Anyone shoot one of these? I’ve been tossing around the idea of getting one coyotes but wondering if its worth the price tag. How far out are you comfortable shooting at coyotes with a 223 in general? Is there a better deal to be had for the same quality? Thanks for any info fellas, I appreciate it!
http://www.in-depthoutdoors.com/community/forums/topic/not-impressed-with-my-howa-at-the-moment/
Sorry, only have time to post the link. FWIW, I want one in 22-250 despite his stock issues.
DT
@Chance R.
I have 2 Howa 1500’s in 22-250 – both in stainless. My furthest prairie rat kill is over 700yrds (yes I was lucky). If I ever needed a rifle that I MUST depend on in a small cal., the Howas have proven themselves to me over and over again.
With that said, I reload and have specific loads for those guns. The factory Hornady V max shot extremely well. Other manufacture I tried in “factory” loads sucked.
I bought both in the Thumbhole Sporter. You can get an after market Boyd stock in a thumbhole for about $129.00 plus shipping.
I am into the thousands of rounds through my barrels, and they have held their accuracy. I did the break-in recommended by Legacy Arms and I attribute that to the longevity.
I also don’t shoot the max loads. I’m pushing a 55gr bullet a little under 4000fps. It blows a prairie pups into pieces and if I hit bone on a coyote a softball size hole.
My brother in law shoots it in a 223 and loves it. He has the bull barrel and it does a better job at dissipating heat. He reloads also and has a load that is remarkable with 50gr Vmax bullets
On the down side –
Tom (from the link provided above) had a very crappy customer service encounter with them. Unless there was reasonable circumstances, it should not have taken that long on a replacement stock.
I’ve called into the C/S a few times – hit-mis on getting the help you want.
Not a lot of “local” dealers and often you need to order them into a store or Special Order.
I think they are all still shipped with the spring/drop plate. The replacement bottom plate and magazine is around $100?? haven’t looked recently.
223 at 300 yrds is very deadly
Picture is a 3 shot group at almost 400yrds
100_5276.jpg
How far out are you comfortable shooting at coyotes with a 223 in general?
Well, that, of course, is going to depend a lot on how well you can shoot.
Personally, looking at my pet loads, a .223 I think the .223 starts running out of gas for coyote sized game around 300-350. YMMV depending on load, but there’s a larger point here. The thing of it is we’re talking about hunting here, so I think that we have to take into account not just what distance you can HIT at, but the distance at which you can actually reliably KILL. It takes much more to kill a coyote than it does a varmint.
There are several rifles in the same budget category as the Howa. Personally, I’m shooting ragged hole groups with a pimped out Savage Axis stainless. It’s crazy how good of a rifle you can get these days for less than $500.
Grouse
Thanks for the info guys. 700 yards is very impressive Randy, i dont know much about the 22-250 is that a bigger load than the 223? I honestly dont shoot that much where reloading on my own has crossed my mind although it is possible in the future.
I agree TFG it will definitely take some time to get comfortable shooting game at long ranges. That will be the most important aspect when i do get one is getting it dialed in. I may have to look at a cheaper gun and use that extra cash towards a quality call.
I would suggest you invest in quality scope before the call. Calls can be found on ocasion for reasonable price. Considering most predator hunting is in low light conditions, the best glass you can afford would benifits you
Thanks for the great info Randy I appreciate it.
I agree TFG it will definitely take some time to get comfortable shooting game at long ranges. That will be the most important aspect when i do get one is getting it dialed in. I may have to look at a cheaper gun and use that extra cash towards a quality call.
Keep in mind that the NEED or even the opportunity to ever shoot at coyotes at longer ranges is highly variable depending on where you hunt.
What you see on TV with guys calling coyotes over 2 mines of open ground and then zapping them at 400 in the wide open never happens where I hunt in norther MN. Coyotes do not go into the open where I hunt, I found that out after years of trying to emulate the western hunting style on eastern coyotes, which are much smarter and more wary.
My best coyote rifle is a a 12 gauge shotgun with a 3 inch load of copper plated BBs through a full choke. My average shot is 35 yards. My biggest challenge to hitting coyotes is keeping from sh!tting myself when they jump out of the brush and land in my lap. I’ve had to hold off on shooting coyotes because they ran and stopped right on top of my call.
Long range coyotes don’t happen everywhere. You have to play by local rules.
Grouse
Just chiming in with Randy here……. I have a Howa in .223 and the ONLY factory loads it likes is Hornady’s. Vmax or “training SP’s” grouped the same. This isn’t meant to be discouraging but after sighting in a Savage Axis that would shoot WPA’s in tighter groups, it really put a damper on my excitement for owning a Howa. At the bare bones of it all though, the gun is still shooting the Hornadys well enough to feel like I’m plenty good to make a killing shot out to the 300yd marker.
Randy’s Howa’s are tuned in and show what is capable. At the same time, in the Howa vs. Savage contest, I’m actually more confident in my Savage. All guns can be different though so maybe this is just a case of the way it went for me. As a result, I bought a second Savage Axis. This time in 22-250. The two guns were purchased and upgraded for just a little more than the price of my Howa. From where I stand, the “value” vote goes to the Savage as well.
@stillakid2 Just curious how many rounds you have through you savages? Buddy of mine has put about 700 through his .270WIN this summer and he is having issues. He also has a Savage 2 in a 22-250 and has about 1500 through it and its still a solid 1MOA riffle. I don’t have a horse in this race, but I am extremely pleased with having many thousands down the tube and still sub-MOA with no changes to my original load or seating depth.
I estimate that I have about 7000+ through “Streak”. That is my first Howa 22-250. I average shooting about 150 to 200 rounds per month plinking targets and 400 to 1000 rounds on each P/dog trip.
There is a considerable $$$$ difference in HOWA to Savage. If Savage owners are getting longevity, then i agree its a great value
I would suggest you invest in quality scope before the call. Calls can be found on ocasion for reasonable price. Considering most predator hunting is in low light conditions, the best glass you can afford would benifits you
No truer words were spoken when it comes to accuracy at long range glass can make or break a rifle. Me personally I hate Mill or Moa dots they are to big for long range shooting in IMO. Every day hunting at closer ranges they are OK but beyond no dice they will cover to much of the target.
@Randy…..
I don’t do nearly the amount of shooting you do. My 22-250 has only 300ish rounds through it and the .223 has maybe a 100 more. I do very little target shooting as a whole and I used 4 different guns last time I went poodle pounding.
You make an excellent point regarding longevity but Grouse would probably be a better testament pro or con than me. If I remember right, he’s got the same pairing I do….. calibers anyway. I’m not sure if stainless or blue makes any difference in barrel quality, regarding accuracy longevity. But he does shoot more than I do…….. I think……..
Just for the sake of conversation, I have two 17HMR’s. A Savage BTVSS 9317 with a laminate thumbhole stock, and a bull stainless barrel. This gun was meant to do some serious varmint control. The other is a Mossberg 817, synthetic stock, blued, and as cheap as a cheap gun can be. This was intended for plinking and convenient varmint opportunities. I had purchased new optics for both guns and needed to sight them in. I put a Leupold VX2 on the Savage and a Bushnell Banner on the Mossberg. At 50 yds, the Mossberg is out performing the Savage! The Savage has around 300 rounds through it and the Mossberg is brand new. Either way, there’s a terrible feeling that sets in when a “lower quality” rifle shoots better than what should be “the good one”.
My Howa has the King’s Snow Camo on it and was meant for winter use only. Unless something drastic changes, this will last until I die. It’s just that I bought the 2 of them only 2 weeks apart and sighted them in at the same time. Because of the price tag, a person expects a better experience right out of the gate and I didn’t get that. It’s a good thing it shoots Hornady’s or I would’ve dumped it long ago. And I don’t mean to slam Howa’s…… as I said, this is just the way it’s gone for me. Perhaps I got one of the Friday models…… but it does give me decent accuracy at a decent range using Hornady ammo so we’ll keep it but you understand…… (don’t you?)….. why I feel the way I do? Until something flips on the Savage, I have more confidence in that one. Aaaaaaand……. given the rate I shoot, it might be a very long time before that happens.
I have wondered if that stock Nikko-Sterling scope has anything to do with it. It’s clearly not the best quality but it has the matching camo pattern.
@Randy…..
I have wondered if that stock Nikko-Sterling scope has anything to do with it. It’s clearly not the best quality but it has the matching camo pattern.
I have the Howa 1500 Kryptic .223 that came with the same Optics the Nikko Sterling. It truly sucked for accuracy the best I could do was 1 inch at a 100 yards. Pulled the Nikko off and put on my Grand Slam and tightened up my groups to 1/2 at 100 yards using a load that I shoot in my AR.
Me personally I hate Mill or Moa dots they are to big for long range shooting in IMO. Every day hunting at closer ranges they are OK but beyond no dice they will cover to much of the target.
That is the specific difference in Rear Focal Plane and Front Focal Plane scopes. Rear Focal planes are fixed and I agree, the mildots can appear too large. In a FFP, it scales with the magnification and gives you much more accuracy
@ Tom P
Thanks for the heads up on your experience. It’s been awhile since I shot this one but if I remember right, I was closer to 3/4″ @ 100 yds with Hornady ammo. Anything else was like 1 1/2″ or worse.
@ Randy
Say! I just found out that my Weatherby Laserguard is made in Japan…….. by who???? Yep! Howa. THAT gun is one of the best out of the box experiences I’ve ever had! So…… with that being said, I guess I have a solid testimonial for them after all!
@ Tom P
Thanks for the heads up on your experience. It’s been awhile since I shot this one but if I remember right, I was closer to 3/4″ @ 100 yds with Hornady ammo. Anything else was like 1 1/2″ or worse.
@ Randy
Say! I just found out that my Weatherby Laserguard is made in Japan…….. by who???? Yep! Howa. THAT gun is one of the best out of the box experiences I’ve ever had! So…… with that being said, I guess I have a solid testimonial for them after all!
Was just gonna mention that the Weatherby Vanguard S2’s are made by Howa. My 243 vanguard s2 will do sub half MOA.
The Howa 1500 action is very solid and used in a few custom builds and a few manufactures
I would look into a 243 before a 223 the 243 is a more accurate shooting bullet the ballistic coefficient is much better. I do long range Compton shooting and in small caliber shoots 9 times outta 10 everyone shoots a 243. The good part about that round is you can use any gun from a savage axis to a howa, sako, or a high end Remington. As long as you have a good optic on it it will shoot 500 yards accurately enough to put a coyote down everytime. If you wanted to go further I suggest going with only handloads. I have a Remington 243 with Nightforce on top bull barrel and a McMillan stock. I can get half moa groups no problem at 600 with that. Its by far the best round that you can shoot fast and have awesome knockdown power. Also if you intend to use handloads do a ladder test with atleasr 4 or 5 different grain weights. That can make a huge difference in accuracy when you get out to thatlonger range.
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