Rockman’s Report/Please listen

1/14/06

Where do I begin, it has been a trying year to say the least. With all of the warm weather and very sketchy ice, as a resort owner for over 17 years. This is the worst I have ever seen for ice conditions. We go from upper 30s and 40s with rain and heavy wet snow last weekend, to below zero, with 30 mph winds and no snow. It is to say the least very, easy to make the rite choices when it comes to your lives. I can not condone what is going on with some of the other resorts on the lake rite now. With 6 vehicles this weekend, that have gone completely down to the bottom of the lake out of these resorts that I speak of and have been speaking about for the past 2 weeks. How can they go to bed at night with a clear conscience? How can they say that they are doing their best to keep you safe? When they have been letting people drive their vehicles on the worst ice in 20 years, for 2 weeks. Well, they got what they knew was going to happen this weekend. That is: that trucks went down to the bottom of the lake, luckily the people all got out in time. I will not let any one out of my resort this week with a vehicle until the weekend. The road needs that time to, not only heal from the traffic this weekend, but also to put more ice on it before the mad rush of the upcoming weekend. I was keeping as many vehicles off the lake as possible this weekend. I did not let anyone out that had a vehicle over a 3/4 ton out there, and they could not be hauling a house with them. After I heard about the first 4 vehicles that went down by Saturday, I was very uneasy about any vehicles being out there. I could not wait until Sunday to get them all off safely, so that I could sleep easy tonight. It is a very, very stressful time for all of us in this ice business, but I think, and you can quote me on this. I think that there are a few resorts that are not being cautious enough this year. I am in no way, telling people not to come up and go fishing, just make sure that the ice is thick and strong enough to handle the traffic that is going to be put on it through their resorts. I do not think that this is being to Over Cautious. This is what Karen McQuoid had to say about me in the Mille Lacs Messenger this week, and I quote:

Shame on Messenger

In last week’s Messenger, one southern resort owner provided some overcautious advice, and it was certainly not appreciated here on the southeast corner of the lake. For most of us who live here, we understand that the ice characteristics vary between the north end and the south end and the east end, etc. At our resort, for example, we have 13 to 13 1/2 inches of consistent, good ice within our bay. These conditions likely vary from further north or even south near Wahkon Bay or Cove Bay. A visitor might not realize this distinction and could be needlessly scared off by a local paper’s published information. (A quote by resort owner John Odle appeared in the Jan. 3, issue of the Messenger.)

Each resorter monitors the conditions of their respective areas, which is why fishermen are always encouraged to check with the local resort prior to heading out.

I expect this type of generic fear-based hype from the Twin Cities media. I realize that on the Internet, these types of reports often are out there as expert opinions and go unchallenged. However, why would our local paper print this type of misinformation? Winter fishing is critical to our economy all around Mille Lacs Lake – not only to the resort owners, but to the restaurants, gas stations, bait shops, gift shops, grocery store and so on. We all work hard to promote our area as a safe, fun destination. Shame on you, Messenger, for publishing this. Why not instead suggest that a person stop at a local resort or bait shop prior to going out fishing?

Come on; let’s try to help each other out rather than making a challenging season even more challenging.

Karen McQuoid, Mac’s Twin Bay Resort

Now, I do not know about you, but for me. How can you ever be to over cautious when it comes to peoples lives? Her attack on me, I found not only insulted my intelligence in this business, but also put undue risk to others on the lake. I was just going to let it go when over 50 people this weekend saw her letter to the editor and told me that if nothing else I needed to defend my honor and my reputation. So that is all I have to say about that.

Now for the report

The fishing on Friday was very slow. Saturday was a bit better, once the cold front had settled in and the winds came down. There were some nice walleyes and perch caught out in 22 ft of water and out in 27 ft of water. Sunday morning their was a great perch bite from 7:30 am until about 10:30 am. Then everyone went home and the walleye bite turned on at about 1:30 until about 4:30 pm. There were more that 5 walleyes caught this weekend over 27 inches. Very few fish this weekend were less than 21 inches. Most of the walleyes that were caught this weekend were caught on fat heads and small sucker minnows. I will be fishing tomorrow just to get rid of some of the anxiety I have had for the past 2 weeks. Wish me luck

Be Safe

We will see you when we see you.

The Rockman

I haven’t been up yet, but will be next weekend (with a 4 wheeler). I would much rather play things safe rather than risk it and I am always glad to see your report. Thanks and be safe. Good luck tomorrow with the stress reliever!!

Thanks for the update Rockman
To tell you the truth, I would rather have someone be upfront and honest with the conditions and the bite. I couldn’t imagine losing a vehicle or my life by pushing the envelope. If the ice is only safe out to a certain distance, then that is as far as I would want to go. Why risk your life or vehicle?

I’m pretty sure that the vehicles that have gone through have been people off roading about the lake.

As long as we’re on the topic,…..Mille Lacs is seeing many new visitors due to popularity and lack of ice elsewhere. Many people usually fish smaller lakes which are a bit more predictable. Yes the thickness of the ice is a rule of thumb but that is minor when you’re dealing a piece of ice this big. Some cracks are always open no matter how cold it gets. Most of the fallen vehicles have been in an active crack. Its fairly simple,….If you access the lake via resort road and expect to be safe, you stay on or near the roads. At no point can you expect to drive on the lake and go anywhere. Keep it safe guys

hey rock that’s why i go out at your resort i have 11year old son and i want to keep it that way and Hope he want to keep his father. its nice to have someone you can trust and not after the $$$$$ thank you

Rockman: great reports. You can never be too cautious when dealing with people’s lives. A group of us were also wondering what it costs to get a vehicle pulled out of the lake ( not that we’re the least bit interested in learning first hand!!) I’ve heard that insurance does not cover. Ture?? Thanks.

I saw 3/4 ton trucks with wheel houses on the flats this weekend.One guy drove by us and the ice broke open enough to let water through,then proceeded to drive over to his buddy and park directly next to his truck and wheel house.This kind of ignorance not only wrecks the ice but scared the hell out of everybody out there.Use common sense and be safe out there.

this year i have gone out of 5 different resorts, and now I can honestly say that the next times I get out I will be at your door step rockman you were honest to me, showed me some good places to set up , and actually said me then “I dunno” as an answer to my questions I thank you and I hope to get over there again soon!

thanks again, Mike

With the weather we have had this winter, my only question is why? It was just 40* and raining 12 days ago. I know that not everyone has access to ATV/Sled, but on such a big body of water with such poor ice conditions this year…why would anyone feel safe right now driving out–a resort road or anywhere on the lake? I know that alot of people are posting this thick of ice…or this, but the fact is the ice is not a normal winters ice. I hate to hear that people are going through. I understand that alot of people don’t fish unless they can drive out, but is any fish worth it? I would imagine that each and everyone that lost their vehicle this weekend will not be driving out again real soon. Or will think twice in the future about it. Please use caution, and maybe think twice about driving out this year.

Hey, Rockman, sick to your guns, you did the wright thing and dont let a few people get under your skin. I have never fished up there but you can bet when I get the chance this winter you will get all of my buisiness, thanks for telling it like it is that is why your reports go so far

KORY

I second what Matt said, At no point can you drive on the lake and go anywhere….

Agreed with Glen and Matt. No offense intended Rockman… but you seem to be judging other resorts as much as Karen judged you. Conditions vary from resort to resort. And who is to say that the resorts didn’t tell these people to “Stick to the roads” and the people going down ignoring this advice. I heard about one truck and house going down that were driving ALONG SIDE of a nice crack. I doubt the resorts that let them out told them that they had free range of the lake. Come on now… I know you want business and you want others to know you are concerned… but the above bash against all other resort owners is uncalled for and not warranted. If you can name me one resort that told their customers to feel free to roam the entire lake without caution… I will take this all back.

I understand your concern Rockman. And your choice to allow vehicles access through your resort is your buisness. I do know that resorts on the east side are marking their roads with stakes to known “Safe areas” of the lake. (Yes, I know no ice is 100% safe, I acknowledge that, but we all know what I am talking about within reason.) The routes to the flats are very sketchy at best, and no one is making cracks safe beyond the resort roads. I felt very safe traversing roads marked as safe by the resort I used. I did not travel to any of the flats without an ATV or snowmobile. Your area of the lake is obviously different from the area I fish, and I appreciate your warnings. The fact that the ice is not safe where you are right now is one thing. But to claim that resort owners are irresponsible for allowing vehicle traffic out of their resorts is not fair in my opinion. The vehicles that I know of that went down were in fact “Off Roading” and the resort that I frequent has been URGING people to stay on marked roads. They have been taking care of unsafe spots with bridges, and have been telling folks that buy road passes to report any unsafe spots that they may encounter. I believe that to be good information to be handed out by any resort.
How about people driving on from public accesses? With the small amount of snow on the ice, there are many people driving on from PA’s. Cracks and heaves are not being controlled by any resort.
My advice? Go on the lake through a resort that has a good reputation for caring for their roads. Listen to the advice of the resort owners. If they do not recommend traffic by vehicles, listen to them. They make their living doing this. If you travel off marked resort roads, you do so at your own risk.

i agree however I have not drove any thing other then my sled out this year (and plan to keep it that way) I have been told very little about ice conditions from many of the resorts I have been to this year, maybe that has changed but even at Hunters all then said was follow the road thats it no directions as to any where abouts on the lake you are at or are going to! Rockman you are the only place that gave me any heads up as to what was out there maybe thats just what I am looking for when I go out of a resort

Come on you two. Lets reread what I wrote. The only control that we as resort owners have,starts at the acesss. If you do not let them out. They cannot wander in the 1st place. I can tell you from experience, that 20% of the peole will listen to what you say. The rest are out there making the wrong choices. If you could have seen what I saw this weekend as far as people listening, you would have throw your hands in the air and quit. People were driving way over 50 mph and whipping shittys and driving rite next to houses all day and night long. I saw it and I heard about it from people that were out there this weekend. It was not just my place either. This topic has been turned into me against them and that is way off of the mark on the message I am tryng to send. Staying alive is all I am concerned about rite now. Me and you. Lets not forget who is morally responsible for your saftey when you use my access. That is any resorter that is letting people on the ice with vehicles rite now. I can tell you this. If someone would have gone down out of here. I would be closing the road off to vehicle traffic indefinetly. They did not and still took the 10.00 bucks and told people to just stay away from the marked area. Come on, was that the rite choice?. Bad move on their part I do beleive. I had my post deleted on another site that I am sure you all have been to, just becuase that particular resort on the site is a sponcer. If we as posters and members cannot voice or opinions on these sites, in a respectful manner without fear of censorship. Then what good are they? I have a feelimg that you will only get my posts on my web site pretty soon. I spend a lot of time putting these reports together and i do think them through before i post it, just to have them deleted if they strike a nerve with the owners of the site. That is Bull S**T. just imagine if you could do that to any press. We would be living like the Iracy’s, in fear for our lives to have freedom of expretion.
The Rockman

I think we all need to use common sense. I know this is not the first year, vehicles have gone down in the pond. I know this is not the first year that people have been racing and whippin’ donuts on the lake. I know this is not the first year the ice has been suspect. I don’t think this needs to be turned into a pizzing match between resorts, “I care more than you” and so on. Ultimately, when a person pulls up to the big lake, they make the decision, whether to pull into the PA or the resort. They make the decision whether to walk into the resort and pay the access walk out or ask questions about conditions & directions. I know the resort I frequent, will answer any and all questions you have. Let’s just exercise some common sense and some respect for the ice and your fellow angler.

Glen Ertl

Big G
You are rite. This is not the 1st time for all of what you stated, But this is the 1st time since the early 60s that we have had this bad of ice conditions. Lets keep this in perspective. Look at Eddy lybeck or any of the resorts that have been doing this for a very long time. They are thinking just like me on this issue. We do have some control when it comes to letting people out of our acesses.
Those are the facts.
Rock

Rockman,

First of all… I have been on this site long enough to know that your posts will most likely not be deleted. This is not due to Freedom of Expression… it is due to that fact that you have not crossed a line. These forums as well as other forums are not bound by the consitution that provides freedom of speech. These are privately owned sites that are moderated for the better of the community. If your posts start bashing specific resorts… expect them to be deleted. James and the mods are VERY fair in how they conduct themselves and this site. But as I have learned on other sites by watching others… learn to conduct yourself and your posts properly… and you won’t have a problem.

Now to respond to your post. Here is a quote from you:

Quote:

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I can not condone what is going on with some of the other resorts on the lake rite now. With 6 vehicles this weekend, that have gone completely down to the bottom of the lake out of these resorts that I speak of and have been speaking about for the past 2 weeks. How can they go to bed at night with a clear conscience? How can they say that they are doing their best to keep you safe? When they have been letting people drive their vehicles on the worst ice in 20 years, for 2 weeks. Well, they got what they knew was going to happen this weekend. That is: that trucks went down to the bottom of the lake, luckily the people all got out in time.

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As long as the resorts are up front and honest with the fisherman, I have no problems with them. If they tell me to stick to the staked roads, and I go off roading… nobody in their right mind could hold the resorts responsible. You can’t fix stupid. If you stick to what you wrote above, and assuming no ice is 100% safe, how could you, as a resort owner, ever let ANYONE drive out onto the lake from your resort? What is a resort owner to do? Have people take a personality test before going out to see if they dumb‘s?

Please keep the reports coming, Rockman! we all appreciate it!

Call the DNR. they will tell you that in fact there was a truck that went down. As per my conversation with The Dnr just yesterday evening, there were 6 total for the weekend. You could even call the guy that pulls them out. His name is Rick Straka He lives in the area. None of them were from the west side. I wonder why?

Ya know, how ANY of you can post ANYTHING other than a “thank you” to guys like John who post up front reports to make YOUR life better and safer is beyond me! If you disagree with him or others in cases where well intended efforts are concerned, WHY debate or whatever with them?

It amazes me that MOST of these posts, whatever the subject, are rarely signed with real names nor do these “profiles” have ANY pertinent contact or identity info within them.

If you have an opinion…fine. If you have some good, well intended info or wanna debate an issue…fine. But be up front and put your REAL name, contact info and whatever in your profile or eventually you WILL lose the REAL up front posters who are the KEYS to YOUR fishing success and YOUR fishing safety. Why play these “name games”?

Now— back to the subject of SAFETY and FISHING reports offered by John. Without “anonymous” postings…

Thank you John!

Steve Fellegy
218-678-3103

Steve,

I go by a nickname given to me a long time ago. I have never thought that someone that does not include their real name is “hiding”. The debate above is not about whether Rockman, or John as you are calling him (he does sign off with his name either), are providing useful information. The issue I was debating was most of his original post did not contain useful information other than what seemed to be slamming other resorts. At the end of one of my last posts… I asked him to keep providing the reports and told him we appreciate it.

Dave Barber

As a victim of identity theft I will say I understand why alot of people in todays society creates a name to hide there real identity. And when registering to alot of sites they tell you up front not to use your personal information thus creating a user NICKNAME/Password!
It is your choice to put your personal information on the net for millions to view and it is others choice not to open that door for millions.. This site is a great site and has many honest maybe dishonets maybe registered members but everyday there are many browsing thru the site and many others that are not registered and again honest maybe dishonest maybe one never knows.
But as a victim of identity theft and still trying to recover from it I opt not to use my real name but my intials to my name…

I still do not see where I had slammed or blamed anyone for what had happend this weekend. I will not respond to anything more on the subjest. For those of you that have faith in me and my experiance, go to my web site for the real post http://www.rockyreef.com there I will not be bound by so called site rules and ethics that do not give me the rite of free speech without cencorship
That is all I have to say about that.
John odle aka The Rockman 13207 twilight rd
Onamia Mn 56359
phone
320 532 3431
Owner of Rocky Reef Resort for 18 years

You cannot steal someone’s identity by learning thier name, address and phone number. All of that info is readily availble by many other means.

Keep you SSN and DL numbers private. Don’t post bank account numbers and I assure you will not have a problem with identiy theft.

Now, spam in you e-mail account is another matter.

-J.

Jon~
You are correct that info is no use for easy identity theft but it is the open door for a start to identity theft. Today the identity theft area has grown and has evolved to alot of ground pounding and homework. With a name and address and a few posts on the internet such as 50 thousand dollar boats for sale or being mentioned by people owning is enough fuel to give a thief to take that drive to Jon Does house and check out his mail box for the rest of the info needed to attack his credit lifestyle. I am just saying from what I have been told in these classes is that every protective measure one takes to protect his identity is just another step it makes harder for the criminal out there trying to steal there identity..

Getting a little rough around here these days.
Slow down, way down, when driving on the ice. I wonder how many of these problems are from the ice roads being damaged by speed?

Jon, are you saying that I should not respond/invest whilst only trying to assist the second in line to the nigerian throne? he only needs me to send him $34,676… which just happens to be the balance in my 401K?!?! And I am to get $24 million for my troubles?!?!

The_bladepuller~
Alot of ice damage is caused by speed on the ice most of it starts out on how fast people enter the ice causing an under the ice wave which goes in the direction a person is going at time of entering and causing the damage at the otherside where the ripple applys pressure to the ice as it meets the shore. The faster peole enter the larger the ripple effect is causing more damage at the ending point of the ripple. Another cause of ice damage is volume of traffic. Not enough time between vehicles carrying heavy loads for the ice to repair itself. Thus causing some ice roads to become rough and unsafe to travel at times…Just my .02

What?!?!? You got that email too?

Damn…. Something’s not right here

Oh well

Chris

Quote:

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You cannot steal someone’s identity by learning thier name, address and phone number. All of that info is readily availble by many other means.

Keep you SSN and DL numbers private. Don’t post bank account numbers and I assure you will not have a problem with identiy theft.

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Jon, no offense… but you are completely wrong. Name/Address/Phone number are some of the basic starting points to identity theft. I am in IT and know quite a bit about online security. Using this information through email, many elderly folk have been dupped out of thousands of dollars. Basic assumption of the victims is that if the person on the other end already has this information, they must be legit. Same goes with over the phone scams. “Hi, this is so and so from your financial institution… We are updating our records and we would like to verify that the information we have is correct… Is your address still “such and such”. Yes? Ok, and the phone number I called is still the best contact for you? Ok, and your savings account we have listed down as XXXX-XXXX-XX is that correct? No? Ok, can you please provide this so we can update your records? Thank you so much for your time sir. Have a great day”.

You still think it is harmless? This happens every day.