you get turned in and fined.
Personally – I am not calling in a violation if I believe the person is actually utilizing the take. If I thought they were wasting it, then I’d call in a heartbeat. If they get caught, that’s fine, but I am not going to be the reason they get caught.
Tim
I hear ya, but where do you draw the line? Or was the line drawn (the laws) and some are chosing to ignore it since its “just a deer”. Thats the problem with all this discussion, The law is the law, wheres the question? You can keep making more and more reasons, or keep making the poor farmer even more poor to try to justify it but it is what it is. There is a distinct line to not cross.
The 80’s and now are not the days of “Little house on the prairie”. Thats how some make it seem. Geez 
The law is the law….where does EVERYONE draw the line?
Speeding endangers lives – yet if you drive the speed limit, the majority of vehicles will blow past you during peak travel times. Where do you draw the line? The law is being broken – and people are being endangered – where do you draw the line?
I am not out there shooting a deer, but I also am not calling the law if somebody else does it……. Just lump me into that group of society that “does not want to get involved”…..especially when nobody is getting endangered or hurt……. A farmer shoots a deer out of the pasture and eats it….nobody gets hurt, so I guess you are right….in my eyes it is just a deer.
If that person gets caught, it is their fine to pay and I won’t listen to whining about it, but I am not going to be the reason they get caught.
Tim
You’ve worked in the mortgage and banking industry? But yet the obvious escaped you? When people owned X number of dollars of assets, most of which was financed, how do they sell it when the value literally falls in half almost overnight? What kind of option do banks have for that? Farms, being located where they are and all, really only appeal to other farmers. When everyone was impacted by the same thing do you really think the neighbors were out gobbling up land?
Everyone is more than welcome to disregard everything I say, I’ll sleep fine either way. And for all the do gooders eager to turn us dirty old poachers in be sure to drop a dime on yourself the next time you realize your speeding or don’t have your seatbelt on. You would do that right? Oh let me guess, you guys NEVER break even the smallest laws right?
While some here might be surprised at how many of us are willing to take care of our families ourselves I am utterly amazed how many socialists we have. You say there are programs, and there are. But you ever try and take advantage of them as a former, out of business, self employed person? What banker Joe has for options farmer John often doesn’t.
It was mentioned above. Society doesn’t want to get involved. And that includes people here, no matter what they type behind the anonymous monitors. Want proof? Show me a successful Neighborhood Watch program. Sure we see the signs but when is the last time ones been credited with solving or preventing crime?
When it comes to survival remember this. It is the guy in the mirror that counts.
With that I’m signing out of this conversation as I don’t like the tone it is coming to, myself included. I normally come here to relax not hash out hypotheticals.
Ive heard the “speeding and seatbelts” thing a little too much to ignore. There is a huge difference between an incident of speeding, forgeting your seatbelt, and a gross premeditation of poaching. If you try to deny this, then youre splitting hairs and lying to yourself.
Nope – when a person sets their cruise control 5 over, 10 over, or what not……that is also a premeditation to break the law. Like it was posted earlier…..the law is the law. It is black and white.
The “laws are laws and MUST be obeyed”
Ah, God bless your bleeding hearts-they are in the right place but if your going to run with that reasoning, we might as go all the way and condone the spearing and netting of walleyes–better yet lets all do it whenever we get the urge–there are a million justifications.
Sounds like an excuse, not a reason. Maybe he should go out and shoot squirrels, woodchucks, skunks, weasels, owls, hawks, chipmunks, grouse and everything else that walks the face of the earth on his land that he “thinks” he owns to feed his family—don’t pick on just the tasty venison. Heck, we have a million turkeys these days-send him out to get one for Thanksgiving.
We have too many socialistic systems that have been put into place to feed, cloth, heat his home and everything else that would be just right up his alley and designed just for him.
Food stamps, food panteries, deer donation programs, yada, yada, yada.
Come on guys, reason we have game laws is due to past overharvest, market hunting and everything else uncontrolled.
Call it what it is: poaching, tell him to stop.
He owns all things domesticated or licensed–not the wild things that just happen to run across his land.
Maybe if this line of bunk continues, the next thread should be “chipmunks and mustard sauce”.
Sheesh,
Jeremy
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Ah, God bless your bleeding hearts-they are in the right place but if your going to run with that reasoning, we might as go all the way and condone the spearing and netting of walleyes–better yet lets all do it whenever we get the urge–there are a million justifications.
Sounds like an excuse, not a reason. Maybe he should go out and shoot squirrels, woodchucks, skunks, weasels, owls, hawks, chipmunks, grouse and everything else that walks the face of the earth on his land that he “thinks” he owns to feed his family—don’t pick on just the tasty venison. Heck, we have a million turkeys these days-send him out to get one for Thanksgiving.
We have too many socialistic systems that have been put into place to feed, cloth, heat his home and everything else that would be just right up his alley and designed just for him.
Food stamps, food panteries, deer donation programs, yada, yada, yada.Come on guys, reason we have game laws is due to past overharvest, market hunting and everything else uncontrolled.
Call it what it is: poaching, tell him to stop.
He owns all things domesticated or licensed–not the wild things that just happen to run across his land.
Maybe if this line of bunk continues, the next thread should be “chipmunks and mustard sauce”.Sheesh,
Jeremy
AMEN 
In WI a landowner can trap and hunt small game YEAR ROUND on his land. So much for the regulations in effect to protect over harvest, blah,blah, blah.
This tells me 1 thing, it is ALL about the money when it comes to deer. The State says it is okay for the owner to hunt squirrels, rabbits, and what not on his land all year which means some of that time is OUT OF SEASON. Is he still a “Poacher”? The State says no.
But, now you bring in the word DEER, and people get all up in arms. All deer are is a State cash cow. People put way too much value on a deer. If it is on my land, I should be allowed to do what I choose with it. If a person can hunt the small game all year, why not the deer as well? Mainly because they want your money, they could care less about the deer. The deer herd is so thick, they probably out number the squirrels.
But either way, I am not one to hide behind a computer and I am defini9tely not afraid to tell you how I see things.
If I am a landowner, in any state, and down to dire need, I would not hesitate to provide food off of an animal that is on MY property. I can also say I sure hope it never comes to that.
Let’s just do away with all seasons. Anyone can hunt anything at any time. This would surely work out well for us, as it did in times when people really needed to hunt for food. A poacher is a poacher is a poacher. I may be a little selfish, but I believe no one person owns a wild animal. Heck, I could shoot a deer a night on my 2 acres… their always crossing my yard and eating my feeble attempt at grass, despite them, I plant more. There is no reason in todays world, in America, that someone has to shoot their food to survive. Sorry, plain and simple. I can remember post about a certain ethnic group, catching fish, one after another, any species and keeping them all. There was no counting, there was no size restrictions… the person who seen them, called Tip… I assure you, the people that were catching the fish, were consuming them, and I would guess they were not millionaires either. Alot of people jumped on that post, some of the same that are on the other side of the fence today…. Kooty, in short, poaching is always poaching. Some people may have more tolerence or compassion or other reasons for disallowing a law. Doesn’t mean their right or wrong, but in the eyes of the law, I would say they are wrong until proven otherwise.
big G 
Just an FYI here guys I am not even all the way through this thread yet and I have already had to edit a couple of small lines in some posts and I may have missed some.
We can all respectfully disagree on a subject but when the name calling starts that is when I will have to lock this one up. I see this post going nowhere fast but I will leave it for now.
PLEASE LETS BE RESPECTFUL OF EACH OTHER!
Heres something to think about too. Where I used to hunt at Norms farm he raised corn and alfalfa to feed to his cattle and hogs. The last year I hunted there he lost over a thousand bushels to deer predation and the DNR wouldn’t compensate him or any of the neighbors in that area, corn at that time was $2.85. so thats nearly $3000 he lost to feed just the deer. The deer were born on his place, they ate there and they died there. Norm took pretty good care of these deer,,,for the DNR and for the people of Iowa. They are a natural resource of the state here but nobodys paying Norm for his time and hardships raiseing these deer. Norm did his darndest to keep his farm afloat but he eventually stopped and went back to being an electrician because it was less hassel and believe it or not he was making more money as an electrician in rural Iowa where prices are way below what the city prices bring. Norm was forced to stop farming his place because of the market and prices it took to plant, fertilize etc,,,plus that $3000 a year it took to raise those deer. Maybe if he didn’t have those hard times and didn’t have such bad crop damage he could have made it, to me this is a guy who has been forced out because of hard times. Norm speant an awful lot to keep his family farm afloat and could have used that $30,000 over a 10 year period that the deer took to keep his farm afloat but because of the way laws are writen he quit farming… does anybody think its right if Norm would have shot a deer to eat during these hard times after he speant all that money planting and loosing what he did if his family was hungry? I could tell everyone what they do in that area to thin the herd the best they can but then you’d have people yelling about that. I know what decesion im going to make in this matter.
Hes another thing that I was involved in, my former neighbor called me one night saying they had a young doe for a raodkill and I met him there and took the deer. While I was cleaning it Gene said Dan do you want another one that someone had just hit 30 miles north of there. I said sure and we took off and hit speeds about 90 miles an hour going to this accident scene. Even though I was following a Deputy I was still exceeding the speed limit and it was considered completely legal. The thing Im saying is Just because theres laws, these laws are guidelines to center on. Do I think a judge would find a farmer guilty of poaching when he was feeding the deer and hit hard times so he decided he’d take one for food. Id be willing to bet most judges would consider the situation and find him innocent,,,beings he fed and raised these deer that was part of the reason he was forced out of farming. There are certain scenerios that do come into play,,,like hard times and hungry stomachs.
I agree mossydan, leave it up to a judge. If a judge says you poached, you poached. Should we as a society, have laws, but then allow them to be skirted on somebodys honesty ? Do they really need to shoot deer out of season to survive ? How many deer would of Norm had to shoot to recoup $3000 a year ??? Deer eating corn is nothing new… they have been doing it for centurys. Did Norm allow hunting on his land during season or did he just hunt them ??? I would think the herd is way too big in that area, if they are eating all that corn. It couldn’t have been specific to just Norms fields…. isn’t Iowa full of corn ??? I don’t think we can blame all corn loss on the deer either. Birds, squirrels, ducks, geese and rodents take their share too.
big G
Ya I hear ya G but the judge is speaking for the people isn’t he. I know alot of law inforcement would say and think, do it but just don’t get caught if your hungry. Im not saying that poaching is right which Norm wasen’t doing anyway, he dosen’t hunt of eat deer. Alot of his neighbors do and they do hunt and have the same losses to thier corn. Birds don’t eat much corn except for the turkeys, the coons eat it when its young and tender but still the Judge was talking for the wisdom of the public and what they would think, after all hes sat infront of alot of jurys and knows the way they think and the way they convict. There are certain sscenerios and things that do determine whos guilty and whos not, wheather someone finds out or not.
well yesterday I lost my job, today I’m putting the house up for sale and tonight I’m going out shining with my bow for food. i have 2 tags so I’m sure the sheriff will say I wasn’t poaching if I get caught, and won’t give me a ticket because I was just trying to provide for my family, heck he’ll probally offer me a job, or buy my house to ease the strain on me. I hope no one looks down on me beacuse I will be trespassing and shining, but it’s only because I’m too proud to get public assistance, or sell my possessions. I know you all understand and will not hold this against me, thank you for your understanding.
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I’m going out shining with my bow for food
I would use a rifle myself, your odds will be better Use a potato for a silencer so the neighbors don’t hear you 
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I’m going out shining with my bow for food
I would use a rifle myself, your odds will be better
This wouldn’t work he can just eat the potato….
Thanks for the laughs guys !!!! 
big G 
Right, wrong, or indifferent I also am making my way out of this “hypothetical” situation.
well I’m glad everyone understands it was a joke. I would never do this!
The law is the law. You cant lay claim to wild game becasue they are on your land. That’s simply ridiculous. I can’t believe this post went this long.
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