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My guess is the “guides” who did get licensed are loving this. It eliminates competition for them which puts more money in their pocket.
Must be other “guides” your referring to. Hasn’t done nothing for or against me.
I think the speed limit is to slow, but I follow it or pay the ticket…and complain about it too I guess.
Yes they guys er…guides that took the time, trouble and expense to follow the law should be loving it. Whether the see more of the almighty $buck$ or not.
I think the government has went overboard so to speak but nothing new there. If guides have all this training–what about other jobs that impact the public. Cab Drivers handle more people each year than guides but I am betting their testing is no where near as stringent. How many other jobs out there fly under the radar but because the Coast Guard has time on it’s hands it has singled out one group to heavy hand. Just my opinion by the way 
I can see these rules for a barge captain or the tow captains for the local tow companies that transfer small tows to the various small docks along the Mississippi. These guys are pushing tows and are on federal waterways. I didn’t know it took another liscense and now maybe another test to guide on a reserve on a federal waterway? I realize that the government is probably trying to make it as easy and uncomplicated as possible and thats why im saying its all to complicated just to take someone fishing.
For the clients sake there has to be requirements for thier safety and those are good ideas but where does fingerprinting, letters of recomendation and someones past history come into play and what good does it do. All this does is complicate things for potential guides or guides that have been working on the river for a long time. What were the requirements 15 to 20 years ago, were they this complicated and what was wrong with them then that made these people think that more rules are needed now, it just dosen’t make sense to complicate things for guys who want to be a guide. Can anyone here explain to me why some of these requirements are needed and what they do and give everyone a good reason.
I can see the cpr and medical requirements but not some of the others ones. Some may ask why should he care unless hes going to be a guide, its all the red tape and nonsense that it creats and makes it harder and will put some guys out of business who have been on the river guideing for several years, does the government really want to put these guys out of business with all the hassels, maybe they should take another long hard look at it and reconsider the requirements for a simple guides liscense just to catch fish, its not pushing tows.
With all the talk about the six pack license what happens if you get caught with out one what happens just wondering
For and example this is what happened this weekend.
The coast guard was checking a lot of the boats during the derby in Algoma this last weekend. One of the boats didn’t have the appropriate safety equipment. He was hulled off in handcuffs and will fined. Not sure what the fine will be but each offense can reach up to $10,000.
Hey Guys,
Being a Fellow hoop jumper I’ll tell ya we have seen a lot of part-time guides leave the business here on the Border. Don’t get me wrong there are plenty of guys guiding under the table still though. I carry a 3 ring binder in a water proof container in my boat with all my proper licensing. There are several documents in which need to be ready to be displayed. On top of the requirements stated above we also guide in the National Park up here, so have to go through proper licensing with the park service as well. I’ve found the Coast Guards, CO’s and Park Service enforcement to be very cordial and matter of fact. When presenting by binder in a very organized matter with my business cards, mission statements…. We can just talk about the weather. I’ve chose to add things instead of meet the requirements. Seems not having proper licensing we all know we need would provide too much undue stress all day on the water WONDERING. I’ll let other guys deal with that!! I certainly can’t say I’m completely against licensing though. The Twic addition had many rolling their eyes up here also as most feel it was repetitive background checks and fingerprinting from our captains license. In my understanding the reasoning for having to carry a TWIC card is for entering unsecured Ports. We don’t have one here on Rainy Lake, but they are lumping us in for simplification on their end. Oh well I feel pretty important carrying it!! LOL!! Seems the federal government is the federal government, and they could have possibly utilized the information they already had on record. With that being said it is what it is. If they tell me I need a Photography license to take pics of big fish I’ll be off to Duluth again!! LOL!! Good luck changing the minds of the feds!! Better off getting your stuff. We’ve been patrolled here pretty extensively by CO’s, Park service and Coast Guard for many years. The way I look at it….This is my full time business, and like any full time business there is an investment involved. Just thought I’d weigh in. For the record although it might not be required to be properly licensed on most Minnesota waters I think I would be. I wouldn’t feel comfortable in this day and age accepting $$ for guiding in the event of something happening in the boat. I think theres is a real potential that you could hang yourself out to dry. Good converstation guys, and now I think more understand some of the little known challenges fishing guides manage to put some bread on the table. 
I’d like to know what offenses in a person’s past would disqualifiy them from being a guide. I wonder if they require a swimming test? I would think that would be one skill a fishing guide should have. I can see a class requirement for safety but no fingerprints. I don’t have a criminal history but what if I did? I would think guiding would be a great way for someone with a questionable history to make a living where they don’t need someone to hire them.
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I would think guiding would be a great way for someone with a questionable history to make a living where they don’t need someone to hire them.
In some instances I’d agree yes, but would you want to not-knowingly be out on the water with an previous axe murderer??? 
I’m not sayin… I’m just sayin… 
I guess I don’t know if the regulations are over the top and don’t really care, but I would hire the guide who is a professional and does what he needs to do to be legal. If these regulations weed out someone with a drug problem or 10 DWIs, I’m all for it. A questionable past shows questionable-decision making. If these regulations weed out poor decision-makers, I am all for it. If it is too much hassle then it really isn’t something you want. That is how all jobs are. If you want it, you do what you have to do to get it. I would also guess some of the “weekend warrior” type guides would rather not be registered as I am sure they don’t want other federal agencies to know about their under the table money-making career.
Pete,
Would you be happier with an axe murderer who hasn’t been caught yet? I would ask for references. Put the shoe on the other foot too. Would you not hire a famous guide who is on a great bite if they had an issue 20 years ago? What do we do with folks who have a criminal history? Throw them away and hope they don’t come back?
Sure I’d hire em’. If someone screwed up 20 years ago etc and they are a straight-shooter now, I have no problem with them guiding, what so ever.
While I do think these reg’s might be a little over-the-top I’m not as concerned about someone’s past, as I am their present.
Despite drug tests etc being a pain in the butt, it would be nice to know from a client prospective that they are clean etc, especially if they are going to be driving me around on the river.
I agree that the tests described here are a little but onerous, but I’m in the camp that believes there should be a guide license required for all guides in the state. In MN right now there isn’t even a registration requirement, let alone an insurance or CPR certification requirement.
Part of me even says that guides and tournament fishermen should be paying fees to the state for deriving a profit from a public resource. I have mixed feelings about that statement, though.
Anyway, while I agree that things like a background check, etc., may be overkill, the drug test, safety equipment, and some of the other requirements seem 100% right on to me. The fact that it discourages part timers isn’t a bad thing in my book.
All this just to be a fishing guide?????
Seems like royal overkill. I can take a buddy out fishing for the day, teach him how to fish, cater to him and my liability is nothing (other than boat insurance).
No license required, no special cards, no background checks.
Let’s say I win the lottery and want to be a fishing guide—but do it for humanitarian reasons and charge NOTHING: bet I’d still have to get the stinkin’ crapola of stuff.
Guess I’ll have to call myself a fishing humanitarian rather than a fishing guide at that point 
.
I can understand professionalism and some sort of legitimacy-like a professional organization and basic licensing to better self police the ranks, but this much, give me a break.
What about all the drunks driving around in the cabin cruisers?
That is where the regulations should be!!!
Jeremy
As someone who HATES government interference in anything, 
I fail to see how this is any different them me as a contractor having to get a license through the state. This requires that I take a test to show proficiency, PAY the fee, show them my insurance requirements, and then prove continuing education to keep up on important aspects of the industry.
Is this overkill for a contractor, a guy who builds stuff? Yeah, but the consumer (you) is getting a benefit that myself, and other contractors are meeting minimum requirements. This does not stop guys with a truck and a hammer from building houses.
This is very similar to what they are forcing guides to do now. Meet minimum requirements and show proficiency. It does not stop guys from guiding who want to do it, but does make it more difficult.
Yeah Farm but contractors are shady characters to begin with…People who you give money to.. often before the work is done on jobs that cost thousands. Guides get a deposit but generally don’t get paid until the work has been done. In tough economic times, the government fighting budget cuts finds revenue where it may by say enforcing or pretending to enforce rules from the CFR.
For clarification, taking out a friend or anyone else for that matter, without charging them does not require an OUPV license.
So let me know when your on a bite Doc! 
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This is very similar to what they are forcing guides to do now. Meet minimum requirements and show proficiency. It does not stop guys from guiding who want to do it, but does make it more difficult.
I disagree. What they are doing is forcing guides to meet the MAXIMUM requirements which in my pea sized brain is inconsistant with what goes on in the real world. If I put two guys in my boat to go fishing and charge for it I need to go through redundant testing, training and certification processes. My boat is a very small presence on the water. More often than not it is not more than 3 people including me in the boat. I am “Teaching” safety, proficiency and responsibility of ones actions on the water.
Yet I can go out and buy a 50 foot cabin cruiser, load it with drunk half dressed people and blast up and down the river at full throttle weaving in and out of traffic, rocking fishing boats from here to Kingdom Come and not need any certification at all?
So let’s look at the “Why” of this. WHY is the Coast Guard so concerned about the lowly fishing guide? Because they can scare this group into compliance. Job security. Could you imagine if the outcome of telling all of these mega-boat owners that they had to have a 6-Pack, background checks, testing and training? The boating industry would collapse. Taxes derived from this industry would be lost and it would be a catastrophe. These big boats often carry more people than a 6 pack allows! They would need a full blown Captains license! 
Again…which portion of the boating public where SAFETY is the concern would/should be “Controlled” by the Government?
Do you concern yourself with the background or the sobriety of the Tuna Boat driver as he is bearing down on you coming up or down river? Do you consider it when you get on those boats and party down with your friends?
Personally, I think this is a witch hunt and I see it as misguided. Pardon the pun.
By the way, I have a squeaky clean record. I have insurance. I am a former EMT and law enforcement officer. I am also a “Part Time” guide that can’t afford the time and excessive expense to put forth toward a part time profession. It’s a shame.
The next weekend that you are on the river and look at those big boats, think of some of your and my comments here. Please tell me where I am wrong. 
Honestly, I think the reason they do this is to keep track of the income that part time and full time guides make. With more info in the federal system they can take part of it especially since you are on a Federal Waterway or Public fishing area. There is also a big crack down within the state of outfitter and guides not filing sales tax forms. Anyone that has a website, advertises,and etc. will be getting called. A new person was just hired to start taking a look at all outfitters and guides. This is why I started a LLC Corporation for my guiding and outfitting. I can log right onto their system and report all earning and etc..plus protect my rear with a LLC and not have my persnnel assest invovled.
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Honestly, I think the reason they do this is to keep track of the income that part time and full time guides make.
Exactly, you beat me to it. I am not a guide, but see this as a way to procure income from those that may not be reporting it. The stringent rules are there to help justify the real objective. It is probably a much higher percentage of the part timers that may not be reporting their guiding income. Making it more difficult for them makes sense as it gives more business to the guides with licenses who would have to report their income because that is their business.
That’s a pile of crap in my “Opinion”. You have the IRS and their enforcement division for that. Come on now…Look up and down the River! How many “Guides” are working on a consistant basis? It is laughable to think that there are sooooo many that you would need the CG to be the enforcement arm to flush out people who are making a couple of bucks! If that was the case…then why wouldn’t they make getting certifications cheaper and easier to get??? More people=More $$$ to the Federal coffers.
Again, I stand by my post above. Just me, myself and I.
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More people=More $$$
I think the law of supply and demand works here too. If the market is flooded with guides then guiding prices will fall. There are only so many people in one day that are willing to pay for guiding services. So the amount of money brought in by the guides is dependent on the price charged times the number of people using the service. Guides that comply with the licensing will probably have to charge more to compensate for the extra expense and time. This will probably make for less people interested in hiring a guide due to cost. It all balances out for the most part, but the quoted statement is not going to hold true.
“…increase the cost of a guide”
Got me thinking.
Just a quick run down using insurance and the OUPV fees (all of them) over the five years the license is good for costs less than $11. per trip.
For the fella that’s guiding a couple four times per year…the insurance alone would be cost prohibitive.
The Coast Guard is part of Homeland Security. When they get involved with anything, costs and jumping through hoops are not relevant. 
This the way I see life now compared to the way it was 30 years ago. Remember the thoughts you used to think and how comfortable everyday was just in general. I don’t know about you but I was way more relaxed and I never heard too much about anything that serious to be concerned with. Part of the reasons I think is theres way way too many rules and regulations and alot of them are about things and situations that 20 to 30 years ago weren’t even a concern for lawmakers but now they are, how come. Is it really that important that we have laws to do everything. Another 20 to 30 years down the road and your going to have to be liscensed just to take someone in your family fishing or even put your own boat in the water is the way I see it. Wait and see,,,if it dosen’t happen id be surprised. Thier already trying to get people in some states to take a test befor they can buy a fishing liscense, I thought that was the DNR’s responsibility policeing whats done. Im not going to put up with any of that, im just going fishing wheather they like it or not, its my right, its partly my water and I need to feed myself and I now have to take a test when Im 75 to now get my fishing liscense, wheres it all going to stop. Maybe this is a little too extreem but I don’t think im that far off and I am on the right road. 
Is this the perfect cat fishing boat or what?
Taken in Red Wing on Tuesday.
Ya Brian enough of the depressing stuff. Ya its a cool boat and the coast guard at that, I wonder if I had my thumb out I could hitch a ride, even for a few minutes would be way neat. Whats that a Honda on the back.
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Whats that a Honda on the back.
I think it’s two Honda’s.
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Ya Brian enough of the depressing stuff. Ya its a cool boat and the coast guard at that, I wonder if I had my thumb out I could hitch a ride, even for a few minutes would be way neat.
Just put up a flare…..I’m sure you would get a ride
You know that is the first CG boat I’ve ever seen on the river. If you had a break down on the river, how many would call them? vs a buddy?
I’m guessing they wouldn’t help in a break down situation. They might give out US Tow’s phone number.
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