Dead Starter Battery on the Water!!!

Let me recount my first experience with a dead starter battery while out on the water at 7 pm at night, all alone.

Basically trolling for walleyes from about 3+pm with my Minnkota. At about 6.30 pm decided to put on my nav lights. Did not want a ticket from DNR, you see. After a while, was wondering why my nav lights did not appear to be as blinding as before. But brushed it aside. Then my LMS332C shut down on me. But I managed to restart it. At about 7pm, the last boat left, leaving me alone. Thought that I should go to. Tried to tilt down my main motor and nothing!! (I had tilted it up to avoid potential skeg and prop damage). I could not tilt it down. And with the motor being out of the water, I did not want to start it. I then realized that I had completely drained my starter battery from using my LMS332C for 3+ hours. ****…so I tried to start my kicker thinking that it would require a smaller current and its alternator could recharge the battery for the main or if not, potter back with the kicker. A few weak cranks and that was it. Kicker also cannot start.
I was amazed that I could let something like this happen to me. Thank god I had two deep cycle batteries on the boat – one for my electric anchor and other misc and one for my trolling motor. And thank goodness, someone long time ago, told me to keep jumper cables in the boat if I did not want to keep a heavy battery jumper. I ripped it open from its box (it was still brand new from Sears), hoping that instructions came with it. I was not absolutely sure which went to which and I did not want to do something that would fry my electronics and circuits. And also, I had never ever had to jump a car before, so I was not very knowledgeable there. Fortunately, there was a instruction sheet, I connected red to red from one of my trolling motor and black to black, and managed to get my main motor tilted down and started. Phew…..but the battery was so low that even with the main motor started and running, trimming the motor dimmed my nav and console lights.

Quesion:

Does this sound like a prolonged use of fishfinder depleting the starter battery or is my battery faulty? The batt is trojan and less than 1 year old. In between use, an onboard Minnkota charger keeps it charged up.

What can I do to avoid future occurences? Do you guys have some kind of habit or practice that mandates that you run the main motor every so often to recharge?? It did not occur to me to do this at all, as someone had told me before that the fishfinders draw very little current.

After this event, I am thankful I got the experience out in small water and not in big water. Also, have considered that I should run the motor for 15 minutes every 2 hours. Does that sound right? Also have considered installing a remote battery status indicator for the starter and maybe the other batts so that I would remember or know when to recharge the starter when out on the water and for how long.

Also, is the T8 kicker motor capable of maintaining sufficient charge on the starter motor battery while I am running the LMS332C for 3-4 hours of kicker motor trolling?

Any advice or opinion greatly appreciated.

You’ve got battery/wiring problems. If your battery freezes it may do enough damage to make it act that way. Or you may have short in your wires somewhere and its not breaking the fuse. A one year old trojan should not do that as they’re great batteries. You should be able to run your locator, lights and stereo practically all day. There should be no reason to have to start it up and recharge. Try taking a 12 volt tester and connecting the ground from the battery to a grounding area on your boat(any aluminum). If your tester lights up, you’ll need to find the short. Good luck with it!

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You’ve got battery/wiring problems. If your battery freezes it may do enough damage to make it act that way. Or you may have short in your wires somewhere and its not breaking the fuse. A one year old trojan should not do that as they’re great batteries. You should be able to run your locator, lights and stereo practically all day. There should be no reason to have to start it up and recharge. Try taking a 12 volt tester and connecting the ground from the battery to a grounding area on your boat(any aluminum). If your tester lights up, you’ll need to find the short. Good luck with it!

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So basically, use a multimeter and connect the black terminal to some aluminium??

TSC…I had almost the same thing happen to me yesterday but I had company in the boat and decided to leave when the rains came at 5:30 pm so I wasnt stranded in the dark. And I was ony 300 or 400 yards from the ramp….. BUT i could have also been 7 or 8 miles, in the dark, and by myself, as I also fish alone 1/2 the time.
I was fishing below Dresbach dam and just put a new lms 334-s on my boat and moved my lx-125 to the bow. I noticed my lms would shut off on its own occasionaly, but chalked it up to a glitch in the unit, which I am used to with anything ressembling a computer or electronics. I also ran both locators and GPS on the 334. The livewell was cycling every three minutes with a couple of chunky sauger in there. My trolling motor runs on the 2 – 12volt batteries up front. I am assuming nothing is tied to them other than the 74# thrust trolling motor. I ran that motor almost continuously for 10 hours at 1/3 power. Still showed 3/4 power at quit time. I am not sure if it is coincidence, but this has never happened until I put that 334 on my boat. I am quite sure they dont draw hardly anything, but we only would start the motor about every hour and run up to the dam for another 1 hour float. The motor only ran for a minute or so every hour. The last float down and the motor wouldnt turn over. My lms 334 also shut down. The motor is a new merc 4 stroke and clicked a couple of times and one roll over finally started. We let her idle for a half hour or so and everything was fine. My point is my boat is only 1 year old also, I cant imagine we both have bad batteries. But I cant believe that the 334 had anything to do with it . I have wing nuts on all three batteries, so a quick transfer of one of the front batteries would get me out of trouble. I also thought of the jumper cable thing, but its just one more thing to take up space. I hope someone with voltage or battery knowledge chimes in here to tell us if its possible to drain a new battery down with 2 locators and a livewell pump running all day. Except for the spring walleye run, I always run the motor more often and am constantly moving around, so it probably wont be a problem then. Keep us posted if you find out anything , I will do the same…………Murf

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TSC…I had almost the same thing happen to me yesterday but I had company in the boat and decided to leave when the rains came at 5:30 pm so I wasnt stranded in the dark. And I was ony 300 or 400 yards from the ramp….. BUT i could have also been 7 or 8 miles, in the dark, and by myself, as I also fish alone 1/2 the time.
I was fishing below Dresbach dam and just put a new lms 334-s on my boat and moved my lx-125 to the bow. I noticed my lms would shut off on its own occasionaly, but chalked it up to a glitch in the unit, which I am used to with anything ressembling a computer or electronics. I also ran both locators and GPS on the 334. The livewell was cycling every three minutes with a couple of chunky sauger in there. My trolling motor runs on the 2 – 12volt batteries up front. I am assuming nothing is tied to them other than the 74# thrust trolling motor. I ran that motor almost continuously for 10 hours at 1/3 power. Still showed 3/4 power at quit time. I am not sure if it is coincidence, but this has never happened until I put that 334 on my boat. I am quite sure they dont draw hardly anything, but we only would start the motor about every hour and run up to the dam for another 1 hour float. The motor only ran for a minute or so every hour. The last float down and the motor wouldnt turn over. My lms 334 also shut down. The motor is a new merc 4 stroke and clicked a couple of times and one roll over finally started. We let her idle for a half hour or so and everything was fine. My point is my boat is only 1 year old also, I cant imagine we both have bad batteries. But I cant believe that the 334 had anything to do with it . I have wing nuts on all three batteries, so a quick transfer of one of the front batteries would get me out of trouble. I also thought of the jumper cable thing, but its just one more thing to take up space. I hope someone with voltage or battery knowledge chimes in here to tell us if its possible to drain a new battery down with 2 locators and a livewell pump running all day. Except for the spring walleye run, I always run the motor more often and am constantly moving around, so it probably wont be a problem then. Keep us posted if you find out anything , I will do the same…………Murf

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Hmmm…very interesting. Thanks for posting your incident too. I also just realized that I too had my aerator running at auto during the whole time. I wonder….

I am just very worried it is some thing very complicated that I cannot fix. Hope someone helps us out.

To check for a short, a multimeter will work provided you’re on a 12 volt setting.
I remember a time when this happened to me. All my problem was,..was a loose wingnut and dirty terminals.
If your batteries freeze they can be ruined in one year. Its important you take them out during cold periods when they’re not being used, otherwise invest in a trickle charger or battery maintainer. Just running a small current through battery is enough to keep it from freezing. A great example of this people who ruin motorcycle batteries. They’re much smaller and freeze easier. Last year I forgot about mine and ended up buying a new one.

That t 8 will run enough current through the alternator to power your PC.
There should be no reason for having to recharge it every couple hours.

How exactly should I check for a short with the multimeter? I am quite dumb about that. Can you give me some specifics?

Also, I have been keeping my batteries on the Minnkota charger all winter. And I take the boat out at least once a month, so I do not think the battery has freezed….what do you think?

Here is my take on the situation. Is it possible that there is too many things hooked up to one battery? I know when I used to try and run the electronics and the trolling motor on one battery, the battery would be dead in no time. Now I run the trolling motr on a seperate battery system and have eliminated the problem. Just a thought

TSC and Matt….

I just went out in the garage to check a couple of things.
First I tried hooking the alligator clip up to the positive side of my motor battery to make sure the light worked on my tester. It worked . Next I hooked to the negative side and grounded to the aluminum and of couse it did not light up . I assume that is how you are testing for a short Matt??
2. I turned on the back locator which is the lx 125 right now. Looked up the voltage on the screen and it is showing 12.7 volts.
3. Next I went to the bow to check the LMS 334. I turned it on and it seems to freeze up and then shuts down , just like yesterday. I just got it friday and hooked up the power to the power source provided by Starks last year on my previous bow mount locator. One thing seems odd, when I pull the lake chip out the unit will run on just sonar, but if you put the chip in it shuts down?? .
I left the chip out and checked the voltage. It shows 11.4 volts.
#4 Question. Did Stark wire the front locator to the 2 batteries in front or the back motor battery? If it is to the back battery why arent both locators showing the same voltage? or is the back locator mounted to the front batteries. I damn near need to tear the boat apart to trace the wiring.
5. Why does the unit shut off with the chip in but not while its out. Does the GPS mode need over 11.4 volts to run ? Someone told me they need to be over _______volts?, but cant remember what_______ was.
I’m starting to get a little . I hate wiring and electrical troubles.
Any ideas would be great………..Murf

So from your tests, it does not look like a short then and is probably related to the LMS334 then? Well, at least you have isolated your problem. I hate to find out that it is a short cos so many things can go wrong. I will try testing for a short on mine based on what you did. Thanks. What a coincidence that you had a similar event to mine. Must be the weather…hehe

I’m hoping its the back battery and not the lms334. Even though its brand new, I hate the hassles of returning and waiting for replacement. Plus I’m not 100% its the unit yet. I am going out to switch the units to see if they show opposit voltage readings at there different location. If they do show 12.7 and 11.4 in revers from where they are now, I will see if the chip works in its 12.7 volt location then I will know its battery related. If its battery related, I need to determine if I’m drawing off that one battery too many items or if my battery is shot or if my motor for some reason isn’t recharging the battery. I’ll be right back.

God I miss my canoe…….. ………Murf

Murf now calm down
Thats correct for testing a short. Look good and close at the light to see if its on at all. This test works because a short circuit creates a circuit directly between ground and postive terminals.

2)Voltage and Amperes are two different things. Voltage is the force/pressure behind the amperes driving the electronics. That meter means nothing other than guaging a worn out old battery.

3)When a lowrance locator does not have enough power. Thats exactly what it will do. (start up and then turn off).

I’m guessing that processing the chip requires just enough power to turn the unit off because of lack of power.

4) Your voltage reading on your locators can vary from anything from cold air temps to wire guage. Don’t even pay attention to those volt meters.

5) When your unit is searching for satellites it does suck more juice.

Calm down and check to make sure your terminals are clean. Take a wire brush and clean everything on the terminals including the rings on the terminals powering youe electronics. Start simple first then work to the less obvious. You can do it

It is easy to determine which battery runs what. Just disconnect one terminal of your starting battery and see what works and what doesn`t.

Had an interminitent problem with my trolling motor one time. Checked all connections they were all tight and clean. Happen to put some pressure on one of the wires going to the trolling motor from the battery. Wire came right out of the battery terminal connection. Problem solved took forever to find. Was getting ready to send trolling motor in to get it fixed.

Electrical problems can be H_LL to find.

I’ve determined a couple of things.
1. Both the 125 and 334 are powered by the back battery.
Matt you are correct those voltage readings are not highly accurate. I switched units and had totally different readings from both units from their previous readings.
But I threw the charger on the back battery and both units read 14 volts. I assumed the couple extra volts wouldnt fry the unit. Those little fuses in line are suppose to take care of that little problem.
2. After charging my back battery a little while the 334 now runs. I assume as posted earlier, the 334 probably draws a little more with the chip and the gps searching.
3. Now I just need to determine if my battery is indeed shot, or a short,(which does not seem to be the case as I checked my tester with garage lights off and no low flicker of light). Or if I am just running too much off that lone battery without running my gas motor to recharge.
I’m making headway, “Life is Good”.
Getting near time, I’ll charge the back battery and try again next time. If problem occurs again I’ll probably need to yank the 1 year old battery and spring for a new one. It could be worse. I’d rather have to spring for a battery than wiring troubles. I’ve been down that road one too many times…….Thanks for everyones help. Good luck on your battery troubles TSC………Murf

Tom P. Sometimes the obvious is so …well…….Obvious!

I did find what I needed to know by starting at the other end of the cat, but I think your way of skinin’ is better.
I’m the type of guy you would cringe at if I was recruited to do electrical or computer related duties. I do have a few talents, just not sure they are too valuable

Wats, I hope those fingers are back in order for the next fair weather fishing trip. Its hard enough to keep them warm without having them pulverized first …….Murf

They are ready for Wednesday night I think the fact they were cold is why I didn’t yelp to awful loud when it happened Hope you get everything running good for the upcoming bite that is starting to take shape

Time for bed. I didnt read all the replies. Sorry.. But if your battery is a starting battery and your discharging it with accessories, thats your problem..

Sorry if anyone already posted this.,.

Since the early ’90’s when graps/GPS units became the norm, and boats added second livewells, and electric motors became good enough to become primary fishing motors no matter what the conditions are, dead starting batteries also became the norm. It started to become common to have to jump the starting batteries from the trolling motor power source to get home.

So……for the past ten or more years, I have NOT put a “starting” battery in any of my boats. I use the SAME size/style battery for my starting battery as I do for the bowmount. That being a 27 or 31 series regular deep cyle battery. Since doing so, I have NOT ever had an issue with my “starting” battery. After 6-7 hours of NOT using the big engine, having at least two if not three graph/GPS units running continuously along with both livewells on full time, NO problems. In those situations or even lesser use, a “normal”,healthy starting battery would have been too dead to run the big engine.

My advice to ALL…use a regular deep cycle trolling motor battery for the starting battery too. (not some combo deal(starter/deep cycle) either. A regular 27 or 31 size deep cycle.

Steve Fellegy
#49

everybody laughs at me, because i have 3 deep cycles in my boat. the starter battery is just that, its only hooked to the big engine and boat gauges. i switched the night running lights and livewells to their own battery ( i bobber fish at night alot) and my depth finder, radio and camera are on another. the last thing i want is a dead battery, 8 miles from shore on mille. my 2 cents.

big g

I too run all my electronics off one battery, the boat off another and have the two deep cycles up front for the trolling motors.
4 total
That’s just me!!!

And Like G said

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the last thing i want is a dead battery, 8 miles from shore on mille. my 2 cents.

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Hook, as you can attest to, those LMS 350’s we used to use can suck up some juice!

good info on here guys. Am taking the maiden voyage with the 334C at Pool 4/Everts starting tomorrow. Will monitor the performance. I have jumper cables plus two deepcycles in addition to the starting battery. Thinking its not a problem with the 334C, but will keep an eye on it and report when we return.

I run all of my electronics off of my starting battery except my trolling motor. I have had it run out of juice on me before, and had to jump it off of my other batteries. The problem that I found was causing it was that it was just running low on water. I keep my batteries plugged in all of the time and the water boils down on them. I have made it a point to just check/top them off a couple days before I go out. Since I have been doing this I haven’t had a problem with them, I can go from dusk till dawn without running the big motor and there is still enough left in them to fire it up.

When you do this, make sure you use distilled H20.

Yep, I do. Out of curiousity, What happens if you use regular water or bottled drinking water?

the minerals in standard water reduce battery life and corrode the plates in the battery which can cause the battery to short out causing a dead battery over time. Best advise for long battery life in cars or boats is to keep the water level full and charged. Terminals, posts cleaned and then a thin coating of No-Ox on them and they will never corrode again.

CA

I think you guys are on to something. I thought my back battery was a deep cycle, but they may have put in a cheap combo to keep costs down at the dealer last year. I’ll have to look…Thanks again ……Murf

Murf: Both my batteries were cheap dealer ones. No name on them but had a dealer sticker. Didn’t last two years. Went to WallyWorld and got new ones and haven’t had a problem since. This is the 3rd seaason on them.

My old man had a similar problem w/ his LMS 350 (live well, lights, stereo, etc) draining things down.

What he did was run an extra set of cables from trolling motor batteries in the front back to the starting battery. That way he could “jump” start whenever he wanted without moving batteries around.

DaveB,

I had always thought of doing that, but had a concern about how big of wire to run to carry the current. What size did you use for this, and did you put it on clips or a direct connect terminal?

Thanks in advance