Decipher this

• Ice fishing: Angler name and address must be prominently displayed on ice fishing shelters (portable or otherwise) when the shelter is not occupied or otherwise in use.

The way I take it is if you are leaving your shelter unattended overnight, you must display the name & address. No matter what kind of house.

Seems reasonable to me

Decipher-
convert (a text written in code, or a coded signal) into normal language

DNR certainly has its grey areas, I would not consider this one.

The grammar is correct, but it reads funny if you’re trying to read between lines.

The “not” applies to both things mentioned.

Put an “is” in it’s place to see what I mean.

I think technically if you aren’t around… in a reasonable distance, this would also apply during daylight hours.

Probably depends on the warden, but if you have a portable setup at noon but nobody has been within sight of it for an hour or two you could stand a good chance of having it removed, or whatever the infraction for that may be unless it has the proper ID on it.

saugeye-steve wrote:

• Ice fishing: Angler name and address must be prominently displayed on ice fishing shelters (portable or otherwise) when the shelter is not occupied or otherwise in use.

so correct me if i am wrong, but at one time all you needed was your drivers license or DNR number on a shelter??????

it is also my understanding that you dont need a shelter license on a portable if you remove it at night. if its left overnight it needs a shelter license. its also required to have at least a 3 inch reflective something or another on your shelter.

glenn57 wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>saugeye-steve wrote:</div>
• Ice fishing: Angler name and address must be prominently displayed on ice fishing shelters (portable or otherwise) when the shelter is not occupied or otherwise in use.

so correct me if i am wrong, but at one time all you needed was your drivers license or DNR number on a shelter??????

it is also my understanding that you dont need a shelter license on a portable if you remove it at night. if its left overnight it needs a shelter license. its also required to have at least a 3 inch reflective something or another on your shelter.

Correct. You can use your DL or DNR number.

http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/fishing/shelter.html

As much as I like to rip the GOV, this one seems pretty cut and dry.

ps. I like that this is on page 69. and yes we were deep into the bourbon cabinet last night.

Attachments:

1. Shacks2.pdf
2. Shacks1.pdf

Eelpoutguy wrote:

As much as I like to rip the GOV, this one seems pretty cut and dry.

ps. I like that this is on page 69. and yes we were deep into the bourbon cabinet last night.

well if nuttin else i got my neck exercises in for today!!!!

IceNEyes1986 wrote:

The way I take it is if you are leaving your shelter unattended overnight, you must display the name & address. No matter what kind of house.

Unattended or occupied is how I interpret the rule.

I believe the intent is as follows:

Ice fishing: Angler name and address must be prominently displayed on ice fishing shelters (portable or otherwise) when the shelter is not (occupied or otherwise in use).

In expanded form: Not occupied or otherwise Not in use.

When in doubt ask the DNR.

There is a debate on this same topic on one of my FB groups. Using that same wording >>> (portable or otherwise) you could take your full size Hard House or Ice Castle out on Mille Lacs and keep it on the ice without a FH license as long as it’s occupied.

However, the DNR has been issuing tickets for any house that is not a soft side portable. Yes, issue tickets to persons in the hard house fishing. These are houses never left un attended.

We will see how this plays out in court as at least one of these guys plans to fight this ticket.

-J.

All shelters that don’t collapse need a license to be on the lake.page 69 in regs

Jon Jordan wrote:

There is a debate on this same topic on one of my FB groups. Using that same wording >>> (portable or otherwise) you could take your full size Hard House or Ice Castle out on Mille Lacs and keep it on the ice without a FH license as long as it’s occupied.

However, the DNR has been issuing tickets for any house that is not a soft side portable. Yes, issue tickets to persons in the hard house fishing. These are houses never left un attended.

We will see how this plays out in court as at least one of these guys plans to fight this ticket.

-J.

There doesn’t seem to be any gray area in the wording:

“Portable shelter definition

A shelter that collapses, folds or is disassembled for transportation.

Portable shelters only need licenses and identification when left unattended, which is defined as all occupants being more than 200 feet away.”

Unless they can collapse or disassemble their shack it’s not a portable.

Agree. I don’t get into these debates. I do agree the DNR has always and will continue to write the rules in the most confusing, contradicting fashion possible. This happens every year. Including this year.

For example, for about 3 days earlier this December, they had updated the Mille Lacs special regs extending the season on walleye fishing through March 31st. I know at least one guy who printed the reg update off the DNR website and say he plans to fish for and keep walleyes through 3/31.

He says give me a ticket – see ya court.

Just sayin’

-J.

This looks pretty clear to me.

https://www.dnr.state.mn.us/fishing/shelter.html

Wisconsin is pretty much the same.

RVRDUX

RVRDUX wrote:

He says give me a ticket – see ya court.

That’s the problem. Even if he wins in court…he loses.

BK, you of all people should understand this one. Just look a the border water regs as an example!

See ya in count!

-J.

One of the issues the DNR has been working on over the years is how to take the laws and statues and make them readable by Joe Sixpack. Sometimes what they think is understandable…isn’t.

But here’s the law and a link to it.
Link

97C.355 SHELTERS ON ICE; DARK HOUSES AND FISH HOUSES.
Subdivision 1.Identification required. All shelters on the ice of state waters, except portable shelters under subdivision 2a but including dark houses and fish houses, must have: (1) the owner’s name and address, (2) the owner’s driver’s license number, or (3) the “MDNR#” license identification number issued to the owner legibly displayed on the exterior with characters at least two inches high.
Subd. 2.PreviousLicenseNext required. (a) A person may not place a dark house, fish house, or shelter, except a portable shelter, on the ice unless the house or shelter:
(1) is licensed; and

(2) has the license tag attached to the exterior in a readily visible location, except as provided in this subdivision.

(b) The commissioner must issue a tag with a dark house, fish house, or shelter license, marked with a number to correspond with the license and the year of issue. A dark house, fish house, or shelter license is not required of a resident on boundary waters where the adjacent state does not charge a fee for the same activity.

Subd. 2a.Portable shelters. (a) A person using a portable shelter that is not identified under subdivision 1 may not leave the portable shelter unattended between midnight and sunrise and must remain within 200 feet of the shelter while the shelter is on the ice of state waters.
(b) If a person leaves the portable shelter unattended any time between midnight and one hour before sunrise or is not within 200 feet of the portable shelter, the portable shelter must be licensed as provided under subdivision 2.

Subd. 3.Door requirement. A person may not use a dark house or fish house unless the door is constructed so that it can be opened from the outside when it is in use.
Subd. 4.Distance between houses. A person may not erect a dark house, fish house, or shelter within ten feet of an existing dark house, fishhouse, or shelter.
Subd. 5.Burning structures. A person may not burn a structure on the ice of state waters without permission of the commissioner. The commissioner may allow burning only after determining that the structure cannot be removed from the ice by another reasonable manner. The owner must remove the remains of the burned structure from the ice.
Subd. 6. [Repealed, 2006 c 281 art 2 s 58]
Subd. 7.Shelters prohibited; dates and times. (a) A shelter, including a fish house or dark house, may not be on the ice unattended between midnight and one hour before sunrise after:
(1) the first Monday in March, for state waters south of a line starting at the Minnesota-North Dakota border and formed by rights-of-way of U.S. Route No. 10, then east along U.S. Route No. 10 to Trunk Highway No. 34, then east along Trunk Highway No. 34 to Trunk Highway No. 200, then east along Trunk Highway No. 200 to U.S. Route No. 2, then east along U.S. Route No. 2 to the Minnesota-Wisconsin border; and

(2) the third Monday in March, for other state waters.

A shelter, including a fish house or dark house, on the ice in violation of this subdivision is subject to the enforcement provisions of paragraph (b). The commissioner may, by rule, change the dates in this paragraph for any part of state waters. Copies of the rule must be conspicuously posted on the shores of the waters as prescribed by the commissioner.

(b) A conservation officer must confiscate a fish house, dark house, or shelter in violation of paragraph (a). The officer may remove, burn, or destroy the house or shelter. The officer shall seize the contents of the house or shelter and hold them for 60 days. If the seized articles have not been claimed by the owner, they may be retained for the use of the division or sold at the highest price obtainable in a manner prescribed by the commissioner.

Subd. 7a.Houses left overnight. A fish house, dark house, or shelter left on the ice overnight must be marked with reflective material on each side of the structure. The reflective material must measure a total area of no less than two square inches on each side of the structure.
§Subd. 8.Confiscating unlawful structures; civil penalty. (a) Structures on the ice in violation of this section may be confiscated and disposed of, retained by the division, or sold at the highest price obtainable, in a manner prescribed by the commissioner.
(b) In addition to other penalties provided by law, the owner of a structure left on the ice in violation of this section is subject to a civil penalty under section 115A.99.

(c) This subdivision also applies to structures left on state public access sites for more than 48 hours past the deadlines specified in subdivision 7.

Thanks for all the replies.
I copy/pasted that from the Wisconsin-Minnesota boundary waters regs and it was confusing.

I was checking for St. Croix river info in particular.

Brian Klawitter wrote:

One of the issues the DNR has been working on over the years is how to take the laws and statues and make them readable by Joe Sixpack. Sometimes what they think is understandable…isn’

You ain’t a kidding —

Subd. 3.Door requirement. A person may not use a dark PrevioushouseNext or PreviousfishNext PrevioushouseNext unless the door is constructed so that it can be opened from the outside when it is in use.

OK, Got it.

Brian Klawitter wrote:

One of the issues the DNR has been working on over the years is how to take the laws and statues and make them readable by Joe Sixpack. Sometimes what they think is understandable…isn’t.

But here’s the law and a link to it.
Link

97C.355 SHELTERS ON ICE; DARK HOUSES AND FISH HOUSES.
Subdivision 1.Identification required. All shelters on the ice of state waters, except portable shelters under subdivision 2a but including dark houses and fish houses, must have: (1) the owner’s name and address, (2) the owner’s driver’s license number, or (3) the “MDNR#” license identification number issued to the owner legibly displayed on the exterior with characters at least two inches high.
Subd. 2.PreviousLicenseNext required. (a) A person may not place a dark house, fish house, or shelter, except a portable shelter, on the ice unless the house or shelter:
(1) is licensed; and

(2) has the license tag attached to the exterior in a readily visible location, except as provided in this subdivision.

(b) The commissioner must issue a tag with a dark house, fish house, or shelter license, marked with a number to correspond with the license and the year of issue. A dark house, fish house, or shelter license is not required of a resident on boundary waters where the adjacent state does not charge a fee for the same activity.

Subd. 2a.Portable shelters. (a) A person using a portable shelter that is not identified under subdivision 1 may not leave the portable shelter unattended between midnight and sunrise and must remain within 200 feet of the shelter while the shelter is on the ice of state waters.
(b) If a person leaves the portable shelter unattended any time between midnight and one hour before sunrise or is not within 200 feet of the portable shelter, the portable shelter must be licensed as provided under subdivision 2.

Subd. 3.Door requirement. A person may not use a dark house or fish house unless the door is constructed so that it can be opened from the outside when it is in use.
Subd. 4.Distance between houses. A person may not erect a dark house, fish house, or shelter within ten feet of an existing dark house, fishhouse, or shelter.
Subd. 5.Burning structures. A person may not burn a structure on the ice of state waters without permission of the commissioner. The commissioner may allow burning only after determining that the structure cannot be removed from the ice by another reasonable manner. The owner must remove the remains of the burned structure from the ice.
Subd. 6. [Repealed, 2006 c 281 art 2 s 58]
Subd. 7.Shelters prohibited; dates and times. (a) A shelter, including a fish house or dark house, may not be on the ice unattended between midnight and one hour before sunrise after:
(1) the first Monday in March, for state waters south of a line starting at the Minnesota-North Dakota border and formed by rights-of-way of U.S. Route No. 10, then east along U.S. Route No. 10 to Trunk Highway No. 34, then east along Trunk Highway No. 34 to Trunk Highway No. 200, then east along Trunk Highway No. 200 to U.S. Route No. 2, then east along U.S. Route No. 2 to the Minnesota-Wisconsin border; and

(2) the third Monday in March, for other state waters.

A shelter, including a fish house or dark house, on the ice in violation of this subdivision is subject to the enforcement provisions of paragraph (b). The commissioner may, by rule, change the dates in this paragraph for any part of state waters. Copies of the rule must be conspicuously posted on the shores of the waters as prescribed by the commissioner.

(b) A conservation officer must confiscate a fish house, dark house, or shelter in violation of paragraph (a). The officer may remove, burn, or destroy the house or shelter. The officer shall seize the contents of the house or shelter and hold them for 60 days. If the seized articles have not been claimed by the owner, they may be retained for the use of the division or sold at the highest price obtainable in a manner prescribed by the commissioner.

Subd. 7a.Houses left overnight. A fish house, dark house, or shelter left on the ice overnight must be marked with reflective material on each side of the structure. The reflective material must measure a total area of no less than two square inches on each side of the structure.
§Subd. 8.Confiscating unlawful structures; civil penalty. (a) Structures on the ice in violation of this section may be confiscated and disposed of, retained by the division, or sold at the highest price obtainable, in a manner prescribed by the commissioner.
(b) In addition to other penalties provided by law, the owner of a structure left on the ice in violation of this section is subject to a civil penalty under section 115A.99.

(c) This subdivision also applies to structures left on state public access sites for more than 48 hours past the deadlines specified in subdivision 7.

It blows my mind that someone in St. Paul wrote that up, and was like YUP that’ll work. The Hunting and Fishing Regs across the board need to be simplified, about 20% as long as they currently are, and understandable to the average person. IMO they are significant barrier to new hunter/angler entry into the sport, no one wants to start a hobby they don’t understand the rules for, let alone may be fined significantly or have valuable items confiscated.

Jon Jordan wrote:

For example, for about 3 days earlier this December, they had updated the Mille Lacs special regs extending the season on walleye fishing through March 31st. I know at least one guy who printed the reg update off the DNR website and say he plans to fish for and keep walleyes through 3/31.

He says give me a ticket – see ya court.

Just sayin’

-J.

This would be on my “do not recommend” list.

A typo or other error in a communication is not going to overrule the law regardless if he or she has a printout of such erroneous information. Would it really be worth taking to court?

Looking back at Mille Lacs legend and lore archives, there was a notable Mille Lacs community individual who attempted a very similar scheme.

Targeting, catching and keeping a walleye during the closed season. It did not go as this individual planned.

Although motives may be different, likely the result will be the same.

Remember these laws and rules are written by lawyers and politicians. The regs book pulls the language pretty much straight from those laws.

Joe Dirty wrote:

Seems reasonable to me

I think this one is pretty clear. I would guess the otherwise in use is for people like me who basically use their shelter as a means to transport gear.. so it’s being used for it’s intended purpose and not just sitting on the ice with nobody around. I’m usually within 200 ft of it. When I’m not I don’t worry about it because CO’s are reasonable people and they aren’t tax collectors out extorting $ from citizens like a lot of people make them out to be. As far as law enforcement agencies go. I would say the DNR’s primary focus is on education and not enforcement. Every CO I’ve had the occasion to meet is friendly and more than willing to answer questions. If I have questions I call them and ask. I don’t go off what other people online in forums or social media say.

Jon Jordan wrote:

Agree. I don’t get into these debates. I do agree the DNR has always and will continue to write the rules in the most confusing, contradicting fashion possible. This happens every year. Including this year.

For example, for about 3 days earlier this December, they had updated the Mille Lacs special regs extending the season on walleye fishing through March 31st. I know at least one guy who printed the reg update off the DNR website and say he plans to fish for and keep walleyes through 3/31.

He says give me a ticket – see ya court.

Just sayin’

-J.
[/quote
Hopefully that works out for your acquaintance..I’m predicting a fine and a few years without fishing privalges. Not a gamble I would make with my fishing privalges but we all must pick which hill we want to die on.