Outlaw Your Lead?

Senator Yvonne Prettner Solon is proposing a bill to phase out the sale of small lead tackle.

What do ya think about this?

Press Release

Sully

I think it would be good for the environment in the long run. Hopefully they wouldn’t outlaw use of existing stock, only outlaw new sales. I have about 300 BFT jigs that I need to use up first. Would hate to have to start over and buy all new stock. I would go broke.

I have been using tungsten this winter. Seems OK.

She is a tree hugger of the worst kind. She gets her name on all kinds of eco-nazi crap every year.

I think it is ridiculous. The loon population in MN is in great shape. They mostly eat small fish – and those are not the fish that are breaking lines and swimming around with a jig in their mouth. If we do happen to lose a couple a year – that is acceptable to me. We lose several loons a year due to boating and to muskies. Maybe we should out law boats and muskys.

Ridiculous.

Tim

One of the first things that comes to mind is, “How would this change the way I fish?” My understanding is these alternative materials are less dense, so it would create a larger profile to equal the same weight.

If the data is there to support the need for a change, I’m onboard.

It seems the data is conflicting, so I’m less enthused about being forced to change the way I fish.

If this bill was passed, I may have to drive the truck down to Prairie du Chien to have Dave stock me for life.

gotta give her credit… she must have some huge Cojones to try this in MN. On the other hand, if the stats are real, that’s a sh*tload of lead at the bottom of our waters.

That is a lot of lead – that is basically inert. Lead gases are bad, and should be avoided, but the solid lead in the water is pretty harmless – just like a pebble.

Think of all the lead pipes in the homes of people for years and years. If solid lead and water were harmful, we’d be extinct.

Tim.

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The price ranges from 20 percent to 200 percent more than lead. But supporters of a lead ban say the total cost to anglers is very small each year — about $2 to $3 extra for a season’s supply

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I’d bet this statement is false for most of the fisherman on this site.

$2 – $3 annually? Not even close. Take a jig like a precision head. Expect to pay $1.25 – $1.50… EACH for a painted head.

That would drastically effect the way many of us fish.

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$2 – $3 annually? Not even close. Take a jig like a precision head. Expect to pay $1.25 – $1.50… EACH for a painted head.

That would drastically effect the way many of us fish.

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I don’t can’t imagine what a day flipping wing dams would cost.

Mendotaeye, Get your wallet out…the bill is for use and sale.

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The bill, introduced last week by Sen. Yvonne Prettner Solon, DFL-Duluth, would make it illegal to sell or use lead sinkers or jigs weighing one-half ounce or less.

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And for those of you who think fisherman carry that much voting weight in this state…think again. There was a time when a duck hunter could not imagine shooting a load with less killing power than lead. We learned to shoot the faster loads and limit our range.

It is just a matter of time.

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Think of all the lead pipes in the homes of people for years and years. If solid lead and water were harmful, we’d be extinct.

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Lead pipes in homes were only used for drains. Still have lead pipes in my old house. They work just fine until you send a roto rooter down one….

-J.

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From 1983 to 2004, on Lake Mille Lacs in central Minnesota, the study estimated more than 100,000 pieces of lead weighing more than a ton were left behind.

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Statements like this make me cringe. 2000 pounds of lead in a 20 year period on a 300,000 acre lake. Sounds like a lot. But is it really? Basically comes out to one 1/4 lindy sinker for every boat….. I think??? When these statements are made they need to be put into perspective.

By the way, last time this came up I swear the amount they came up with was one ton EVERY year. I don’t know what to believe any more.

-J.

There is lead water lines in homes also. Especially in St paul. Sorry jon. The reason I believe this is not a big problem is that the water lines form a thin coating on the inside of the pipes after a while and no water really comes in contact with the piping.

Now back to the important stuff. Fishing.

Learn something new every day!

They used lead for water lines in the early 80’s and the water industry test quite frequently in those houses. I think the dates for testing are houses built in mid 70’s to 84.

this bill has very little to do with protecting the environment. the statistics even after being skewed just don’t add up. it does however have everything to do with making fishing more unappealing, through $, to certain demographics that just can not afford a $2.00 jig, or a tackle box full of them. it is just another poorly masked attempt to “thin the herd”.

i also would not doubt some of the biggest supporters of this bill are tackle companies, since most of us don’t posses the equipment to pour our own steel/tungsten/bismuth tackle they have the world to gain.

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i also would not doubt some of the biggest supporters of this bill are tackle companies, since most of us don’t posses the equipment to pour our own steel/tungsten/bismuth tackle they have the world to gain.

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I’ve yet to meet anyone in the tackle industry that is “pro” lead ban. Most have spent quite a bit of time and money opposing it.

i’ll be more specific.

http://www.xcaliburtackle.com/tackle_weights.asp

http://www.tru-tungsten.com/cart.php?target=category&category_id=2

http://www.penetraterweights.com/products.php?id=6

http://www.yourbobbersdown.com/

i would guess that these are a few that have a vested interest in the issue.

obviously the mainstream tackle suppliers would have to retool. however, it would be a gain on the behalf of the larger producers that can afford the transition costs, because there would be much less competition on the backside of the deal.

i’ll add that once again if someone yells the sky is falling, despite what the issue is, if it is slapped with the “environmentally conscious” tag you dare not oppose it or face the risk of being labeled morally wrong.

I agree….. Bad law proposal.
Personally, I think this scare tactic is just like the Radon issue. The Radon groups claim that something like 100,000 (+/- ??) people a year go to their grave from Radon. At 43, I’ve not gone to one funeral yet. I don’t know anyone that has ever made it to a Radon funeral either (dead or alive).
HOWEVER,… I just got my DU magazine and they have an article about ducks and lead shot in some southern states. They say they are still cutting up dead ducks from lead shot.
Who knows??? – and who knows what’s next??
Every time the law makers get together in this state, rather than fixing real problems, all they do is dream up new one’s (that we usually have to pay for).

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i’ll be more specific.

http://www.xcaliburtackle.com/tackle_weights.asp

http://www.tru-tungsten.com/cart.php?target=category&category_id=2

http://www.penetraterweights.com/products.php?id=6

http://www.yourbobbersdown.com/

i would guess that these are a few that have a vested interest in the issue.

obviously the mainstream tackle suppliers would have to retool. however, it would be a gain on the behalf of the larger producers that can afford the transition costs, because there would be much less competition on the backside of the deal.

i’ll add that once again if someone yells the sky is falling, despite what the issue is, if it is slapped with the “environmentally conscious” tag you dare not oppose it or face the risk of being labeled morally wrong.

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I know the owners of two fairly large tackle companies, that manufacturer non-lead lures, that have and will continue to fight a lead ban. They’ve been forced to provide the products to other areas of the country that have already gone lead-free but that doesn’t mean they like it or feel the move is good for the industry as a whole.

I will also agree that there are companies out there that have made the descision to be a lead-free company as part of their business model. I’m not sure how they would feel about more lead bans. On one hand they have a niche market if a few states have lead bans. On the other if lead is banned in a fishing power house state like MN… then all tackle companies will be making lead-free products which would dilute their hold on their niche.

I still stand by my statements… most tackle companies are dead set against a move to ban lead.

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I just got my DU magazine and they have an article about ducks and lead shot in some southern states. They say they are still cutting up dead ducks from lead shot.

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i’d agree that leadshot is not good for fowl.

lets compare:

a guy shooting anywhere from 6 – 40 shells a day(depending on skill levels) at 1oz.-plus, lead per shot. that is alot of lead spread over an area. to add to the issue all the grains of lead seem to be optimal size for birds and fish to ingest.

a guy fishing looses 10 – 1/4oz. jigs in a day( that is about %1000 more than most daily outings that i can attest to personally), that is still only the equivilant of roughly 2 lead shotgun loads. also the typical size of said jigs is almost never suitable for ingestion by fowl or fish.

james, i agree with you and will say we both have legitimate opinions. i should have been more clear about my first “supporters” statement.

the bottom line is that to the general, unknowing, unthinking, and kneejerk reaction public, even the simplest utterings of “LEAD BAN” is guaranteed to earn them morality points in the (i’ll save the vulgarities) “environmentally consious” world. it will help balance their “carbon offset” so-to-speek, LOL

-BS

No doubt if we switch out all of our toxic materials to something more “green,” we’d probably all be better off at some point, but where does it end?
Remember way back when – if we ate bacon or drank coke (soda) we were all going get cancer and die? Nobody made laws to protect us from those mean pork farmers or the Coke Corporation. Remember the recent “John Sponsel” – “Are we just scaring ourselves” report on ABC TV (with IDA mambers following-up with posts about it here)?
In a way, I equate some of that stuff to exactly this. ….Just like I’m going to wear helments now when I go down-hill sledding with my kids. etc., etc., etc.
There are many ways to make small improvements in our world. The problem with this issue is that the lawmakers want to arrest and/or fine us for fishing with lead jigs!
(Had to do a Randy Moss!)
All this while we continue to elect public officials that have constantly broken the law and brush it off as if it were no big deal. If that is the case, why have the law?
With this, the local C.O. will have to have us open our tackle boxes to see if my Northland-Fuzzy-Rapala-Storm crank-jigger-thing has lead in it – or not!! ….And then make sure I have my PFD, boat registrations, license and numbers properly sized and showing showing, my proper licenses and stamps, plastic water bottles, my low emmission (green) motor, driver not drinking, one fishing rod in MN, my fire extinguisher, my operating horn, I’m wearing my glasses while I drive the boat, my fish is 15″ long – but not over 15-1/2″, my gas is 87% octane and has 10% ethanol in it, I’m not conveying my lucky fishing technique’s/results to anyone over a radio (but my cell is OK), and oh yeah, I slowed for the no-wake bouy,…. and on – and on – and on. HELP!!

I would love to know who is lobbying these politicians and how anti lead statements can be placed in the dnr regulations (MN)each year.

Quoted from the MN DNR Regs 07-08:

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The tackle industry, recognizing a growing awareness and concern
about lead in the environment, has begun to create steel, tin,
bismuth, or plastic sinkers. Consider using non-lead tackle when
you go fishing.
Here’s what you can do to help:
• Ask local sporting good stores to stock
non-lead fishing tackle.
• Spread the word by telling other anglers
about the problem.
• Dispose of old lead sinkers and jigs properly by
locating a drop-off location.

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I think this has been in the regs for quite a few years.

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Quoted from the MN DNR Regs 07-08:

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..but it might just be one of those bits of info that got pushed out recently.

Last year for sure…it made me go hmmmm…. then.

Do they make tungsten 12ga shells? just wondering

STCROIXER

Yes.

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i also would not doubt some of the biggest supporters of this bill are tackle companies, since most of us don’t posses the equipment to pour our own steel/tungsten/bismuth tackle they have the world to gain.

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The tackle companies, Scenic included, do not want to see this and we are some of those fighting this the most. If you read these forums and notice how many people are opposed to spending $1.50 – 2.00 on a jig you will notice that there are not very many who would like to spend that kind of money on jigs. So if we can’t sell them then why would anyone who is in this business be in favor of something like this ?

As for the equipment issues to pour the alternative metals, we are already set up. Scenic has been pouring alternative products for about 3 years now in many of our custom made products. The cost of materials to make alternative jigs is unbelievable to say the least. I am hearing the guys in states that this has passed complaining about the prices but we are just passing down the pricing.

If and when we are put in the position to make these other products we are going to but just like the people buying them we are not going to like it.

This entire lead issue has been created by the tree huggers who would rather you did not even fish. If it was up to them you would not trap, hunt or fish period. They are not capable of catching a fish except on a video game and would starve to death if they could not buy their Tofu from the local grocery stores. Many of them are the same ones who think chocolate milk comes from brown cows and all milk comes from a store. Or does it come from a milk weed plant?

Because they needed a way to reach the heart strings of the general public and to obtain media coverage they decided to work on the loon issue. I am in no way saying that a jig does not kill a bird if it is eaten. However in all the studies I have read on this issue most of the reports indicated that a loon could have been, may have been or could possibly have died as a result of lead poising from fishing tackle. Very few of them directly positively identify that fishing tackle was the cause of death.

So in all the cases that were studied where any type of lead was found in the blood stream, when asked by the person performing the exam if this was caused by fishing tackle their answers were, could have been. may have been or could possibly have been caused by tackle. In other words they know it was caused by lead poisoning but not positive where it came from. Could it have been shot in another country or state where it is not a crime to shoot loons? Could it have eaten a fish that had a high toxic substance with in it? They don’t know but that answer is never published. The maybe answer gets published instead.

Bottom line is that the lead is not good for you. But you can bet your bottom dollar that once everyone switches over they will soon begin hollering that the bismuth, tungsten and tin in the lakes are harmful as well. Maybe we should start making jigs from rocks to appease the tree huggers. But then remember we would not be allowed to put hooks in them either. Maybe they should ban cars too while they are at it as they are a huge cause of deaths in our state. Oh wait they cause death in people not loons so cars are exempt from tree hugger stupidity. There sure are better things in this state they could spend money on to make people safer then fishing tackle!