Farmer loses prize antlers to Iowa state officials

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2016/06/01/iowa-prized-antlers/85270466/

What a mess!!! Interesting to know if his side of the story was true or not.

Pat McSharry wrote:

What a mess!!! Interesting to know if his side of the story was true or not.

I’d be interested to know what the tipster had for info on this. It wasn’t made available as part of the story. Or if it was I missed it. I don’t follow these stories as closely as some of you diehard hunters do but it always seems like when this kind of story pops up the hunter ends up talking a little too loudly around the wrong set of ears… and that’s what ends up getting them pinched versus some black helicopter undercover investigation type deal.

This is being posted all over the hunting world, mostly with the spin that this is some kind of unconscionable government over-reach / citizen abuse.

I suspect James is onto something, I was thinking the same thing: I wonder what was said/done that tipped Law Enforcement off in the first place? Regardless, it left me with the sense that there are way more facts to this story and why they guy was investigated and charged in the first place. The tone of the article suggests that the charge that stuck ended up being the only one they could get him on, so they stuck to it to the max. Which again makes me wonder…

This might be in the minority view, but IMO this is one of those “Just follow the law.” situations. Follow the law and you’ve got no issues. How hard is it to stick a tag on a deer before moving it from the kill site? Seems like in Iowa it’s even easier, just stick it on the rack and you’re done.

Just another post that reinforces my view that poaching and game/fish law violations are rampant today. With the amount of money that people are spending these days to fish and hunt, I think a new “it’s owed to me” mentality has crept in.

I also think the “enemy-ization” of state natural resource departments has turned some anglers and hunters into what they view as some kind of fishing/hunting Robin Hood. They think thumbing their noses at game laws is somehow “getting back” at these state agencies that are now so vilified.

Grouse

TheFamousGrouse wrote:

I also think the “enemy-ization” of state natural resource departments has turned some anglers and hunters into what they view as some kind of fishing/hunting Robin Hood. They think thumbing their noses at game laws is somehow “getting back” at these state agencies that are now so vilified.

I really agree with you Grouse. I too many times hear people complaining about getting checked but then complain about how lakes are getting overfished. I am glad to see the CO out checking people. It keeps them honest and obviously from all the tickets written at the game stop on the interstate this fall we need to be checking even more people in our state. It’s not hard to follow the law when it is written in black and white.

TheFamousGrouse wrote:

I suspect James is onto something, I was thinking the same thing: I wonder what was said/done that tipped Law Enforcement off in the first place? Regardless, it left me with the sense that there are way more facts to this story and why they guy was investigated and charged in the first place. The tone of the article suggests that the charge that stuck ended up being the only one they could get him on, so they stuck to it to the max. Which again makes me wonder…

I would agree 100% with that.

My other thought is, When you shoot a deer of this magnitude legally you don’t make mistakes like that.

I was waiting for others to comment but feel about the same way. No way something fishy isnt going on here. Laws were clearly broken. My guess is everybody was gunning for that rack. One guy got a shot into it then this guy shoots it last without a license. Greed.

After reading the article my only Question is how many of these people lawyers attorneys would be following through with this if it was a small buck or even a doe. Would the CO just have given him a warning? Hunters do make mistakes getting caught up with all the excitement of harvesting an animal and forgetting things. I’ve forgot my knife and even forgot my arrows laying on the ground after harvesting a deer with all the excitement and picture taking. I wonder how the Wisconsin deer season will be this year with the new tag system. Guys walking in convenience store to get a pop etc. and not having the deer tagged. According to the law as long as your with the animal it don’t need to be tagged but as soon as you leave it. It needs to be tagged, with those wonderful paper tags. Good luck everyone.

MN law is the same as Iowa, tag before you remove from the kill site. I agree if it had been a small buck or doe, dude wouldn’t have been at the local watering hole “bragging” about his 200″ rack… and nothing would have become of it.

Guilty till proven innocent.

Just a guess here, being that everything smells fishy, but it possibly was wounded and stuck in the creek. Then the guy didn’t want to use his actually tag on it, but got rack crazy. If it was a doe or forked horned buck he’d have shot it in the head and left it stuck in the creek. A simple call to the local co would have taken away any doubt. If he wanted the antlers that bad, dispatch it and put a tag on it. If he didn’t, call the co and see what he wants done with a wounded deer, with a big rack, stuck in a creek. Be willing to bet he just got stupid because of the rack. There’s a lot of dead buck skulls pulled out of the woods by shed hunters. This is a lot different, but there’s even some questions about finding dead or wounded bucks at anytime of year. If in doubt, call the local co, they are usually very helpful. Wounded bucks or “green” deer aren’t my cup of tea and yeah it’s a big deer, but I couldn’t shoot a wounded deer stuck in a creek, tag it and feel like something was really accomplished. Dispatch the animal, then call the co before touching it and explain the situation. The Oklahoma hunters situation seems a very odd part of the story? Did they ‘fess up or did someone tipp them in?

@basseyes, you are probably on the right track with the “Antler fever” theory. The only thing I disagree with is at the end of your post you say to dispatch the deer and call the CO. I would not recommend that. Call the CO first. You could get yourself jammed up by shooting it first.
DT

iowa DNR has a serious boner for antlers. maybe the only thing they take super serious.

deertracker wrote:

@basseyes, you are probably on the right track with the “Antler fever” theory. The only thing I disagree with is at the end of your post you say to dispatch the deer and call the CO. I would not recommend that. Call the CO first. You could get yourself jammed up by shooting it first.
DT

I’d agree, but the actual ethical thing would be to dispatch the animal as quickly as possible. To bad ethics and regulations differ at times.

basseyes wrote:

The Oklahoma hunters situation seems a very odd part of the story? Did they ‘fess up or did someone tipp them in?

I believe this guy was under investigation for illegally running a hunting operation or something to that effect. Hunters from Oklahoma did not have a proper license, but what some farmers do because of the almighty dollar, they will take big money from out of staters and allow them to use their landowner tags. I am pretty sure this is the case where I was reading about the investigation earlier.
As has been said there is always more to the story. No excuse to not report the kill right away especially with out easy it is to do.

This is right in my back yard and there is no doubt much more to the story…..

There are several ongoing cases within the last few years relating to the IADNR and antler seizure without concrete evidence one way or the other.

Maine Deer Hunter Astounds with 19-Point ‘Millvale Monster’

Earlier articles written relating to this story:

http://www.desmoinesregister.com/story/news/crime-and-courts/2015/11/27/farmer-dnr-square-off-over-prize-antlers/76309422/

A lot of landowners, farmers especially, view critters as theirs. Most farmers are closer cousins to ranchers out west than is realized. They view wildlife as cattle or cash crops and not much more than a commodity. The antler craze fuels a lot of people to do things they wouldn’t otherwise do. Awesome deer still and sad it was illegally shot first by the Oklahomans and wounded, while being illegally guided. Then was illegally transported by someone else. This should be a prime example to keep your crap straight, no matter your views or opinions on regulation details. Personally I like our regs on site tagging, takes on the cross tagging and camp deer issues that are still real problems. Have known and heard of guys still doing crap like that and it’s irritating. Own property and hunt in area 178. Poaching, road hunting and a general disregard for property rights and trespassing is so common it’s just accepted, drives me bonkers. The CO’s are pretty entertaining to talk to about it and have trouble getting trespassing violations to stick because of how the laws are written. The road hunting thing is just beyond redonkulous. One co has tagged guys multiple times for it. One guy has actually complained to the co about his ears hurting when shooting from inside his truck. They caught 18 people in one day shooting at a deer decoy till someone ruined the decoy. One guy had his wife driving and shot out her window, right over her. That’s just insanity! Sounded like most of them if not all were “locals”. Some of the landowners and locals are really trying to curb some of it, but it’s such a hard thing to monitor or prosecute, it’s just absolutely aggravating. On a plus side the trail cam activity is way up with deer and down significantly with wolves. Have had the tcams out for a month or so and only have caught 3 wolves on them, with a tremendous increase in doe’s, yearlings and bucks so far vs the last 2-3 years. The bear numbers seem to be way up as well. So it’s looking like the herd has really benefited from a couple mild winters and the bucks only seasons.

Joel VandeKrol wrote:

This is right in my back yard and there is no doubt much more to the story…..

There are several ongoing cases within the last few years relating to the IADNR and antler seizure without concrete evidence one way or the other.

It seems like the Iowa DNR has the bit between their teeth when it comes to going after suspected funny business related to landowner tags being used by anyone other than the landowner.

My observation is that I’m glad we don’t have a system of landowner tags in MN that in any way resembles other states. The amount of questionable to outright illegal behavior that these tags seem to encourage goes off the charts.

It is so rampant that there seems to be a large number of hunters who either don’t know or don’t even care that their use of these tags is illegal. I’ve seen multiple cases of guys in internet forums outright admitting to multiple years of criminal activity by admitting they were using landowner tags on a regular basis when they were not entitled to do so, or their entitlement, at best, would have come under severe scrutiny had a CO showed up.

Grouse

big_g wrote:

MN law is the same as Iowa, tag before you remove from the kill site.

Actually G that law changed a long time ago, you need to fill out the tag and punch the holes at the kill site but you do not need to attach the tag to the deer until the deer is loaded on to a motorized vehicle. This is so the tag is not damaged while dragging out of the woods.

HOW TO… Tag Your Deer and Validate Your Site Tag
Your Deer License and Site Tag comes as a two-part form. The upper
half is the Site Tag for tagging the deer in the field. The lower half is the
Deer License and Registration Slip.
1.
At the kill site you must:
a. Detach the Site Tag from the Deer
License/Registration Slip.
b. Before moving the deer, validate the
tag by using a knife or similar sharp
object to cutout the appropriate
notches indicating:
• Month the deer was killed,
• date it was killed, and
• time of day it was killed (a.m. or
p.m.). Mark carefully—if more
than one month, date, or time
is cut out or marked, the tag
becomes invalid.
2.
A person may move a lawfully
taken deer from the site of the kill
without attaching the validated
tag to the animal only while in
the act of manually or mechani
cally dragging, carrying, or carting
the animal across the ground and
while possessing the validated tag on their person.
3.
The validated tag must be attached to the deer when the deer is
placed on a motor vehicle or an ATV, a vehicle or a trailer being
towed by an ATV or brought into a camp, yard or other place of
habitation.