Finally….common sense prevails

I see they are talking about finally folding up the Northstar rail service from Big Lake into the cities. What a colossal waste of money.

I used it for a few years before covid when I worked down town. Pretty slick actually. Only took 25mins from the anoka stop vs an hour of traffic but I agree after covid its pretty much a waste.

thought they were just gonna kick that down the road a bit????

or is that a different line????

Was just a few years ago they talked about extending it to Rice! Youbetcha, how full(or empty) were the cars on average?

Very full honestly. Had way more trips too. No clue if it made money but it was pretty busy.

Was honestly curious. That surprises me.

They are considering swapping it to a bus line.

But here’s some stats

“In 2019, the Northstar Line carried 767,768 passengers and operated seven days a week. After COVID-19 hit, Metro Transit cut back Northstar’s daily round trips and eliminated weekend service. Annual ridership plummeted to 50,433 in 2021. As Northstar gradually added trips, that number had nearly doubled to 97,265 by 2023”

https://kstp.com/kstp-news/top-news/leaders-consider-bus-route-to-replace-struggling-northstar-line/

I don’t care how many they haul it’ll never make a nickle. When I rode it you paid on the honor system. Nobody on the train at all collecting funds or making people pay. I really wonder how many paid. I’ve read thats also a major problem on the other lines as well as the crime.

They said on the news tonight the actual cost to operate was well over $100 per passenger. Something tells me we lost our taxpayer arse on that venture!!

Shocking….., YET another metropolitan council face plant … if only they were elected, we could VOTE them out. Maybe we will get lucky and the folks who thought that was a good idea will get fired … I doubt it, no way the chief potato head in this state would do that to his cronies, they will just move onto another stupid idea that is not wanted or needed …

chief potato head!!!!

Look at the SW line they are building. Billions (with a B) over budget and years behind. Light rail has been a tremendous fail for the Twin Cities. They should’ve stopped after the Blue line from the airport to downtown.

The green line from MPLS to St. Paul is also a fail. The crime is so bad along that line no one wants to ride it.

We took it from Big Lake to the Twins game a couple times. It was pretty slick. Long before all the crime and crap that is going on now. It was pretty full when we went too.

In theory it’s a good idea. However when you don’t staff it you make payment and safety optional which is a no go for most law abiding people. I’m sure a few here would be pleased if they were able to “scam” the state by not paying the 50 cents or whatever the cost is for a ride.
I read last year they are still pushing to put in a line from Duluth down to the Metro. Another boondoogle that will cost billions and serve practically nobody. Where in the world do these guys who approve of these things come from?

Dutchboy wrote:

Another boondoogle that will cost billions and serve practically nobody. Where in the world do these guys who approve of these things come from?

Say it louder for the people in the back! I am with you all the way on this.

Dutchboy wrote:

In theory it’s a good idea. However when you don’t staff it you make payment and safety optional which is a no go for most law abiding people. I’m sure a few here would be pleased if they were able to “scam” the state by not paying the 50 cents or whatever the cost is for a ride.
I read last year they are still pushing to put in a line from Duluth down to the Metro. Another boondoogle that will cost billions and serve practically nobody. Where in the world do these guys who approve of these things come from?

The metro area isn’t built to support mass transit like this. We’re too spread out for it to work.

The reason it got traction initially is because most of the funds came from the feds, not as much was paid for by the state. So, even though tax payers fund it, the direct hit to the MN taxpayer was minimal. However, Hennepin county raised taxes to help fund it.

The SW line original budget was $1.3bn and it’s now at $2.9bn.

Only gubment could accomplish something like this. Will be interesting to see how much those last 2 lines change before it’s operating. I especially like “changing soil conditions”.

The Southwest Light Rail Transit (SWLRT) project in Minneapolis, Minnesota was originally estimated to cost $1.25 billion and open in 2018. However, the project’s budget and timeline have changed multiple times due to challenges like construction issues and changing soil conditions. The project is now expected to open in 2027 and cost $2.86 billion.
Original budget and timeline
Budget: $1.25 billion
Opening date: 2018
Current budget and timeline
Budget: $2.86 billion
Opening date: 2027

Seems like all the “mass transit” plans are flawed. I’m not an expert but I do know downtown has has far less employees commuting now since covid/work from home changed the employment scope. Then, look at the debacle the Southwest Rail project is! I am in the Eden Prairie/Hopkins area frequently and it’s just sitting…far over budget and embroiled in lawsuits. It’s maddening and completely irresponsible. I went with a few friends to a Twins game year before last and we met at a brewpub in South Mpls. Took the LR to Target Field on a weekday. It was far from crowded and at one stop, a few guys outside were fighting…one reached in his hoodie pocket acting like he was going to pull out a gun and the other two ran. On the way back after the game, a really pleasant middle aged AA woman got on somewhere downtown. You could see she was going home after work. A buddy who is a former cop started talking to her asking questions on how her experience was riding the light rail. She said it works well for her but nobody rides it anymore since downtown is basically a ghost town. The guy smoking crack in the seats behind us was an eye opener too. I personally don’t think I’d ride it again and certainly not at night. The “do gooders” may well do us all in…

Karl Hungus wrote:

Seems like all the “mass transit” plans are flawed. I’m not an expert but I do know downtown has has far less employees commuting now since covid/work from home changed the employment scope. Then, look at the debacle the Southwest Rail project is! I am in the Eden Prairie/Hopkins area frequently and it’s just sitting…far over budget and embroiled in lawsuits. It’s maddening and completely irresponsible. I went with a few friends to a Twins game year before last and we met at a brewpub in South Mpls. Took the LR to Target Field on a weekday. It was far from crowded and at one stop, a few guys outside were fighting…one reached in his hoodie pocket acting like he was going to pull out a gun and the other two ran. On the way back after the game, a really pleasant middle aged AA woman got on somewhere downtown. You could see she was going home after work. A buddy who is a former cop started talking to her asking questions on how her experience was riding the light rail. She said it works well for her but nobody rides it anymore since downtown is basically a ghost town. The guy smoking crack in the seats behind us was an eye opener too. I personally don’t think I’d ride it again and certainly not at night. The “do gooders” may well do us all in…

My understanding is they have more transit cops now. I’ll pay for an Uber from my house before I’d ride it. At one point, they weren’t enforcing the ticketing policies so it was mainly homeless people just riding the train back and forth.

It should be insulting to every thinking person, that they keep building rail lines. People are accustomed to their own vehicles, OR an Uber/Lyft picking them up wherever they are currently standing. Not walking, biking, driving or Ubering to a train station to go a few miles. I used to live in St. Paul and took the Green Line to DT MSP once, it was over an hour to go 11 miles. And then recently took the Blue Line from Term 2 to Term 1, there were multiple homeless people, a few empty liquor/beer bottles rolling around and a crack pipe. Just the place I want to bring my kids…I also work in EP, no one wanted the SW rail here from the get go, but still they pushed forward. Now no one goes DT for work, and the locals REALLY don’t want to export MSP problems here, and still it moves forward. It’s both ridiculous and insulting imo.

I think they build them for the homeless.. it gets cold here.

Not to worry , Dutchy! They are or have been working on the next money pit, Northern Lights Express! This will run from Minneapolis to Duluth. 80% funded by the Feds and 20% on MN. Estimated cost at $592-million and riders fares will cover $12 million or 63% of the operating costs.

Based on previous experiences I’m sure the estimated cost will be much higher than the $592M and the riders fares will cover less than the $12M/63% of the operating costs. Just my opinion.

California has the same. A rail line that’s millions over budget and nowhere near completion. I think it’s a money washing machine

grubson wrote:

California has the same. A rail line that’s millions over budget and nowhere near completion. I think it’s a money washing machine

Unfortunately Minnesota and California have too much in common.

grubson wrote:

California has the same. A rail line that’s Billions over budget and nowhere near completion. I think it’s a money washing machine

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I don’t know how wasting an initial investment of 317 million is common sense. Required to prevent further bleed out but not common sense. Even the bus line will be a loss of 1.7 million a year to operate with the current ridership. Common sense would be the complete dismemberment of the met council.

Riverrat wrote:

I don’t know how wasting an initial investment of 317 million is common sense. Required to prevent further bleed out but not common sense. Even the bus line will be a loss of 1.7 million a year to operate with the current ridership. Common sense would be the complete dismemberment of the met council.

The met council and the Minneapolis city council all need to go. It’s mind boggling the decisions they make. The MPLS city council is an even bigger head scratcher because people vote for these idiots. They make Frey look like a conservative with how absurd some of their ideas are.

This looks like the result of a combination of remote work after VID and a bunch of people saying take your 15 minute city and shove it.

The California high speed rail, approved in 2008, is without a doubt the biggest disaster we’ve seen in a long time. Three times over on cost (estimate $106 billion) for a 463 mile rail, none of which is operational. Only 60 miles of guideway have been completed and it’s over a decade postponed to completion as of today. Meanwhile, Japan can knock one of these out in 5 years.

Oh fun, mass transit whine time on IDO!

These projects were not all created equal. The original blue line was pretty successful at one time. I know it made a huge difference in my life when I was younger. When I had my first job downtown in 2005 I was making peanuts, we had one vehicle and the wife was using it to drive to Shoreview every day. LRT saved me at least 30 minutes per trip compared to the bus options and my monthly pass was a fraction of the cost of parking downtown. At that time they had metro transit cops checking tickets and passes every single day. Trains were packed during the commute hours.

Early days of the green line I had decent experiences as well. My sons girlfriend rides every day from union depot to UMN and yet you grown men are too traumatized by the crime?

I never had a problem with the crime. Its been awhile since I rode the light rail in the cities but the only problems I had then was people trying to sell me CDs and they were original music and not even bootlegs. Cops got on at any stop that people who looked suspect were also getting on. But the subsidization of a rail system with state dollars by an unelected commission is pretty scary. And they do it alot. Your savings can be at least partially attributed to the taxes collected on roadside cow and rock stands from people who have no input and no choice but to pay.