How much did your property tax increase?

buckybadger wrote:

I’d like to see something more “locked” related to purchase prices for property values as far as taxation goes. The runaway values on property people like us will never sell is a kick in the ***s. You’re handcuffed.

I get what you’re saying but just because you haven’t sold your house in X number of years doesn’t mean the property value isn’t increasing. Anyfish2 said some really good points above. I think a lot of you that are surprised at the valuation of your house that you’ve lived in for 10+ years should take a look at what comps in your area are selling for. The housing market has gone nuts the last several years and property valuations typically lag. Also, like Anyfish2 said, things have gotten a lot more expensive since COVID and the counties/towns/school districts are seeing those same inflation pains that regular consumers are. It’d be unrealistic to expect counties/schools/etc to be immune to inflation. Costs are going up for everyone everywhere and that will only continue if new tariffs are put in place.

TheFamousGrouse wrote:

One thing that people often don’t take into account is that when a nearby property sells, the recording of that transaction can set off a chain of valuation adjustments. That’s what I think happened to my farm property in Pine county. The neighbors property sold and what do you know? On my latest property tax statement my value has gone up to almost what was paid per acre for his property when he sold it. Coincidence???

But what can I do? I can hardly argue that my property isn’t worth what the property next door just sold for.

My cabin neighbor had his place listed for a year at a price that everyone made fun of, we all thought he was out of his mind. Well, some dumbasses from out of state actually bought it for really close to his asking price about month ago. My value went up about 50% basing it on that, we’ll see what happens next year.

2024 property taxes (2023 emv) went up 10.8%; 2025 property taxes (2024 emv) will go down 0.6%. And based on comp sales in my neighborhood my house would still sell for at least 15% above those emv numbers.

Home values are up almost 50% in the last 5 years, and property taxes are tied to property values. All the threads on here about real estate being the best investment, and the same characters are complaining about property values going up?

Gitchi Gummi wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>buckybadger wrote:</div>
I’d like to see something more “locked” related to purchase prices for property values as far as taxation goes. The runaway values on property people like us will never sell is a kick in the ***s. You’re handcuffed.

I get what you’re saying but just because you haven’t sold your house in X number of years doesn’t mean the property value isn’t increasing. Anyfish2 said some really good points above. I think a lot of you that are surprised at the valuation of your house that you’ve lived in for 10+ years should take a look at what comps in your area are selling for. The housing market has gone nuts the last several years and property valuations typically lag. Also, like Anyfish2 said, things have gotten a lot more expensive since COVID and the counties/towns/school districts are seeing those same inflation pains that regular consumers are. It’d be unrealistic to expect counties/schools/etc to be immune to inflation. Costs are going up for everyone everywhere and that will only continue if new tariffs are put in place.

We built our forever home starting in 2021 (13 month build). I’m very aware of what things cost post-Covid.

I don’t care what the government says it is worth. I gain absolutely NOTHING from my property value going up if I never have intention of selling it. I’m young enough that I adjust my budget/investments/work accordingly. I really feel for someone who worked their entire life to own acreage or a nice property…bought it at a realistic amount during a time where valuations increased in a predictable way…has since retired/aged…and now are handcuffed to whatever someone says it is worth as an endless source of tax revenue.

I understand property values going up and taxes to follow but what happens when property values go down such as 2008. The taxes did not go down the following years but stayed the same. In buisness if sales are down you have to make changes in spending to account for this in goverment you just keep spending. If your going to increase in good times you have to decrease during bad. Many people did not recieve any wage increase during those times but public employees still got cost of living increase.

Carver County has been pretty good on this front, we moved to our current home in 2020. Tax rates went +6.8% in 2020, -4.9% in 2021 (levy fell off), +6.3% in 2022, +2.6% in 2023, and +11.7% in 2024. So we are +16% in aggregate during the time we’ve lived there. Our home value has greatly exceeded that due to overall growth and buying at the right time. However, if I look back 10-15 years my current taxes are still in that same +16% range due to some levies to build schools back then.

I get people being upset with increases, especially if it impacts your ability to stay in your long time home. But of all the taxes these are the one’s you have the most impact on, by voicing your opinion to someone in your community, or working to replace them if you think they are spending irresponsibly (school board, county commissioners, city council etc.). Most of these elections are decided by a tiny amount of votes.

My sympathy goes to the younger generations who will grow up and be priced out of real estate ownership, regardless of how hard they work.

ganderpike wrote:

My sympathy goes to the younger generations who will grow up and be priced out of real estate ownership, regardless of how hard they work.

This is very true. I even see it with the younger guys that are coming in to the union. Great pay great work and can hardly afford renting. That tells me the government is doing a great job. Affordable housing at its finest. Now days a single family home starting at over 350k is wild.

ganderpike wrote:

My sympathy goes to the younger generations who will grow up and be priced out of real estate ownership, regardless of how hard they work.

This and why do I not get a refund when the value is said to go down?????

The entire property tax system is BS and needs to be completely redesigned into something stable and fair. Currently its an incentive to own a POS, do no maintenance, and never invest a penny into it until you want to sell. Property is no different than your 401K. Value goes up and down but means absolutely nothing until you want to cash out.

I built my last house as a very basic box. Cheap finishes, blah, blah, blah. Spent about 230K and anticipated 3K ish taxes. Well neighbors spent much more and prettied up their houses much more and sold them for 450-600K. People over spent on them and think they are worth that much – let them pay tax on that amount. Ironic that I could raze a house and if ordinance allowing, live in a camper and pay for a vacant lot. To be fair to all it should be classification of land and how many sqft. The fact that you built a crap box or a mansion is a personal choice of life style and should not be part of the equation.

ganderpike wrote:

My sympathy goes to the younger generations who will grow up and be priced out of real estate ownership, regardless of how hard they work.

Very true. I have a handful of friends that didnt buy before covid and now its pretty tough to make even a starter home work out.

Randy Wieland wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>ganderpike wrote:</div>
My sympathy goes to the younger generations who will grow up and be priced out of real estate ownership, regardless of how hard they work.

This and why do I not get a refund when the value is said to go down?????

Around us they sent the values through the roof, they have now been adjusted accordingly. But our taxes still went up even though our value went down. It’s a pretty neat feature I thought.

supercat wrote:

I understand property values going up and taxes to follow but what happens when property values go down such as 2008. The taxes did not go down the following years but stayed the same. In buisness if sales are down you have to make changes in spending to account for this in goverment you just keep spending. If your going to increase in good times you have to decrease during bad. Many people did not recieve any wage increase during those times but public employees still got cost of living increase.

You got thinking about how values and tax acted so I looked back at my records.
In for the 2008 assessment my home value was $124,100 with a tax of $938. For the 2009 assessment (post housing crash) my home value was $113,300 with a tax of $824. That is 8.7% decrease in value and a 12.1% decrease in tax in response to the housing market. unfortunately i do not information on any levy amounts to see what they did as well.

All from 2008 to 2025 proposed my taxes have increased from $938 to $1484 while my value has increase from $124,100 to $215,000.

buckybadger wrote:

We built our forever home starting in 2021 (13 month build). I’m very aware of what things cost post-Covid.

I don’t care what the government says it is worth. I gain absolutely NOTHING from my property value going up if I never have intention of selling it. I’m young enough that I adjust my budget/investments/work accordingly. I really feel for someone who worked their entire life to own acreage or a nice property…bought it at a realistic amount during a time where valuations increased in a predictable way…has since retired/aged…and now are handcuffed to whatever someone says it is worth as an endless source of tax revenue.

do you feel your value should stay at what you paid for it for insurance purposes too or just property taxes? For simplicity, say you bought a house for $200k 10 years ago and got it insured at that value. Fast forward 10 years and its value went up to $300k and it burns down and you need to rebuild it. Should your insurance just pay out at the $200k value? Or the current value of $300k? Can’t have it both ways.

Same with vehicle registration tax… you’re taxed on the value which goes down over time as it depreciates. Property taxes are also based on value and houses appreciate in value. Its a pretty simple concept.

Youbetcha wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>ganderpike wrote:</div>
My sympathy goes to the younger generations who will grow up and be priced out of real estate ownership, regardless of how hard they work.

Very true. I have a handful of friends that didnt buy before covid and now its pretty tough to make even a starter home work out.

There are some people who I do feel bad for with regards to housing as mentioned above, and some who I think made their proverbial bed (or lackthereof) and now will have to lay in it.

I feel bad for the “Gen Z” population or people who are currently 18-27 roughly. Even if they are hardworking, self made with solid jobs and smart financial decisions – owning property is going to be an uphill battle for sure. They were likely too young in most instances to own pre-covid. Today a solid job for someone who is single is not enough to buy much of a home due to both interest rates, taxes, and prices.

I do NOT feel bad for most of the “Millenials” aged 28 – early 40s as they had a window availble to them with low interest rates and opportunities to position themselves in property. I am currently 35, and bought my first house on my own at 23 with very little down that was a foreclosure. I sold my little fishing boat and a second vehicle (jeep) that I had worked hard for, to afford a downpayment. I didn’t take extravagant vacations or have a jacked up truck sitting in my parents driveway living the good life in my early 20s. It pi$$es me off when people remind me how “lucky” I am to have done that, and nearly trippled my money selling that house less than 10 years later. I combined sacrifices and decisions with sweat equity. I don’t feel bad for people who chose the opposite. Some of my friends chose the same path as me, and others didn’t. That’s a choice.

Gitchi Gummi wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>buckybadger wrote:</div>
We built our forever home starting in 2021 (13 month build). I’m very aware of what things cost post-Covid.

I don’t care what the government says it is worth. I gain absolutely NOTHING from my property value going up if I never have intention of selling it. I’m young enough that I adjust my budget/investments/work accordingly. I really feel for someone who worked their entire life to own acreage or a nice property…bought it at a realistic amount during a time where valuations increased in a predictable way…has since retired/aged…and now are handcuffed to whatever someone says it is worth as an endless source of tax revenue.

do you feel your value should stay at what you paid for it for insurance purposes too or just property taxes? For simplicity, say you bought a house for $200k 10 years ago and got it insured at that value. Fast forward 10 years and its value went up to $300k and it burns down and you need to rebuild it. Should your insurance just pay out at the $200k value? Or the current value of $300k? Can’t have it both ways.

Taxes and insurance are not even remotely the same thing. One is optional. One is not. I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make or what you’re asking?

I’m saying that I have no intentions of reselling or ever selling, nor do most people who own rural acreage in my area. The value I purchased/built for is what I thought the land and building was worth. I agreed to that. The government coming in and saying that because some farmer sold out on the other side of the county for $11k an acre…my value suddenly skyrockets is BS.

Insurance has nothing to do with it. I’m not arguing insurance increases as they are tied to rebuilding/replacement costs and I am free to shop around or go without insurance alltogether. Please highlight for me where I can elect whether or not to pay for taxes, or where I can shop around for different rates or coverage

buckybadger wrote:

Please highlight for me where I can elect whether or not to pay for taxes

Not saying you can elect or not elect to pay them, but you can certainly challenge them if you think they’re unfair.

Its right on the form, there’s a date and time. If you really think they’re unfair, and you can prove it, you should see results.

bucky, did you dispute your valuation with the county? its obvious the system isn’t perfect and thats your opportunity to debate the valuation. Complaining on here isn’t going to get you anywhere. If you don’t like how your county/city/school district’s elected officials spend the money, vote for someone else.

You’re taxed based on the value of your property. Houses appreciate in value. Its pretty straight forward stuff. The fact that you don’t ever plan to sell your house has no impact on your tax assessed value. Its completely irrelevant.

In my area School, City, Township, and County employees all get a raise. Maybe not what they deserve but a wage raise. Health Insurance goes up for everybody.
I guess I painted with to wide a brush saying all government employees get a raise. I don’t know about Federal but the State employees I do know got raises. None of them got what they wanted.

Gitchi Gummi wrote:

bucky, did you dispute your valuation with the county? its obvious the system isn’t perfect and thats your opportunity to debate the valuation. Complaining on here isn’t going to get you anywhere. If you don’t like how your county/city/school district’s elected officials spend the money, vote for someone else.

You’re taxed based on the value of your property. Houses appreciate in value. Its pretty straight forward stuff. The fact that you don’t ever plan to sell your house has no impact on your tax assessed value. Its completely irrelevant.

You are already conditioned to accept that as set-in-stone fact. That is part of the issue. There are historical instances where that is not a guarantee, but taxes rarely go down to follow.

Nobody here is debating HOW property taxes and valuations work from an educational perspective…I question WHY it works the way it does.

Not a single one of my neighbors has bought/sold/built anything outside of me in the last 4 years. Why should what a corporate farm on the opposite end of the county or township pays for a piece of land somehow impact the “valuation” of my property? That’s not a comparison for these magical “valuations.” They are buying completely different land for a different purpose, with funds gathered in a completely different way.

The system is broken. It’s just broken in a way that supports government spending at the expense of working, landowning citizens…so it’s ignored

buckybadger wrote:

The system is broken. It’s just broken in a way that supports government spending at the expense of working, landowning citizens…so it’s ignored

The problem with “government spending” is what are they spending all that money on? Well, it’s…this is awkward…it’s us.

Now I know, I know, I know. EVERYBODY on this forum is a self-made man. Never took a dime from the government, we’d all kill ourselves before we ever accepted a penny of government money. We all pulled ourselves up by our own bootstraps and made our own way in life with no “handouts” ever. Setting aside, of course, public schools, roads, state universities, bridges, water and sewer treatment, parks, outdoor recreation, etc. But this is all minor stuff, none of it costs any real money.

There’s a real crisis coming because the hate and demonization government employees are getting from the public is driving them out in droves. The university I went to had a HUGE school of education, it was one of the largest departments on campus and had its own buildings. There were hundreds of graduates every year from this department alone when I was there in the 1980s.

Two years ago they shut down the department due to a lack of student interest. They went from over 3000 full time students (most of them pursuing teaching degrees) to less than 100. The university has determined that there won’t be student numbers to justify restarting the department so they are bulldozing the buildings because this represents a cost savings over mothballing them.

My father was Superintendent of Schools in MN and throughout his career, a typical opening for a teacher–even in a rural MN school district–would attract >50 applicants and in most cases 5-10 really good candidates to choose from. Now even suburban districts get almost no qualified/licensed applicants for open positions posted for extended periods of time. Rural districts struggle to get 1-2 applicants at all, much less qualified ones.

Sorry to say that if we want teachers and a whole bunch of highly-qualified other people that are required to run our modern world, we’ve got to figure this out. This road we are on where all ‘government’ employees are seen as overpaid, underworked, useless wastes of space that should be eliminated is a road to self harm and ruin.

TheFamousGrouse wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>buckybadger wrote:</div>
The system is broken. It’s just broken in a way that supports government spending at the expense of working, landowning citizens…so it’s ignored

The problem with “government spending” is what are they spending all that money on? Well, it’s…this is awkward…it’s us.

Now I know, I know, I know. EVERYBODY on this forum is a self-made man. Never took a dime from the government, we’d all kill ourselves before we ever accepted a penny of government money. We all pulled ourselves up by our own bootstraps and made our own way in life with no “handouts” ever. Setting aside, of course, public schools, roads, state universities, bridges, water and sewer treatment, parks, outdoor recreation, etc. But this is all minor stuff, none of it costs any real money.

There’s a real crisis coming because the hate and demonization government employees are getting from the public is driving them out in droves. The university I went to had a HUGE school of education, it was one of the largest departments on campus and had its own buildings. There were hundreds of graduates every year from this department alone when I was there in the 1980s.

Two years ago they shut down the department due to a lack of student interest. They went from over 3000 full time students (most of them pursuing teaching degrees) to less than 100. The university has determined that there won’t be student numbers to justify restarting the department so they are bulldozing the buildings because this represents a cost savings over mothballing them.

My father was Superintendent of Schools in MN and throughout his career, a typical opening for a teacher–even in a rural MN school district–would attract >50 applicants and in most cases 5-10 really good candidates to choose from. Now even suburban districts get almost no qualified/licensed applicants for open positions posted for extended periods of time. Rural districts struggle to get 1-2 applicants at all, much less qualified ones.

Sorry to say that if we want teachers and a whole bunch of highly-qualified other people that are required to run our modern world, we’ve got to figure this out. This road we are on where all ‘government’ employees are seen as overpaid, underworked, useless wastes of space that should be eliminated is a road to self harm and ruin.

I mentioned that the school referendum here passed, and that I supported it in a previous post.
Schools provide a service that pays for itself in dividends with teaching skills, jumpstarting career initiatives, providing “daycare” so to speak for working parents (although that’s not what it is but does create time to work), sports and extra curricular opportunities, and so on. I’m pro public schools to the end and voted for our new local building project. I’m on the local Booster Club board and the Scholarship foundation for our public school.

What I struggle to support to the same extent though are the dog parks, the cobblestone crosswalks, the dyed concrete accents on sidewalks, the mowing of roadside ditches like they’re a golfcourse fairway, the salting of public roads that we pay for infinetly on both the front end and back end, the 13th and 14th downtown mural going next to numbers 11 and 12. The county jail built that cost $20 million and is equipped to house 72 inmates and currently has 3 total inmates is tough to swallow. Thankfully it is only “staffed” to house 30 inmates though…which it hasn’t held once in the past 10 years.

Bucky, I think we all understand your prespective. The problem is, like so much in government, change happens slowly. A(n) important part to this is there must be solution to the current problem.
Do you have a solution? Or a different/better why applying property tax?

Or rather, how do we fund our local governments and schools?

MN property tax is progressive, meaning higher valued properties pay a larger share of the tax base. $600,000 will pay more than a $100,000 home, due to homestead exclusions and more. Agricultural homestead properties pay at a rate half of that as residential properties.

There lots of things I would like to see happen. Like I would like to see a cap on taxes for our neighbors that are over 60. But that means those of us under the age of 60 would pick up the burden of the taxes that they would no longer pay. That is a burden I would except, but many other would not.

At the end of the day, our property taxes are what the local governments and schools levy. Be it $1 or $1 billion dollars. They question is how to you feel the fairest and most equitable way is to divide that burden amongst the residents of your county?

I am sure there are some great ideas out there, they have to be shared with our representatives and get passed in our STATE legislature for any meaningful change to happen.

TheFamousGrouse wrote:

The problem with “government spending” is what are they spending all that money on? Well, it’s…this is awkward…it’s us.

C’mon Grouse, you know that’s not what the problem is. Most people on both sides of the aisle are ok with spending on “us”, the problem is the fraud, corruption and inefficiencies before it reaches “us”. It’s $250M+ Feeding our Future fraud, a blank checkbook ($8B, still TBD years and counting) for Southwest Light rail, $100M+ Child Care Assistance Program Fraud, $18.5M for a Loon Center, $10k for a Dungeons & Dragons podcast, it’s $16M annually for 173 DEI positions in the Walz administration, it’s all the misappropriated COVID funds, it’s a $7.2M Goose Creek rest stop, it’s $1M+ DEI positions in just my local school district alone while 1/3rd of students can’t read/write at grade level and all the teachers say they need more student facing staff, or spending $18B surplus on “us” that has us headed for a $5B deficit. And these are just the one’s recently in MN. You just start adding 0’s to the frequency and severity once you get to the Federal Level.

A proposed school tax would double my property tax !? The village has 300 residents the school had 15 or 17 graduating class . They do not have the tax base to keep it open, either the students . A local business had been supporting them with a grant and now the money has run out . I am against it period . Bad for the teachers but even worse for fixed income people . The thing is the school had the chance to integrate with neighboring schools and refused , stating they wanted to preserve their identity .

BigWerm wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>TheFamousGrouse wrote:</div>
The problem with “government spending” is what are they spending all that money on? Well, it’s…this is awkward…it’s us.

C’mon Grouse, you know that’s not what the problem is. Most people on both sides of the aisle are ok with spending on “us”, the problem is the fraud, corruption and inefficiencies before it reaches “us”. It’s $250M+ Feeding our Future fraud, a blank checkbook ($8B, still TBD years and counting) for Southwest Light rail, $100M+ Child Care Assistance Program Fraud, $18.5M for a Loon Center, $10k for a Dungeons & Dragons podcast, it’s $16M annually for 173 DEI positions in the Walz administration, it’s all the misappropriated COVID funds, it’s a $7.2M Goose Creek rest stop, it’s $1M+ DEI positions in just my local school district alone while 1/3rd of students can’t read/write at grade level and all the teachers say they need more student facing staff, or spending $18B surplus on “us” that has us headed for a $5B deficit. And these are just the one’s recently in MN. You just start adding 0’s to the frequency and severity once you get to the Federal Level.

I believe everything you just put down is at the STATE level. This has NOTHING to do with your property tax.

That would be your income and state sales tax paying for all that.

Not to say there isn’t waste locally as well. But if you or me are not at local meetings making our voice heard, it just complaining to complain.

Anyfish2 wrote:

I believe everything you just put down is at the STATE level. This has NOTHING to do with your property tax.

That would be your income and state sales tax paying for all that.

Agreed, and as my first post on this thread said regarding property taxes, “of all the taxes these are the one’s you have the most impact on, by voicing your opinion to someone in your community, or working to replace them if you think they are spending irresponsibly (school board, county commissioners, city council etc.). Most of these elections are decided by a tiny amount of votes.”

I am new here but have been following this site for along time. First time I thought I needed to chime in. Grouse I agree with everything you said. Everyone here has benefitted one way or another from government. I know it will make people mad to say that but technology,water,power,roads and many other things have all been improved with government help. Businesses have gotten start up money, large corporations get billions in subsidies and some people don’t say a word about it. In 2008 when property values fell counties and such still had contracts and services that need to be paid regardless of our property values. I wish everything would be cheaper but that’s not reality. I wish everyone had great jobs and pay but it’s a large world. Everything and everyone isn’t equal. I have no doubt I will get angry replies here but I’m OK with that. Conversations are good to have.

I definitely don’t have the answers but welcome the questions and conversations as well.

Random tidbit:

There are ~17,300 parcels of property in Wabasha County of all different shapes and sizes.

The county will be operating on an approximate $17 million dollar budget in 2025.

I realize all parcels are not equal, but that would literally equate to $1000 per parcel to cover the entire budget…not the $7900 I’ll pay this year. Progressive taxes are just that – too progressive. I understand flat taxes have their downfall and can’t be implemented to all properties….but “flatter” taxes wouldn’t hurt.

Someone down the road who has a house valued at $200k shouldn’t pay 1/4 of what I do for property taxes given we have the same use of roads, schools, public safety, etc. It doesn’t cost a DIME more to provide local government services to me than it does to them. The broken system simply operates on the idea that they can squeeze more out of me and that I will responsibly pay more than my share of taxes.

***Can we start charging property taxes to churches yet Minnesota? Whoever signed off on that part of state law/the consititution is an idiot***

Your local budgets at city or township are all public record. I’ve done it many times here. get a copy and read it – then read it again. The part that is disgusting is the lack of oversight on overages. When my credit card was maxxed out, additional charges are denied. unfortunately too many overages in gov’t is just passed through. Until a loud mouth jerk like me comes along and asks too many questions. Then I become the A-hole in the township. But I was sick to see the 100’s of thousands dollars wasted. Sure would be nice if that money did what it was suppose to do.

There are ~17,300 parcels of property in Wabasha County of all different shapes and sizes.

Would be interesting to see how many residential properties, commercial properties, recreational, and ag use acres that equates to. Take the equation away of house value and pay flat rate on the land.

Quick google search says that Waubasha County is 523 square miles of land. 27,878,400 x 523 = 14,580,403,200.- thats about $0.001166 per sqft of land for tax