Nice work notice I got today…

Only precious metals I can afford to hoard are jigheads…

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With a debt of $16 trillion heading to $20+trillion… honestly our economy is done. Little changes in take home pay or increasing taxes will not make a dent to the hole we are already in.

Mathematically its just a matter of time (3-5 years?) and our GDP will not be able to pay even the interest on the unbelievable debt we have accumulated. Therefore, the principal amount of debt just spirals upward until our economy finally crashes once and for all.

We have had too high a debt for years, the difference is that people just can’t mentally grasp how proportionately higher its gotten in just the last 5 years. It is economically impossible to tax enough to pay off the debt… there is really no way to stop this.

Me… I just want to have a boat that is paid off and fish a lot as the economy crashes – at least I’ll be able to feed my family. That’s my personal financial plan

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Sad but so true. Once we get up to $24 Trillion deficit the interest ALONE will be crippling to our country especially our children and grandchildren. It feels criminal to me.

Once we see the hyperinflation that we are headed toward, that $20 trillion will just seem like…..$20 TRILLION OMG THAT IS TRILLION AND NOT BILLION????

For those of you who dont like math, if interest rates return to the historical norm of 5%, that is $1 TRILLION FLIPPING CLAMS per year of interest, or 25-35% of the budget, or $6,600/year/working American OF INTEREST.

To defend yourself, load up on cheap debt and buy hard assets. Dont wait to Thank me later.

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It isn’t an increase… it is a reduction that has expired.

And you’ll get it all back through retirement, plus interest – so it is a great investment as well.

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I’m 33, and allready got notice that I’m only going to get 60% benefit, and early retirement for me is 67. I’m not counting on the value going up much in the next 34 years.

DaveB, what do you consider the best hard asset ??? (and don’t say Adrian Peterson)

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It isn’t an increase… it is a reduction that has expired.

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all are equal, some are just more equal than others

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Once we see the hyperinflation that we are headed toward, that $20 trillion will just seem like…..$20 TRILLION OMG THAT IS TRILLION AND NOT BILLION????

For those of you who dont like math, if interest rates return to the historical norm of 5%, that is $1 TRILLION FLIPPING CLAMS per year of interest, or 25-35% of the budget, or $6,600/year/working American OF INTEREST.

To defend yourself, load up on cheap debt and buy hard assets. Dont wait to Thank me later.

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Dave this is good, accurate info. Just think that’s only talking the interest payments! Too bad our country’s finances are run like most households with credit card debt, interest only mortgages, etc. In general, people are just too ignorant to have even a basic financial understanding of this serious situation be are heading towards. I know because I was once one of these ignorant people until about 12 years ago.

They certainly could tax us out of our deficit but a balanced approach is the only way it will work. During the Eisenhower era they had much higher taxes than they do now and paid for the interstate highway system, WWII, and Korea and didn’t put any of that on the credit card. If you can’t afford precious metals, the end of the SS holiday won’t amount to much anyway for you. They could easily make that holiday permanent if they taxed FICA for those over the current ceiling. All of us regular shmoes that don’t make over a hundred K, pay fica on all of our income while those making over don’t pay fica on anything over that which is a crime.

How is that going to help? You do know, that SSA benefits are based off your income level (ie what you paid in). The only way uncapping FICA will create surplus is if you uncap the tax but leave the cap on the benefits.

Another thing you could do is remove the state income tax deduction. Why should people in states with no income tax be paying for those with high state and local taxes??? Why hasnt a democrat recommended that? The only people harmed would be the people in high income urban areas like CA, NY, MA, NJ (wait, I see a trend here, now I get it).

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How is that going to help? You do know, that SSA benefits are based off your income level (ie what you paid in). The only way uncapping FICA will create surplus is if you uncap the tax but leave the cap on the benefits.

Another thing you could do is remove the state income tax deduction. Why should people in states with no income tax be paying for those with high state and local taxes??? Why hasnt a democrat recommended that? The only people harmed would be the people in high income urban areas like CA, NY, MA, NJ (wait, I see a trend here, now I get it).

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Taxpayers in states with no income tax get to deduct state sales tax paid in lieu of income tax. This provision was reinstated and made retroactive for 2012.

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How is that going to help? You do know, that SSA benefits are based off your income level (ie what you paid in). The only way uncapping FICA will create surplus is if you uncap the tax but leave the cap on the benefits.

Another thing you could do is remove the state income tax deduction. Why should people in states with no income tax be paying for those with high state and local taxes??? Why hasnt a democrat recommended that? The only people harmed would be the people in high income urban areas like CA, NY, MA, NJ (wait, I see a trend here, now I get it).

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Taxpayers in states with no income tax get to deduct state sales tax paid in lieu of income tax. This provision was reinstated and made retroactive for 2012.

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No, you can choose. In MN we can take sales tax OR income tax, not both.

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They certainly could tax us out of our deficit but a balanced approach is the only way it will work. During the Eisenhower era they had much higher taxes than they do now and paid for the interstate highway system, WWII, and Korea and didn’t put any of that on the credit card. If you can’t afford precious metals, the end of the SS holiday won’t amount to much anyway for you. They could easily make that holiday permanent if they taxed FICA for those over the current ceiling. All of us regular shmoes that don’t make over a hundred K, pay fica on all of our income while those making over don’t pay fica on anything over that which is a crime.

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Libs like to drag out the high marginal tax rates (92%) during Ike. That was on incomes over $3 million in today’s dollars. Few people actually paid that. They still had a lower rate on dividends and capital gains, 25%.

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No, you can choose. In MN we can take sales tax OR income tax, not both.

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If you have both, yes, you can choose. I’m not sure if you are disagreeing with me or agreeing with me.

What I have learned from this thread is that I need to be prepared for a paycheck haircut, pay off my fishing boat, and load up on silver and vaseline!

…sounds like the lyrics to a new country music song to me

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They could easily make that holiday permanent if they taxed FICA for those over the current ceiling. All of us regular shmoes that don’t make over a hundred K, pay fica on all of our income while those making over don’t pay fica on anything over that which is a crime.

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If we make people pay more, then can they take more out in the end? Should we deduct the amount people get back if they don’t reach that 100K ceiling? For instance, should someone who makes $20K a year average their entire employed years have their benefits reduced 80%?

Dave,

Some good points. I bet one reason not many paid the highest amount was because the people put the money back into their business and hired folks. I also think if we had that tax now it would do the same thing. Pug, I think that social security is a safety net program and some people even though they paid in if they had the means and don’t need social security well a lesser payment may be in order.

I have a briliant idea…. think of this. If we take one capable & employable person, off the government handouts and get them paying “in” it might work. For example, if they receive $2000 a month in assistance & instead, if they actually “worked” and paid in taxes of $600 a month, that is a $2600 swing per month. That is $31,200 per year. If we could get all the unemployed people (approximately 12.2 million) to get a job, it would only take 52 years to wipe out the deficit

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If we take one capable & employable person, off the government handouts and get them paying “in” it might work.

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Hey, we won’t tolerate any of that logic around here….

I’m also wondering what effect it may have to stop issuing tax refunds that surpass the amount paid in (i.e. EITC)?

All the problems we face… we all tend to blame politicians for not fixing, but really what are they suppose to do? None of us want to pay higher taxes or give up huge amounts of services, or benefits. We want to take care of those that try, but can’t find work. We want children fed, we want more education, we want national security. We want our old to be protected. Sick cared for. It is hard to cut the abuse without hurting the real needy. We want, but we struggle to accept that any real change is going to include huge sacrifice on both ends… paying more, getting less.

This thread started on the complaint of someone having a reduction in a tax end… he complained it was an increase, and a terrible thing. 2% really? Imagine how it would be taken if real change was asked for. We are all part of the problem, as unpopular as it really is to hear.

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All the problems we face… we all tend to blame politicians for not fixing, but really what are they suppose to do? None of us want to pay higher taxes or give up huge amounts of services, or benefits. We want to take care of those that try, but can’t find work. We want children fed, we want more education, we want national security. We want our old to be protected. Sick cared for. It is hard to cut the abuse without hurting the real needy. We want, but we struggle to accept that any real change is going to include huge sacrifice on both ends… paying more, getting less.

This thread started on the complaint of someone having a reduction in a tax end… he complained it was an increase, and a terrible thing. 2% really? Imagine how it would be taken if real change was asked for. We are all part of the problem, as unpopular as it really is to hear.

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I totally agree.

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All the problems we face… we all tend to blame politicians for not fixing, but really what are they suppose to do? None of us want to pay higher taxes or give up huge amounts of services, or benefits. We want to take care of those that try, but can’t find work. We want children fed, we want more education, we want national security. We want our old to be protected. Sick cared for. It is hard to cut the abuse without hurting the real needy. We want, but we struggle to accept that any real change is going to include huge sacrifice on both ends… paying more, getting less.

This thread started on the complaint of someone having a reduction in a tax end… he complained it was an increase, and a terrible thing. 2% really? Imagine how it would be taken if real change was asked for. We are all part of the problem, as unpopular as it really is to hear.

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I disagree. We pay to much already and the gov’t waste and overhead is mind blowing. I wonder how much more the gov’t could do if they were to straighten up and control waste.

On top of that has anyone actually looked at the net worth of those in congress and the house? Almost 100% of them are multi millionaires. How could any of us possibly trust them or expect them to understand “middle class” and “lower class” issues and/or help us.

That 2% is just the tip of the iceburg. When Obamacare kicks in, I think some will start in Jan-Feb there will be another 3.2% taken out in increased insurance costs. Between the 2% return of payroll tax and the addition of Obamacare, the taxes on someone who makes $30,000 per year will increase $1560. Now that is “hope and change”!!

Also the reason the figure in the “fiscal cliff” bill was agreed to be moved from $250,000 to $450,000 was that the tax increase wouldn’t affect our fine government representatives as much….my opinion

Look closely, very closely, at the trajectory of our national debt the last 4 years. Looks like a hockey stick. 10 trillion to 16.3 trillion, just like that. On our way to about 20 trillion in next 3 years. 100% plus of GDP.
The “fundamental change to the United States of America” we were promised is happening right before our eyes.
One day my grandson is going to look me in the eye ask Grandpa, how did you let this happen? What were you people thinking?
The good news? At some point the bond market will say enough. You (gov) cannot borrow at these low rates. It will say that my clients (lenders) need more interest to justify the risk of lending money to you (gov). Happened in Greece overnight.
The debt super cycle is just about coming to an end. The bond market will put an end to it if they can. If they can’t the end will come very quickly with a loss of confidence, as confidence is the very thin thread that holds this thing all together. I am in the financial business and confidence is everything.
What to do? Make absolute sure you are out of debt yourself. Own some hard assets, gold silver. Have protection. Have some cash on hand. Have some food stored up. BECOME AN INFORMED VOTER. We still have a little time to turn this around but it will take political leadership. That may mean forgetting about your party, union affiliation, how your mom/dad voted or if you are liberal or conservative.
Gosh, this post is depressing.

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Look closely, very closely, at the trajectory of our national debt the last 4 years. Looks like a hockey stick.

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Sure you weren’t looking at global warming? Not that those policies won’t raise our cost of living.

I would have been willing to go over the cliff and make things real hard on us all to make us wake up. I knew after 3-6 months we’d be sitting in a far better position with a little pain.

For abopt 2 years we have been hearing about making those a little better off to pay their fair share. My answer was always, “What exactly would that do to improve the economy”? Those rooting for it, I hope you are happy. The rich had their taxes reverted, now after the smile comes off your face, please let me know how it helps the economy or anything? The CBO says despite raising taxes on the rich, 10 years of $4T in debt. A lot of good that did.

I also have thought if it is such a great cure all to tax the rick, then why not let them all roll back? Raise our taxes so I can have my rainbows, lollipops and sunshine.

Just a point of clarification….the top 1percent income earners start at $400K for an individual. In 2013, by most conventional definitions, someone making $400K per year is certainly not “rich”. Probably a moot point, but the term is being used entirely too loosely.

I am going to have to side with hoffies on this. It is a first… I know but it can not be laid out any clearer than he did for you. Maybe the fact that you’ve only been in the work force for 2 years will help us all understand a little more about you

Fire at will young man

Oh by the way you can always move to China Mexico or any other hell hole out there if you don’t like it here

I will side with this “young man” . it is a tax increase and anyone who denies it is mistaken. That being said we all need to realize,when we re-elect a socialist for president it isnt rocket science, we get a socialist agenda, May god help us all

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I will side with this “young man” . it is a tax increase and anyone who denies it is mistaken. That being said we all need to realize,when we re-elect a socialist for president it isnt rocket science, we get a socialist agenda, May god help us all

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AMEN!!!

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I am going to have to side with hoffies on this. It is a first… I know but it can not be laid out any clearer than he did for you. Maybe the fact that you’ve only been in the work force for 2 years will help us all understand a little more about you

Fire at will young man

Oh by the way you can always move China Mexico or any other hell hole out there if you don’t like it here

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I can see how this may have been misleading, and youth is all relevant…but I’m 35 years old.

I would also argue that our nation is one of freedom and is a capitalist one. Therefore, if you desire socialism, then perhaps YOU should move.

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Oh by the way you can always move to China Mexico or any other hell hole out there if you don’t like it here

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I get so tired with this remark when both sides use it. It is as if people don’t realize America is all about having opposing views and the freedom to express them.