Timber Wolf Problem

This was in the Chetek WI. paper a couple of weeks ago. It is the remains of a 750 lb, heifer which was eaten in less than 12 hours.

I got this email. For all the “animal lovers” who say people never see wolves and never come into contact with them is wrong. I personally have seen this many times. these kind of encounters are NOT (I repeat) NOT rare. Happen all the time, they are just not reported! This story is directly from a DNR CO. Not some made up B as in B, S as in S.

The wolves appeared shortly after Scott Wundinich shot and gutted a deer, then climbed back into his stand.

“Four or five, including a pitch-black male, came running out of the woods together,” recalled Wundinich, 48, of Eveleth, Minn. “I looked to my left and saw three more. There were three or four more on my other side. I was stunned. I yelled and screamed, but they pretty much ignored me. They paced back and forth. They wanted my deer and the gut pile.”

Despite firing several shots to try to scare away the wolves, they lurked, sometimes howling and barking, about 50 yards from Wundinich’s stand for 45 minutes.

“I was scared,” he said. “I’ve been hunting since I was 12 and I’ve never seen anything like this. It was a real humbling, eerie feeling.”

Afraid to get down, Wundinich hunkered in his stand until darkness descended on the woods near Lake Vermilion in northeastern Minnesota.

Then, with his rifle still loaded, he cautiously climbed down.

“I could hear them,” he said.

With a small flashlight in his mouth, he scrambled to his ATV about 120 yards away. “I started it up and drove out of the woods as fast as I could go.”

Wildlife officials say the encounter with wolves was unusual. But Wundinich and others, including some northern Minnesota conservation officers, say such encounters and sightings there are becoming more common.

“I’d say almost 50 percent of the deer camps I’ve checked have said they’ve seen wolves,” said Dan Starr, Department of Natural Resources conservation officer in Tower. “That has increased. They [wolves] are getting pretty bold.”

Said Wundinich: “We have an unmanaged population of wolves in northern Minnesota. They are becoming a problem.”

Dan Stark, a DNR wolf specialist, said he hasn’t received more calls about human-wolf encounters. Surveys done in 2007-2008 estimate the state’s wolf population at about 3,000. It’s unknown if that number has increased since then.

He said Wundinich’s experience is unusual because wolves generally don’t stand their ground, even with food present.

“I’ve walked in on wolves feeding, and they scattered,” he said. But a downed deer could affect their behavior.

“I’ve had them bark and howl at me, but they seem to keep a certain distance. I probably wouldn’t get down from a stand and try to drag the deer off.”

Wolf attacks in North America on humans are extremely rare. But that didn’t ease Wundinich’s mind when he was in his stand with a pack of wolves below Nov. 8. Here’s what Wundinich said happened:

With his dad and nephew hunting elsewhere, he shot a small buck about 3:50 p.m. He climbed down and gutted the deer. Because he couldn’t legally operate his ATV until after shooting hours (a half-hour after sunset), he went back into his stand. That’s when the wolves showed up.

He stood up and made noise. “They scampered off a bit, but it didn’t scare them,” he said. He shot his 30.06 rifle twice in the air. “They ran about 45 yards away on top of a hill and started howling.” Unsure what to do, he used his cell phone to call his dad at the cabin, who told him to call Starr, the local conservation officer, whom Wundinich knows.

“He [Starr] said fire some shots to scare them. I told him I had done that,” Wundinich said. “He said to leave the deer.”

After a while, he fired two more shots, then reloaded his rifle. “I told him if I was attacked, I would shoot,” Wundinich said. Wolves are protected and managed under the federal Endangered Species Act, but people can kill them to defend themselves.

Sometime after 5 p.m. Wundinich finally climbed down, got to his four-wheeler in the dark and sped to his cabin, less than a mile away. Armed with his rifle, he and his nephew each drove four-wheelers back to retrieve his deer.

“The gut pile was mostly gone and they bit into the hindquarters and neck and chewed on an ear,” he said.

Wundinich said he was reluctant to tell anyone about the experience because he feared no one would believe him. Starr, however, mentioned the incident in his weekly report, which is distributed to news media. He said he has no reason to doubt Wundinich’s story.

“He was legitimately shook up,” Starr said.

Other conservation officers have received complaints from hunters, saying there are too many wolves and too few deer. DNR officials say deer numbers are down because of recent tough winters and liberal hunting regulations. Stark, the wolf biologist, said a lengthy DNR deer study in the Grand Rapids area showed that wolves kill about 5 to 10 percent of does yearly. Other studies estimate wolves kill 45,000 to 60,000 deer yearly. In recent years, hunters have harvested 220,000 to 250,000 deer.

As for Wundinich, he planned to be back in his stand this weekend, the last of the regular firearms season, with his wolf encounter fresh on his mind.

“I’ll never forget it as long as I live,” he said.

Fishhunter,

I guess I look at things differently. That would be a great experience IMO. What an opportunity to get some awesome pictures.

I have had a couple chances to see wolves in the Hill City and Orr areas where I frequent. Nothing like that though.

I’ve slept on the side of a mountain next to my moose kill. The horses alerted us to a wolf pack that lurked around the perimeter all night long. Sure it was unnerving, but exciting at the same time.

I would have been nervous and excited in Wundinich’s situation as well.

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Any healthy deer can outrun any wolf in wooded land and its likely that the ones being found dead from wolves, if it was a wolf, probably wasn’t real healthy to start with.

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Seriously, you honestly beleive that statement? Seriously, you must be joking. If you think the only deer that wolves kill are the weak and old, you really should do some research on this.

Here are a just a couple examples:

#1 Winter time with high snow levels. Wolves can run on to of the snow while deer cannot. Wolves have a clear advantage and target any and all deer.

#2 Wolves hunt in packs right? Yes, I am correct. Wolves run healthy deer to the point of exhaustion and then move in for the easy kill.

There has also been research that shows wolves are also killing for the thrill. They have been taking down deer and then not even eating them.

For all the people on here who think they are better than everyone else because the only opinion that matters is yours. This morning when you woke up you put your pants on the same way I did, one leg at a time. You and your opinion are no better than mine or anybody else’s.

You can argue all day about the wolves and how they should not be touched, I can respect your opinion. I also don’t plan on trying to change your mind because it isn’t going to happen, I realize that.

But, for the people who head up north once a year to join in the great pumpkin army and hunt for deer. You are there a short amount of time and do not see or deal with the reality of a high population of this type of predator and their effects.

My mind is rooted deep with the history of the devastation they have done to the cattle and sheep industry in the past. If allowed history will repeat itself and people will be dealing with them again. Maybe that is a good thing, the government trappers will be back in business. We can start shooting them from planes and baiting and poisoning them again.

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Right back at ya, dude. Which leg do you start with? You and I are probably a lot more alike than you think.

And to be perfectly clear on a couple things….I spend a great deal of time “up” there and see plenty of both ends of this candle. Much of it first hand with living animals, that where I root my history.

Secondly, I don’t hunt up there. I leave the spruce heifers for the locals.

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DNR officials say deer numbers are down because of recent tough winters and liberal hunting regulations.

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See. It’s our own fault.

Do either MN or WI have programs that monitor the wolf population and at what point will they decide that there are to many and to reduce that number by either trapping or hunting them?

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Alyshia Berzyck, of Minnesota, was attacked and killed by a wolf on a chain on June 3, 1989. The wolf tore up her kidney, liver and bit a hole through her aorta. One month later, on July 1, 1989, Peter Lemke, 5, lost 12 inches of his intestine and colon and suffered bites to his stomach, neck, legs, arms and back in another wolf attack in Kenyon, Minnesota.

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Alright….There is no documented incidents of humans being attacked, or killed, by a wild wolf, not being held captive in any way. You need to take a trip to Kenyo and see what the area might hold for a wolf. The only way you’d see one there is on a leash or in a cage.

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Thanks for clarifying, a wild wolf

big G

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If wolves are causing problems (I don’t know, I’m not a hunter), it’s up to you, if you call yourself a sportsman, to take it to the DNR and present your case. Taking the law into your own hands is not okay.

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you’ve obviously never tried to convince the DNR in this state of anything, nor do you follow the regulations they currently have for hunting, and the lack of habitat management in this state, by said DNR.

I say “Shoot, Shovel, and Shut-Up”…

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…and Shut-Up”…

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That includes when you get caught, except I would add, take your punishment like a man.

I am tired of the walleye eating all the young bass in my lake and eating all the adult bass food sources. I am going to apply club, shovel and shut up.

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you’ve obviously never tried to convince the DNR in this state of anything,

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What I have seen at age 62 is the special interest groups getting their way over and over and the sportsmen/women/whatever shooting themselves in the foot.

I’ve watched trap shooters disreguard the anti gun crowd because “they” weren’t part of the handgun control that was trying to be enacted, I’ve watch the ATV and snowmobile crowd go at each other over trails and both lost ground to the activists who wanted both of them out.
The list goes on….

I’ve watch more damage being done because of infighting than I care to think of, so when you say “Have you ever”
I’d ask, have you ever got together as a united front???

Just a thought.
Al

The WI DNR started pounding excuses up are butts before the 2009 deer season ever opened telling us all why we are not going to see any number of deer. How stupid do they think the public is? T zone hunts and a countless number of available antler less tags has led to a sad deer herd in Wisconsin. The DNR should be ashamed of themselves. I have been to there open public meetings and they do not listen to a thing you or I have to say. Instead they collect are info and rephrase things to make it look like they got the point.
Example…..No T zones the year of 2009, they just renamed it as herd reduction. Look at last years zones and this years zones, no change except for the name. They are playing us for stupid

So with that, do some of you honestly believe the DNR is going to listen to anyone about the wolf problem?

The only way it will happen is if the public gets themselves organized and take a shot at them were it hurts, in the wallet. The DNR has forgotten, they do work for us. We need to tell them to take there tags and stick em where the sun don’t shine.

And next time I here from the DNR we are suppose to get the younger people involved, I am going to ask right back…”how do I compete with video games when there is nothing to see in the woods anymore?” Good luck with that!!!

It might not be right to use the wolf phrase SSS in an open forum but…..If you think the DNR is here to listen and help, you are clueless

There is a problem with both the wolf and deer herd and no help to come. Heck, lets extend the deer season next year in Wisconsin….that is what the DNR is doing to help

And before anyone tells me they seen a hundred deer this year, make sure to tell me it was in a Northern National forest before I tell you your full of

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The WI DNR started pounding excuses up are butts before the 2009 deer season ever opened telling us all why we are not going to see any number of deer. How stupid do they think the public is? T zone hunts and a countless number of available antler less tags has led to a sad deer herd in Wisconsin. The DNR should be ashamed of themselves. I have been to there open public meetings and they do not listen to a thing you or I have to say. Instead they collect are info and rephrase things to make it look like they got the point.
Example…..No T zones the year of 2009, they just renamed it as herd reduction. Look at last years zones and this years zones, no change except for the name. They are playing us for stupid

So with that, do some of you honestly believe the DNR is going to listen to anyone about the wolf problem?

The only way it will happen is if the public gets themselves organized and take a shot at them were it hurts, in the wallet. The DNR has forgotten, they do work for us. We need to tell them to take there tags and stick em where the sun don’t shine.

And next time I here from the DNR we are suppose to get the younger people involved, I am going to ask right back…”how do I compete with video games when there is nothing to see in the woods anymore?” Good luck with that!!!

It might not be right to use the wolf phrase SSS in an open forum but…..If you think the DNR is here to listen and help, you are clueless

There is a problem with both the wolf and deer herd and no help to come. Heck, lets extend the deer season next year in Wisconsin….that is what the DNR is doing to help

And before anyone tells me they seen a hundred deer this year, make sure to tell me it was in a Northern National forest before I tell you your full of

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Bravo Brent! Exactly what I have been saying. There is an alterior motive of some kind OR the DNR is soley responsible for systimaticaly destroying the deer herd. No different than over fishing a lake. I know one person that bow shot 5 deer last Dec in N. Wis. That mean he removed 10-15 deer from that herd this year. Assuming many deer have twins. That is one person. There are thousands of greedy people doing the same thing but the law is on their side. The DNR has destroyed our public deer herd. The wolves only have a small part. I’m sure they play a bigger role in some areas and I support culling the pack in those situations. Again let me go on record as saying I fervently beleive the DNR has destroyed our once vibrant deer herd.

Bret you are right on with your post. I couldn’t have said it better. Good job

I am not following. How has the Wis. DNR lowered the deer numbers in Wisconsin or are you saying they have done nothing to bring the numbers up?

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I am not following. How has the Wis. DNR lowered the deer numbers in Wisconsin or are you saying they have done nothing to bring the numbers up?

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For the last couple years now Doe tags and seasons have become out of hand. People without any restraints have taken more than there fare share of antler less deer, by doing this the mature breeding does disappear. Every doe taken is 1-2 more deer that could be seen the next season. The tags that were handed out so liberally is what has wiped out the herd, for this I blame the DNR (for the abundant tags and promoting an over harvest) and, the people who took advantage of the tags without seeing what has been happening the last 4 seasons in Wisconsin. Yes, the DNR has done nothing to bring these numbers back up.

To bring the deer numbers back it will take a buck only season in many units and, a big cut back in antler less tags in other units. I also believe as others, the DNR has been bought off by the insurance company’s…how flippin’ stupid to believe an insurance company is loosing money today. I don’t know about everyone else but my rates just go up. Plus, more cars more revenue, and yes….a better chance a deer is going to get hit but I don’t see where they lost money.

Another thing that the DNR has helped do with the slaughter, especially in Northern Wisconsin, lost revenue for local resorts and establishments. There are not near the people running to the North woods. Are crew of 9 never had a problem being seated no matter where we visited.

Opening morning there were 3 shots that rang out in a distance through out the whole day, if you ever sat in a tree stand opening morning you know that’s not right, know matter the weather conditions, post rut, pre rut or any other excuse the DNR is preparing to give us, the people who purchase the tags and by doing so, pay a wage to insure are resource is takin’ care of.

The DNR does not listen to the people that are actually spending there time in the woods, bottom line

For those that have there own land and are able to manage there own deer, my hats of to you. Please keep it healthy because if the DNR wakes up, you are keeping the breeders alive

Just my 4 cents worth pug

Wasn’t it about 4 years ago when they wanted to cut down the deep population because of diseased deer?

I thought that was the plan. Thin the WI deer herds to a level that wouldn’t allow the disease to spread?

The virus was found in Southeast-Mid WI. Never state wide and, just as a note: VHS has been around before you are I were born. The DNR finally got some fancy stuff in the lab 4-5 years ago that tested for VHS.
Another BS reason in there book to take out the deer herd. VHS was and still is found throughout the western states many, many years ago and there has been no big push to kill off the Elk or Deer herd of which it has been found in.

No kidding! By the way it was portrayed in the media a few years back the average Bk would never have guessed.

Thanks Bret

What I’m saying Pugs is the dnr in wi. is doing their best to decimate the herd we once had. The dnr went so far as to entertain the idea of having a 3 week hunting season in 2010. Anyone with a brain the size of a pea can tell you that would be detremental to the herd, cause that would be prime rutting season for deer.Imo the dnr better quit bitin the hand that feeds them, they would like for the general public to think they have all the knowledge and wisdom on the subject,b.s. They just keep coming up with more brain farts. How do I spell educated idiots—– D.N.R. I have seen quite a few deer seasons come and go, and I for one am tired of the nonsense.Hopefully I’ve cleared a few things up for you Pugs, if not I’ll answer more questions.

Just like fishing isn’t called catching…hunting isn’t called shooting.

Heaven forbid you guys don’t get 10 chances at your deer this particular year, I guess thats why they call it hunting.

Oh but there has to be ONE reason for this, and it definitely isn’t the fault of the biggest predator of them all (humans).

Thats right the humans we call d.n.r. Thank you for clarifing the fact Lax

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For the last couple years now Doe tags and seasons have become out of hand. People without any restraints have taken more than there fare share of antler less deer, by doing this the mature breeding does disappear. Every doe taken is 1-2 more deer that could be seen the next season. The tags that were handed out so liberally is what has wiped out the herd, for this I blame the DNR (for the abundant tags and promoting an over harvest) and, the people who took advantage of the tags without seeing what has been happening the last 4 seasons in Wisconsin. Yes, the DNR has done nothing to bring these numbers back up.

To bring the deer numbers back it will take a buck only season in many units and, a big cut back in antler less tags in other units. I also believe as others, the DNR has been bought off by the insurance company’s…how flippin’ stupid to believe an insurance company is loosing money today. I don’t know about everyone else but my rates just go up. Plus, more cars more revenue, and yes….a better chance a deer is going to get hit but I don’t see where they lost money.

Another thing that the DNR has helped do with the slaughter, especially in Northern Wisconsin, lost revenue for local resorts and establishments. There are not near the people running to the North woods. Are crew of 9 never had a problem being seated no matter where we visited.

Opening morning there were 3 shots that rang out in a distance through out the whole day, if you ever sat in a tree stand opening morning you know that’s not right, know matter the weather conditions, post rut, pre rut or any other excuse the DNR is preparing to give us, the people who purchase the tags and by doing so, pay a wage to insure are resource is takin’ care of.

The DNR does not listen to the people that are actually spending there time in the woods, bottom line

For those that have there own land and are able to manage there own deer, my hats of to you. Please keep it healthy because if the DNR wakes up, you are keeping the breeders alive
Just my 4 cents worth pug

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And there sir, you have hit the nail squarely on the head.
Very good read and lots of truths!

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Just like fishing isn’t called catching…hunting isn’t called shooting.

Heaven forbid you guys don’t get 10 chances at your deer this particular year, I guess thats why they call it hunting.

Oh but there has to be ONE reason for this, and it definitely isn’t the fault of the biggest predator of them all (humans).

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You are speaking to the wrong crowd dude! If you have read any of the comments made, not a one person here complained about not getting 10 chances at a deer. The complaints are, the deer are not there to even see. Now pull your 10-15 year old kid away from his video games and tell him how much fun he or she is going to have hunting in the great North woods!!!!!!

Yep humans have the control on pulling the trigger but in a lot of cases greed keeps some people from thinking straight. The DNR brought out the best in the greedy ones by supplying a countless number of tags. Earn a buck was also mandatory so the buck hunters that do not want to shoot a doe, had to shoot a doe if they wanted a chance at there buck. This is the crap that has to stop.

They call it hunting when there is something to hunt. You might as well call the Wisconsin deer hunt a stroll in the woods these days.

Sorry if you don’t understand but maybe you should get your off the couch and head to the Northern zones and see what people are talking about

Since the thread starts off ranting and is TITLED about no deer=wolves…I found it very fitting to comment on the nature of the thread! You said it yourself, greedy humans with no self control.

Take a look at a map Mr. Clark as you can see Amery is considerably farther north than Sparta and I’ve seen deer all 11 years of my hunting career (yes that means I’m 23, no 15yr old kid for me). Get your off the couch off the couch and comment at a useful forum. I’ll take the high road and choose not to make assumptions about your life.

My couch commit might have been out there, sorry if it offended anyone, I’m a little uptight after 7 out of 9 guys never seen a deer the first 4 days of the season, and we do hunt hard. Just a walk in the woods is proof the sign is not there.

When I talk about the Northern units I’m talking Bayfield, Iron, Vilas, Forest…well you get it, the county’s North of Hwy 8. The State Forest and National Forest have been whooped on for to long. As for the topic (Wolfs)…..bad time to try and introduce wolfs to the area if you ask me. That is where I have been going with the deer herd.

I to have seen deer, only because of a lease in Cataract, Monroe County (Private land not Public). With that said, there are not near the deer in this area either and I refuse to shoot a doe for that reason.

Listen to the people in the woods, the DNR flat out said last year “we overestimated the deer herd and under estimated the bears”. No bull hey, the people that have been spending the time in the woods have been telling them that for years now. They just don’t seem to care if you were to ask me…..in one ear and out the other.

I have been in the woods for 38 years now and this is the worst I recall ever seeing the deer population. I know it’s just not me with the beef, spend sometime up North and listen to the locals. Heck, listen to the locals around here this year. It is not going to get any better either if we all just sit around waiting for the DNR to do something about it. Therefore….someone better start ranting and raving!!

Agreed…I can appreciate civilized discussion, versus low blows right off the bat.

A key term, we are not “introducing” wolves. We are REintroducing wolves…they’ve been here loooooong before us.

Ok, I got it. Not only am I from Minni, but I am also not a hunter. However that doesn’t mean I am not interested or even concerned with conservation matters relating to hunters no matter where they live. Thanks for bringing me up to speed. I definitely would have to side with you WI deer hunters.

This has been a very lively thread!!!

I think there is much work to do with the intelligent management of our Upper Midwest Deer Herd

Dog

Now that it has bring brought up again, I apologize for the miss information. I did not mean VHS virus, it is CWD….guess my emotions had the best of me there

I would say this goes not only for Wisconsin, but also Minnesota and North Dakota. I was fortunate enough to have multiple chances/sightings of deer this year and managed to fill my tag, however; it wasn’t easy and lots of work to get them. This is also the first year in 7 I have not seen one buck, nothing from a spike to a mature buck.