Confused, mad, embarrassed, intrigued

There is a lot of talk about the media in here. I’m not disagreeing. I think the media is an issue (both sides of it). Fox, CNN, NBC, etc. etc. all had “live footage” of protests, riots, etc. shoving cameras in faces of people who were fired up often promoting division from both sides.

Food for Thought: Is this ALL the media’s fault? Sure a lot of it is. Could it be that we as a society crave this BS subconsciously and tune in regardless promoting them to continue their coverage? If we didn’t turn on the TV, share nonsense on social media, or start 8 page threads about these topics…the media wouldn’t cover it. The reality is that humans unfortunately crave this crap. We’d rather be more fired up about something from either side (indirectly encouraging the media) than ignoring it. The media’s crap isn’t going anywhere. Unfortunately the reason for that is staring all of us right in the mirror.

…now I’ve got to get home and fire up my TV, check social media, and crack a beer while b****ing about the media

The fact of the matter is “TV” media is the worse. People tend to believe what they see on TV and seldom research another view or opinion. Same for social media. If it’s printed it’s the truth. If all your friend are “Fox” watchers or “Facebook” friends then you will only hear that side of the argument. My preference has always been the newspaper, radio & NBC news. If I was still unclear I came to IDO for clarity.

Fair & Balanced.

big_g wrote:

Yes, being a middle aged white man, has tremendous benefits… let me list them in priority… I will have to think about these for awhile. Media and people constantly telling people of color.. ” you are treated differently, you have no chance, the cards are stacked against you… nobody knows your pain… you are screwed no matter what… the narrative continues… the actual programmed racism is continued.

Until we can tell ALL people, when you are interacting with a police person, their goal is to control the situation and to go home safe at shift end.. when ANYONE starts acting all crazy, things will escalate quickly. Can we get the message to people of all races… when dealing with police or military (NG) troops, please comply and live. When you get stupid, stupid things happen. It really is that simple, but the media will not put that message out, there is no money in people getting along.

Amen. Race isn’t the issue. People decide to ignore orders from a police officer… I don’t care if you’re white, black, or purple. You’re going to get in trouble for that. Being a white male is tough. Everything is our fault. We don’t have any days or months dedicated to recognizing us. We just get fingers pointed at us every time…

Look at crime by race. 56% of all homicides in 2019 were committed by people of color (who make up 13% of the population). That makes the odds of a person of color being violent much higher than other races right? Statistically, that means there would be more deadly encounters with people of color and police officers.

My point is that this isn’t a race issue. It doesn’t matter if you have a wide nose or not. Respect police officers and they’ll respect you. Common denominator is people resisting arrest and breaking the law.

Tool – Vicarious comes to mind…

big_g wrote:

Can we get the message to people of all races… when dealing with police or military (NG) troops, please comply and live.

Ignoring the examples of times people were complying and still ended up dead this is still a WEIRD take, to me, in the supposed land of the free.

Dutchboy wrote:

The fact of the matter is “TV” media is the worse. People tend to believe what they see on TV and seldom research another view or opinion. Same for social media. If it’s printed it’s the truth. If all your friend are “Fox” watchers or “Facebook” friends then you will only hear that side of the argument. My preference has always been the newspaper, radio & NBC news. If I was still unclear I came to IDO for clarity.

Fair & Balanced.

It’s gotten to the point where I hear about a story then research it. There’s few sources that report the story instead of taking a side and creating further division in the US

Reef W wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>big_g wrote:</div>
Can we get the message to people of all races… when dealing with police or military (NG) troops, please comply and live.

Ignoring the examples of times people were complying and still ended up dead this is still a WEIRD take, to me, in the supposed land of the free.

Link some of these please. I’d be interested in looking into them.

What’s weird to me is knowing you have a target on your back and then proceed to be an Outlaw.

rjthehunter wrote:

Ignoring the examples of times people were complying and still ended up dead this is still a WEIRD take, to me, in the supposed land of the free.

Link some of these please. I’d be interested in looking into them.

Ever heard of Philando Castile

Pretty sure Philandro ignored commands to not pull his gun out, at least 4 times… and started “reaching” for his wallet (cops have no idea what your reaching for) and not complying. It only takes a second and boom, from either party. Another chance to educate lost.

big_g wrote:

Pretty sure Philandro ignored commands to keep his hands on the wheel and started “reaching” for his wallet (cops have no idea what your reaching for) and not complying. It only takes a second and boom, from either party. Another chance to educate lost.

X2

I just re-watched the video.
Seems other should also.

Eelpoutguy wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>big_g wrote:</div>
Pretty sure Philandro ignored commands to keep his hands on the wheel and started “reaching” for his wallet (cops have no idea what your reaching for) and not complying. It only takes a second and boom, from either party. Another chance to educate lost.

X2

I just re-watched the video.
Seems other should also.

Yep. Again if people would listen to law enforcement… Instead of telling the police you have a gun, you hand them your permit to carry with your driver’s license. You’re not even required to inform officers in MN that you’re carrying. I would. But it’s not required.

The thing about statistics is you can use them to tell all sorts of narratives. We all agree racism exists in America right? Well 67% of cops are white. Using the same logic you applied in your argument rjthehunter one could conclude that racism against people of color is more likely to exist in the policemans workforce than it would be in a more diverse workforce.

You can look for specific examples of police brutality up and down if you want but it’s about more than that. We aren’t that far removed from when the Nixon administration targeted blacks with their drug campaigns, or Rodney King or the recent rise of white supremacists attaching themselves to Donald Trump and his rhetoric.

When I posted on here about why people refuse to buy tundras for example one response I got was because the generation before us fought the Japanese and the hard feelings remained in the following generation. It’s confusing to me why dodge doesn’t get that treatment being they are now an Italian company and the two were allies but thats besides the point. The point is it doesn’t take recent events to instill an emotion in someone. Sometimes those thoughts and feelings cops and black people alike have about one another can play a roll in these situations and their outcomes. At least it wouldn’t be too hard to imagine that being the case. Really no way to prove that but it makes sense to me that it would.

Idk just some food for thought. You can agree with it or not.

Racism existed in this country in 1800, 1900, 2000, 2021 and will still exist in 2100. It’s not going away.

crappie55369 wrote:

The thing about statistics is you can use them to tell all sorts of narratives. We all agree racism exists in America right? Well 67% of cops are white. Using the same logic you applied in your argument rjthehunter one could conclude that racism against people of color is more likely to exist in the policemans workforce than it would be in a more diverse workforce.

You can look for specific examples of police brutality up and down if you want but it’s about more than that. We aren’t that far removed from when the Nixon administration targeted blacks with their drug campaigns, or Rodney King or the recent rise of white supremacists attaching themselves to Donald Trump and his rhetoric.

When I posted on here about why people refuse to buy tundras for example one response I got was because the generation before us fought the Japanese and the hard feelings remained in the following generation. It’s confusing to me why dodge doesn’t get that treatment being they are now an Italian company and the two were allies but thats besides the point. The point is it doesn’t take recent events to instill an emotion in someone. Sometimes those thoughts and feelings cops and black people alike have about one another can play a roll in these situations and their outcomes. At least it wouldn’t be too hard to imagine that being the case. Really no way to prove that but it makes sense to me that it would.

Idk just some food for thought. You can agree with it or not.

I know racism is still a thing. But statistically the police force would be more equally diverse than the general population. 73% of the US population is white. So If 67% of cops are white, then, based on the total population, there’s more diversity within the police force vs general population.

I’m looking at it statistically and it appears to favor minorities within law enforcement.

Pretty much sums it up IMO. WARNING SOME NAUGHTY LANGUAGE

crappie55369 wrote:

The thing about statistics is you can use them to tell all sorts of narratives. We all agree racism exists in America right? Well 67% of cops are white. Using the same logic you applied in your argument rjthehunter one could conclude that racism against people of color is more likely to exist in the policemans workforce than it would be in a more diverse workforce.

The alarming aspect to this “logic” is the only condition used to postulate racism is that the cops are white. Is it POSSIBLE that none of the white cops are racist? Or are they, in some proportion, inherently racist because they’re white? That seems incredibly simplistic. Should I assume you’re racist since you’re white? I would hope we’re all a little more advanced than that. Does racism exist? Certainly… across all races to some extent. Does discrimination against the elderly, overweight people, women, etc., etc. exist? Sure, but to prescribe prejudice to a group based on a single, inate attribute is prejudice in itself.

shady5 wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>crappie55369 wrote:</div>
The thing about statistics is you can use them to tell all sorts of narratives. We all agree racism exists in America right? Well 67% of cops are white. Using the same logic you applied in your argument rjthehunter one could conclude that racism against people of color is more likely to exist in the policemans workforce than it would be in a more diverse workforce.

The alarming aspect to this “logic” is the only condition used to postulate racism is that the cops are white. Is it POSSIBLE that none of the white cops are racist? Or are they, in some proportion, inherently racist because they’re white? That seems incredibly simplistic. Should I assume you’re racist since you’re white? I would hope we’re all a little more advanced than that. Does racism exist? Certainly… across all races to some extent. Does discrimination against the elderly, overweight people, women, etc., etc. exist? Sure, but to prescribe prejudice to a group based on a single, inate attribute is prejudice in itself.

i said that because the workforce is predominantly white racism against people of color is more likely. That doesn’t mean racism is more likely that means where it does exist it will be against people of color. Is it possible that none of the white cops are racist? Across all of America? Is it possible the sun burns out tomorrow? I suppose, but the odds are not likely.

In any group of people some of them are bound to be racist. I am using that as a premise. I am not suggesting that a cop is statistically more racist than anyone else and im not suggesting that a white person is more racist than a person of color. All i said is that cops are statically a majority white. As such, statistically, if a portion of them are going to be racist, as is the case with any sizable population example, they are going to be predominantly racist against people of color.

So to clarify, would a black cop in lily white small town Minnesota be more prejudice than a white cop in North Mpls.? How about a black cop in the South side of Chicago? Or, could the prejudice be against law breakers vs law abiders? Umm, I may need to think this over.

Dutchboy wrote:

So to clarify, would a black cop in lily white small town Minnesota be more prejudice than a white cop in North Mpls.? How about a black cop in the South side of Chicago? Or, could the prejudice be against law breakers vs law abiders? Umm, I may need to think this over.

IDK. I somewhat sidetracked the discussion here. Ill just stay out of it. Better for all parties involved, especially me

I’m not going to paint one specific generation than being more racist as another but the only people I personally know who openly show signs of being racist are my older relatives. They are white and they live in a rural setting. Some of them have passed on now but several of them are still with us and their attitude towards non-white people is something I not only disagree with with, but also condemn. So perhaps at least in my personal experience, it is a generational thing more correlated with rural-residing individuals. My sample size is very small, so should be taken with a grain of salt, though but the pattern is obvious.

Mike Kohler wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>crappie55369 wrote:</div>
i said that because the workforce is predominantly white racism against people of color is more likely. That doesn’t mean racism is more likely that means where it does exist it will be against people of color. Is it possible that none of the white cops are racist? Across all of America? Is it possible the sun burns out tomorrow? I suppose, but the odds are not likely.

In any group of people some of them are bound to be racist. I am using that as a premise. I am not suggesting that a cop is statistically more racist than anyone else and im not suggesting that a white person is more racist than a person of color. All i said is that cops are statically a majority white. As such, statistically, if a portion of them are going to be racist, as is the case with any sizable population example, they are going to be predominantly racist against people of color.

These “WOKE” guys just cant let it go.

youre attempted insult is noted. Thanks for your insightful contribution to the forum!

big_g wrote:

Pretty sure Philandro ignored commands to not pull his gun out, at least 4 times… and started “reaching” for his wallet (cops have no idea what your reaching for) and not complying. It only takes a second and boom, from either party. Another chance to educate lost.

Philando is a poor example to use as someone complying because as you state he wasnt. The conceal/carry instructor who he learned from has testified that he did an arm’s length of things wrong based on the instruction he taught him and others. Carrying a pistol in your shorts pocket is just one of them.

Here is a recent story in MN. White guy drags a cop with his Car and hits the cop in the head with a hammer. He never got shot. Just this week the video from Virginia made the news of the Army Officer being pepper sprayed.

That and all the other recent history makes it seem to me that cops treat black people differently.

https://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2021/04/14/police-man-drags-hutchinson-officer-with-car-hits-him-with-hammer-after-face-mask-dispute/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

I just read that story this morning. Unreal. Assaults an employee and then a cop all over the refusal to wear a mask in Menards.

gimruis wrote:

I just read that story this morning. Unreal. Assaults an employee and then a cop all over the refusal to wear a mask in Menards.

There was an incident in that same store I think just last week. I wonder if its the same POS?

[Here is a recent story in MN. White guy drags a cop with his Car and hits the cop in the head with a hammer. He never got shot. Just this week the video from Virginia made the news of the Army Officer being pepper sprayed.
That and all the other recent history makes it seem to me that cops treat black people differently.]

You and the media are cherry picking and intentionally dividing people. The cops treat people by their behavior. Not their race.

Just maybe it has something to do with criminal behavior.

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The incident in Hutchinson happened at 1:50 pm and I rolled through the area at 3:00 pm for my second shot at the Thrifty White, one block from the Menards. Where the guy stopped was between Menards and highway 7. They had some roads shut down.

suzuki wrote:

[Here is a recent story in MN. White guy drags a cop with his Car and hits the cop in the head with a hammer. He never got shot. Just this week the video from Virginia made the news of the Army Officer being pepper sprayed.
That and all the other recent history makes it seem to me that cops treat black people differently.]

You and the media are cherry picking and intentionally dividing people. The cops treat people by their behavior. Not their race.

THank you!!