Gamehide hoodie…

the more power the smaller target sepration
peak to peak dont mean a whole lot look at the RMS # the higher the better

If you can see a maggy fall all the way to the bottom in 30’+ you aren’t going to miss a fish with either unit! Don’t worry about the specs they are both awesome units! It comes down to what features you want at the price you want to pay.

Ferny.

Depends on how you plan on using them. I have the FL-20 and just now found the benifit of the low power setting. it is great for seeing the true bottom thru the weeds, and also for turning down the power so your waxie doesn’t look like a 30″ northern in shallow water. Aslo if you plan on using the unit on your boat and outside your fish house, the FL-20 flat screen is amazing. There is never an instance where you can’t read the screen because of glare or simply because you don’t have the unit faced directly into your eyes.

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What are the benifits of having more power?

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MarCum uses more power so they can offer the best Interference Rejection system available. Interference Rejection is the feature that allows you to tune out other flashers around you while you are fishing. The LX-5 has 12 levels of IR and without the power, the IR feature would not work as well as it does. It is not a filtering system, so you don’t lose performance with use use the IR feature.

Power also gives you better target seperation. Target seperation is different than Target ID. Target seperation is the amount of space between two targets before they appear as one target on the flasher.

Power allows you to have a feature like SFL (Super Fine Line) on the LX-5. Using SFL gives you 3/4 inch target seperation without having to use the zoom mode.

The only reason you need a Low Power Setting on a flasher is if you can not turn your flasher gain down enough to accomplish the same thing. On the LX-5 for example, you can turn the gain as low as you want, until the bottom is gone. There is no need for a Low Power Setting, by turning the gain down, you can eliminate everything.

Just a few examples why power is a good thing

You can’t go wrong with either of them, both of them will be a nice upgrade over your exsisting unit. That being said I still gotta give the nod to marcum

Marcum’s charging system alone would do it for me, you can plug it in and forget it, it will keep your battery 100% without ever overcharging.

I also just upgraded. I had a FL-8 from when they first came out, although it still works like new I did want to get the IR feature. It really don’t matter which one you get because they are both good units from my inderstanding also. I did get the FL-20 Dual Transducer just because it offered me more of a piece of mind because of the Great luck I had with my old one. I also like the dual Zoom and the dual Cone is way cool.

The charging system is the same on both, Plug them and forget them.

Both marcum and vexilar are very good units some better options on each IMO. However I wouldn’t compare an older fl-8 to any of the new units. I am not an expert, I have used both and done some reseach, so correct me if I am wrong. Target seperation is NOT soley reliant upon power. I believe it is part of the equation. I am not going to say one method is better than another, but I believe marcum uses more power and less sensitive reciever to gain the said target seperation. The more power is also used in some other aspects of the flasher like Scott said. Vexilar uses less power and more sensitive reciever. Units from fl-8 to fl-20 all same power. I would not pay much attention to power, look more at target seperation and the other functions that meet your needs.As far as different setups I like the way marcum keeps it simple, Vexilar has to many variations of the same thing IMO.

thanks alot everybody. The biggest reason I want to upgrade is that when I first got this unit I never realy had to worry about interference, but now everybody has one and when people move in on me I sometimes have alot of trouble tuning them out. I also like the new zoom features. I fish everything from 2′ of water on the river to 40′ on some lakes, so I’m just trying to find something that works for every situation. If I could take what I like about the vexilar and what I like about the marcum I would have a perfect unit. It’s a tough decision!

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Vexilar uses less power and more sensitive reciever.

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The only true part about this statement is that Vexilar uses less power. I have seen first hand the reciever tests.

Like someone said earlier, buy what you feel confortable with

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Ok I have a vex fl-8. It has been a good unit for me over the past 10 years,

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Sounds likes one good reason to stay with Vexilar. Either unit will be a step up for you….but like I tell others, go with the product and company you are most confident with.

Chad

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I would not pay much attention to power, look more at target seperation and the other functions that meet your needs.

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The power of a MarCum unit directly correlates to the units clarity of output signal, target separation, and interference rejection.
As Scott said above, MarCum and Vexilars inference rejection is of two different types. Vexilar uses a series of filters while MarCum utilizes the addtional power available to perform a relative phaseshift of its output signal which results in a much larger window to reject unwanted signals.

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The charging system is the same on both, Plug them and forget them.

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Be careful with leaving the FL 20 plugged in for extended periods of time….

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Vexilar uses less power and more sensitive reciever.

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The only true part about this statement is that Vexilar uses less power. I have seen first hand the reciever tests.

Like someone said earlier, buy what you feel confortable with

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Don’t get me wrong marcum products are great. After seeing your response I checked the vexilar website. Under the support heading, subheading tips and articles, it states that it uses the less power/ more reciever method compaired to some competitors inverse method? If you have seen tests to disprove this I will be calling vexilar on their fib. I am also not saying that power doesn’t increase target separation, but compare the vex fl-18 400 watts, 2.65″ target sep to the lx-3 1500 watts 2.15″ target sep (pretty close). Just to show target sep can be achieved with less power. Now step up to the lx-5 and you can count the legs on a waxie. Once again correct me if I am wrong. I just want to get the facts.

You seem to be very interested in the target separation capabilities of these units. To compare we will use the capabilities stated by each manufacturer.

An LX-5 can achieve stated separation down to 3/4 (0.75″) of an inch. If 2.65″ is the stated seperation for the top of the line Vex then the MarCum can boast a 350% improvement in target separation. Plus standard dual transducer (not standard on the Vex), vastly superior interference rejection, adjustable zoom (not standard on the Vex) soft side carrying case (not standard on the Vex)… and for less money than you’ll have to shell out for the FL-20.

Both manufacturer’s make a good product. Only one is truely great in my opinion. When you can have great for less money… what was the questions again?

Thanks for your reply James, but I think you missed my point. Would you by a flasher based soley on peak to peak power? As I stated before I would focus on OTHER aspects of the flasher not just power or target sep. I was not comparing target sep other than to point out that it has been done with less power. I already boasted about the lx-5. I would like more info on the tests on the vexilar recievers that Scott talked about. Also someone awhile back posted that the foil buttons wear out, I have not seen this have you?

I have not seen any issues with the control buttons. Even when temps are very cold or over long periods of heavy use.

Would I buy a flasher based purely on peak-to-peak? Heck no. Bumping up the output wattage would be simple for any manufacturer. What counts is what you features you are able to offer as a direct result of that extra power.

Clearly MarCum uses some of that extra power to produce better target separation than the comparable Vex units. I don’t think anyone disputes that. Another area where the power really comes into play is with the quality of MarCum’s interference rejection system. Vex relies on filters to eliminate interference where MarCum actually alters the output signal. Filters reduce sensitivity.

If there’s a way for Scott to post the sensitivity of the various receivers, he will. I’ve never seen those test conducted but I do know that when I’ve toured MarCum their engineers have an entire wall of Vex units they test, test and retest to ensure the MarCum products are the top products on the market.

Some times all the technical “stuff” clouds the decision making process. You’ve obviously got a great handle on all the specs and capabilities. Now it is time for you to fish with both units and see which one works best for you and the way you fish. Once you’ve found a unit, regardless of manufacturer or price level, that works for you and you have confidence in when you’re on the ice… then there’s no questioning that purchase decision.

If you can make it to the LOTW Get-Together there will be MarCums and Vexilars a’plenty for the testing.

James, Scott, Matt thanks for the indepth discussion. I think you may have viewed my posts as personnal opinions, thats not the case. I just tried to put out some facts as is viewed them. I would love to be at the GTG but not this year, to many obligations. Make sure you guys get good pics for all of us that can’t be there. Oh and as far as trying out some units and making a decision, that was made quite awhile back………………………….MARCUM I just like to show both sides of the coin.

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Would you by a flasher based soley on peak to peak power?

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No I would not. You bring up very good points, and I was out fishing last night so I didn’t get a chance to respond until now. People need to understand “Sensitivity” is a term used to describe an overall performance of several factors. What I am saying, is there is a lot that goes into how “Sensitivity” is measured.

You have to take into account things like Distortion, Noise and Gain, as those are what affect the end results of how a flasher performs. Saying something is more “sensitive” without taking into account distortion, noise and gain does absolutely no good to anyone that is actually using the product.

I know the results of the testing of all of these on the LX-5, LX-3 as well as the Vexilar FL-20 in case one wants to see the testing. As an end user of the product, this is really what matters.

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I know the results of the testing of all of these on the LX-5, LX-3 as well as the Vexilar FL-20 in case one wants to see the testing. As an end user of the product, this is really what matters.

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Hook me up!

I fish a fair bit for Lake Trout, and in 60-80 feet of water, I could rarely see my jig near the bottom with the FL-8. The abundance of other stuff in the water column tends to clutter the screen as I increase the gain. It seems that 50-60 is the usual limitation of effective jig-watching(sometimes less).

With the marcum, I have no issues under most circumstances watching my jig 75-80 feet down. I have not tried any deeper than this yet.

So for deep water fishing (over 50 or so feet) – I give the Marcum a hands-down victory in being the better unit. In the shallower water, so far, I notice no significant improvements over my 14 yr old vex FL-8.

Tim

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Hook me up!

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Here are some sonar facts:

The Vexilar FL20 receiver has more then twice the distortion of a MarCum LX5/LX3 receiver.

The Vexilar Fl20 receiver is more than twice as noisy as that of a MarCum LX5/LX3.

The Vexilar FL20 has half the receiver gain than that of the MarCum LX5/LX3.

MarCum’s transducer is more efficient and more sensitive.

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Hook me up!

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Here are some sonar facts:

The Vexilar FL20 receiver has more then twice the distortion of a MarCum LX5/LX3 receiver.

The Vexilar Fl20 receiver is more than twice as noisy as that of a MarCum LX5/LX3.

The Vexilar FL20 has half the receiver gain than that of the MarCum LX5/LX3.

MarCum’s transducer is more efficient and more sensitive.

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Thanks for the info Scott. Are those facts true for the fl-18 also?

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Thanks for the info Scott. Are those facts true for the fl-18 also?

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FL-20, Fl-18 or FL-12

Well…I purchased one of the Gamehide Hoodie Fleece jackets that IDO currently has on special for $55. Overall a very nice quality and I cannot wait until September when I can put it to use in my stand!
BUT…….It is advertised as having a drawstring waist and it comes with a tag on the garmet that says it has a drawstring waist…It does not. Just thought I would let you guys know about this fact in case that’s a biggie’ for you.
They offered to take it back which is kinda’ standard I guess. What disappoints me a bit is that they have yet to make that change on their website so they are still advertising them as having a drawstring waist. Not bitchin’ just thought folks should know this fact before purchasing…RR