If an ethenol plant is powered with electricity from coal and also uses natural gas, wouldn’t we still be better off because we have plenty of this here in the U.S?
I say to hell with depending on oil from other pain in the [censored] countries.
you dont get something for nothing.. the use of corn is not the answer… but.. why cant they use the stocks and leaves of the corn too? If I understand right now all they use is the kernals… that equation is doomed… to much cost in petrol products and not enough gain… but if they used ALL the crop.. then that would be better… and better still would be to rely on grasses that dont require so much fertilizer, pesticides, and petroleum to plant and harvest… our society uses petroleum products for WAY more than just power for gasoline driven engines.. petroleum products infiltrate everything we do….. there at this time is NO replacing them… you might be suprised at how much of your fishing gear is petroleum product related…. its pervasive…. there are huge changes ahead…. but no one knows how far ahead…
I, too, grew up on a farm and still have relatives that farm. My brother sold all of his crop from 1400 acres produced last year to an ethanol plant and a soybean processing plant for a premium price of a little over 20 cents per bushel. This paid his trucking costs for 40-45 miles each way and put about $30 per hour back in his pocket. Granted, not all plants pay that much of a premium. It is my understanding that there have been technological improvements that make ethanol production more efficient than it was a few years ago. I also found it interesting that Cargill (I believe) is against spending any money on ethanol production because they don’t want competition driving up the cost of corn, at a time when corn is unbelievably cheap. Farmers can’t make it on $1.40 corn.
It takes fuel to:
Plant
Spray
Harvest
Dry
Put into silo.
Put into elevator
Put into Truck/Train/Barge
Ship to ethanol plant
Process at plant using natural gas and electricity.
To some extent we do this with oil as well. 
Great topic Hookem 
I have a Chevy Avalanche that will run on E85, but I have yet to fill the tank with it. I have been wondering how this would affect my mileage. Right now I am getting a litte over 15 mpg.
I am curious to see what you get! 
I haven’t stayed up on this thread…so I hope you guys don’t tell me to stay caught up or git out!
I came to scratch my head…Left Lakeland today at $2.87 today, Cannon Falls and surrounding little towns were selling for $2.65 as the lowest…but most were at $2.67. Came home and the price was $2.89?
Almost pays for me to drive to Cannon Falls to get gas!
Rochester was at $2.87 too.
Other note…back in the ’70’s was “gasahal” was the up and coming thing…(wink wink…nod nod) I lived about 2 miles from a plant. It was a barn converted to a gasahal plant of all things.
Anyway in taking a tour, they explained that the only part of the corn plant that wasn’t used was the (picked already) corn/cob and the root…but if the root came out of the ground…they would use that too.
Now you’ve peaked my interest River Eyes!
If anyone is still reading this post, I have to say that everyone is right. We do use ALOT of oil in other things besides just gasoline. But remember we also produce ALOT of oil ourselves. Close to half of what we use is from here. I bet more thatn half of what we use is for gasoline.
The issue is not becoming completely independant from oil, its to become completely independant from FORIEGN OIL!!!!
One other point. This whole country feels that we are being gouged by the oil companies. Who’s to say that this won’t happen with Ethanol companies?
Seen a documentary the other night about ethanol. The reason sugar cane is better suited for making ethonol is because the suger coming from cane is easier to make into ethonol. In processing corn, it first has to be made into sugars then its made into ethonol, maybe sugar beets is a better way to go or sweet corn that we eat, its higher in sugars. Making ethonol from something high in sugar to start with sounds like its a better idea, less processing to get it to the form of alcohol. In this documentary they don’t use any petrolem at all to heat the distilling process, its all from former productions of ethonol. Its ethonol from start to the final product, can’t remember what country it was though. I remember when vcr’s came out at $400 a piece, they said give it a few years and the price will come down, now you can buy new ones for under $40, hope its true here too.
Ive got another good brainstorm to brillant idea!!!!! tell our government head incharge of the production of alcohol to go talk to Heilmans brewery or to any of the other good brews, bet they can cut alot of short cuts for the government. Step one- sit here and drink this one 1st. Step-2 sit here and drink this one 2nd. Step three sit here and forget about it and give us the contract, we will produce your alcohol for you and have it to you by Janurary 1st 2007, burp! just a thought burp! My cars run on old style and my boat too!!! 
I seen that also that was in Brazil, there totally independent no forign oil at all,the use suger cane to make the ethanol and use ethenol to run the plants, was pretty neat show.
Rocky, I got 13.5 mpg using e85 normally I get 15.5 mpg. I tried one more tank to see if it changes. I’ll keep you informed. 
I wish my truck could use the E-85….and least until somebody is willing to do something about the current gas prices….Because this gas price upcharging or oil prices has got to stop…
To bad those guys that invented the car that ran on water were still around….But funny how that dissappeared to. But i think that was in the 60’s..Sure could use that now..Like to see what those oil guys would do for work then…
It won’t.
I bought a little V6 Chrvy Malibu from Hastings Ford as my economy go-to car. I will use it for work, and keep the boat attached to the truck, and parked until needed. 
When you go from high riding in a nice truck to skinning your buns on the pavement…it takes a little getting used to. However, $30 as opposed to $60 to fill it is pretty cool.
My GEO only holds 8 gallons of gas and keeps going on air compared to the van when hauling the boat. I’ll drive that thing forever if it will last that long. 
I think Lake Zumbro [12 1/2 miles from my driveway] and I will be seeing alot of each other this year.
Thanks, Bill
For me, I don’t even look at the price anymore 
I won’t lessen my fuel usage due to prices. Instead, I have taken on more work to offset my gas expenses. But, I also have it pretty good living where I do. I can be to multiple boat ramps on 2 different pools as well as 2 local lakes in 20 minutes tops. Plus, I live 3 blocks from where I work 
so that helps a lot. If the price climbs higher, I will just have to make more adjustments to my extra expenditures. Heck if I quit chewing, I would have enough to enter 3 fishing tournaments and fuel to run them a month 
At 3-4 cans a day (almost $9 bucks a day), that adds up quite a bit over a month. Also, if I were to track my daily purchases over a months time, I know I will find uneeded spending trends that can be cut to use for fuel purchases if needed. Bottom line, I have to have gas no matter what the cost, there is no way around it in today’s world
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It won’t.
I bought a little V6 Chrvy Malibu from Hastings Ford as my economy go-to car. I will use it for work, and keep the boat attached to the truck, and parked until needed.
I bought a Toyota made Chevy Prizm… gets nearly 40 MPG on the highway and the suburban might see a total of 10 miles per month. I caught myself whining to my girlfriend one day about fuel prices as I was off for another commute in my ‘burb.
Long story short the fuel dollars I saved in 13 months paid for the little prizm with some fun money left over each month.
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I wish my truck could use the E-85….and least until somebody is willing to do something about the current gas prices….Because this gas price upcharging or oil prices has got to stop
It won’t stop. It will never stop. We’re talking about a product with limited supply and aggressively increasing deamnd. It will be $3.50 a gallon, followed by $4. And on and on and on. The only way to “do something about it” and reduce the cost to you and your family is to reduce your consumption.
I can remember when it was 1.38 per gallon and a friend of mine complained that it took a hundred dollar bill to fill up his Ranger boat and Suburbon. Just a couple weeks ago I heard Nate say it took 113.00 to fill up his 1800 Pro V. You are right in saying theres no end. I think I need to start using the jon boat. We might become best friends Mr. Jon Boat and I. 
Thanks, Bill
Wats, (Happy Birthday BTW!) I still use the gas! 
I burned 135 gallons during the two weeks of the FLW League and Tour events here on Pools 3,4 and 5. (In the boat only!) Now I can use less during the week, and when it is time to fish I am not behind the 8 ball $ wise.
Jeepers Creepers…135 gallons 
WOW, that is a lot of gas. I would have to sell one of the kids to pay for that much fuel. And I thought 22 gallons a weekend was a lot 
It will make that new boat towing truck last forever that way too. They are way too enpensive to replace often.
Thanks, Bill
I had help with the cost. Those two weeks were the exception rather than the rule. I will be lucky to put that much more through it the rest of the year!
Well, with gas the price it is, i still see these yuppies driving their huge SUV’s around Cedar Falls. It seems like a direct correlation between the speed at which you drive, and the miles per gallon your car achieves. I’m on HWY 20 just cruising along at 60-65 mph, and i’m getting rolled up by GMY Yukon Denali’s and these other prissy SUV’s that never see dirt/mud.
I would imagine pre-fishing for 2 tournies takes quite a bit of running and gunning. I didn’t get to pre-fish for my first 2 tournies this year. I saved a bunch in gas cost, but paid the price at the scales And my next tourney won’t be any better because I will be going to an unknown pool with no pre-fishing time at all
Im looking for an old toyota or nissan mini truck right now. If i can find one that runs i don’t care too much about how it looks, fishings more important to me than a wax job so i really don’t care much about how it looks, thier only transportation anyway and i heard those little trucks run on just about air like Bill said and everybodys right we have to just go with the flow. The gas prices stink and i don’t think theres anything we can do about it anytime soon so im going fishing. I don’t want to make anyone think im a blowhard by some of my statements that i’ve made in the past but the price of gas totally stinks and im finially getting over how pissed it made me. I hope the prices come down for everyone but i don’t think it will anytime soon. Ive got an old 1964 283 chevy virgin motor block sitting on the garage floor that come out of my sons 64 super sport that he junked out that needs to be rebuilt and im thinking about doing it. I’ve tossed ideas around from what i’ve read and heard about in those 100 mile a gallon carbs in the past and believe it or not guys i think i’ve got an idea on how to build one. If i had a drawing i’d put it up here on the site for others to look at and see and wouldn’t care a bit if anyone could expand on it and build thier own, it would be nice if they also could and i just might give it a try. I know i can vaporize the gas without too much difficulty but the reserviour that holds the liquid gas and a wick system has to be exerimented on for size and the right material for a wick and to get the right size but what the heck if it works it works, if it don’t it don’t. If i knew anyone with a machine shop with a milling machine i’d be in there tomorrow night after work. If i do get where i can maybe try building this design im so pissed at the oil prices i’d put the design here on the site for anyone to build and to heck with anyone trying to buy the design, thats crap when people need to fish and need to do the things they need to do. For you guys that know basic carburation you know in the old days when motors had carburators and you ran out of gas and had to pour gas down the carb to prime it so it would start faster, thats only gas vapors that are igniting not atomized gas like it is after the motors runs. If it starts on those vapors and runs for a bit all a guy might have to do is keep trying until you can get the gas to vaporize in a carb befor it goes to the heads and valves, if it can be done then why wouldn’t it run, they run on natural gas. You’d want to keep the excelerator plunger for that little extra gas needed for exceleration then it could run on vaporized gas. It would work if you could get enough vapors to the heads and sparkplugs like when your primeing the motor after you’ve ran out of gas. A guy just needs to find a way to get enough vapors in a carburation system befor its drawn down to the cylinders by the pistons. Boy i’d like to see someone in America come come up with an idea and make those oil countries crawl, wouldn’t that be fun. If a motor will run on propane which i think is less powerful that vaporized gasoline than i know it would run on gas vapors. For example if you could fill a tank with vaporized gasoline with a big torch head held over the carburator and when turning the engine over trying to start it open the torch valve, all the vapors coming from the torch head would start the engine up, the mechanics know what im taking about. Maybe draw the air going into the heads and valves over a reserviour that holds a sponge. This sponge gives off gas vapors because this sponge is sitting in a reserviour of gasoline. If a guy could find the right size for a reserviour and sponge to give off those vapors then why wouldn’t it run. If it will run when you prime a motor after you’ve ran out of gas and your restarting it then why wouldn’t it run. Maybe run a couple air lines in the bottom of this reserviour and the air entering this reserviour that holds this sponge vaporizes the gas even more. Gasoilne atomizes fairly easy so a guy would have to find a way to produce just vapors. If theres anyone here on the site that has access to a machine shop and knows basic carburation and would want to give this a try i could send drawings and make phone calls on what my ideas are. If they can take propane and make it into a liquid then make it back into a vapor then why can it be done with gasoline when its already a liquid. If anyones got any ideas message me, i want to build one of these carbs if i can and i’d be glad to give mine. Man i’d like to see the oil companies and oil countries do some crawling instead of us who like to fish and hunt,,,
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Well, with gas the price it is, i still see these yuppies driving their huge SUV’s around Cedar Falls. It seems like a direct correlation between the speed at which you drive, and the miles per gallon your car achieves. I’m on HWY 20 just cruising along at 60-65 mph, and i’m getting rolled up by GMY Yukon Denali’s and these other prissy SUV’s that never see dirt/mud.
That statement should get the attention of some of the people around here with SUV’s. I didn’t know it was mandatory to go “muddin” if you owned an SUV. Some people actually own them for pulling their boats.
I’m not saying you have to be fender deep in mud with an SUV (which by the way,can be a lot of fun, but requires quite the cleanup!)
Yes, some people do use them for towing a boat and you can tell because the hitch usually shows signs of wear or use, but way too many times do i see a Tahoe with the towing package, and i’m 99.9% positive it hasn’t been used. I just get frustrated seeing good trucks go to waste. I know way too many people that buy them just for their looks…. I’ve often thought about some way to regulate buying a large SUV/Truck. Some way you would have to prove you have use for it, whether it be the location of your house and the need for 4wd, or showing a title for a boat/rv/trailer/ect… There is just no need for some urban families to have a 12mpg SUV to cart their kids around, get a minivan. But, it’s the USA, so they are entitled to whatever they would like to drive, which is fine, but i just get frustrated seeing people waste precious resources in that manner. But, i guess that’s just the geologist in me 
Keep up the good work Mossy. We need people like you to build better cars and put US autos back on the map. I have resolved to use less. I bike 7 miles to work instead of taking my jeep. Weather permiting. Less wear and tear and I get to be more physically fit. I have put my houseboat at the river up for sale. I am sad about it but driving to and from there is no longer an option. Mendota is 5 minutes from my house. the problem is the water isn’t moving and I am a lousy lake fisherman. I still think we are being ripped off but I have decided to put my money where my mouth is. My gas usage has been cut down by two thirds and my 30 horse johnson on my 16ft mod v 6 gallons will last me a month. Can’t sugar cane be grown in the USA?
Mossydan, you have the right idea. I can,t get this site to link up (something i,m doing wrong) but if you google search for “how to run a car on gas vapors” a site from an El Paso Texas news station as an article about a guy using your exact idea and driving a car 200 miles on less than 2 gallons of gas . This happened in 1977 and the young man has since passed away.
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