House passes carbon-free energy requirement HF7

glenn57 wrote:

mayhaps draw that line about clearwater!!!!!

Ok, but only for the donuts.
DT

Carbon footprint

go to 7:45 mark and watch the reality.

“According to the U.S. Energy Information Administration, the average U.S. home uses 893 kilowatt-hours (kWh) of electricity per month. Per the U.S. Wind Turbine Database, the mean capacity of wind turbines that achieved commercial operations in 2020 is 2.75 megawatts (MW). At a 42% capacity factor (i.e., the average among recently built wind turbines in the United States, per the 2021 edition of the U.S. Department of Energy’s Land-Based Wind Market Report), that average turbine would generate over 843,000 kWh per month—enough for more than 940 average U.S. homes.”

Eelpoutguy wrote:

I don’t k now how it is possible but it looks like this is where the future for energy is.
Pretty much a game changer. We are a ways off though.

A major breakthrough has been announced by US scientists in the race to recreate nuclear fusion.

Physicists have pursued the technology for decades as it promises a potential source of near-limitless clean energy.

On Tuesday researchers confirmed they have overcome a major barrier – producing more energy from a fusion experiment than was put in.

I saw this as well and did a few quick Google searches and reads. I’m in the boat of this being probably “the future” as well.

I’m thinking more like the end of the century vs. 20 years from now. The governments of the world are far too invested in some of the heavy metal mining, fossil fuel, “today’s green energy”, etc. production for a change anytime soon. The biggest variable with energy production is not what we are capable of via science, rather whether or not it can be profitable for those in charge (world leaders, lawmakers, CEOs, and so on)

What would really push this Nuclear Fusion down the road is some wealthy person who doesnt give a damn about mainstream politics and cowtowing to anyone (like Elon Musk) to invest in it and get it really rolling. No chance someone like Gates would do it.

CaptainMusky wrote:

What would really push this Nuclear Fusion down the road is some wealthy person who doesnt give a damn about mainstream politics and cowtowing to anyone (like Elon Musk) to invest in it and get it really rolling. No chance someone like Gates would do it.

Musk: https://futurism.com/elon-musk-slams-fusion

Other billionaires, like Amazon founder and noted Musk rival Jeff Bezos, do believe in a greener future powered by fusion reactors. Last year, news emerged that Bezos was investing in Canadian fusion energy startup General Fusion.

Microsoft founder Bill Gates and Virgin CEO Richard Branson have also invested in fusion tech.

CaptainMusky wrote:

What would really push this Nuclear Fusion down the road is some wealthy person who doesnt give a damn about mainstream politics and cowtowing to anyone (like Elon Musk) to invest in it and get it really rolling. No chance someone like Gates would do it.

Two links in the same post never works for me.

Gates: https://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherhelman/2022/01/02/fueled-by-billionaire-dollars-nuclear-fusion-enters-a-new-age/?sh=79e249f929f3

That puts Helion in a race with Boston-based Commonwealth Fusion Systems, an MIT spinoff, which raised $1.8 billion from investors including Bill Gates and George Soros.

Brittman wrote:

California is an example of social agenda outpacing any realistic capabilities …
The pace at which retirees and remote workers are leaving California is amazing. What is disappointing is that often they bring their “blue” politics with them. Austin and Nashville are just two examples.

In 2021, about 360,000 people relocated from California to another state–or, in some cases, country. That’s up from about 275,000 the year before, and both of those numbers represent a significant increase from pre-pandemic departure rates.

Texas is currently the number one destination state for those leaving California. That’s been true for several years, though some of the other top destination states have shifted recently.

Research from UCLA showed that between 2015 and 2019, Texas held the number one slot. The other most common destination states were Arizona, Nevada, Washington and Oregon.

It should be interesting to see the shift in voting in those and other states as more and more people leave Calf. I’ll bet the #’s are way higher from 2022. I would not be surprised if its Double what it was in 2021.

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“Net zero” is one of the single most telling signs of the decades-long decline in American education, specifically STEM education.

As I read this thread and the accompanying links it just reinforces what I already know from using my brain…. we are being fed a load of BS to accomplish the goal of someone who already has more money than they need to make even more and keep them in their cozy little seats at the public trough.
Someone mentioned it too: push hard enough and far enough and when the pendulum finally swings back maybe you’ll have made some headway on your electric energy nonsense. As it stands the current mindset ( democrat OR republican) were never going to make this change in a timely manner. The ONLY GOOD I see coming from the current administration is forcing a different energy solution onto us. Unfortunately that solution is not going to work and “kills” entire industries and jobs and infrastructure supports in the process. Conversely WELFARE will never change because no one wants to cut off the generational process and impact ONE generation to solve the problem. Just keep continuing the handouts and reinforcing the lifestyle.
“Fuel” the private sector ( $$$ incentives) to come up with a new source AND THEN USE THE NEW SOURCE – Our govt will NEVER get that done. But we will still be up against the big monopolies that will try to squelch and new sources as it will directly impact their revenues and the feds will support them on this because they spend so much money on helping these same idiots get re-elected.
Get rid of the PAC’s and lobbyists in Washington for a start.
RIGHT NOW there is nothing that makes sense about our electric energy push. Hell, read the post that Bigwerm attached – Nearly 500,000 gallons of water are used to extract one ton of lithium and there 17 pounds of it in each battery?!?! That’s 29, 400 batteries. AT that rate we won’t need to worry about lead jigs cause there aint gonna be no water to fish in.
We are so intertwined and “clueless” because none of the “real” information is being spread – what comes out is carefully controlled by the current administration ( No? this is the same administration that brought you the new position of “Ministry of Disinformation ( or whatever they called it).

Someone else referenced this:
The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples’ money
Margaret Thatcher – Prime Minister United Kingdom 1979-1990

Some other favorites for the current thread….. It’s not like some of our current issues are new news…..

“Democracy must be something more than two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner.” James Bovard (civil libertarian)

Everyone wants to live at the expense of the State. They forget that the State lives at the expense of everyone.
Frederic Bastiat – 19th Century French classical liberal theorist, political economist,

“When the powers of state, that have been mandated to reach out and protect the interest of people, begin to usurp the Constitution and undermine our laws, people must rise up and speak against the regime. If the citizens fail to hear that call, they should be charged with patriotic treason.”
Theodore Roosevelt, the 26th President of the United States (1901-1909)

Slums may be breeding grounds of crime and poverty but middle class suburbs are incubators of apathy and delirium.
Cyril Connoly (author)

Earth provides enough to satisfy every man’s need but not every man’s greed.
Mohandes K. Gandhi (major political and spiritual leader of India)

“A government that robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul. ”
Unknown

I’m not upset that you lied to me, I’m upset that from now on I can’t believe you –
Nietzsche – 19th century philosopher and poet

Opinion is really the lowest form of human knowledge. It requires no accountability, no understanding. The highest form of knowledge is empathy, for it requires us to suspend our egos and live in another’s world.
Bill Bullard – lawyer, former House member and Senator in Michigan

Ya got a few good ones there Umy.

Hard Water Fan wrote:

So where do they think the magical carbon free power is going to come from?

largest source of carbon free energy = nuclear

pick your poison

Seems like the MN government didn’t go far enough. Both cement and steel are significant contributors of the world’s CO2. The legislator should have included the equal reduction of the use of concrete, steel, and asphalt (Oil derived) by the same amount and same time frame. It’s easy to pick on the demon that has been easy to point out.

Art Green wrote:

“According to the U.S. Energy Information Administration, the average U.S. home uses 893 kilowatt-hours (kWh) of electricity per month. Per the U.S. Wind Turbine Database, the mean capacity of wind turbines that achieved commercial operations in 2020 is 2.75 megawatts (MW). At a 42% capacity factor (i.e., the average among recently built wind turbines in the United States, per the 2021 edition of the U.S. Department of Energy’s Land-Based Wind Market Report), that average turbine would generate over 843,000 kWh per month—enough for more than 940 average U.S. homes.”

But that doesn’t take into account transportation (line) losses, commercial/industrial use, and assumes that electricity is consumed at a constant rate throughout the day(it isn’t).

Great read UMY !!

This entire debate is premised upon the fallacy that we are the cause of climate change. Absent an overactive political media campaign, the REAL science behind the debate is anything but conclusive. Except for some “scientists” (and I use the term loosely) massaging a ton of data, the only link between us and global warming is a geo/solar cycle that repeats itself about every 600-700 years. And, you guessed it, we’re fast approaching another peak in that cycle. This cycle is born out in the written, tree ring, ice core and sedimentary records. So if we didn’t cause all those events prior to fossil fuels, event’s that corrected themselves after 50 or so years, isn’t it presumptuous to assume that this time it’s our fault?

Gitchi Gummi wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Hard Water Fan wrote:</div>
So where do they think the magical carbon free power is going to come from?

largest source of carbon free energy = nuclear

pick your poison

NONONONONONO NOT THAT KIND OF CLEAN ENERGY REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE.
and that ladys and gents is how you know that climate change is a scam. Solving the issue makes the grifters go away, makes them lose their “power” and makes them irrelevant

Unicorn farts contain zero carbon, and the exhaust smells like pumpkin pie.

Oh, waitaminute. unicorns are an endangered species. Kinda like intelligent politicians & bureaucrats.

duh queen wrote:

Oh, waitaminute. unicorns are an endangered species. Kinda like intelligent politicians & bureaucrats.

I heard they went the way of the mammoth after 1800

duh queen wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Art Green wrote:</div>
“According to the U.S. Energy Information Administration, the average U.S. home uses 893 kilowatt-hours (kWh) of electricity per month. Per the U.S. Wind Turbine Database, the mean capacity of wind turbines that achieved commercial operations in 2020 is 2.75 megawatts (MW). At a 42% capacity factor (i.e., the average among recently built wind turbines in the United States, per the 2021 edition of the U.S. Department of Energy’s Land-Based Wind Market Report), that average turbine would generate over 843,000 kWh per month—enough for more than 940 average U.S. homes.”

But that doesn’t take into account transportation (line) losses, commercial/industrial use, and assumes that electricity is consumed at a constant rate throughout the day(it isn’t).

That’s right. I was pointing out the low percentage of capacity usage. Lets put up some more though.

Gitchi Gummi wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Hard Water Fan wrote:</div>
So where do they think the magical carbon free power is going to come from?

largest source of carbon free energy = nuclear

pick your poison

I agree about nuclear, but my understanding is that this bill does not allow for the use of nuclear. So maybe I should have stated:

So where do they think the magical carbon free power is going to come from if they don’t allow nuclear?

THe new nuclear designs are very cool. Never say never ( Chernobyl, 3Mile Island) but the way they have them designed now the meltdown, if any occurred, would directly stop itself by how it would meltdown in the first place – virtually “accident free” although nothing man puts his hand to is accident free.
Face it folks, they don’t want clean energy in “your” way – they want it “their” way ( puts money in their pockets and reduces your money in the process.
To think any party is looking out for your interests is completely naive!
See again…..

Earth provides enough to satisfy every man’s need but not every man’s greed.
Mohandes K. Gandhi (major political and spiritual leader of India)

“A government that robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul. ”
Unknown

I’m not upset that you lied to me, I’m upset that from now on I can’t believe you –
Nietzsche – 19th century philosopher and poet

UMY, you forgot Winston S Churchill:
‘I contend that for a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up…

Classic Churchill, be speaking German without him

Been using this one lately. Seems appropriate for the times.

“Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.” -Mark Twain

IDO is the dictionary definition of group think.

Matt Moen wrote:

IDO is the dictionary definition of group think.

All fun and games until you gotta give up your boat that spews carbon emissions, leaks a tiny bit of fuel, and disturbs fish with noise pollution. All for the greater good amaright?!

Incrementalism is real

Art Green wrote:

“According to the U.S. Energy Information Administration, the average U.S. home uses 893 kilowatt-hours (kWh) of electricity per month. Per the U.S. Wind Turbine Database, the mean capacity of wind turbines that achieved commercial operations in 2020 is 2.75 megawatts (MW). At a 42% capacity factor (i.e., the average among recently built wind turbines in the United States, per the 2021 edition of the U.S. Department of Energy’s Land-Based Wind Market Report), that average turbine would generate over 843,000 kWh per month—enough for more than 940 average U.S. homes.”

Now double the power consumption of each home to make up for the electric vehicle, add in business use and we end up needing twice the wind turbines we have now.
That’s a lot of wind turbines.