I’ve seen a few Youtube videos recently with people saying FFS is spooking fish while ice fishing. Some I think are excuses when people aren’t marking or catching fish…but this video with pros like Hoyer, Hjelm and Minke saying they’re experiencing it makes me think it’s a real concern.
Also seeing guides on Lake Winnipeg commenting on FFS spooking fish lends credibility.
What are your personal experiences with FFS on the ice?
I use livescope. I see lots of fish chase my baits but won’t bite. I attribute it to the fish being neutral. When I’m experiencing this other people without live imaging are experiencing the same. I primarily fish walleyes. Can’t say I catch more on set lines away from the house.
It certainly has a stronger sonar pulse than traditional flashers or standard sonar on a boat.
I can’t comment on it personally, but its been brought up in the fishing realm before from tournament anglers. Fish get pressured to certain presentations and adapt, usually by biting less often.
I’ve seen a few Youtube videos recently with people saying FFS is spooking fish while ice fishing. Some I think are excuses when people aren’t marking or catching fish…but this video with pros like Hoyer, Hjelm and Minke saying they’re experiencing it makes me think it’s a real concern.
Also seeing guides on Lake Winnipeg commenting on FFS spooking fish lends credibility.
What are your personal experiences with FFS on the ice?<div class=”ido-oembed-wrap”><iframe loading=”lazy” title=”Tour Level Gold Walleye HAMMERS – Hoyer, Hjelm, Minke | Different Fish, Same Problems” width=”850″ height=”478″ src=”https://www.youtube.com/embed/dGIvCaOJDrc?feature=oembed” frameborder=”0″ allow=”accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture; web-share” referrerpolicy=”strict-origin-when-cross-origin” allowfullscreen=””></iframe></div>
I wouldn’t call it a concern, but rather a good thing if it’s happening.
Been fishing with scope for over 3 years now. I have definitely seen fish shy away from livescope.
I haven’t seen it much open water, but I see it very often when ice fishing. For me, it tends to happen in deeper water in down mode. I don’t encounter it much in forward mode.
In down mode, if you turn the gain up a little bit, your cone is visible on the screen. I have seen a lot of fish swim towards the cone, hit the edge of it, and then swim the other direction. Burbot seem to be the most “scope shy” in my opinion. Just yesterday I had some crappies spook because of it.
Definitely a real thing
It definitely happens with certain bodies of water and certain species. It’s three ducers vs one so it’s a lot more noise. Hard bottoms make it worse due to sonar deflection. And obviously shallower water is worse than deep.
The fish on Mille lacs are very sensitive to it. Probably because it’s used so much out there by the bass and walleye guys. Fish will be coming toward you, stop, turn around and leave. When fishing open water I’ve seen big schools scatter. Some palegic creatures on Lake Superior are extremely sensitive to it. I always bring a standard flasher to have in case the ffs is spooking them. Muskies are learning too.
I was just talking to my buddy about this on the ice the other night. I said maybe we should turn off one or both of our vexilars for a bit just to see. Easier said than done lol.
But I do believe there is something to it. Ever point the transducer at your head? Sounds funny but you really can hear/feel that “clicking.” One time I was catching a bat in a fishing net in somebody’s house and it’s echolocation was pretty audible. Felt/sounded just like a flasher. 
Anyways, I do believe sonar can affect fish and their willingness to bite, especially if they’re already being finicky.
I absolutely believe this. I was out with a friend last weekend and I got on some fish early. He set up directly behind me. I was using my FL-20 and he had his Garmin in down mode. I caught around 30 crappies and some good gills mixed in during the prime half our before/half our after sunset. He caught 5. He put his wheelhouse on that spot and fished for 48 hours with his family over the weekend, again running the Garmin in down mode. 8 lines down, 60 fish caught in total. I have been out for that prime hour each night this week solo setting up on the same spot and caught 20-30 each night, and I’m leaving at 5:30-5:45 with fish on the screen. There is no reason they shouldn’t have caught 200 plus fish with that many lines down. The majority of the time it’s been impossible to keep two lines in the water they have been so aggressive. I for one consider this a win. The fish won’t get decimated and I save $3,000.
I think that people think they understand a lot more about fish behavior than they actually do. There are a few variables that we can control — depth, bait/tackle/gear, presentation/speed/technique, and of course sonar. We want to believe that everything a fish does is in response to one of these variables. So when guys see a fish coming in toward the cone, they assume that they are coming because of their bait, and when they turn away from the cone, they assume it was because of the sonar noise — while ignoring that they have no idea what else is happening just outside of the cone that could be contributing.
The more I try to understand what fish are doing and why they’re doing it, the less fun I have fishing. Older I get the happier I am to use my Garmin mostly as a depth finder/ safety device.
There is an article in one of the recent Infishermans talking about this.
They talked about what levels of sound fish can hear and feel at. The Levels of ultrasound, megahertz, do not fall in the fish range for feel/ hear.
Infisherman says scientifically it shouldn’t bother fish, but like previous posts- doesn’t mean it doesn’t in the real world.
I was ice fishing walleyes with a friend yesterday and I had FFS and he didn’t. We set up on a flat and he was 50-75 yards away. I marked 30 fish in about 4 hours and got 2 to bite. He used a Vex and saw plenty of fish, but couldn’t get any to bite. Considering we both fished this area during first ice and did well, I’m attributing the negative mood of the fish to the time of year more than I am FFS.
There is an article in one of the recent Infishermans talking about this.
They talked about what levels of sound fish can hear and feel at. The Levels of ultrasound, megahertz, do not fall in the fish range for feel/ hear.
Infisherman says scientifically it shouldn’t bother fish, but like previous posts- doesn’t mean it doesn’t in the real world.
The science IS the real world. It’s literally the only real thing. All the other stuff that we try to convince ourselves of is the result of the human brain’s inability to explain our lived experience. Because humans are pretty bad at understanding science and the natural world, we adopt all sorts of wild theories that fly in the face of scientific evidence.
It may be a burst of very high frequency sound, but when it happens there is a very audible “click”. Every depth finder I’ve ever owned was plainly audible. If the fish are shying away, it’s from the click.
SR
The Infisherman article talked about the “clicking”, and it’s potential effect on fish.
Because humans are pretty bad at understanding science and the natural world, we adopt all sorts of wild theories that fly in the face of scientific evidence.
Very interesting. I wonder where I heard this before.
I absolutely believe this. I was out with a friend last weekend and I got on some fish early. He set up directly behind me. I was using my FL-20 and he had his Garmin in down mode. I caught around 30 <strong class=”ido-tag-strong”>crappies and some good gills mixed in during the prime half our before/half our after sunset. He caught 5. He put his wheelhouse on that spot and fished for 48 hours with his family over the weekend, again running the Garmin in down mode. 8 lines down, 60 fish caught in total. I have been out for that prime hour each night this week solo setting up on the same spot and caught 20-30 each night, and I’m leaving at 5:30-5:45 with fish on the screen. There is no reason they shouldn’t have caught 200 plus fish with that many lines down. The majority of the time it’s been impossible to keep two lines in the water they have been so aggressive. I for one consider this a win. The fish won’t get decimated and I save $3,000.
Coordinates or it didn’t happen… 
Older I get the happier I am to use my Garmin mostly as a depth finder/ safety device.
Yeah, keeping you safe from catching fish… 
Ha. I don’t need much help there!
I’ll go out for a few hours, drift downstream, watch the eagles, put my feet up with a cold one, catch a handful of fish and enjoy the night. If you told me that focusing on my electronics would increase my catch rate tenfold, I wouldn’t be interested. I stare at a screen all day, I’m on the boat for different reasons.
I can guarantee keeping an eye on your screen can help you catch fish tenfold. I don’t necessarily mean FFS.
I understand your solitude and stance. I am just the opposite I enjoy being on the water like you, but I get just as excited if not more so figuring out a pattern.
Well, I guess that settles it, ffs has no effect on fish, because, SCIENCE! Because, you know, science has never been wrong throughout the history of science…
Bob benson was one of the pioneers of using ffs on open water Muskies. He is out scoping nearly every day of the season on vermilion. He has seen first hand how Muskies have smartened up to it since it first came out to now. But he’s not a scientist so…
I guess I’ll believe guys like Hoyer and Benson along with my own experiences to form my opinion on the subject over some scientists.
Maybe “Bob” should stop smartening up those muskies….
I was on a multi-day basin bite fishing from a house. There were maybe twenty houses on this one particular spot and every day, every house was doing well. One of the house owners let his grandson and a couple buddies use his house where the bite seemed almost exceptional. The kids came and commenced to turn on a boom box with bass loud enough that I could clearly hear it sixty feet away. The kids weren’t banging around in the shack or raising heck, just had the loud music going. They caught a very few crappies, everyone else caught plenty, the houses further away from the music doing considerably better. Its easy for me to see where the audible clicking of a transducer could affect the fishing.
Well, I guess that settles it, ffs has no effect on fish, because, SCIENCE!
Bob benson was one of the pioneers of using ffs on open water Muskies. He is out scoping nearly every day of the season on vermilion. He has seen first hand how <strong class=”ido-tag-strong”>Muskies have smartened up to it since it first came out to now. But he’s not a scientist so…
I guess I’ll believe guys like Hoyer and Benson along with my own experiences to form my opinion on the subject over some scientists.
Meh. Scientists sometimes fail because scientists are human. But over the course of history, collectively, scientists have established some basically indisputable facts about the natural world. humans who don’t understand or even seek to understand these scientific truths are happy to accept anecdotes as valid explanations, because it feels good to think “hey, yeah, that makes sense. I understand this.” Then, any single minuscule anecdote that they interpret as contradicting scientific fact is seen as a smoking gun. “Hah! I knew science was BS!”
“scientists have established some basically indisputable facts about the natural world.”
Not exactly how science works. That’s why they refer to Theory, not indisputable facts.
It’s one thing to be a scientist and it’s another to be a scientist who follows or properly interprets the science. Haven’t we experienced a very recent example of this that literally affected everyone?
I’ll probably eventually buy a FFs, for winter pannies. Sounds to me like it is best for finding an area that they are using, cut all your holes, stay put or move quietly and use your Vex-bad idea to ‘shine’ those fish for too long.
Sounds to me like it is best for finding an area that they are using, cut all your holes, stay put or move quietly and use your Vex-
This has been effective for me the last few years. I might use the FFS for fishing in a house but not very often. Leave the FFS in a central location of your holes. When the fish leave the hole you’re fishing, go scan with the FFS to find which direction they went and fish in that area.
What I’ve gathered reading through these posts, is that if I become a “real” scientist, that I’ll know exactly what nature and wildlife can and will do all the time. I’m thinking I’ll probably win every fishing tournament for the rest of my life, just to rub my “science” in all the non believers faces..(sarc)… 
I don’t believe scientists can tell us for sure what will bother fish and to what extent every time on every lake with every species. There’s so many factors that will change constantly. The ice above the fish will affect the “noise”. Thickness of ice, So will oxygen levels, barometric pressure, clarity, mineral content, micro organisms and plankton, depth, predator vs prey, size of fish, weeds, bottom content…. And every combination would or could change the outcome, making first hand experience the actual reality, vs lab studies science. And I do believe in ffs bothering fish a great deal on some lakes. I’ve seen it. If a scientist somewhere says it doesn’t, well, he’s wrong.
You acknowledge how complex and numerous the factors are that influence fish behavior, and then the very next second you say you’re positively sure that one single factor explains a behavior you observed? Because “first hand experience?”
You acknowledge how complex and numerous the factors are that influence fish behavior, and then the very next second you say you’re positively sure that one single factor explains a behavior you observed? Because “first hand experience?”
According to your posts you don’t own ffs. Do you even have any ‘first hand experience’?
If you owned one and fished a lot like some of us, I think you’d realize you are out over your skis on this one.
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