Fishing Ethics

I have pondered the ramifications this post may lead to and decided it is best to air some “dirty” laundry.
While out in the middle of the lake trolling with Jon J on Saturday, we saw a boat with one angler in it. Even from a distance of 100 yards or so, we could see this angler had 2 lines out. Playing the devils advocate , an announcement was made on the VHF radio to anyone listening, that this slob in a red Lund was fishing with 2 lines. We could see this “sportsman” scramble to pull one line up so we know he was listening. It was not too long later, that with binoculars , we could see him running 2 lines again. Another public service announcement was made and a fellow fisherman even commented that he could see the sob himself.
More radio chatter resulted and then the comment that blew me away came across the airwaves. GET OVER IT! I was stunned that someone would try to defend this slob. It may have been the idiot himself.
Well , here goes. If you are out in the middle of the lake look for a maroon Lund Pro V Magnum with Yammy ob’s. This clown has a large white umbrella to shield him from the sun so he is easy to spot. This make me think he is out often and fishing like an outlaw is common practice.
I will pass this info on to the local CO’s and maybe this guy will get checked often.
Dino

Well Done !!

There is one other comment I would like to make about nets attracting fishermen. We had just landed a nice fish and with 4 guys in a red 17′ boat, it must have looked like a (name your own ethnic group here) fire drill.
This boat came off of plane and swooped out in front of us so close that we had to swing wide so our outside boards did not make contact with the jerks. And this was at least 200 yards off of the flat.
Oh well , thats fishing!

Mr. D, My two comment’s….Didn’t you have a cell phone? That’s what the tip line is for. Not that I’m holding you responsable for not turning the guy in…but I think you should have…After you warned him yourself as you did… (in case he wasn’t aware of the law)

Also, I think the CO should have made a note on the ticket…..yup, you guessed it….”GET OVER IT”!

As long as we are talking about Ethics….

We met 4 boats while fishing some narrow rivers by Redwing. Three of the boats slowed to No Wake speed when they went around us..(we where anchored along shore). These rivers were less than 100 feet wide. One SeaDoo jet boat didn’t think it needed to slow down…in fact he went faster. when he passed us… Had my wife not been with me (she hates confrontation…unless it’s with me ) I would have stopped them and given them the boating rules turned to the page that pertains to the “no wake within 100 feet of another boat….

As you said…”Oh well, that’s fishing!”

I am not going to try to justify what the person in the Red Lund was doing, but it happens a lot and not just him. The guy in the Red Lund is on the water most days,and has probably not kept a fish all year. If you watch the trollers on Mille Lacs you will see them pulling extra lines occasionally. These people never keep a fish and personally I don’t care that they are using extra lines.

I am a big supporter of using two lines in this state and I personally think it is a joke that we can not. We have limits to prevent over harvest, one more line doesn’t make a difference in most cases. Many states have different laws for trolling versus rigging. In some states you can use 3 & 4 lines each while you are trolling. As we all know, open water trolling with one rod in the boat a tough task.

Again, I don’t want to sound like I am justifying this practice, however, I do think the law should be changed to allow 2 rods year around, so that it is legal.

How many poles can you have in Minnesota? Does anyone know about Wisconsin, I think it is 3 here.

One rod on inland lakes in MN during the summer. 2 rods / lines may be used during the winter. On boarder waters between MN & WI (Mississippi River & St. Croix Rivers) 2 lines may be used during the open water season.

And I agree with Scott about being limited to only one line on MN lakes. Old, out-dated law that needs to be changed.

Great response Scott & James!

I agree totally, I think??? I agree about changing the law. 2 lines per person, year around, will not do anything to the fish population, that is why we protect the fish by limits and slots.

I definitely do not back the guy in the Red Lund , to think he is of a higher power or above the law , especially after Dino sent a warning shot at him .

I couldn’t agree with you more Scott. I never understood what the reasoning is behind that law. Like the other posts stated, it doesn’t effect the total number of fish in the live-well one bit!! It sure would be nice to pre-fish with more than one line! But the law is what it is and I will abide by it just the same.

Being on the Croix…where I can only use two and my friends the cheeseheads can you three..I complety agree with a law change….But the fact remains…it is the law at this time and until it’s changed it should be followed not based on when I felt like it or who I am…

I saw that Red Lund out there this past week a few times with the umbrella up. We proceeded to pull a couple nice fish in and he immediately turned my way and started to make his way to where I was. I was not close enough to tell how many lines he was running, I simply turned away from him to stay away from the crowds. I do not go out of my way to see that people are obeying the law, its an expected obligation and priveledge by purchasing a fishing license and reading the rules and regulations, however I do support the 2 lines per angler law being changed in Mn. Slots and limits are what drive the harvestable weight from a body of water, not multiple lines. Sure it would make a guy more efficient on the water, but thats the entire purpose of having a daily possession limit. There was some discussion on that topic with the DNR about a year ago if I remember right? Anyone remember what came out of that proposal discussion?

I think I need to add that although I think they law should be changed I would in no way encourage anyone to break the law until it is changed.

If I remember right, the 2 lines in the summer never came up for vote. I know at that time the head of the DNR was not for it. I also think it was introduced the same time as the bill that would have done away with shelter licences for portable ice houses. That didn’t make it either.

Every once in a while, a bill effecting fishing/hunting gets passed that actually makes sense, rarely, but it does happen

As James said, I do not condone the activity of the Red Lund, even though I have seen him doing it before. I just chose not to say anything because I think one line only is ridiculous.

The law of only one line in open water has always baffled me. Especially since you can use two in the winter, one of which (a tipup) you are hardly paying any attention to.

On a related note to the posts above…what is it with people moving in just because a few fish are caught. I always thought the fun of fishing was locating them and catching them, not using binoculors to see who’s pulling them in. I see nothing wrong with asking people where they are biting, what the are biting on, who-what-when-where-why….etc. But you don’t use someone’s fishing spot while they are currently using it. As I mentioned in previous posts, this is my first trip to milly and I was hoping to get away from this stuff. Maybe there is no getting away from it.

ps I don’t own a Lund…

Call me a selfish, whining crybaby. But if I can’t fish 2 lines, you can’t either! (That comment is not pointed to anyone in particular.)

Count me as another person who would like to see the law changed. But the fact is it’s one line. And we all know that aint gunna change anytime soon. Probably never. You want to fish multiple lines, go to Wisconsin!

So, as you can see, it’s one of those things I see out on the lake that pisses me off! I’m not shy about that fact either. So, if you see a guy in a red YarCraft with a Merc 150 on back. (Only Red YarCraft I have ever seen and only one on the lake I’m sure.) Please pull in that extra line. As the topic of this posting questions: Where are the ethics here?

Dino, you don’t need to call the Mille Lacs CO. I have already talked to him. I was creel checked at the wharf yesterday and gave them all the info. The CO assured me that they would widen their checks out to the flats. Currently they have concentrated their efforts on the bobber fishermen out of Isle. As he put it “They have been keeping us busy there….” (Meaning the bobber fishermen are running multiple lines there too.) I forget his last name, but the first name is Bob and his number is 218-927-4804.

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Maybe there is no getting away from it.

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I live on the St Croix…Not much getting away from it here!

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You want to fish multiple lines, go to Wisconsin!

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Jon? Where do you stand on this issue?

Kidding aside. Doesn’t the DNR monitor a channel up there?

I too vote in favor of adding an additional line to MN open waters. But I do wonder about it not making a difference. When it comes to trophy waters, MN is better than WI. Maybe it’s the people or economically related, but trophy fish……. I aim toward MN all the time! WI has some dandies but I think more fish or limits are caught over here because of multiple lines, thus reducing the number of potential trophy fish. Also, in the hands of a poacher, I’d like to see some data on how an extra line carries no effects.

If the whole world practiced CPR, run 10 lines if you have the boat for it. But until then, I see MN comparing their fisheries to other states and until the fishing is better somewhere else, why would they change?

Breaking the law is breaking the law and if you feel like turning someone in, do it. We’re all accountable for our actions and that’s that. I speed, I get a ticket. I steal, I go to jail. On and on…… so if this guy’s not keeping fish, it’s like speeding. He still deserves a ticket by the lettering of the law. If he’s hoarding fish too, it’s like stealing and should be dealt with accordingly.

Honestly, if the guy needs to run 2 lines that bad, list an open seat in the Trip/Swap forum and take a buddy! Do a daily ARM event with one BB/BS and book up your summer! I don’t feel it’s worth the risk of losing ANY of my hunting/fishing priviledges…… but maybe that’s a “values” issue?

Another 2 cents……

Kid;
I agree with you wholeheartely.

The “average” anlger doesn’t catch their limit of walleyes, execpt for probably the “top ten” walleye waters in this state.

My opinion of the top ten would be:
LOTW
Mille Lacs
Mississippi
Leech
Winni
Rainy
Vermillion
Kabe
Gull
Crane

If I recall correctly, all of these waters have some type of slot limit imposed of some type. Why? Because these waters, an angler can go and catch their limit.

Take a look at the other 9,990 waters……..It is a bit of a challenge. Now, at times, if an angler could run 2 lines, I feel the odds of catching more fish are very likely (be it 2 slip bobbers, 2 trolled cranks, 2 jigs, etc)

Another group of people who will catch their limit of walleyes are guides. It is the guides business to get their clients “food”, as many clients want the “food”, considering the amount of money they are spending. Not all clients, but I would guess the majority???? Am I correct???

So, in my honest opinion, I do feel it would be impactive to fish 2 lines on a lot of water.

I hear comments of how it would be nice to troll multiple lines for open water trolling…………but doesn’t the 1 line make it more of a challenge????

I hate all the goofy laws that Minnesota has. But this one, I think is honestly a good idea.

Now, again, as much as I hate all the goofy laws………..I would be in favor of an angler running 2 lines if that person purchased a “conservation” license, which would restrict the person from harvesting trophies and have maybe a 2 fish limit. Also, I would have to add that if one person in the boat has the conservation license, then all persons would have to follow the law, or not run 2 lines.

I know I’m kinda tapping into the “realm” of the guides here and running 2 lines can be critical for putting fish in the boat to “feed” their clients. However, when you look at the vast amount of anlgers in Minnesota………I have to say leave it be.

Where do I get the idea of the conservation license??? Ontario has a conservation license that only allows 2 fish possession with NON over 18 inches……….

In my opinion, this would only truely benefit guides and waters will lower quantities of walleyes (example would be to run a lindy rig with a minnow, and the other with a crawler to see what the fish prefer. Instead of running a minnow for an hour to only rule out the fish don’t want minnows. If you could run both types of bait, you could possibly rule out the weaker bait in a matter of minutes). And, on bodies with vast quantities of walleyes, it would only make you more efficient in collecting your limit of fish, meaning it may only take 4 hours to get your limit, instead of 8 hours…….

Good post Gary but if we have limits in place, how would 2 lines make an impact. When lawmakers set the state limit at 6 fish, is that the number they came up with after considering most anglers are not that skilled and they probably wont catch 6 fish? If thats the case, allow 2 lines and cut the limit to 3. I never understood why we can have two lines in the winter but not in the summer. Winter fishing can be just as good sometimes. Limits are limits and if you buy a license, you are entitled to your limit. The only case I would use a two lines is when bobber fishing alone. Say I have two lines out and catch my Mille lacs limit of 4 and head in. With a one line law, I can add another person in the boat to make up for the extra line but now I have also increased our limit to 8 fish. I know a few guys that “force” thier kids to get into the boat to add the extra lines. No problem taking kids fishing if they want to go, but to lay them on the floor with a GameBoy is just silly. This goes back to the camera argument when they were going to ban them. All these smart lawmakers thought all the lakes would be fished out. Well its 6 years later and I still dont see cameras making fish bite. You can lead a horse to water yada yada…

Gary I would support your conservation liscense for two lines.

I also dont think MOST people dont pull limits from the lakes you listed. During hotbites it can happen, but the trend for the last few years has been poor. The average guy cant buy a bite on Leech and Leech has no slot. Mille lacs has been slow to most people the last two years. Mille lacs didnt have a slot until the netting started. LOTW is a winter walleye factory, I would bet 80% of the fish caught are from resorts putting the average joe on fish. Most slot limits are put into place to keep people from keeping large females, not because these lakes are easy to fish. I have to disagree a two line law would only benefit guides. Just my 2 cents..

I hear ya Derek. And alot of what you say makes sense. However limits are based on many factors. I know a South Dakota lake that had perch limits. Everyone flocked there because catching their limit could be done. It hurt the population before the dnr could respond. Now the limits are lowered. Limits are established on what the average person can do………And the average walleye guy can’t get his limit on the vast majority of this states waters…….not the majority of the time……….So, a 3 fish limit or even a 2 fish limit is cool with me……..

I look at my own expirence on the river last weekend. I was trolling with my buddy and we were usings 2 lines each. We were able to eliminate which color of crank the fish wanted very fast. Now, if I would of been on my own, it would of taken me much, much longer to decipher that pattern. One, I had to find the fish………..Two, had to give the fish what they wanted. With 4 lines, we found the fish fast…………then we were able to figure out what color they wanted………..FAST. If I would of been alone, it could of taken me 3 or 4 hours to figure out what we did in 30 minutes.

The same with dragging jigs. We started in the morning with 2 different colored jigs, each loaded with a leech and a crawler. Again, between the 2 of us, we established the pattern real quick, compared to if I would of been alone. We caught lots of fish……….about 4 limits worth…….no, didn’t keep them all…….Only enough for a meal.

Yep, 4 guys with 1 line each could of figured out the same pattern. But the 2 lines for 2 guys got it done quick. If I would of been alone, with only 1 line……..It might of taken me 2 hours of decipering one jig pattern. And my opinon of the guy who makes his kid go fishing just so he can fish 2 lines……..he ain’t much of a “father”.

Yep…….In my opinion it is a blast pulling 4 lines behind a boat. You really got to put them all in sync and when you are catching fish………man you feel “cool” about it, because you got it in sync. Why is it cool? Not everyone can do it all the time………..

But, running multiple lines………how does it “not” make a person more effective? Yep, “horse to water”……..but these fish will eat something……..it is all a matter of the process of elimination. You will eliminate much faster, baits that don’t work, making you more effective and productive.

I know lots of people (including me at times) that go to bodies of water and struggle. Yet, the experienced person goes out and scores. If the “rookie” can go out and run multiple lines to do the “process elimination” eventually the pattern that the fish want will be figured out and the “rookie” is going to score “faster”.

Again, for sport………I’m all for it…….
But for “harvesting”……….IMHO it’s no good…..

Gary/Derek,

You both have very valid points in my opinion. This is a great topic for discussion. I grew up with two rods in my hands all the time. Yes, there were days when we caught our limits much quicker because we had two rods, others we still got skunked. I miss being able to have a larger variety of lures over the side. Some days it made me a more efficient fisherman, some days it didn’t help. Either way, I was limited to x amount of fish. Do we need to consider changing limits because of this?? I’ll leave that to the “experts”.

Since most of us here are huge supporters of selective harvest, it’s seems second nature that even if we were catching more fish, it doesn’t equate to keeping more fish. We just want to have the fun of catching.

Most of “good” lakes, have harvest limits, slot limits, reduced bag limits and posession limits. I think you are getting my point.

Even if a lake such as Mille Lacs has a 1 fish limit, the overall harvest will not change, the average catch per angler per outing is less than one fish.

Two lines simply gives you more options. More baits in the water, more water that can be covered. In the overall “harvest” it wouldn’t make a bit of difference.

We can fish 3 lines here in Wisconsin but when I’m trolling the river with a partner we only have 1 line each out anyway.
Only so much room on the river here. Besides, we can hardly keep up with 1 line each lately.

Haha! Love that smilie!

well i might be a little late to add to this post but i am going to add anyway. Last sunday, i was out fishing on pepin and watched one guy in the boat running 3 lines. i didn’t say anything to that guy, but i look at it this way. if he needs to have that many lines in the water, he must really suck as a fisherman. not only does he suck as a fisherman, but should get a healthy fine from the DNR. I follow the rules and sometimes don’t even run 2 poles for hte fear of loosing one or getting the lines tangled up and not having my lures out of the water more than in. it doesn’t hurt to call poeple on it, lord knows that if we tried to get away with it, someone would more than likely say something or even call the DNR on us. I support the change to 2 lines also. that way you can cover more water effectively for all fish.

thanks

shane

Shane,

On Pepin, a person who is a Wisconsin Resident with a Wi fishing license can legally fish up to 3 lines…

-J.

All true… but I do believe they may only do so on the WI side of the river.

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Shane,

On Pepin, a person who is a Wisconsin Resident with a Wi fishing license can legally fish up to 3 lines…

-J.

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but i look at it this way. if he needs to have that many lines in the water, he must really suck as a fisherman. not only does he suck as a fisherman, but should get a healthy fine from the DNR.

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Hey, hey, hey now I runs three lines while trolling by myself from time to time. What are you trying to say Shane? Don’t sugar coat it, just come out and say it. LOL

James, I believe you are correct a Wisconsin resident may only run three lines on the WI side of the navigational channel.

Gator Hunter

I agree gator, i know that WI people can run more than 2 lines. I am just using that as an example of other things that people have seen or even done themselves. I know guys that will go fish the big pond when it ices over and put all 6 or 8 rattles wheels down into the water. I just get mad when i see others that do this and then i see others that follow the rules. I know that most of the guys that put all of them lines dont really catch a whole lot of fish. i have had better luck with 1 pole than 2 or 3.

shane