Yamaha Model Year Designation ?

I finally got the call that the new rig was good to go.
I was giving the boat the fine tooth comb and when looking at the motors (F150 and T-8) I noticed that both
had manufacture dates of 2005 which usually would mean
to me that they are 2006 motors. When I questioned my sales guy he told me they were 2007’s. Having previously
owned two other Yamaha outboards I told him he was full
of chit.
After further discussion he brought out the owner who told
me that Yamaha, Mercury, and Honda no longer designate
model years. Basically telling me a motor manufactured
in 2005 (without a significant design change) could be
sold as a 2007, 2008, and beyond.
This basically protects the dealer from getting stuck
with a bunch of “non-current” inventory, having the
ability to call a motor whatever year they want.
I don’t think it helps the consumer though. I don’t want
to have to explain this to the next guy if I decide to
sell.

Can someone please confirm their explanation.
I guess this change happened in the last year or so and its been awhile since I bought new.

They also installed a T in the fuel line without a selector
switch between the main and the T-8. They said as long
as there is a primer bulb on both motors that the factory
says the switch is not necessary.
Its not what I discussed with the salesman but if there
is no chance for a problem I’m okay without the switch.
Again your comments are appreciated.

Thanks,

Dan

P.S. Boat is still at dealer.

Ive never heard of that.. How would explain that to a buyer if you would sell the boat? I guess if your PO states a 2007 motor, I wouldnt worry about it.. But it sounds to me like your getting a non-current motor and if thats the case you should be getting $$$ knocked off the motor. Sounds like the dealer is trying to avoid that. My Yamaha says 06 on the motor and the PO.

I walk striaght to the garage, after reading that post thinking,D’OH Bought mine in 06′ and it reads 06′ on the motor!

I dont know if I would be to happy with the dealer after reading these posts. I would nada the two motors and see what the price difference is and go in and demand some type of reimburstment or take the complete unit back and tell them to refund your funds and go find something worth every penny you are spending..
You can also turn it over to the better business bureau and or a local t.v. news station for further investigation and save the next guy from being taken by the dealership. Not everyone is going to go over there boat as you did they just want to hit the water..

I just nada’d it for you and there is near a two thousand dollar difference between a 2005 and a 2006 and that is money that should still be in your pocket not theres..

Bought my 115 in 2002 and it says 2001 on the ser# plate??? Arrgh…I got

Just kidding…It was a left over from 2001. Ordered the 2002 boat the following January.

Doesn’t make cents to me?

Tom, that would be a non-current boat and you should have gotten a discout on the motor..

I wonder if the banks are being told about this? Loaning top dollar money for a motor that has lost value just sitting.

Another thing a dealer will do is buy up a bunch of those non-current motors from the factory at a huge discount. Then sell them on packaged boats.

From the horse’s mouth…

http://www.yamaha-motor.com/outboard/faq/viewfaqanswer/14/8/71/home.aspx

Thanks for the responses guys!!

Thanks for the link *Nick*. The dealer should have

copies of that all over the place if they are going to throw a motor manufactured in 2005 on a 2007 boat.

I looked at a used boat with a F115 Yamaha on it and

gave a guy a little hell because he told me the boat

and motor were 2006. It said 04 on the motor and I

questioned him on it. He didn’t give me the dealer’s

same song and dance so apparently nobody told him and

he didn’t notice. I guess an apology is in order.

As long as the “blue book” people will have date ranges

for determining used value, as stated in the link, I feel

a little better about not having everything 2007. I just

wish they would have explained it up front.

Thanks,

Dan

Did you read the bottom of the Yamaha FAQ on the link? They state prices listed in NADA are only for horsepower, not year or newer technology. Who do they think they are kidding? A motor that is a couple years older is not worth near as much.

C Hof,

Regarding used values, I was editing my reply as you
were typing yours. I hope it never becomes an issue
if/when I sell the boat and that the used value,
as Yamaha is stating, is in a date range and not specific to a model year.

Dan

I was just thinking about this a little more. The date range that Yamaha supplies would be a manufacturing date range since they have no idea when a dealership sells a motor. So, if a dealership stocks up on motors and sells one new two years after it is made, the information that Yamaha provides to NADA would still be that the motor was made two years ago. It would be impossible for them to track when the motors are actually sold to end customers and then provide that information to NADA. The only other thing that they could do would be to state “motors of XXX model number sold new in 2007” would be worth $XXX. Just make sure you keep all of your original paperwork so that if you sell it, you have proof you bought the motor new this year. Otherwise, there would be no way to verify when it was “new”. Good luck, I hope it doesn’t cause you any trouble.

It still seems like you would be losing two years of value with the blue book.. I dont see the blue book changing their system. This sounds like the manufacturers and dealers have made an agreement to be able to sell left over motors as current stock.. Which I dont see a problem with but the banks and the blue book folks need to understand this as well.. Whats next? ATV’s and Snowmobiles. I dont see a difference between a $5000 outboard and a $5,000 ATV.

Does this mean they are also going to stop putting the year in the serial number?

From Yamaha’s website:

How will my outboard be valued in appraisal publications?

Currently NADA, BUC and ABOS use the normal model year to place value on outboard engines. Moving forward, Yamaha will supply these three publications with specific production date ranges to place value on an outboard. Since most boat packages are valued based on the horsepower of the engine, not the year, make or technology of the outboard, not having model year elimination will have not impact on value determination.

So does this mean a boat package with a 150 hp that is 20 years old is worth more than a new boat package with a 50hp?

NADA value of a 2005 F150 is $8,350
2006 is $10,350

Explain to a bank or buyer this new method of removing the year dates..

When I go to buy a new boat in 2 years, I will be stating that the only acceptable delivered package will be with a motor built within the last 6-12 months. They can sell an old motor to someone else.

The dealers and manufacvturers pushed this, so they wouldn’t have to clear those left-over motors at a discount. This is a classic case of the consumer taking it in the shorts. If everyone demands a motor built within the last few months, they will eventually see that consumers are not as gullible as they think.

The issue will be eneducated consumers. They will not know to ask for a newer produced motor. That is why these details are not being readily publicized.

Glenn

I just sent this to NADA to get their opinion. We will see what they send back:

Quote:

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I would like to know your take on outboard manufacturers eliminating model year designations. They state:

“Currently NADA, BUC and ABOS use the normal model year to place value on outboard engines. Moving forward, Yamaha will supply these three publications with specific production date ranges to place value on an outboard. Since most boat packages are valued based on the horsepower of the engine, not the year, make or technology of the outboard, not having model year elimination will have not impact on value determination.”

http://www.yamaha-motor.com/outboard/faq/viewfaqanswer/14/8/71/home.aspx

I would like to know how you will handle this. When I look today at a 2006 outboard vs a 2005 outboard, I see a $2000 difference in value. This differentiation will no longer be available under the elimination of model year designation.

Thank you for your input. I will be passing your comments along to several boating message boards (encompassing more than 30,000 users), as there is a quite large concern over the direction the manufacturers are taking.

Regards,
Glenn Schultz

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Everyone is worried about NADA values, they really dont mean that much. If your banker or loan agent is hung up on an nada value, and not looking at what u actually got or are getting, if your talking used, then u have a problem. I just got a NEW 2007 YAMAHA, and it is a 2007 even though the tag on the mounting plate says 2005. What makes it a 2007 is the dealer receipt, like was stated by Derek. You also have your warranty registration card as proof, and therefore yamaha will have it on record.

I just don’t understand how a new 40 horse 4-stroke made in 2005 is worth less than a new 40 horse 4-stroke made in 2007.

Someone please explain to me how a motor looses value sitting in a crate? You get the same motor, warranty and technology. I must be missing some thing.

What’s next, freshness dating on outboards?

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I just got a NEW 2007 YAMAHA, and it is a 2007 even though the tag on the mounting plate says 2005. What makes it a 2007 is the dealer receipt, like was stated by Derek. You also have your warranty registration card as proof, and therefore yamaha will have it on record.

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So if your in the market for a new car and I have a

2005 (brand new, full warranty) can I write it up as

a 2007 and charge you the same amount as the guy buying

a true 2007. (Barring no significant design changes from

2005-2007)

As the dealer I’ll write it up for you as a 2007 so I

don’t have to sell it cheaper than a true 2007.

I’m not okay with it but you do what you want with your

money.

Yamaha’s warranty starts from the date of purchase.

They know what the manufacture date is which will always

indicate to me the age of the motor.

The warranty card will state the start and expiration

date of the warranty. THAT’S IT!!

I know the above analogy is not comparing apples to apples

but what makes it right for a marine dealer and not

an auto dealer?? Like Derek said “what’s next? Snowmobiles

and ATV’s.”

Did the dealer you bought your 2007 Yamaha explain to you

that although the motor was manufactured in 2005, Yamaha

said they could call it a 2007 so that’s what we’re going

to write it up as?

Dan

James,

You wouldn’t by chance be in the market for a new truck

would you??

I have a 2004 (0 miles, full warranty) that I can let

go for the same price as the 2008’s. I’ll have to wait

until I get a 2008 to give you a price though.

Keep me posted, I’ll keep that 04 crated up for you!!

Dan

And worse yet, a motor sitting for 2 years WILL have issues with gaskets drying out, and other “gremlins” that won’t show up until you begin to use it.

Another issue is that during that 2 year period, all of the manufacturers make improvements and “tweaks” to the newer built motors, particularly the DFI 2 strokes. Are those motors sitting in the crates getting updated by the dealer? Not very likely, so you in fact ARE getting an older, possibly inferior motor.

I’m sorry, but if I am buying a 2007 motor, it better have been built within the last 6-12 months, or it is still a leftover and not a current model.

The fact is, this was cooked up to eliminate the dealers having to take a hit on unsold motors. The uneducated consumer WILL take it in the shorts on this.

I am still waiting to hear back from NADA for their position.

Glenn

Quote:

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James,

You wouldn’t by chance be in the market for a new truck
would you??
I have a 2004 (0 miles, full warranty) that I can let
go for the same price as the 2008’s. I’ll have to wait
until I get a 2008 to give you a price though.
Keep me posted, I’ll keep that 04 crated up for you!!

Dan

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I think that is provided the 08 is not a new model. For cars, there are usually minor updates every 2-3 years and major updates every 5 years.

Quote:

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Someone please explain to me how a motor looses value sitting in a crate?

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Seismic activity causes the value to “loosen” up and

fall right off the motor. It ain’t pretty either.

Dan

Quote:

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And worse yet, a motor sitting for 2 years WILL have issues with gaskets drying out, and other “gremlins” that won’t show up until you begin to use it.

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Not true. I’ve ALWAYS purchased hold over motors, my last was a new 2003 yamaha T-8 purchased late 2006. It ran perfectly from the word go. I have never, ever, heard of any problems with hold over motors caused by dried out gaskets.

Quote:

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Another issue is that during that 2 year period, all of the manufacturers make improvements and “tweaks” to the newer built motors, particularly the DFI 2 strokes. Are those motors sitting in the crates getting updated by the dealer? Not very likely, so you in fact ARE getting an older, possibly inferior motor.

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Again, not true. The yamaha site clearly states that they do NOT make significant technology changes from one year to the next without changing the name of the motor. So if you buy a T-8 made in 2002 it is basically the same motor made in 2007.

Quote:

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If everyone demands a motor built within the last few months, they will eventually see that consumers are not as gullible as they think.

The issue will be eneducated consumers. They will not know to ask for a newer produced motor. That is why these details are not being readily publicized.

Glenn

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If everyone deamanded motors built in the last 60 – 90 days the only thing that would accomplished is that dealership would carry little to no inventory. Customers would wait for motors to arrive after the motor was ordered from the factory, one at a time, and dealerships would pass the added cost of doing business “order on demand” to the customer.

Quote:

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Not true. I’ve ALWAYS purchased hold over motors, my last was a new 2003 yamaha T-8 purchased late 2006. It ran perfectly from the word go and I save nearly $600 over buying a “new” 2006. I have never, ever, heard of any problems with hold over motors caused by dried out gaskets.

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Thanks for pointing out the problem James. The days of
saving big $$ buying a non-current motor are gone
because now everything is current.

If your buying that same T-8 today that was manufactured
in 2005 or later you would be paying as much if it was
manufactured in 2007 or later.
Now make the choice of which one you would prefer.

Dan

It honestly wouldn’t make a difference to me. As a guy that has owned a half dozen T8’s one is worth as much as the next. They’re a tool, and a darn good one, that helps me catch walleye.

I’m trying to see how the same motors, built 6, 12, or 24 months apart, with the same technologies and features, could have different levels of utility to the customer doing the buying but I can’t get myself there.

Your mileage may vary.

Quote:

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James,

You wouldn’t by chance be in the market for a new truck
would you??
I have a 2004 (0 miles, full warranty) that I can let
go for the same price as the 2008’s. I’ll have to wait
until I get a 2008 to give you a price though.
Keep me posted, I’ll keep that 04 crated up for you!!

Dan

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I’m a firm believer that buying a new vehicle is one of the most expensive (foolish) things anyone could ever do. Wait 6 months, buy it slighty used. Enjoy the lingering new car smell and stick the original owner with the depreciation.

Sorry James I forgot about your Yamaha affiliation.

For a minute there I thought your were lobbying without

a cutback.

So it’s okay in the marine industry but I see you’ve skirted the non-current truck for new pricing scenario.

Can you get yourself there or are you sticking to your

marine industry mentality across the board???