defunding the police force

Dutchboy wrote:

It’s a bunch about nothing. When they de-fund they will just move some money around. The police budget won’t really change. Maybe a few educational classes for the cops (maybe not). Right now you have a bunch of people trying to get votes to keep a job. They will be forgotten before the first Viking touchdown.

Don’t panic over the unknown.

Dutch, this is false. I’ve spoken directly with some council members and is “friends” with others. They know the national spotlight is focused on them right now, and they truly do believe in other approaches when it comes to enforcement and have the social energy right now to get it done.

You know when you get hurt, and you look at it the day after hoping to see a big @ss bruise yet there is nothing? The disappointment? Kinda want something there to justify the pain you just went thru? That’s a bit what I feel right now, these are some super progressive ideas they are trying to implement, and there is no precedent for them so it’s a huge unknown we as a city will be traveling into, but it’s kinda like a what if its worth it?

Idk, so much grey right now it’s overwhelming quite frankly. It’s not too hard to get ahold of your councilmember around here and see what their thoughts are. At least for some us…

Deuces wrote:

That’s a bit what I feel right now, these are some super progressive ideas they are trying to implement, and there is no precedent for them so it’s a huge unknown we as a city will be traveling into, but it’s kinda like a what if its worth it?

Beads sober up. its crazy to think super progressive ideas will work, now when they have been implement for decades in mpls and St Paul , and this is the end results, of progressive programs and ideas.. i know its hard to believe that Walz and frey wanted the city trashed and maybe burndown, I think they did. Becasue now in the Demorats USA there was and there is precedent to burn cities to the ground, if you dont like what going on in your city! very sad but true IMHO

Deuces wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Dutchboy wrote:</div>
It’s a bunch about nothing. When they de-fund they will just move some money around. The police budget won’t really change. Maybe a few educational classes for the cops (maybe not). Right now you have a bunch of people trying to get votes to keep a job. They will be forgotten before the first Viking touchdown.

Don’t panic over the unknown.

Dutch, this is false. I’ve spoken directly with some council members and is “friends” with others. They know the national spotlight is focused on them right now, and they truly do believe in other approaches when it comes to enforcement and have the social energy right now to get it done.

You know when you get hurt, and you look at it the day after hoping to see a big @ss bruise yet there is nothing? The disappointment? Kinda want something there to justify the pain you just went thru? That’s a bit what I feel right now, these are some super progressive ideas they are trying to implement, and there is no precedent for them so it’s a huge unknown we as a city will be traveling into, but it’s kinda like a what if its worth it?

Idk, so much grey right now it’s overwhelming quite frankly. It’s not too hard to get ahold of your councilmember around here and see what their thoughts are. At least for some us…

My thought was when it actually came time to do something vs talking about doing something in the heat of the moment, that they will back off. The word pandering was used in one of these threads. I think thats the right word. I think right now they are talking about doing the progressive thing but down the road they will reassess as to how it will effect their being re-elected. I’m sure some changes will be made but how and what those changes will look like I don’t know.

Maybe I’m wrong and different things will get tried, I don’t know. One thing to remember is any of these idea’s will need the backing of the residents and businesses. I won’t matter two licks what a bunch of guys on IDO think if they don’t live there.

Keep your eyes open, there will be a lot of self-serving ideas put out there in the near future that will only line pockets and do very little good.

Stay safe.

jwellsy wrote:

A few years ago London, England established ‘no-go zones’ that are ruled by Sharia Law.

I can see similar zones setup around sanctuary cities. Of course the name would be word-smithed to obfuscate reality.

How prophetic. Not yet officially sanctioned as a no go zone but it’s nearly there. Seattle is run by progressives of the same ilk as Minneapolis.

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Ice Cap wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>jwellsy wrote:</div>
A few years ago London, England established ‘no-go zones’ that are ruled by Sharia Law.

I can see similar zones setup around sanctuary cities. Of course the name would be word-smithed to obfuscate reality.

How prophetic. Not yet officially sanctioned as a no go zone but it’s nearly there. Seattle is run by progressives of the same ilk as Minneapolis.

London no go zones are debunked on numerous websites.

Seattle maps of one night of unrest and now all of a sudden it’s chaos everywhere? Seriously, where do you guys come up with this stuff?

You both sound like my teen kid who I argue on the daily with bc of the horrendously erroneous news stories she tries to bring up but on the other side of aisle.

I am not for this total disband, said it once in this thread, guess I have to say it again. But refuse to allow this political slander that is going on in here. I’m very much pro cop, needs reform but it’s a good system overall that just needs some fixing.

I am not for this total disband, said it once in this thread, guess I have to say it again. But refuse to allow this political slander that is going on in here. I’m very much pro cop, needs reform but it’s a good system overall that just needs some fixing.
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I think you and I generally agree – reform is needed but a disband is a bad idea. I also agree this isn’t political pandering at this point. I think once the members start hearing from constituents the tone may change. I don’t believe the majority of the citizens want to see the police disbanded. I’d like to see a overhaul of not only the police but also the police union, our city council, and the mayors office.

On a funny side note – I keep visualizing these unarmed community service officers riding unicorns down first ave sprinkling pixie dust on the fights outside the clubs on a Saturday night. Then getting punched in the face.

Beads, I think if you and I got together with a few hours, a fishing rod, and a case of White Claws we could probably solve this.

I’m now hearing from quite a few media outlets and prominent Democrats that say Defunding the Police is not actually what it sounds like. Its not really “defunding.” Its more along the lines of reforming. Well call it Reform the Police then, not Defund the Police! If you called it what it was, you might actually get more people to listen to you.

gimruis wrote:

I’m now hearing from quite a few media outlets and prominent Democrats that say Defunding the Police is not actually what it sounds like. Its not really “defunding.” Its more along the lines of reforming. Well call it Reform the Police then, not Defund the Police! If you called it what it was, you might actually get more people to listen to you.

Very early on in this thread I posted about how this is terrible PR and marketing by the Democrats. This is what I was talking about. Reinvent the police! Restructure the police! Refocus the police! Not hard to come up with a better slogan

The governments number one purpose is to enforce law. This allows law abiding citizens to exercise their right to freedom.

If MPLS does not want to do the job, the state will. If the state does not do the job, the feds will. I doubt people in MPLS will like that model either.

Careful what you wish for.

-J.

gimruis wrote:

I’m now hearing from quite a few media outlets and prominent Democrats that say Defunding the Police is not actually what it sounds like. Its not really “defunding.” Its more along the lines of reforming. Well call it Reform the Police then, not Defund the Police! If you called it what it was, you might actually get more people to listen to you.

You mean they intentionally mislead the public, or just didn’t think how defunding would of been perceived by the public?

I think their recipe in this case is heavy on political ineptitude sprinkled with some pandering for flavor

I can not wait for televised debates…

Biden has already come out against it so won’t be much of a debate. I think it will be similar to this site overall. Lots of old people yelling over each other

Don’t worryaboutit wrote:

Biden has already come out against it so won’t be much of a debate. I think it will be similar to this site overall. Lots of old people yelling over each other

Biden, debate?

Don’t worryaboutit wrote:

Biden has already come out against it so won’t be much of a debate. I think it will be similar to this site overall. Lots of old people yelling over each other

Define old people.

Beast wrote:

You mean they intentionally mislead the public, or just didn’t think how defunding would of been perceived by the public?

They’re politicians. Do you believe everything politicians tell you?

suzuki wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Don’t worryaboutit wrote:</div>
Biden has already come out against it so won’t be much of a debate. I think it will be similar to this site overall. Lots of old people yelling over each other

Biden, debate?

I think they should start every debate with Biden in it with 2 questions. Who are you? and Where are you? Now that would be funny. About 1/2 the time I hear him talk I don’t think he knows who he is, or where he is.

jwellsy wrote:

A few years ago London, England established ‘no-go zones’ that are ruled by Sharia Law.

Total BS. The same crapola was being circulated about Detroit, Chicago, etc, etc.

Have you ever even been to London?

Grouse

Matt Moen wrote:

Beads, I think if you and I got together with a few hours, a fishing rod, and a case of White Claws we could probably solve this.

We get 2 cases and solving world peace isn’t out of the question.

Wonder how much MPD lawsuits and settlements have cost us taxpayers over the years? Wonder if restructuring can help to eliminate those.

Deuces wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Matt Moen wrote:</div>
Beads, I think if you and I got together with a few hours, a fishing rod, and a case of White Claws we could probably solve this.

We get 2 cases and solving world peace isn’t out of the question.

Wonder how much MPD lawsuits and settlements have cost us taxpayers over the years? Wonder if restructuring can help to eliminate those.

I wonder how many lives have been saved and how many other good deeds done by the MPD over the years? I wonder if restructuring will eliminate a lot of that.

fishthumper wrote:

I wonder how many lives have been saved and how many other good deeds done by the MPD over the years? I wonder if restructuring will eliminate a lot of that.

Or make more of it? Think of the duties a police officer has, it is quite ridiculous to think one person can excel at all of those.

It’s taking the system and breaking it into more manageable parts that accomplish alot more than what it does now. Again, due to no fault of the officers. It’s systemic change that’s needed.

Plenty of people attacking the character of officers so I get some peoples defensive reactions for them, but you can’t move forward with a conversation if everyone is in their own corners playing defense.

There’s only one layer that counts and that’s the one interacting with the public. Training is one thing, but a person would have to be pretty naive to think there will never be any rough handling between the two some of the time.
Its much better a mistake happen occasionally than animals on the street having no fear of the law. Far fewer innocents will be harmed.
People seem to be demanding perfection when it does not exist.

That’s my thought for the day. Hopefully I only offended a “few” people.

Not one of the Mpls clowncil members has come out with anything but defund and dismantle the police. Not one idea of a plan on how to do that, when they plan to do that, how they might protect and serve people in Mpls. Nothing, not one thing. They make these grand plans, have an impromptu vote and declare no one can stop them. How are people supposed to take that? Just assume it will be all rainbows and lolly pops and now everything will be a Utopian dream? This is very typical of progressives. They have big ideas but no plans. Just look what Nancy Pelosi said about Obamacare. “We have to pass the bill so we know what’s in it.”

Thank God the County Sheriff where I live basically told Mpls you made your bed now sleep in it.

blackbay wrote:

Just look what Nancy Pelosi said about Obamacare. “We have to pass the bill so we know what’s in it.”

As a point of order, Pelosi never actually said that oft-repeated misquote.

What Pelosi actually said was, “We have to pass the bill so that you can find out what is in it, away from the fog of the controversy.” The context was that [in her opinion] the benefits of the bill, not the contents of the bill as is often implied by the misquote — would only be fully evident to the public after the legislation was passed and implemented.

I don’t agree with the far left, but across the spectrum, I respect those who are trying to make a change happen. BTW, if you want to read a great book about so-called “progressives”, read Dave Durenburger’s “When Republicans Were Progressives”. Yes. Really. Once they were.

Grouse

fishthumper wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>suzuki wrote:</div>

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Don’t worryaboutit wrote:</div>
Biden has already come out against it so won’t be much of a debate. I think it will be similar to this site overall. Lots of old people yelling over each other

Biden, debate?

I think they should start every debate with Biden in it with 2 questions. Who are you? and Where are you? Now that would be funny. About 1/2 the time I hear him talk I don’t think he knows who he is, or where he is.

I wished the cameras had kept rolling when Nancy and her gang were doing the photo op. where they were kneeling with their look alike scarfs. I bet it was hilarious watching then try to get back to their feet.

Looks like Seattle tied the hands of their police force and so far things are going very well for them. If thats what mpls wants have at it.

As a recently retired Minneapolis cop, I say let the council and citizen activists have their way. However, at this point we’ve heard zero substance to their “defund the police idea.”

The city government is broken, the department is broken, and the community is broken. Constant blame placed solely on the police department is a way for those in charge to take the easy way out.

I asked specifically for some references to what’s the plan and was given these sources by Philippe. He’s active in forums and responds to emails/VMs as best he can. Last 2.5 weeks he had 6500 of them so lil jammed up now.

Here are some references that I’m attempting to get ahold of in print form and digest. Not a fan of digital books.

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Deuces wrote:

I asked specifically for some references to what’s the plan and was given these sources by Philippe. He’s active in forums and responds to emails/VMs as best he can. Last 2.5 weeks he had 6500 of them so lil jammed up now.

Here are some references that I’m attempting to get ahold of in print form and digest. Not a fan of digital books.

I don’t have social media to click on his link. Any chance you can expound on what he posted?