Doc Samson on Lowrance, GPS, Sonar, Mapping etc.

A couple of years ago we invited Doc Samson here to answer questions about sonar and GPS. The Q&A was a big hit so we’re invited Doc to answer questions for us again.

For those of you who do not know Doc Bruce Samson, he is a professional walleye angler and is often featured in angling magazines. Doc is mostly known for his use of high tech GPS and sonar tactics, thus the name of his website, http://www.hightechfishing.com . Doc has had a very impressive career, winning several PWT, RCL, and MWC tournaments. Just this past season, Doc won the 2006 PWT Super Pro on Ottertail Lake, MN! Doc often credits his success to his ability to effectively utilize his electronics.

For those of you who may be interested in learning some of Doc’s secrets, he offers two Lowrance DVDs that detail how he uses GPS and sonar to his advantage.

So, please welcome Doc and feel free to post any relevant questions.

Welcome Doc!

Welcome back Doc!

Wade I thought I saw somwhere that he had a DVD for the Ifinder or H2O series as well. If so do you have those available?

Welcome back Doc. Great to have you with us.
Thanks, Bill

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Wade I thought I saw somwhere that he had a DVD for the Ifinder or H2O series as well. If so do you have those available?

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Not that I know of. Bennett has some instructional videos. You may have seen those.

Doc should be stopping in Wednesday. I got this started a little late in the day. I’ll get us started…

Doc, We had a question from a member who wanted to know how he could make his own lake maps. Can you please explain how you make your own contour maps, and the pros and cons of making your own maps versus buying a pre-loaded map chip like Lakemaster or Navionics?

LakeMaster and Navionics maps are good if they are high definition which means they collected detailed information with their equipment and created the map. Lakes that are small often aren’t mapped; however I suspect that most lakes will be mapped in the future. I map areas that they haven’t. This summer I mapped areas of the Missouri River at Mobridge for trolling. It really helps to see the points and turns ahead so you can anticipate depth changes when you are contour trolling. Creating maps is easy to do. Lowrance has a log chart feature that records the depth and matches it with the position (lat-long) and saves it as a digital file. You can open this data in mapping software programs like 3DField, DrDepth, and GlobalMapper and create a contour map. I have attached a file of a map I created. You must be able to use computer software. If you can use Microsoft Word and Excel you can use mapping software.

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Lowrance has a log chart feature that records the depth and matches it with the position (lat-long) and saves it as a digital file.

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About the “log chart” feature on Lowrance units, can you tell us a little more abou that, Doc? Are there other reasons an angler might use this feature? Do you have any other examples you can share?

The log chart feature records the data that is used to create the display you see on the water. If you log this data onto a SD memory card, you can play it back in the SonarViewer which is free from http://www.lowrance.com. This software plays the chart on your computer like a VCR plays a movie. Pause, fast forward, reverse, and many more tools are available. I think one of the most important features is that you can adjust the sensitivity and the colorline of the chart you recorded. When you are on the water and something interesting is on the display you don’t have enough time to adjust the setting to see which setting is best before the graph scrolls the picture off the screen. With the SonarViewer you can pause it and leisurely improve the settings at home when you aren’t distracted (we like to fish when in the boat, not fight with electronics). This is how I learned the optimal settings for displaying fish at 20 mph. At 20 mph, navigating is more important than being focused on your electronics. If you crash and burn, all the knowledge you obtained is wasted. I have been teaching the importance of this at my classes for years. My students will even send their charts for my interpretation.
The logged charts will also play in the Emulator but if you have a long recording you have to watch the whole “movie” each time but I don’t have enough time for that. Fast forward features are good for type “A” personalities. Sonar is the most important tool in my boat so I will learn any feature that can help me catch fish. I will drive 6 hours for the best minnow; why not spend 6 hours learning your sonar?

That sparked another question, Doc. About recording on Lowrance units, do we have to use Lowrance data cards or are there other brands that we can use to record logs?

What about working with Mapcreate or saving waypoints and trails? Do we have to use Lowrance data cards or can we use another “off brand”?

Hello Doc. When using the mapcreate card reader with the emulator can I add waypoints on the emulator without harming the Navionics or Lake Master card? Is the waypoint being added to just the emulator or will it appear on the card when I am out in the boat acturally using the Globalmap unit? I have basicly just been using my GPSs for fishing and marking waypoints and trails. I want to expand my knowledge but have very limited computer/GPS knowledge. I mostly fish rivers and small lakes except Lake Pepin would be the bigger lake I fish. My boat GPS units are Lowrance 4800s and 3200s Globalmaps.
Thanks, Bill

Doc,

Thanks for the info. I am curious about the actual process you use for recording the data to make contour maps. I’m not looking to make production quality maps – just want to map a few small local lakes close to home that have not been surveyed at all.

Specifically, how quickly do you drive when recording? With each pass, how close are you to the previous pass? Do you record the periphery first and then lengthwise pass – or do you use another pattern? How large of a SD card will I need for the recordings? Of the map rendering software you mentioned, which is your favorite?

Sorry for all the questions. This is just great to be able to “pick your brain.”

Thanks again,

TwoBear

Thanks Wade for this forum!!!!

Wade,

I recommend SanDisk as the best brand and their prices are comparable. This brand has been reliable. These cards work for logging charts and saving waypoint files from MapCreate or your Lowrance GPS.

Bill,
When you add waypoints to the emulator, they have nothing to do with a LakeMaster or Navionics card; they are saved in the emulator’s memory. If you want to move the waypoints on the emulator you need to save the data to a card and put that card in your boat GPS and load the waypoint file. When you create a new waypoint on an emulator or a boat GPS, it is saved to the unit’s internal memory and has nothing to do with a map card. They will display on your unit at the same time the map card displays it’s map. So, the waypoint seems to be related to the card but it isn’t. Long story and I hope it explains it well enough, if not ask for more.

TwoBear,

I usually drive at 4-6 mph but I have recorded data at 20 mph on plane and it worked fairly well. 4-6 is best on drop offs. The width of the passes depends on the drop off. 50-150 ft will create a nice map. How you record doesn’t matter, but it is best to get the shallowest part of the structure and make a path around the deepest part. 512-1GB cards more than enough. GlobalMapper is my favorite but it is the most difficult. I have used 3DField the most and I have created a tutorial on a CD in order to simplify it for my mapping class students. DrDepth is new to me and works well. It is the only program that will create a map while you drive the boat, but you need a PocketPC or a computer in the boat to run the software for this purpose and I know of only 3 other pros that now have laptops for the boat. I am guilty as I taught them!

Hi Doc,

I run a LMS-332c on my dash and really like it. I am trying to decide on a unit for my bow and was wondering if you had any input for me.

I have a Auto-pilot with U/S and was wondering which unit, either a LCX-17m or a 332c, would work best? Which unit would show me the best detail, arches, etc? I know the 17m has 3000 watts and the 332c has 2400, does that make a big difference?

Any help here would be greatly appreciated and GOOD LUCK this up coming season!

Those units are almost identical in collecting the information from the transducer and they way they display fish and underwater details. You will not notice any difference because of the wattage as both have more than enough power for fresh water. The power considerations for detail are not as pertinent as they were a few years ago. The displays are different and most prefer color after they use it. The screen size of the 332 is smaller but most 332 users still really like it. Lowrance units are similar in how they work, but their displays are different in pixels, color and size. This is the main reason for the different prices. If you log a chart with the 17 and the 332 and play them back on the SonarViewer, they will look the same, and both will be in color. Fish arches are dependent on boat speed mostly and on chart speed. I have attached a photo of fish arches at 0.5 and 4 mph. When 0 mph, they are usually displayed as a horizontal line until the fish moves. My next post will only have a photo of fish arches at 20 mph and 4 mph.

20 mph to 4 mph Lake Erie

Thanks Doc. Thats was what I was hoping to hear. It says that trying to remove, add to, and transfer data with the chip will damage it and you will lose the content on the chip. That part scared me but but yet you see and hear of people adding waypoints [including myself] when using the chips in their GPS both on the water and on an emulator. Thanks for removing the fear of possibly losing whats on my chips.
Thanks, Bill

I tried to pull up Docs website, but I can’t get it to work. Is this a bad link, or is the site down?

Thanks,
Brent

Doc,

Regarding making your own contour maps, can you “update” a map that you create with additional logs? Or can you create a map from multiple logs?

My wife and kids enjoy boating rather than fishing, but I would like to make the “joy rides” a little more productive by logging the information and turning all those logs into something useful.

Thanks.

JD

Thanks Doc,

So either one will work good with my Auto-pilot transducer? That is what I am worried about most. Thought maybe that would be where more power would be best. I trust your word, so which one would you rather use? I have got one of each on order at Cabela’s.

Also, you ever use the Fish-reveal feature? Was wondering how to set that up right so I can see fish better in trees.

Thanks again Doc,

Brent,

I tried my website and it isn’t working. First time in 2 years. I will notify my webmaster.
JD,
You can keep adding data to the map file.

Thanks Doc.

I appreciate all the good info

Doc, you website was working last night so it would have just gone down today.
Thanks, Bill

Bill, you posted

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It says that trying to remove, add to, and transfer data with the chip will damage it and you will lose the content on the chip.

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I quick called Bruce at the boat show about this. Are you trying to save the info to the Lake Master or Navionics card? The warning might be because of that. You never want to write any thing to those. If you have a double card slot, its real easy to do by accident and its one of the things Bruce talks about in his class to watch out for.

WarrenMN

I had a Navionics card in the slot at the time. Theres only one slot in my Globalmaps. I didn’t know if it would save it to the card or only the emulator. I did cancel out the spots I marked. It was my first time playing with the card reader and not sure just what all I was doing. I have only used my GPSs so far for trolling and marking waypoints.
Thanks, Bill

Great information – just what I was looking for. I’ll have to look into the Dr. Depth. It would really be slick to acquire the data directly to my Dell Pocket PC right on the boat! What type of interface is required to connect a PC/PPC to the lowrance systems to acquire depth and GPS data? Will you be teaching any of your mapping classes in the Metro area anytime soon?

Thanks,

TwoBear.

P.S. I’ll look for you at the Crestliner booth at the MPLS Boat Show this Sat. – Will you be there?

Bill,
It is a little confusing. You have the emulator running on the computer and you have a Navionics in the card reader and you are wondering if you save a waypoint on the emulator it will be saved on the Navionics card?
TwoBear,
Go to this website and select examples and then select connections for more info on connecting to a PocketPc. Best of all email DrDepth from the site and he is very good at explaining the process since he designed it I will be at Crystal –Pierz every day.

DrDepth

WarrenMN

Thanks! I’ll stop by on Sat.

TwoBear