How Can We Keep Our Schools Safe?

  • Kyhl
    Savage
    Posts: 749
    #1763672

    I think there are a lot of people looking at this FL situation and wondering how can a kid who is so obviously disturbed walk in and buy a gun. He had pictures of dead animals and things on social media and was publicly making threats of hurting people. Hence the idea of a waiting period, and background check, if done properly could have potentially stopped him.

    But… maybe you guys are right. Maybe a background check is just too much. Maybe the better solution, along with the other two I posted, is to empower law enforcement to detain such an obviously disturbed / threatening individual prior to him acting. Pick your poison I guess.

    But please have the main takeaway be… there is not one solution for this, we need to work together from multiple angles, and just perhaps, being willing to compromise a little bit to better protect our kids.

    No one should have powers to harass someone that has not committed a crime.
    And there is the problem with your plan. We cannot detain people for saying something stupid. We cannot detain people for thinking bad thoughts. We are stuck waiting for an act to be committed and then using police powers we can react to those actions.
    Our society was designed this way on purpose. I do not want to live in a world controlled by the thought police. Thank God for the ACLU in this instance.

    When I buy a gun, they submit an application and I wait… about 20 minutes. What exactly does this do ? I am not against it taking 3 days to do this check… if it is actually being done correctly and is effective. Nik Cruz bought his weapon from a dealer…? If I posted on-line that I wanted to be a professional school shooter and this was known to anybody with an internet connection, I would think when my form gets entered for the background check, it would say DENIED. Having 39 interactions with law enforcement as a 19 year old, I would think would be red flags. Moreover, I would think if I posted that on the internet, I would have someone knocking on my door to investigate the threat ???

    How do we know if a person was not wrongly targeted by someone on a power trip? I know that does not fit the FL situation but allowing this to be a criteria opens up other situations where someone could be denied their constitutional right because someone was unfairly targeted.

    The problem with these types of ideas is that they rely on someone else to make a judgement and that someone else might not be competent to make the judgement. If it is a right then it is up to the person to act accordingly or for someone directly connected to that person to raise red flags. We can’t give that power to someone else.

    crappie55369
    Mound, MN
    Posts: 5757
    #1763674

    Pseudo security prisons? Really?

    some peoples descriptions of what they want schools to be are more drastic in change than others. As I said I was throwing it out there as a thought for discussion not as a statement of what I think would be a reality. And a sporting event or the airport are quite different places than schools. One you go to several times a year maybe while the other is a daily part of your life for 13+ years. To compare the two as to what the effects of that exposure would amount to is not an equal comparison. In any event its something that concerns me but not greatly at this point and I am not suggesting it be used as an argument against adding security to our schools.

    Jon Jordan
    Keymaster
    St. Paul, Mn
    Posts: 6019
    #1763681

    . And a sporting event or the airport are quite different places than schools.

    They are all the same >>> Gun Free Zones !

    -J.

    Tom Sawvell
    Inactive
    Posts: 9559
    #1763686

    Florida school shooting suspect gets ‘piles’ of fan letters

    http://www.kare11.com/mobile/article/news/nation-world/florida-school-shooting-suspect-gets-piles-of-fan-letters/507-533119516

    He should never see them….the letters. Instead, the feds should be reading them and paying visits to those who have sent them. They should have warrants to search any and all computers, phones and to confiscate any guns said to be owned by the sender. There shouldn’t be a cent’s worth of glory or positive in the shooter’s actions. Piles of mail of this type should equae to piles of investigations.

    biggill
    East Bethel, MN
    Posts: 11321
    #1763688

    Tom, I’m sure they will be following up or watching.

    The point of me posting the article is to show the affect media glorification has on the public and other impressionable people.

    <div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>biggill wrote:</div>
    Pseudo security prisons? Really?

    some peoples descriptions of what they want schools to be are more drastic in change than others. As I said I was throwing it out there as a thought for discussion not as a statement of what I think would be a reality. And a sporting event or the airport are quite different places than schools. One you go to several times a year maybe while the other is a daily part of your life for 13+ years. To compare the two as to what the effects of that exposure would amount to is not an equal comparison. In any event its something that concerns me but not greatly at this point and I am not suggesting it be used as an argument against adding security to our schools.

    Kids attend school between 175-180 days a year. Each MLB team plays 162 games a year during the regular season. Schools typically have less than 5000 attendance daily. MLB has 10,000-50,000 daily. How is that not comparable?

    You brought it up.

    big_g
    Isle, MN
    Posts: 22450
    #1763691

    big G wrote;

    When I buy a gun, they submit an application and I wait… about 20 minutes. What exactly does this do ? I am not against it taking 3 days to do this check… if it is actually being done correctly and is effective. Nik Cruz bought his weapon from a dealer…? If I posted on-line that I wanted to be a professional school shooter and this was known to anybody with an internet connection, I would think when my form gets entered for the background check, it would say DENIED. Having 39 interactions with law enforcement as a 19 year old, I would think would be red flags. Moreover, I would think if I posted that on the internet, I would have someone knocking on my door to investigate the threat ???

    Kyhl wrote;

    How do we know if a person was not wrongly targeted by someone on a power trip? I know that does not fit the FL situation but allowing this to be a criteria opens up other situations where someone could be denied their constitutional right because someone was unfairly targeted.

    The problem with these types of ideas is that they rely on someone else to make a judgement and that someone else might not be competent to make the judgement. If it is a right then it is up to the person to act accordingly or for someone directly connected to that person to raise red flags. We can’t give that power to someone else.

    [/quote]

    big G wrote;

    I did not say that he should be denied a right because he had 39 interactions with LE… I said it should “raise red flags”… maybe his application takes a little longer to actually investigate.. if they were speeding tickets or terrorist threats, that’s all.

    crappie55369
    Mound, MN
    Posts: 5757
    #1763693

    Kids attend school between 175-180 days a year. Each MLB team plays 162 games a year during the regular season. How is that not comparable?

    If your kid goes to every ball game for 13+ years straight then yes its comparable. Of course they would be skipping school for that to happen.

    I don’t think you understand what I am saying. I am saying I have concerns about the psychological impact of walking into a building 180x a year for 13 years that is being talked about as being fortified like a prison and being “educated, nurtured, growing up in” that environment. I am saying that the cumulative exposure to that environment raises concerns with me. I am saying something about surrounding my kids with armed men in plain site to protect against evil in the world gives me the hebe-jeebes. I am saying I value innocence in children and I think it is important to their development to be able to be innocent while they are children and not have armed security forces be a part of their everyday existence starting at age 5. Having said that I also agree measures need to be taken to change what is happening today

    saugeye-steve
    Posts: 293
    #1763694

    If Hillary had won we wouldn’t be having this discussion.

    big_g
    Isle, MN
    Posts: 22450
    #1763725

    I will say, since Nov 2016, EVERYTHING is now the end of the world and if you don’t agree with certain people, you are the devil himself. What did they do for so called “news” before then ?

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