Agree or Disagree w/ shooting 2 bucks in MN

Quote:

---

With party hunting in MN Most guys who would shoot 2 bucks are already doing it………..

Myself for example gun hunt with my family and am also a bowhunter. Any buck I shoot during the gun season goes on a family members tag that is out in the field with me.

---

As I said in an earlier post next year you may not be able to do that with a buck, you may see a new law next year that will not allow party hunting for bucks. With the buck to doe ratio in SE MN being at least 10 to 1 if not more there is absolutely no reason for a guy to shoot more that one buck in MN especially if we are talking basket rack bucks, there are plenty of does out there for the taking.

Quote:

---

PS: If you think that bucks are not chasing does in Ia during their gun season, I state respectfully, that you are mistaken.

---

I agree with you on that Gary but they are not being chased as hard in Dec as they are in Nov durring the peak rut.

I agree with you Gary but most breeding takes place the first rut during November. As time goes on they breed the later does in December and then the early fawns clear into march and april. What it all comes down too is shoot only nicer bucks and let the younger guys go another year or two. Hunting to me is mostly about puting meat on the table so when theres more available does take one of those. I know hunting for meat includes everything but that depends on what you want to hang on the wall. Id rather put something sizable on the wall instead of a spike or fork. I do think that bow hunters are more selective on size then gun hunters because they have a shorter season, atleast they are here. Shoot em while thier young and,,,,,,,,

Just to clarify steve, I personally will only shoot one if it is one I would put on the wall. I am out there to put 1 doe in the freezer and hopefully one for the wall, the rest of the deer are safe! That is just me personally. How could they enforce or control party hunting for does and not for bucks, if they do pass that it will probly be no party hunting anytime which is a shame.

Gary,

I bet you occassionaly see a buck chasing a doe but there is a big difference between november and december rut activity. Alot of the land owners I talk to in Iowa say when they gun hunt the deer are pretty locked down and they shoot most of them on drives.

At the end of this, I’m sure I’m going to be “Mr. UNPOPULAR”…..but here it goes. Please do note that I’m not targeting anyone or singling anyone out here.

SO:
well, what is worse for harvesting of “basket rack” bucks?
Deer drives?
or
Hunting during the rut?

I would oppose deer drives 1000 times. NO, 10000000 times more than opposing hunting during the rut.

Deer drives……well, I have different opinion about them. Dangerous and nothing but a harvest, not a hunt.

as far as “party shooting”. Who cares if another guy shoots 2 bucks?
Same could be said for 2 guys fishing in a boat for crappies.
How about walleyes? Ever share your walleyes to get a “boat limit”. How many guys do you know has 2 trophy walleyes on the wall because he/she “party fished” to keep those 2 big fish?

What if you placed the same criteria in bass fishing. How about bass fishing tournaments? No party fishing!

No party hunting….no party fishing.

Point that I’m making is this:
Don’t build this sport into an “Elitist game”. Good Lord, the muskie fishing is bad enough, where we don’t need a bunch of “buck gods” telling us what we can/cannot shoot because it “might take their trophy”.

Don’t forget the roots and tradition of hunting (or fishing).

Quote:

---

Just to clarify steve, I personally will only shoot one if it is one I would put on the wall. I am out there to put 1 doe in the freezer and hopefully one for the wall, the rest of the deer are safe!

---

We are on the same page Rob

Quote:

---

How could they enforce or control party hunting for does and not for bucks, if they do pass that it will probly be no party hunting anytime which is a shame.

---

I highly doubt you will see MN do away with party hunting for does but I do have it from a good source that no party hunting for bucks will more than likely be a reality next year. Next time you are in Archery Headquarters ask Marty about it he can give you the straight scoop on the subject. How would the DNR enforce this new law? That is a good question, I like the idea behind the law but I am afraid that it will be next to impossible for the DNR to enforce by themselves. I could be all wrong here but I think this is an attempt to try and make it harder for someone to buy multiple tags in someone elses name and use the tags for themselves. I feel that is the biggest problem in deer management is the slobs who buy multiple tags to shoot multiple bucks, the only way to enforce this is for you and me to turn these slobs in period, the DNR can not do it by themselves. I have no time for slob hunters……… no hunters is the wrong word just plain slobs.

I agree with you Gary and with the guys who also party hunt, theres nothing wrong with it. If a few luckier guys get a few more shots to help fill someone else tag thats good, then everybody goes home with meat for the table. Being selective on what a guys standards are is a better deal when it comes to a wall hanger and I even think that if a few smaller bucks are taken that dosen’t hurt eigther. Shooting anything thats got horns is when an area ends up with just smaller bucks. We all know what it takes to have an area grow bigger better wallhangers and not everybody has to think that way but Im glad I’ve got the areas I do to hunt where not many people thinks a trophies a 4 pointer. My boys first buck was a 4 pointer, nows hes a buck of atleast bigger standards.

Quote:

---

At the end of this, I’m sure I’m going to be “Mr. UNPOPULAR”…..but here it goes. Please do note that I’m not targeting anyone or singling anyone out here.

---

No worries Gary we all have strong opinions on this topic and that is cool but I am still going to do my best to try and convert you anyway

You and I are on the same page when it comes to deer drives I am not a fan of them either, I gun hunt the same way I bow hunt from a stand. There are enough guys out there moving around that I do not need to organize a deer drive, a good number of deer I have shot is from someone else who have bumped them because they did not have the patience to sit in one place.

Quote:

---

Don’t build this sport into an “Elitist game”.

---

I do not look at it as an Elitist game I look at it as good heard management, as good sportsmen we should all be concerned about this. With the number of does out numbering the bucks by at least 10 to 1 if not more it just makes good sense to pass on these young bucks and wait for a doe and most times you will not have to wait long for a doe. I look at this the same way I look at fishing walleye in the spring on pool 4, let the females full of eggs go and keep a few males for the livewell, CRP good walleye management. I look at passing on small bucks and taking a doe instead the same way good heard management, not only am I doing my part to help thin out the doe heard I am also giving young bucks a chance to live to see another season and grow a bigger set of antlers. Whats wrong with that, it is a win win situation in my book! I have no problem with kids, new hunters, or older hunters who may not have many more seasons left to hunt taking a young buck but for us seasoned hunters who have a few bucks under our belts why not set the bar a little higher, you will be doing your part for deer management and will better your odds of seeing a better buck by not shooting the first one that walks by.

I know that the main point you and I disagree on is moving the gun season out of the prime time rut and that is one point you and I will never agree on

I wish there was a way that we could have the gun season at peak rut and for the majority of hunters to pass up the young bucks. It would only take a couple of years to start seeing an improvement in the number of mature bucks and giving more hunters the opportunity at a true wall hanger.

I guess my stance is split.

As far as I’m concerned, when it comes to public land, you can take it either way, and I really don’t care (for the most part), because I won’t hunt public land.

However, when I’m hunting private land, that has extreme limited access (me), then I don’t want the government telling me I have to be an elitist and only shoot one buck or only a trophy buck on “my land”, because elitist want the same caliber of monster bucks that they see on caged TV hunts or Texas ranches that cost $5000/deer. (Been there first hand, seen it first hand, won’t do it…….)

Let the hunter choose to shoot for meat, shoot for horns, or shoot for boone/crocket.

“IF” it is true, via surveys, that there are 10 does to 1 buck in a zone or area, then the DNR should be managing that specific spot. However the “zones” are HUGE and should not be lumped into one group, because one area out of 50 has a bad population mix. The DNR has been quite good in regards to herd management via lottery drawings, intensive harvest permits, and bonus tags.

As far as Iowa bucks not chasing the does during the hunting season?
Well, you can tell that to the monster 10point in Cedar Rapids park, in DOWN TOWN, chasing does at lunch time!!! Mossydan should remember the story…..

Thats probably Green Square park in downtown and I believe it Gary. Its only about a mile from an area thats loaded with deer down along the river. I didn’ hear the same story but when ruts here they chase the does all over town and in backyards right in the middle of town and Im not kidding. Heck I live about 3 miles in from the city limits (corn and bean fields) and I can walk across the street to a small undeveloped area and watch them chase there, its not a big deal here. When ruts here they pick up roadkills everyday in town and not just a few, let alone the county. With 3,800 deer just in the city limits (DNR count with infrared at night) and not over the fence they chase all day and night. You really do have to be careful when driving on nights when thier really running hard and thats about any night when the winds not up in November. A buck in rut will chase a doe through machinegun fire, well just about. If they are scattered a little bit when a party hunt comes through they are right back with thier noses in the air and back looking for that perticular doe or another one. Killing alot of younger bucks, especially younger ones during anytime of the hunting season or rut isn’t good for the population of bucks. I think one of the reasons they have shotgun season after the rut is to not interupt it and maybe another to let the genetics spred from the small but potential good bucks down the road. Younger bucks do breed some of the loose does that aren’t protected by a buck right then. So those genetics spread and wouldn’t if gun season was the same time does came into heat, some of those smaller bucks would be taken.

You wouldn’t believe some of the stories I’ve heard from around here with deer ending up in the wrong places, like in school hallways when class is on and ending up in peoples livingrooms coming through the picture window. One guy hit a buck on the road during rut and called the DNR. He got his salvage tag and put the dead deer in his back seat, bad mistake. The deer came too and kicked the shi- out of the back of this guys head. He did get his car pulled over and opened the door and the deer finially ran, what an experience that would be. Bucks in or out of town will breed every chance they get and in almost any condition, minus a slug. When a party comes through they are disrupted but go right back to chasing after they calm down.

I stopped for lunch the other day and was talking about deer hunting to my cousin and a guy over heard me talking, we started talking a little bit and he told me one of his relatives bowshot a buck just outside the city limits here that was a little over 200″ last year. He said Bass Proshops heard about it and bought it for an amount I don’t want to say but it was alot. Theres a few apple trees just up the road about 3 blocks from my house and half the time when I go by theres some sort of deer under those trees looking for apples, fawns, does and bucks.

I came home from work 3 or 4 weeks ago and there was about 6 or 8 people standing in the middle of the street by my house looking over to that wooded area I mentioned earlier. A guy was standing there with a camera and was watching the deer run across the street from my house. I stopped the truck and asked what was up and they guy with the camera came over to me and showed me a picture of the buck I still seen running around there. He got that earlier picture about 1/2 hour befor that and maganfied it on his Nikon camera so I could see his rack. It was fuzzy but I could see he had close to 20 points or more, the guy said he had that many too with long mainbeams. Its cooling fast right now and no wind, it would be an excellent night to go grunt across the street just to see what came in. Anyway theres one heck of alot of deer around this neck of the woods, in or out of town.

Quote:

---

“IF” it is true, via surveys, that there are 10 does to 1 buck in a zone or area, then the DNR should be managing that specific spot. However the “zones” are HUGE and should not be lumped into one group, because one area out of 50 has a bad population mix. The DNR has been quite good in regards to herd management via lottery drawings, intensive harvest permits, and bonus tags.

---

There is another point we agree on Gary
In fact this year for the first time during the 300A season you can take 5 deer in areas 343, 346, 347, 348, & 349. You can take 1 buck and four does or 5 does, even more opportunities to help balance the heard.

Quote:

---

As far as Iowa bucks not chasing the does during the hunting season?

---

When did I say that?

I think what I said was

Quote:

---

I agree with you on that Gary but they are not being chased as hard in Dec as they are in Nov durring the peak rut.

---

I think they should allow it because some hunters would buy both archery and firearm license, but than it ends up that firearm is useless because they tag a buck with archery….

Born and raised in IA and now residing in MN(20yrs) I’ve participated in over 30 IA deer hunts I’ve yet to see a buck chasing a doe during the IA gun season.The only way MN can grow more bigger bucks is to delay the gun season. There is definitely a difference.Its a no brainer but it will never happen.

Quote:

---

The only way MN can grow more bigger bucks is to delay the gun season. There is definitely a difference.Its a no brainer but it will never happen.

---

I agree with you 100%! It most likely will never happen.

Sadly I am afraid you guys are right

My deam is to move to Iowa someday, just have to figure out how to talk the wife into it.

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

The only way MN can grow more bigger bucks is to delay the gun season. There is definitely a difference.Its a no brainer but it will never happen.

---

I agree with you 100%! It most likely will never happen.

---

Steve,if you buy my IA license I will take you on a IA hunt…….LOL